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Cory's Corner: I'm having second thoughts about Letroy Guion

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Cory's Corner: I'm having second thoughts about Letroy Guion

When Letroy Guion was arrested on June 21 for drunk driving, I felt just like everyone else.

The Packers should release him and cut the fat from the organization.

Now I’m not so sure.

The Packers are already without Guion for four games to start the season thanks to violating the league’s performance enhancing drug policy. Defensive line doesn’t have a lot of depth, especially since second year pro Kenny Clark is still a wild card.

Is it selfish for the Packers to think of the franchise after Guion just got in legal trouble? Perhaps, but we all know how tiny winning windows are in the NFL and getting rid of Guion would put more stress on inside linebackers that had trouble tackling and reacting to the ball.

The Packers should only keep Guion if he agrees to be Mike Daniels’ roommate — no questions asked. Let Daniels preach to him what it means to be an NFL player. Let Daniels tell him stories about comeback and success; how Daniels transformed his heavy body in the weight room so people wouldn’t make fun of him.

If anyone is going to put some sense into this guy, it’s Daniels. He has never sugar coated anything and is known as Mr. Fire and Brimstone in the locker room. Let Daniels talk to Guion how much the Packers need him and how much he needs the Packers.

But most importantly, let Daniels impress to Guion that you cannot take this opportunity for granted. And judging by his second suspension in three seasons, he has had two legal issues in the last two years. Guion obviously thinks he is invincible right now and needs someone to bring him back down to Earth.

Obviously, if Guion isn’t willing to room with Daniels and listen to what he has to say, then he should be gone.

The old “Packer Way” mantra should be put to bed. Everyone thinks that the Packers are a cut above and would never consider wins above character.

That’s just wrong. Wins will and always will matter. The fact is, that Guion still has value on this roster — even though he’s missing four games to start the season.

Does keeping Guion send a message to the rest of the team that misbehaving is accepted? I’m not sure it sends that as much as it says that this team is ultra committed to winning.

The Packers are once again in win-now mode. They cannot let Guion go and risk the defensive line depth just because of perception.

The question that comes into play is how bad does he want it? Only Guion can truly answer that now, because the Packers may be getting one of the hungriest guys on the defense when camp opens July 27. 

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Fan friendly comments only: off Comments (36) This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.

Donster's picture

I don't think Guion is committed to winning. He would be doing everything in his power to keep his nose clean so he could continue playing. He is not an elite player in the NFL. Never has been. And there will be players to be had after training camp cuts who will be able to replace him, and more than likely, play at the level he has played at, which has been just average for his position in the NFL. If he was a great player, he would be a household name. But he is only known by his off field antics.

Nick Perry's picture

"Does keeping Guion send a message to the rest of the team that misbehaving is accepted? I’m not sure it sends that as much as it says that this team is ultra committed to winning."

Or the Packers could just cut Guion and sign another player like RJF who wants to be here, wants to play for a SB team, will actually be AVAILABLE for 16 games, and could be part of the solution getting them there.

There's other players out there right now (more after cuts are made) who could bring what Guion brings to the Packers. "dobber" has mentioned Jerald Odrick numerous times and he's still available, maybe for less than the Packers would have to pay Guion IF he comes back to play in 2017. He's already suspended 4 games and I have no idea what this latest DUI will cost him. I frankly don't give a damn at this point either. Go get a player who's more focused on winning a SB than getting toasted in Hawaii just because it's his birthday. 18 year old kids get hammered because it's their birthday, 30 year old men should be way past that.

Have a safe and Happy 4th of July everyone!

Thegreatreynoldo's picture

NP, Would you care to bet right now whether a DL as good as Guion is gets cut this summer?

[Bubba approved and typed comment.]

Nick Perry's picture

What about Odrick? He's available now. How about Red Bryant? He's still available I believe. As far as who's going to be available who knows but there's surprise releases/cuts every year. I know the Bears didn't think Josh Sitton would be released one week before the regular season started last year, stranger things have happened. It's just whether or not Thompson gives them a call to come try out.

I think you have to consider Guion is already gone for weeks 1-4 and now with this new DUI charge how much longer? I understand he has to go through the legal process but his availability is a huge question mark right now?

