Packers Vs. Lions: First Impressions

My immediate thoughts during the Packers - Lions game without the benefit of a re-watch.

...

Matt Hasselbeck was reminded of his "we want the ball and we're gonna score," debacle, Charles Woodson just Lambeau Leaped for the first time ever and ESPN is airing a ton of Brett Hundley pre-game specials. It's Monday night, baby.

Brett Hundley hit five different targets on his first six pass attempts to start the game. Great play-calling on the Packers' first drive as well.

On the flip side, the Packers' defense had a three-and-out had it not been for a (stupid) penalty on Mike Daniels. Rinse and repeat, Lions go right down and score with new life.

Packers were gifted with great field position and gained a single yard. Not ideal. But, Brett Hundley finally let one fly down the field, which is going to be something to watch.

Damarious Randall has played exceptionally well against the run tonight.

Hundley was averaging 4.4 yards per pass by halftime. Not to say that's on McCarthy, but Hundley's settling for too many check-downs.

Psst. Dean Lowry is still alive.

The Packers as a team are averaging 5.2 yards per run. More of an emphasis there would probably help Hundley tremendously.

They need to check up on Darius Slay after the game. Pretty sure he's starting to get a little too comfortable with Jordy Nelson after slow-dancing with him twice in a two-minute span.

Injuries, Hundley's struggles, third-down defense. There are a lot of problems in Green Bay right now.

There's no such thing as a good play in Green Bay without some kind of sacrifice. The Packers' starting offensive line didn't hold together for long.

The Packers looked like they had a pulse offensively, but defensively, they were as lifeless as a corpse.

I'm not running out of excuses for Dom Capers. I'm completely out of them.

__________________________

Zachary Jacobson is a staff writer/reporter for Cheesehead TV. He's the voice of The Leap on iTunes and can be heard on The Scoop KLGR 1490 AM every Saturday morning. He's also a contributor on the Pack-A-Day Podcast. He can be found on Twitter via @ZachAJacobson or contacted through email at [email protected].

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Comments (128)

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marpag1's picture

November 06, 2017 at 10:21 pm

Y'know what? I changed my mind. Let's go ahead and trade Hundley for those two first round draft picks after all.

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Dzehren's picture

November 06, 2017 at 10:42 pm

I’ve just been handed some extremely important breaking news: Brett Huntley SUCKS!!!

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Malland56's picture

November 07, 2017 at 12:11 am

MM has a lot to do with it also

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Big_Mel_75's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:46 am

Remember this powerhouse team that TT built? Oh wait Rodgers is that good. TT on down need to go. MM too, he keeps DC around. This team isn't good in any area.

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Finwiz's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:52 am

They say for a joke to be humorous, it needs to have some degree of truth to it.

That's not even funny, because it has no basis in reality.

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Bedrock's picture

November 06, 2017 at 10:31 pm

I’m officially done with Dom. He was out-coached and out play-called by a man that goes by Jim-Bob.

He has talent. He lacks the ability to put talent into playmaking opportunities.

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Bearmeat's picture

November 06, 2017 at 10:34 pm

Hundley won't be garnering any draft picks worth a damn unless he picks it up.

I'm a Packers fan through and through, so I'll be watching next week. But the competitive part of this year is over. Fire Capers. Force TT to retire. Find a pass rusher or two. Maybe a couple other players to complement our all-world QB who has clearly been most of the team for the better part of the last decade.

See you next September.

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HankScorpio's picture

November 06, 2017 at 10:51 pm

"Hundley won't be garnering any draft picks worth a damn unless he picks it up."

The Vikings are offering the Packers a 3 to keep Hundley on the roster in 2018.

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NashvilleCheesehead's picture

November 07, 2017 at 05:30 am

I nominate this for Best Comment of the Year.

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Packatron's picture

November 07, 2017 at 01:21 pm

Seconded.

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Point-Packer's picture

November 06, 2017 at 10:34 pm

Hopefully this will be the end of Dom Capers. Five years too late.

Davon House was awful tonight.

Haha Clinton-Dix was awful.

Clay Mathews is the most overpaid player in all the NFL.

Perry may be #2.

GB makes Marvin Jones look like Jerry Rice. Only team that does that.

Took GB being down big and the game largely over for MM to open it up. Nice work mashed potato Mike.

This team sucks.

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Malland56's picture

November 07, 2017 at 12:15 am

Clay Mathews has been a bust for 4 years now and counting. Look at his stats. THEY SUCK. He can't pass rush worth a ___ well you know. He hasn't for 3 and a half seasons now. Biggest high paid Packer flop that I can remember.

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al bundy's picture

November 07, 2017 at 12:50 pm

He's playing the wrong position. But MM wants him on the outside not in the middle. He is not a pass rusher. If you got back to the SB year and watch film, Jenkins was a power rusher chasing the QB into Mathews arms all game long. They got rid of Jenkins (he wanted to be paid in money) and Mathews career went in the toilet from them on.

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Finwiz's picture

November 07, 2017 at 01:02 pm

Yes they made a huge mistake not resigning Cullen Jenkins. They haven't had a force like that inside since he left. It made no sense at the time.
I think they just don't like to pay interior lineman, although they over-compensated with Daniels, and he's never really played up to expectations.

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splitpea1's picture

November 07, 2017 at 01:53 pm

I hated losing Jenkins. We had a nice defensive line then.

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jeremyjjbrown's picture

November 06, 2017 at 10:39 pm

I know a bad football team when I see one. Low on talent, out coached and out schemed.

Rodgers was a bigger band aid than anyone dreamed.

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Mojo's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:13 pm

When they restructure his contract it could be that Arod's in line to get $1mil more per season for every loss the Packers have from here on out.

Somewhere in the $30 to $35 per year range. Eric Dickerson was right, he might be the only reason they ever win.

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Leo Van Groll's picture

November 07, 2017 at 07:48 am

I honestly believe that if you put Rodgers on the Browns & they are a playoff team. On the flipside, The Packers without Rodgers ARE the Browns.

