Just read this article by my favorite Packer grouch Bob McGinn. (I write that lovingly btw) It's about Jon Ryan vs. Derrick Frost. Guess what - Jon Ryan is a better punter. Wow. I know it's a shock.

Basically it goes on to say that the Packers wouldn't let Ryan go to a specialist his agent recommended and now he his having his best year as a punter. (after having seen said specialist)

Mike Stock, the Packers 3rd year Special Teams Coach says this to McGinn about kickers/punters seeing specialists:

"I don't believe in those things, and I'll tell you why. One voice is the most important thing when you're coaching a team or a player. You can't have two different voices, especially long distance."

Former Packers kicker Dave Rayner used to work a portion of the off-season with Eddie Murray. Because Murray kicked successfully in the NFL, Stock said that was worthwhile.

Don't the specific skills required to punt make use of outside specialists appropriate?

"No," Stock said. "If you want to get into the discussion of, does this guy know more about punting than the other guy? Do you want to read my bio? I'm not promoting myself, but I know what I know and I know what I've done and I know the people I've worked with.

Here is Stock's Bio for those of you who do want to see it. Needless to say last year's special teams was pretty good (7th Overall). But of course I saved my favorite quote of the article - this one from Will Lewis, the Seahawks' director of pro personnel and a former Packer Scout (97-99):

"I've been around enough kickers to know that the special-teams coach may not be his greatest ally but the guy he worked with in the off-season on strength and technique might be the guy that helps him once he gets into the season," said Lewis.

"To me, a special-teams coach might not be a great kicking coach but he's smart enough to listen to some of the kicking experts. Most special-teams coaches are, like, 'Whatever can help my kickers.'?"

Or not. Or everyone from Ted Thompson to Coach McCarthy to Coach Stock are unwilling to say they made a mistake and are more willing to live with a guy that probably would have been cut by now on most other teams. Hey Mike Stock- check your ego at the door. You are coaching the Green Bay Packers and guess what? Nothing on your resume is as big as that.