Hoyt Harper's picture

I'm disappointed that you are talking about Guion's talent rather than the obvious character issues and lack for personal responsibility. Room with Daniels? COME ON MAN! This isn't high school. The Packers have been too patient with him. Supporting him a third time reflects negatively on the team. Whether there is a D-line challenge or not, releasing him is the right thing to do.

TheVOR's picture

He should have been released after the LB. of reefer and Gun incident. Not sure if he has pictures of Ted Thompson in diamond nylon stockings or what, but there is no way this guy should be on the roster. He should have been released the last time he got popped. GB needs to move on from these people. Question, the night before an NFC Championship game, he gets popped for dope and becomes a massive distraction, or is held out by the team so as "not to be a distraction, which he already is"... Do you want that? Because thats what this guy is, he clearly can't keep his stuff together and clearly has deep addiction issues. All you have to say to yourself is, he's willing to continue *-ing up at risk of a 3M a year job? Thats not rational, thats something far worse, thats stupid, and thats addicted, and stupid and addicted gets you beat. FLING! He's outta here, can't believe he's still on team.

Arthur Jackson's picture

I won't say your post is hysterical Vor, but it is a bit overly dramatic. He has never had an incident during the season. The gun was his and was just some bullshit by the police causing an oversensationalism by the press like he's a gangster for having a bit of weed (not herion or meth or purple drank or....). I would say barely 0.08 BAC on his OWI is in about the same category. As far as I'm concerned .1 was just fine. PEDs, well guys use them all the time to try and get an edge.

That said, Vor, I believe his performance and cap cost says move on. I don't think the Packers need to justify it on anything else. I would say Guion is eminently replaceable.

I'm curious, did you get booted at that other place?

dblbogey's picture

Below average character, below average player. Bye bye.

Since '61's picture

Guion has never been a complete player. At best he is a rotational player who makes a stop or two against the run game. If Guion wants to play, if he wants to contribute to the Packers this season he should demonstrate his commitment by voluntarily getting some help. Instead of the Packers giving him another chance and helping him by rooming him with Daniels or whoever he should take the initiative and help himself. That would show as much as anything else that he is committed to himself first, then his career and then his team. The Packers have stood by him enough already. It's time for him to take responsibility and stand up for himself. If he won't do that for himself he won't/can't be there for his team. If he doesn't get help chuck him regardless of depth on the DL. We can find plenty of marginal players who care about playing and winning and who deserve a chance without Guion's baggage. Time to move on. Thanks, Since '61

Turophile's picture

Even beyond the stuff that he is dealing with (or failing to), he is a descending player who is becoming a square peg in a round hole.

The Packers are moving away from the 330 lb linemen to the more athletic guys in the 295-310 range. Clark has reported that he has slimmed down from his listed 314 lb, Daniels is 310 and Lowry is listed at 296.

Descending player + bad fit for the current D + suspension and DUI on top of that (though I admit the DUI was only just over the limit). I don't see him surviving this year unless the Packers get snakebitten by injury on the D line. He is sitting there holding the 'dead mans hand' (Hickock's hand, 2 black aces, 2 black eights), so unless his hole card is a joker, he'll end up like Wild Bill Hickock was, cut down.

Since '61's picture

Turophile - I agree that Guion is probably done one way or the other this season. I appreciate the reference to the dead man's hand, haven't heard that in a while, but it covers Guion's situation accurately. Thanks, Since '61

croatpackfan's picture

People in US, I wish you happy Indipendent Day...

Spock's picture

Thanks, Croat. Yes, this is the day we celebrate when Americans were freed from paying increasingly exorbitant taxes imposed on us by a rich ruler and... Oh, wait. Never mind.
But, seriously, thanks for your kind thought.

croatpackfan's picture

Regarding Guion - I think, Cory, that Mike Daniels is not paid to be babysitter for adult NFL player. And that is all I would like to say about this article...