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Randy James's picture

November 06, 2017 at 10:53 pm

Mike McCarthy oughta be real proud of what he put on the field tonite. He had two weeks to get this team ready and what happens? They fall flat on their faces. That secondary couldn't have covered me tonite and I'm a 300 lb 60 yr old man. End of rant. On to next week!

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RobinsonDavis's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:02 pm

When are we going to see inspirational game plans? It is obvious our tendencies are being scouted and taken advantage of over and over again. Did anybody see any new wrinkles with either our offense or defense? It is very sad that this coaching staff put this concept on the field with 2 weeks to prepare. The lack of execution is with the coaching staff, I am convinced. Players leave the Packers and become instant contributors on other teams. This is not a player issue, it is the lack of innovation in the game plan.

Do we have designed pass plays down the middle that are longer than 5 yards? Can we force a punt? Can we pass the ball more than once to a TE downfield? Can we jam a receiver off the line consistently?

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Mojo's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:16 pm

"Can we force a punt." Not for six quarters.

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Randy James's picture

November 06, 2017 at 10:50 pm

Mike McCarthy oughta be real proud of what he put on the field tonite. He had two weeks to get this team ready and what happens? They fall flat on their faces. That secondary couldn't have covered me tonite and I'm a 300 lb 60 yr old man. End of rant. On to next week!

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Razor's picture

November 06, 2017 at 10:46 pm

Defense awful. Offense not good. Might have lost even with AR.

Long time hoping that the team would get better and hoping that one or two new faces would make the difference. Sad.

Mark, Ted, Mike, Dom. I can't see how continuing with these guys makes any sense.

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dobber's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:49 am

No...with AR they've got more than a shot to win that game. The defense--bad as it was--still forced 3 FGs. If you're scoring TDs, you win. Problem is, the presence of AR forces teams to play you differently and Detroit played a very conservative game plan last night. They didn't have to do anything fancy.

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Finwiz's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:53 am

Seriously dude? That's a major stretch you got going there.

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dobber's picture

November 07, 2017 at 09:29 am

The Packers are better off playing track meets with #12 under center than the crap we're seeing now. That's my point. Detroit came in and KNEW they didn't have to hang 35+ on the board to win. One of the worst rushing teams--and worst red zone teams--in the league didn't have to abandon the run to stay out front of the Packers, and they knew it. They didn't have to take any risks knowing they HAD to have 7s and not 3s. Detroit played as vanilla on offense as we've hung on McCarthy in recent weeks and they cold get away with it.

Put #12 on the field and you're changing the dynamic completely. Knowing you're likely to average 4+ points per possession puts a lot of pressure on the opposition to take some risks and makes things happen for your defense...bad as it is. Detroit doesn't run the ball 33 times last night at 1.9 ypc against a healthy Packers offense, and they--one of the worst pass-rushing teams in the league--likely don't blitz nearly as often against #12 as they did against a green #7.

I don't see any stretch at all, here: #12 makes all the difference in how an opponent is going to approach the Packers. Get ready for Jordan Howard to get 30 carries next week because the Bears know that they don't have to worry about the Packers offense running away from them.

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Finwiz's picture

November 07, 2017 at 09:37 am

Quit stretching so much, you're going to get whiplash.

Come on. Rodgers may not win that game last night the way that Defense played. Detroit didn't punt ONE TIME. Not once. You are aware of that, aren't you? Detroit took the foot off the gas, or Stafford could have scored 42 on the Packers, and I'm NOT exaggerating.

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Tundraboy's picture

November 07, 2017 at 10:04 am

Brilliant is right. If only our coach could see that.

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:56 am

Also. Rodgers effects opposing offenses. The threat of Rodgers on the other sideline changes the way they play them.

Just look at the Cowboys game as an example. They dreaded giving Rodgers the ball back in the 4th quarter. They tried to keep the ball as long as they could. But left 1 minute on the clock. And Rodgers beat them.
Rodgers forces opposing offenses into mistakes.

There is not that fear now with Hundley.

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

November 07, 2017 at 09:53 am

Dobber, that is brilliant. I tried to express the same thought on APC, just not as well. Detroit's offense looked like they felt all the pressure they would during walkthroughs at practice. If they mess up, no problem, GB won't score anyway and we will on the next possession. Detroit looked like the most relaxed team I've seen in a long time.

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Big_Mel_75's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:54 am

Because the Packers keep making more money every year and that is all that matters. Remember last year when the Packers were on life support and Rodgers lead them back to NFC title game? If Rodgers hadn't done that maybe people will see Mctubby for what he is A TERRIBLE COACH WITH AN ALL STAR QB.

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dobber's picture

November 07, 2017 at 12:56 pm

Every NFL team makes money. The Packers are a non-profit organization. Move on.

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Randy James's picture

November 06, 2017 at 10:46 pm

Sorry can't type. Two weeks to prepare and we see this. That secondary could not have covered me tonite. House was a day late and a dollar short.

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Dzehren's picture

November 06, 2017 at 10:47 pm

Need to draft 3 pass rushers & 3 offensive lineman next year to fix our problems.

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Tundraboy's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:06 pm

For starters that is.

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dobber's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:49 am

...did you mean "Four Starters"?

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Finwiz's picture

November 07, 2017 at 09:00 am

No they don't. First thing that needs to happen is the DC gets forced into retirement, and then you hire a new DC and see what type of D he wants to run. Then you draft a couple of pieces to supplement what you have, and hope he can work with it. There's some talent on this D, there just aren't any really difference makers, guys that can make BIG plays.

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Tundraboy's picture

November 07, 2017 at 09:35 am

Originally meant to begin with, as for starters, but yes 4 would be nice!

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Tundraboy's picture

November 07, 2017 at 09:56 am

High picks mean better chance even for us to stumble our way into a difference maker or two.

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jfajas's picture

November 07, 2017 at 10:39 am

I'll argue that the only guy in our D that is consistently making plays and showing talent is Blake Martinez. 1 in 11...

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HankScorpio's picture

November 06, 2017 at 10:48 pm

6 straight quarters without forcing a punt for the Packers defense.

On offense, they put together a game plan that was both pass heavy and designed to not ask much of the QB.