Handsback's picture

The Packers are in a good spot w/ Guion and should stay there. No need to release him or anything else until after the fourth game. If they lose one of their Dline guys....they have a good backup. If they have a full compliment, then cut him.
It's a win-win for the Packers, I would keep it that way.

croatpackfan's picture

Guion will receive additional punishment from NFL. We are looking at possible 8 game penalty total to gone for the season... So, what to wait?

ejr450's picture

They wait because they can. There's no immediate need to take action. We will see what happens before training camp. Remember, Adams isn't signed yet. Perhaps there is something there we don't know about that could stop him from being a Packer. Then Guion becomes important. I agree, he has represented himself and the franchise poorly over the past few years. He has seemed to waste the opportunity and $$$ in front of him. I too, would prefer to see him off the roster. But - I believe TT is aware and has a plan. He's just not in a rush, as usual.

croatpackfan's picture

Adams will sign. They can sign drafted player up to August, 1st. Nothing special in that... Obviously Packers had some other primary targets to solve and at the time when Packers are free for discussion, Adams left the town.
No big deal!

ejr450's picture

I agree - I think he will sign and we'll see Guion cut in camp. But, it's strange that he's not signed yet when it's a slotted, straightforward deal. Just one of those anomalies that on their own is not big deal but together can paint a different picture. Either way, I doubt 98 suits up for a game for GB this year.

caruso81's picture

If we're going to ruthlessly toss away the idea of "the Packer Way" - which is fine, BTW - then we need to stop holding onto players whose maintenance level is out of proportion with their value to the team. Guion, when considering how available he is, is not much more than a JAG.

Lphill's picture

Guion is just a guy , nothing special can be replaced , he is a bad influence for the younger players .time to say goodbye.

packfan44's picture

We've made two exceptions with him, the third should get him off the team! The NFL won't miss the opportunity this time around! Total of 8 games missed should be about right.....

dobber's picture

I don't know that the Packers have made any "exceptions" for Guion. There are others on the roster who have had suspensions, PED/substance abuse issues, run-ins with the law, DUI, etc. This is--unfortunately--the culture of today's professional athletes. It's really not all that much different from the general population.

croatpackfan's picture

Can you please give us the list of those PED/substance abuse issue, run-ins with the law, DUI etc. players still with Packers? I mean, players that repeated violations...
Thanks!

dobber's picture

Geronimo Allison was pulled over and cited for possession this last off-season. Wasn't there another Packer riding with him?
(packersnews.com/story/sports/nfl/packers/2017/01/10/packers-allison-faces-marijuana-charge/96399446/)
Dimitri Goodson has had a PED suspension.
Mike Pennel is gone, but they kept him through his PED suspensions.
Hell, they signed Guion knowing he'd had run-ins with the law when he was with the Vikings.

None of these guys are stars. They're mostly replacement level (or lower) players...only Pennel was cut. It's not like they're bending their team rules for guys because they can't live without them.

Thegreatreynoldo's picture

Packers who have been suspended:

Guion: 3/17 4 games, – PEDs
Pennel 12/16 4 games -Substance abuse
Goodson 4/16 4 games – PEDs
Pennel: 2/16, 4 games – substance abuse
Bush: 8/15, 4 games – PEDs
Guion: 7/15, 4 games – Gun, marijuana, cash
Datone: 7/15 1 game – substance abuse
Neal: 3/12, 4 games – PEDs * he also faced possible suspension in 2015 but no one signed him
Jolly: 2010, Indefinite Substance abuse
Koren Robinson: 2006, 1 year – substance abuse (GB signed him for 2 yrs knowing he might be suspended – Played for GB in 2007
Jude Waddy, 1998, 4 games PEDs
K. Uecker: 1989, 4 games PEDs
M Ariely: 1989, 4 games PEDs
B Curry: 1975 (devastating leg injury in 1973, never played again, wasn’t a Packer in 1973 through 1975. Long coaching career inc in GB

PEDs: Guion, 2017, Goodson 2016, Bush 2015, Neal, 2012, Jude Waddy, 1998, OL Mike Ariey, 1989, OL Keith Uecker, 1989, OL Bill Curry, 1975. Linked: OL Mike Wahle was expelled from the U.S. Naval Academy for alleged steroid use; offensive linemen Mike Ariey and Keith Uecker in 1989; OL Mandarich confessed to steroid use in his biography. CM3 and Peppers satisfied whatever concerns the NFL had about rumors of their alleged use of steroids.

[mY 7/1 POST ON ACME]

croatpackfan's picture

I see only Mike Pennel (pitty) was suspended twice - he is not with the team. Now it is Letroy Guion who is suspended second time while he is in Green Bay uniform and he waits his 3rd suspension. Should we consult Las Vegas what is his chances to stay as Packer?