On ST, they dribbled a snap back to their holder and on multiple occasions ran the ball out of the end zone to short of the 25.

This team is completely lost right now. All 3 phrases are just a train wreck.

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marpag1's picture

November 06, 2017 at 10:59 pm

"6 straight quarters without forcing a punt"

That's staggering. And painful. And humiliating. Good thing Mike Daniels decided to play rough.

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The TKstinator's picture

November 06, 2017 at 10:56 pm

Pretty sweet ballgame!

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The TKstinator's picture

November 07, 2017 at 05:52 am

(If “sweet” is secret code for “horrible”.)

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Since'61's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:07 pm

1. After Aaron Rodgers and maybe Jordy Nelson there is not one player on the current roster who could have played for Coach Lombardi and probably none who could have played for Mike Holmgren.
2. The Lynn Dickey era Packers teams of the 1980s would demolish this current edition of the Packers.
3. The last time the Lions did not punt during a game was the 1971 season. The Packers defense achieved something that hasn't happened in 46 seasons. Enough said about the Packers defense.
4. After Mike Daniels stupid head butt that turned a rare 3 and out for the Packers D into a Lions TD he did nothing for the Packers. Who knows how this game plays out if the Packers get the ball back at that point. This is not the first time that he has committed an unnecessary and stupid penalty that has hurt the team.
Mike Daniels is a STUPID, STUPID,STUPID player. Sit him down and shut him up.!!!
5. If this is our best effort after a bye week playing at home against a division rival with a healthy OL and a mostly healthy defense the competitive part of our season is over.
6. Josh Jones was the only defender who played with reckless abandon on defense. King and House made some solid tackles in the run game. Clinton Dix was either MIA or late again on many plays.
7. The Lions offense is one dimensional and yet Capers could not come up with a plan to stop Stafford and the Lions passing game.
8. The Packers defense has no pass rush, none, zero, zip.
9. The Packers money used to resign Perry could have been better spent by donating the money to a veterans organization, or an animal welfare organization or to help battered women or the hungry or victims of gun violence or about a million other legitimate causes.
10. Total team failure by GM, Coaching staff and players.
No accountability.

IR Bulaga, Burnett, Brooks, Bennett. Why expose them further for this season. Bennett wants to bail out anyway. Get Bulaga and Burnett healthy for next season. They can still contribute with a healthy Rodgers.

With Rodgers we would be 7-1 without him the Packers have become unwatchable. So much for football as the ultimate team game. Just a sad reflection on the current state of the NFL.

Thanks, Since '61

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Tundraboy's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:10 pm

"The Lynn Dickey era Packers teams of the 1980s would demolish this current edition of the Packers."

Pretty much thought the same thing tonight.

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Pack204's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:18 pm

Your right. I have only been watching NFL since the late 1990’s and i have to say this is some of the worst product on the field I have ever seen. Its all about quality QB play that makes these games entertaining and the NFL is lacking that on the field. I can see why NFL ratings have taken a dive.

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dobber's picture

November 07, 2017 at 10:46 am

They've made their own bed: they want teams to play fast, but the talent to allow that to happen AND to look good isn't there for more than a third of the teams.

Thanks, FFL.

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GBPDAN1's picture

November 07, 2017 at 12:57 am

I gave you a big thumbs up, Since '61. That performance tonight, after a bye and being realitivly healthy, was absolutely pathetic and deserves a rant like yours! Pathetic!!! The Defense is terrible!

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

November 07, 2017 at 04:50 am

I agree with 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 and 10. Okay, 9 as well. (I was going to suggest donating it to me, but I'll concede the point.)

1: Lombardi would have been happy to have Clark and Daniels, the latter of whom I thought had a fine game outside of the boneheaded play, and while Lane Taylor wouldn't have played, he'd have been welcome depth addition. Probably would have appreciated Burnett as well. I also think Lombardi would have known what to do with Bennett's talent. As a player/person, Lombardi would have either made Bennett a HOFer or cut him: I lean towards the former since Lombardi knew how to motivate players.

Re Point #8: You could have listed this 10 times. Or added #11: With a one-handed Perry and Brooks sidelined, GB has almost no pass rushing talent on the roster. Maybe a little from Daniels, Josh Jones, and Burnett. I am on the fire Dom train, but I almost feel sorry for any Def. Coor. asked to generate pressure with the sorry group of pass rushers.

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Since'61's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:14 am

Reynoldo - As always I appreciate your good feedback. Daniels may have been able to play for Lombardi but not after a boneheaded play like he made last night. He just would not have tolerated it. Especially since, as I have posted this is not the first time.

Lombardi could accept a physical error like the bad snap on the FG by Hart. He would not like it but physical errors happens dropped passes etc... But he could not and would not accept mental errors especially when they hurt the team like Daniels did last night.

Thanks, Since '61

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

November 07, 2017 at 10:00 am

You're probably right about Daniels. Lombardi is really a little before my time. I was going to write hehehe, but it would have been fun to watch. Of course, in the sixties, I was very young and a Bears fan. My grandfathers knew Hala and Comiskey, so the switch to being a fan of GB when we moved to Wisconsin came a little hard. I never stopped being a White Sox and Cubs fan.

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Finwiz's picture

November 07, 2017 at 11:06 am

That's a good point about Bennett, more likely the latter solution though.
Burnett I'm not sure he would have found much to appreciate there.
That guy is such an enigma, I can't foresee a way they resign him.

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flackcatcher's picture

November 07, 2017 at 03:13 pm

Brutally accurate '61. One point missing in all this, this was a must win game for the Lions, and they played like it. Yesterday we saw good Stafford. Most of time we get bad Stafford. Must be the Packers year. Defense was pretty good, Stafford was A Rodgers like on third down. As you pointed out the NFL has slanted the rules to benefit one position, this time we were on the other end of that. And the NFL wonders why they are in trouble.

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ollie418's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:02 pm

Not one punt by the Lions says it all.

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Mojo's picture

November 07, 2017 at 12:10 am

From what I've heard, it's the first time an opponent hasn't punted for a game in the history of Lambeau.

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Tundraboy's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:11 pm

Wrote this earlier today, and I'm sticking with it, save only one change. Don't see them beating anyone this year and certainly not the Vikings.