Thegreatreynoldo's picture

Packers who have been suspended:

Guion: 3/17 4 games, – PEDs
Pennel 12/16 4 games -Substance abuse
Goodson 4/16 4 games – PEDs
Pennel: 2/16, 4 games – substance abuse
Bush: 8/15, 4 games – PEDs
Guion: 7/15, 4 games – Gun, marijuana, cash
Datone: 7/15 1 game – substance abuse
Neal: 3/12, 4 games – PEDs * he also faced possible suspension in 2015 but no one signed him
Jolly: 2010, Indefinite Substance abuse
Koren Robinson: 2006, 1 year – substance abuse (GB signed him for 2 yrs knowing he might be suspended – Played for GB in 2007
Jude Waddy, 1998, 4 games PEDs
K. Uecker: 1989, 4 games PEDs
M Ariely: 1989, 4 games PEDs
B Curry: 1975 (devastating leg injury in 1973, never played again, wasn’t a Packer in 1973 through 1975. Long coaching career inc in GB

PEDs: Guion, 2017, Goodson 2016, Bush 2015, Neal, 2012, Jude Waddy, 1998, OL Mike Ariey, 1989, OL Keith Uecker, 1989, OL Bill Curry, 1975. Linked: OL Mike Wahle was expelled from the U.S. Naval Academy for alleged steroid use; offensive linemen Mike Ariey and Keith Uecker in 1989; OL Mandarich confessed to steroid use in his biography. CM3 and Peppers satisfied whatever concerns the NFL had about rumors of their alleged use of steroids.

[mY 7/1 POST ON ACME]

Ferrari Driver's picture

I would much rather have Mike Daniels room with Kenny Clark. If he can develop the mentality he has in Clark, we will have two younger terrific starters for the nickel defense which we play 80% of the time.

I think most of us have had enough of Guion.

Tundraboy's picture

We have had way too many players unable to play a full 16 games, injuries fine, stupidity no . Tired of starting the year with someone serving a 4 game suspension. Enough. Team needs to count on players being responsible enough to be there.

GBPDAN1's picture

Do you think Guion is smart enough to take a Uber on this National drink day? In lieu of his past troubles, it wouldn't surprise me at all if Guion is drunk as I write this and possibly contemplating driving.

flackcatcher's picture

What I want to know is why the Packers value Guion so much. He must add something that we fans do not see. Outside of being a vested veteran, I can't see it.

dblbogey's picture

Perhaps he's fun to be with? Maybe he's a really good dancer? I personally don't see any redeeming qualities in him at this point.

Thegreatreynoldo's picture

Being a vested veteran hurts a player's chances of making a team: it does not help the fringe player. Far from it.

It probably helps a team to have a player suspended for a few games (maybe 1 to at most 4 games, not too many - don't want the player to lose football conditioning) IF the player isn't a starter but is a rotational player at a deep position. That fits Guion to a T. So, a team can afford to carry one less at that position, thus opening a roster spot at another position, while not paying the player even a PS level salary, and doesn't have to guarantee his salary as a vested veteran, but rather gets to decide what it wants to do with the player several games into the season, after it has had a chance to look at say rookie Montravius Adams and 2nd year players Lowry and Clark in real action. The suspended player acts as injury protection while the team retains its full rights to the player, although the player might not be immediately available in the event of an injury. It can be an ideal situation for a team.

Now, it may be that a good player gets released later this summer. It probably will happen, but that player could be a 3 Tech or OT, which we don't particularly need. Relying on serendipity to supply our needs is a hell of a way to engage in roster construction.

No, Guion isn't a good player, he is probably a little shy of being an average 1 tech. He probably was as good as Clark last year overall, except for towards the end of last season when we started to see Clark's high ceiling realized. Guion is simply a better 1 Tech than RJF. Daniels can and does play 1 tech, so does Clark, but at 310 lbs, they just don't have the bulk Guion provides.

GB probably is investigating this newest incident right now. The first part of GB's decision will become evident when we see if Guion is allowed to participate in TC in 3 weeks. If the eventually tacks on a 6 game to year long suspension, the issue is probably moot.

jeremyjjbrown's picture

I doubt there is a single commenter on this page that has not driven with a .086 BAC. I'm not saying it's right, just that you've done it too.

The Packers should wait until his suspension/s are over before deciding. It's possible that they could loose linemen before then. Or, realize that they have a full DL and don't need his distractions anymore.

Yeah, he's been stupid and irresponsible, but I doubt anyone is going to stop watching over Guion's DUI and PED issues.

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