"I'm not throwing in the towel, but at the same time getting Rogers back at the very end of the year, if it means making the playoffs and having a quick exit, I rather he not come back. I'd rather just settle for beating the hell out of the Vikings at the end of the year, knocking them out of the playoffs and going to the draft with top 10 picks. Along the way I hope Hundley shows something, we play the rookies and other young players and get them some great experience. Losing a lot of close games if we are competitive is fine with me. Obviously not what I hoped for this year, but going into another post season with a Capers D?? I'll pass. Rather live to fight another day (next year) and save ourselves the embarrassiment he brings to this team. I'm pretty sure we want to trade Hundley anyway."

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Leo Van Groll's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:08 am

The way the NFC east is playing, the Pack will have to win the division to get in the playoffs. Not happening. Maybe they should take a cue from the Colts, Falcons, or the Panthers from a few years ago & tank a lost season to get a top 5 pick. 5-11 should get them Arden Key or Da'Ron Payne

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ollie418's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:04 pm

Stafford made Capers his bitch!

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NickPerry's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:08 pm

THIS is the team Ted Thompson has assembled folks. The writing has been on the wall for a few years and we even got a glimpse of it in 2013 when Rodgers was hurt too. This is maybe a 4-12 team over a 16 game schedule, maybe.

Everybody has injuries but they were somewhat healthy tonight. This isn't an overly talented roster, but THAT coaching staff takes it down a few notches further. But until Mark Murphy stops making excuses or repeating the same ones Thompson and McCarthy give him after each season nothing is going to change. The only thing keeping them from a Top 5 pick this year is Rodgers winning 4 games to start the season.

THIS team will win 2 more games and that's it, probably against Tampa and Cleveland. Next week in Chicago expect the embarrassment to continue. Add QB to the ever growing list of needs to the Packers 2018 draft.

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Tundraboy's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:18 pm

Yup. Silver lining is the high picks that a 4-12 record gets us. Even MM and DC can't screw that up. Only problem is TT can, but hopefully he will be gone too. Lets pray.

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stockholder's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:25 pm

I think this team has more problems then we can count. If you look at the WRs when Nelson went down. This might be the end of A-Rod too. Nelson lost his speed. He looked like james Jones tonight. I'm not happy about any Wr. Why do I think this offense should be called the Russian Roulette.

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NickPerry's picture

November 07, 2017 at 05:17 am

If I was Rodgers I wouldn't resign there, not with THAT team. You REALLY UNDERSTAND how BAD they are without Rodgers..

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The TKstinator's picture

November 07, 2017 at 05:57 am

What would happen if Rodgers was a Bronco?

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dobber's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:51 am

I don't know, but that team shows you what happens to a team with a good defense and no QB (or OL, for that matter)....they play .500 football.

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jh9's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:07 pm

Without Aaron Rodgers, it's amazing how much this Green Bay Packers team looks like the Cleveland Browns.

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RobinsonDavis's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:10 pm

Positives (sorry...gotta try) -

*We can actually run a successful screen pass!
*Hundley can throw the ball accurately and looked more comfortable once the “chains” were off
*Martinez….again
*King had some nice plays (yes, I know he got beat a couple of times)
*The goal line stand
*BahkT looked like he was back to his ole self from what I could see on TV
*Burnett – just find a way to stay healthy, man!

*Bulaga was struggling from the get-go. He is a warrior, but can’t play as injured as he has

BAD –

*Game plans….I am convince this is a coaching issue, not just a player issue
*Detroit has shaky offensive tackles and we still could not get to the QB.
*Perry has to take a good look at his play especially (yes, I know his hand injury)
*Daniels – just set a bad tone for the D after a very successful start. Real Stupid Mike!
*Hart – poor snaps on at least 3 occasions.
*Fackrell – becoming a swear word
*If the QB can release the ball that quickly, the receivers are running free from the line, unchallenged. HIT SOMEBODY!

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dobber's picture

November 07, 2017 at 05:18 am

The offense moved the ball when they consistently put Hundley in the 'gun...you know, the offensive formation he ran all through college? Where he's going to be most comfortable? If Hundley takes another snap from under center this season (except to kill the ball), something's wrong.

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GeorgiaCheesehead's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:09 pm

I said defense wouldn’t hold Lions under 30. Lions didn’t punt. Lucky they didn’t put up 40. Do we trust in TT and MM still? Their choice to continue with Capers. Our ST still suck!!!

It’s their product no excuses should be good enough time to clean house!!!! MM, TT, MM, DC all must go...

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Pack204's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:11 pm

This is the reality without Rodgers. I put this on MM and Capers for not having evolved this defense or offense in the last 7 years. TT deserves blame in this too for drafting like dog crap. This is gonna be a slow bleed hopefully Ted doesnt totally botch the top 12 pick the team will get for being 4-12 or 5-11. This team is honestly in the bottom 3 of the league without Rodgers. It amazes me how one player has masked these major issues soo much so that the team was making it as far as it has when hes been healthy. It provides a harsh reality of what this team could be well into the future after Rodgers retires if this current regime is still in charge.

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rdent's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:14 pm

How much more do we need to see? Just like in 2013,without Aaron Rodgers Ted Thompson, MM and Dom Capers have once again been exposed as frauds! It amazes me how much AR has carried this team and has made the "three stooges" look so much better the last 10 years than they really are! I hope changes are made this offseason.

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Dzehren's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:24 pm

TT & MM had Brett Farve- don’t forget as well-

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dobber's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:53 am

They didn't have the best of Favre, though. They had the moody, petulant, prima-donna Brett Favre.

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stockholder's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:14 pm

Three straight loses. Capers still sucks. 9 guys on the line and the safeties 20 yards plus back. How can this team be burned so badly on the blitz. Did Hundley even read a blitz. Nelson lost his speed. Adams still does not know how to go all out to catch a ball. Lowry is slower this year, frackwell needs a new job. MM poor call on a 4th down. No power sweeps? This team is nothing like the championship teams of old. And we've all watched the super-bowl every year to know that.

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GBPDAN1's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:27 pm

That defense is so hard to watch. Absolutely no pass rush, so blitzing becomes necessary, which of course gets burnt and gouged for big plays. I'm so glad we are paying big money for our edge rushers. Detroit was down to their 3rd LT, then 4th LT....still no 4 man pressure.

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Mojo's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:27 pm

What happened to Dean Lowry? He was all world in the preseason.

Oops, forgot, that was the preseason.

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Mojo's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:33 pm

Since this season has gone down the tubes, I can take solace in just about the only thing that's gone right this season - GB finally took the all-time series lead against the Bears. At least for one more week. The Bears are a three point favorite.

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:36 pm

Win or lose I love my Packers. I will watch them no matter what.

Is this tough to watch? Yes it is. But I love my team and will continue to watch.

I thought Hundley looked better this game then last game. I think moving forward they can take a lot of things of what Hundley can do and build more game plans off of it.

Currently we are 4-4. Things look bleak. Many are throwing the towel in on the season. But for me I only get 16 games and if we are lucky more a year to watch my team. Win or lose I'm going to watch and cheer on my team!

Go Pack Go!

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

November 07, 2017 at 05:11 am

Hundley looked like an NFL QB on that throw to Kendricks in the 4th quarter. I expect a talented #1 WR to catch the pass that D. Adams didn't lay out for. I've got a slew of caveats on Hundley, but I'll just write that if the game slows down for Hundley, he has enough ability to play in the NFL.

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 07, 2017 at 06:48 am

I thought he looked a lot better, and as the game went on, he seemed to get more comfortable.
I thought he looked much better in the hurry up offense. Perhaps McCarthy should run that more next week. Shotgun and hurry up.

Adams has to make a better attempt at that pass to him. It was a good throw.

I agree. Hundley has the abilities. He just needs the game to slow down for him.

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Tundraboy's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:04 am

Hell will freeze over before MM changes anything that can make a lasting difference with this team. Therefore he must go sooner than later.

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Tundraboy's picture

November 07, 2017 at 10:55 pm

I agree with you RC and I try to find a positive wherever possible with ARod out, making progress in other areas, new approaches, utilizing the full roster, but like your statement,
"Perhaps McCarthy should run that more next week. Shotgun and hurry up."

It's never going to happen with MM and crew and maddeningly he will give us a glimpse or two. He has to go and take his staff with him. Edgar too.

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:58 am

The problem with the offense and Hundley is I don't know who to blame. Is it Hundley, is it McCarthy? McCarthy is going to praise Hundley and take the blame no matter what. All those short passes early in the game, were they designed that way or were they Hundley taking the checkdown?

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HankScorpio's picture

November 07, 2017 at 09:19 am

McCarthy ducked that very question in the post game press conference. He threw out some coachspeak about reading the coverage, blah, blah.
It was obviously the plan. ESPN stats said 13 of the 18 first half passes were 5 yards downfield or less. At one point Hundley had something like 8-8 completions for 27 yards.

In the end, you cannot move the ball without the defense respecting the downfield pass...unless you're playing against a Capers defense. In that case, pretty much anything is going to work. And maybe that is why McCarthy has pronounced such public support for Hundley when it is obvious to anyone with eyes that he stinks. MM has seen Hundley tear up the Packer defense in practice after practice. If only the Packers offense could get a shot at the Packer defense in real games.

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Finwiz's picture

November 07, 2017 at 09:05 am

That was as close to a perfectly thrown ball as you'll ever see to Adams on that play. Give Hundley credit on that one. Adams looked like a guy that didn't want to play, or at the very least, didn't want to try very hard. Pretty much like the rest of the team - uninspired. That ball should have been caught, and set an early tone for the rest of the game. Disappointing effort by Adams.

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Bearmeat's picture

November 07, 2017 at 06:35 am

Ever the eternal optimist, RC. I posted this in another thread, but it applies here too:

I respect being an optimist, and I will always watch as well, but that's where we will always disagree. I am a fan, but I refuse to be a lemming. The Packers are a bad football team right now, and their chance to recover and make it to the playoffs is slightly larger than laughable. Not with this defense and not without a great QB to score a whole lot of points.

Calling a spade what it is, isn't giving up. It's being an intelligent fan. As much as it pains me to say it, the best thing that could happen for the Packers long term now is to be so bad for the rest of the year that big changes are made, and we get some high draft picks. We are not going to win the super bowl without massive defensive changes.

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 07, 2017 at 06:46 am

What in what i said is optimistic?
I said I thought Hundley looked better, which he did. Was he perfect. No. Was he good. not really. But he looked better.

I said i love my team and I will watch them no matter what.

Also, I love the hate. Disliking my comment because I said I love my team and will watch them no matter what...
Apparently I'm not supposed to love my team and am supposed to not watch them?

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Bearmeat's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:25 am

First of all, I didn't downvote you on purpose. Apologies.

Second, we both love our team. You are just looking at (and typing towards) the bright side. What little there is left of it. OF COURSE watching the Packers is a good thing! Some of my fondest memories as a child is of watching the Packers on a cold fall day with my dad. And that was when they were AWFUL! (Side note, does anyone else remember Tim Harris, Chuck Cecil and Mark Lee - man, this defense would KILL for players like that right now)

I'm going to love the Packers, come hell or high water. But I'm also not going to not point out the warts on this roster. They've made mistake after mistake since 2011 in personnel and coaching. And frankly, I'm SICK of it. This team, in this era, with this QB, should have THREE Lombardis by now. But the rest of the team has proven they're inept.

That has me seeing red. I'm pissed. QBs like Rodgers are a once in a lifetime thing, and we've WASTED 7 years of his career! 2 Lombardis between QB12 and QB4 is NOT enough, and with the state of this roster, I don't see any quick fixes coming!

So I want heads to roll. Lots of them. Personnel staff. Coaches. Players. And I'm NOT going to stop shouting that from the rooftops.

There. Rant over. And it's not a rant at you. Just at the sky. Old man yells at cloud. That's me right now.

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:27 am

I didn't say you downvoted me. Honestly I don't vote at all, so if you ever get a like or dislike its not from me...

Yes, we both do love our team. I don't disagree with that at all.. And I am an optimist. But my whole post basically was just saying that I love my team and will watch them no matter what.
I din't say anything was good from last nights game. I thought Hundley looked better but not great.

I agree with what your saying. I'm at the breaking point as well. Its honestly time for Capers to go. Also I'm at the point that its time to let Thompson go. I am fine with keeping McCarthy.
But they need a new voice on defense and they need a GM willing to make stronger moves. One that is willing to work with the coaches and do what they want.

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

November 07, 2017 at 10:05 am

RC: read the link. Look closely at all the routes that Davante Adams ran. Only three routes more than 10 yards downfield. I know there might be sight adjustments, but this tells me that the game plan was all short throws, and this is mostly on MM.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000873618/article/packers-offense-u...

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4thand1's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:46 pm

I was hoping for something different. After the bye usually this team is really good. But it had AR, and we still have Capers. Detroit knew where every blitz was coming from all night. Every team knows their defensive scheme, but MM will still say what a great coach old man Capers is. They won't change shit, but I will. I'm not watching this poor excuse of a team the rest of this year. By firing Capers would send a message to the rest of the team, don't produce you're out.

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Minniman's picture

November 06, 2017 at 11:57 pm

I'm salty that with still circa 10 mill in cap space TT didn't look at Dwight Freeney to shore up the pass pressure - I had him as the sleeper signing of the bye week..... he was a monster for Seattle in the short bursts that they (smartly) used him in.

Definitely restructure Clay and Randall for next year, hopefully not lose them, but to go with a depth strategy, as we seem to fall off a cliff depth-wise after the starters (some of whom are on more of box than a cliff!).

I also echo the sentiments of previous posters about press coverage........... Marvin Jones burning you for a chunk play..........GTFOOH!

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Malland56's picture

November 07, 2017 at 12:28 am

Hopefully not lose them?!!! My god they stink up the place. I have watched every play of CM for 3 and a half seasons now and he just stinks. Watch him the next 3 games and you tell me how bad he plays. I mean every play. He hasn't been doubled team in 3 years because they can handle him one on one all the time. He might get buy a guy once in while but for him being a pass rushing threat, NO WAY.

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Minniman's picture

November 07, 2017 at 05:12 am

Ha ha, I can't defend that......which makes it more important to free up his $$$.

Perry must still be injured because he too was absent when needed tonight.

Kyler Fackrell needs to be released immediately, he's like having only 10 men on the field.....his heart just isn't in the contest as an edge rusher.

Biegel looked like he could be interesting to watch progress over the coming weeks - not TJ Watt though........

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Malland56's picture

November 07, 2017 at 12:22 am

It's plain as the nose on my face now that Capers has to go and not at the end of the season but right now.

It has become real clear that AR has won most of the games for us because he puts more points on the board so the other teams can't catch up. Agree with most of this?

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Malland56's picture

November 07, 2017 at 12:30 am

It does also boil down to BAD coaching in my book. And that means all the coaches.

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TommyG's picture

November 07, 2017 at 01:12 am

I have been a DC apologist for a long time. While I still believe in the 3-4 defense (which we hardly ever run in pure form) I do not have faith in Dom's ability to manage this D. Former players having league leading seasons tells me that this team has talent and maybe always has; heck, I even saw Zombo making plays yesterday. So the problems we saw today are not a player talent issue, in my opinion.

Losing AR means that the D must spend more time on the field, and that the D cannot rely on an explosive offense to bail them out. Our defense has always been best when playing with a lead. Once the opponent became one dimensional our D would often be fairly dominant. Today the Lions played one dimensionally and trounced our D.

Calling MM a guru ever again is hereby forbidden. Hundley has been onboard for nearly three years yet still looks scared to throw down field. Sure, he finally did so when there was nothing to lose, but we all saw the replays of him hitting check downs for three quarters while Jordy and Cobb ran free. Can Hundley get better? Absolutely! He can also gain experience and confidence. But that growth will come from his own experience and mentorship by AR, not by MM; MM had his chance and produced nothing.

MM's performance as a game planner may actually have been okay today. At first I was upset at all the short plays, but on review Hundley is more to blame here as he didn't go through his reads well and quickly went to the check down.

Hundley needs to find his own confidence. He also needs to realize that he is no longer in college and can beat everyone with his legs. In his defense, the OL gave him very little time, but he also bailed pretty early several times.

Basically, losing AR has made everyone's job harder. Even with two weeks to prepare none of them seemed ready. Perhaps they will all feel this pain and take it out on the Bears. I'll be honest, if the bears hang a repeat of this game on our packers, then I too will hang up this season and just enjoy the ride.

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baldski's picture

November 07, 2017 at 02:11 am

I think Hundley needs training in surveying the field. He telegraphs where he is going to throw with his eyes. Rogers eyes are all over the field when he drops back, maybe he can train Hundley.

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Minniman's picture

November 07, 2017 at 05:01 am

I agree. I went back and re-watched the game and thought that he forgot that he even had a left side of the field in the first half, but throughout the match had a propensity to bail out of the pocket early, and has a tendency to bail to the right (shrinking his field options). AR needs to teach him that pirouette move to his left, which keeps the field open.

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Bure9620's picture

November 07, 2017 at 05:47 am

SO, let's be clear was HUNDLEY great? No of course not, but he played fine. Blaming him would be lazy here. But one thing I agree with McCarthy on is this team has bigger issues. Anyone like the 4th down Jet sweep?? Holy crap, Quinn blew that up before we had blockers set. How Capers continually gets chances with no improvement is beyond me. We held them to less than 2 yards per carry, and the Lions still converted 3rd and Longs and never punted??? They beat us at home and did not punt for the first time since 1971. This defense has no chance with Capers and we would have a tough time even with A rod healthy, bailing us out. Let's not forget we were 4-6 last year WITH him. It took Rodgers playing out of his mind to get us to the playoffs. This team has significant issues. I am NOT a fire everyone person, I believe in stability, but I think Capers needs to go during the season.
Things are more bleak than I thought. Pretty disconcerting when you are not even in a game at home against the Lions. That was a clean ass kicking, not a close one at all. This could be a long season. The Packers are resistant to change at the top, but they need that more than ever now.

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Finwiz's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:10 am

People have to face the fact they may have lost this game even with TWELVE playing QB. The defense WAS that BAD!!!

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Tundraboy's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:19 am

"Pretty disconcerting when you are not even in a game at home against the Lions. That was a clean ass kicking, not a close one at all."

And that is why MM and DC have to go. That is unacceptable. Two weeks to prepare and that disgrace? I have to go back a long time to see a game where we never had a chance. Could feel it when score was 7-0

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Coldworld's picture

November 07, 2017 at 06:03 am

We are stale and risk averse. The person best versed in Capers D appeared to be Stafford. We failed to blitz successfully for the entire game, yet we have speed aplenty against a team that has been an open door. That is not aggression it's a sign of a lack of ideas or the nerve to try different options. On offense, after the first series we went to ultra conservative play calling, allowed the Lions to gain confidence and a lead and only then did we risk passes to receivers down field. For another week, the opponent knew by then that passing was the only option. More pressure on Hundley: a QB that seems to lack the self belief necessary to impose himself.

Overall, one can't win football games unless one scores. For the second game I am left wondering what the point is of football with a complete lack of agressive offense is. It only magnifies the obvious bankruptcy of our defensive schemes.

For that reason, this game was about much more than Capers. I like Mike McCarthy. He is a good coach and perhaps could be again, but I am coming to the view that he will only do so with a change of scene.

The last few weeks show that, while the root cause may be the front office, the problems in the coaching leadership are as deep set and fundamental. We need decisive change. We may need to get worse now to prevent our players from long term regression and to get better for the long term.

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

November 07, 2017 at 10:08 am

Well, I have some quibbles but the phrase suggesting that the player with the best understanding of Don's defense was Stafford is priceless.

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fthisJack's picture

November 07, 2017 at 07:28 am

i've been bichin about Capers for 5 years now. the powers that kept him this long should be sent packing along with him. what other ream in this league would put up with this sh!! show defense for this long? it is pathetic and the players have given up. time for a good housecleaning while we still have 12.

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pacman's picture

November 07, 2017 at 07:57 am

The biggest worry I have is that the Hundley Packers improve a bit and they win a couple games and Murphy gives MM / DC a pass on the season to try again next year.

A bunch of us here have been calling for DC to go for a long time. Almost as many for MM to go. And I'm not the biggest technical expert on the game. I just never saw anything more than a few games here and there with great calling and it has been clear for so long that the defense coaching is simply bad - the tackling, the 3rd/4th and long fails, etc. There have been too many embarrassing games over the years.

It's time for all the 'owners' to make themselves heard somehow. Maybe they shouldn't be showing up to games. That's pretty drastic. But if this team had an owner, I would imagine DC gets a pink slip today. How can Murphy stand this? It's one thing to be embarrassed. It's another to be infuriating.

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Bure9620's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:04 am

As we are currently standing in raw sewage, allow me me to unearth the positive parts of the game. Dean Lowry turns out to be a great pick, he is coming into his own, he's disruptive and had a couple of sacks, Kenny Clark was strong at the point of attack and solid against the run.. blah. Blah...whom am I kidding this team is bad, hahahha

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Finwiz's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:07 am

Up to this point in the Packer season, I've been able to keep things in perspective, and not get to low over the Rodgers injury. Until last night.

I went to bed angry, couldn't sleep I was so pissed, slept angry when I finally went to sleep, and of course WOKE UP ANGRY!

This defense is a laughing stock joke, and I am SICK OF IT! Does anybody else around here realize this is the FIRST TIME since 1971 the Detroit Lions, the losers of the NFL, have gone an entire game without PUNTING ONCE???? WTF?????

SOMEBODY SHOULD BE FIRED TODAY, and a message should be sent.

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Archie's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:18 am

Glad to see most of Packerdom has finally come around to realize that the king has no clothes on. 2010 Super Bowl was a fluke. TT is not a good GM. MM is not a good HC and Dom Capers is not a good DC. And Marky Murphy is not a good President, not to see this for himself. Time for all to go. Full reboot and hope 12 re-ups.

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JDK52's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:19 am

deleted

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JDK52's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:20 am

It's been a while since my team could be considered hot trash. Ugh.

My only consolation is that the Broncos (I'm in Denver) also suck right now. So at least I don't have to listen to trash talking from my neighbors and coworkers.

Anyone else get the sick feeling that Rodgers won't stay in GB after his current contract is up? That's definitely my worst nightmare right now, far worse than going 4-12. I just can't imagine he's even remotely okay with this organization after seeing the utter incompetence on the field the last couple games.

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dobber's picture

November 07, 2017 at 09:19 am

Maybe it's just what this organization needs...

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Couch Cleats's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:21 am

Everyone that is ripping Hundley needs to check themselves for a bit. Everyone knows that practice and preseason isn't the same as getting real reps in games that count. This kid is just now getting his chance to learn (which is normally from watching film of the mistakes you made). He's also trying to do it as a 5th round pic with the pressure of being compared to AR. I fully expect him to make mistakes - this is his time to go through the learning process.

My issue is that Capers time for mistakes has long since passed and his unit does nothing to improve and is obviously incapable of upping their game to try to cover for an inexperienced QB going through his learning stage. Rodgers covers for them every week and now we know just how much.

TT's defensive drafting might be as much or more to blame than DC's scheme since we don't have anyone that can get to the QB even against a patchwork OL like the Lions just brought to town even on fresh legs from the bye week. Either way, it's time for a change in leadership on that side of the ball. Fire DC and see if the players respond with more effort. Now is the time since there is nothing to lose for the rest of this season.

My wish is that we have a new GM using what looks like some pretty high pics next year and consulting with a new Defensive Coordinator when he makes them. I would select that new Defensive Coordinator with the idea in mind that he might be my new head coach in the very near future.

I don't believe MM should get the opportunity to pic the next DC and if he insists then let him go be "A highly successful head coach" somewhere else too. AR is basically an offensive coordinator with a helmet anyway, so I don't think it will affect this team much at all to have a new offensive mind in the coaching staff.

This team needs to build a great defense around AR as soon as possible so that he doesn't have to keep dragging them into the playoffs in his late 30's and early 40's.

BTW - I thought that Lions team sucked too. The schedule this year is so soft it almost concerns me that they will fool everyone into looking like a decent team that just needs its QB back again. They are NOT!

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HankScorpio's picture

November 07, 2017 at 12:07 pm

"Everyone that is ripping Hundley needs to check themselves for a bit. "

No, we don't. Flynn and Rodgers both spent 3 years on the bench learning MM's offense. Both hit the ground running. I don't think anyone is expecting a Rodgers-like performance. But we have every right to expect a Flynn-like performance. Hundley isn't anywhere close to even that.

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Packatron's picture

November 07, 2017 at 01:35 pm

This. So much this.

I was expecting much more from Hundley. Especially considering he's been studying at the QB School of Mr. Highly Successful.

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al bundy's picture

November 07, 2017 at 01:02 pm

Look, when I hear about a QB picked in the fifth round and people are saying wow what a steal, I;m saying, wait, 31 teams passed on this guy up to 5 times, some more some less but he was on NO ONES radar and Ted T aint that smart.
Did not know till last night he was Mr interception and had the record for the most sacks. He wants thinking time to avoid interceptions in college and was sacked all the time. That alone dont translate to the NFL where the game is twice as fast.
I'll give him one more game to prove himself but am expecting nothing really. This is season three for him.

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Couch Cleats's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:21 am

Everyone that is ripping Hundley needs to check themselves for a bit. Everyone knows that practice and preseason isn't the same as getting real reps in games that count. This kid is just now getting his chance to learn (which is normally from watching film of the mistakes you made). He's also trying to do it as a 5th round pic with the pressure of being compared to AR. I fully expect him to make mistakes - this is his time to go through the learning process.

My issue is that Capers time for mistakes has long since passed and his unit does nothing to improve and is obviously incapable of upping their game to try to cover for an inexperienced QB going through his learning stage. Rodgers covers for them every week and now we know just how much.

TT's defensive drafting might be as much or more to blame than DC's scheme since we don't have anyone that can get to the QB even against a patchwork OL like the Lions just brought to town even on fresh legs from the bye week. Either way, it's time for a change in leadership on that side of the ball. Fire DC and see if the players respond with more effort. Now is the time since there is nothing to lose for the rest of this season.

My wish is that we have a new GM using what looks like some pretty high pics next year and consulting with a new Defensive Coordinator when he makes them. I would select that new Defensive Coordinator with the idea in mind that he might be my new head coach in the very near future.

I don't believe MM should get the opportunity to pic the next DC and if he insists then let him go be "A highly successful head coach" somewhere else too. AR is basically an offensive coordinator with a helmet anyway, so I don't think it will affect this team much at all to have a new offensive mind in the coaching staff.

This team needs to build a great defense around AR as soon as possible so that he doesn't have to keep dragging them into the playoffs in his late 30's and early 40's.

BTW - I thought that Lions team sucked too. The schedule this year is so soft it almost concerns me that they will fool everyone into looking like a decent team that just needs its QB back again. They are NOT!

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Tundraboy's picture

November 07, 2017 at 10:18 am

Perfect. Just perfect. Nothing more to add here.

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Couch Cleats's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:24 am

Sorry for the double post. I should get an Unnecessary Roughness call for hitting the "Submit Comment" button so hard - Ala Mike Daniels.

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dobber's picture

November 07, 2017 at 08:58 am

Did you hit it with the crown of your helmet?

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BillofAltoona's picture

November 07, 2017 at 10:48 am

No wonder Rodgers broke his collarbone. He's been carrying McCarthy, his coaching staff and 51 other players.

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al bundy's picture

November 07, 2017 at 12:58 pm

Ya think? Hey he would have broken it last night if he was playing with that piss poor pass protection. Beluga was getting beat, Bahtari sucked, the whole O line sucked. They cant run or pass block.

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al bundy's picture

November 07, 2017 at 12:55 pm

I have to keep thinking of that smug attitude of MM saying "we dont need a great defense, we have Rogers we just need to score more points than the other team".
Ya how is that working for ya mikey. Now he is starting to bitch about the defense and saying dont blame the Offense.
I say for all you loyal pack fans on this board, the best thing that can happen to you is for the pack to lose out the rest of the way and d to stink it up big time.

Its the only way to get rid of Capers and Ted t and start over spending money and getting some real picks. House and Dix suck. They are useless. Perry got his money he dont care. Mathews is a nothing burger. Ryan is too slow. Fackrell should be working in a car wash. Daniels had his one good game for the year. This team is a dumpster fire

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Finwiz's picture

November 07, 2017 at 01:17 pm

Literally LOL at the "Fackrell working in a car wash" comment!
I wonder if he'd look lost working there too.

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Packatron's picture

November 07, 2017 at 01:41 pm

Straight fire! LOL.

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mrj007's picture

November 07, 2017 at 02:30 pm

My first impression was that the Packer's run to a super bowl in 2017 is officially over. For so long - all of the 70's, 80's and early 90's had a point (almost immeditately after watching 1-3 games) where the comment "maybe next year". This team is at that point.
Darius Slay owes Jordy Nelson a meal and a movie. Perry and Matthews are invisible. Biegel flashed. Hundley can't make a pass more than 5 yds. McCarthy had to abandon what looked like a promising run game becuase.....defense. No punts by Detroit. McCarthy is only good stating the obvious, but can't really "fix" anything. There is no pass rush. And it didn't seem like the secondary covered particularly well. New long snapper can't snap.

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Tarynfor12's picture

November 07, 2017 at 05:35 pm

Hundley with his gum chewing and facial expression reminds me of Huggy Bear from the 70's Starsky and Hutch tv show. ...he wasn't a good player/actor either.
Told you for years....this team is loaded with C/ C- players and we know who they are....deniers still?

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GBPDAN1's picture

November 08, 2017 at 07:28 pm

Huggy Bear....lol

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