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Vikings 24 Packers 17: Game Balls & Lame Calls

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Vikings 24 Packers 17: Game Balls & Lame Calls

The Green Bay Packers visit Minnesota, the Green Bay Packers go home losers.  Again.

This time, the loss likely ends any real hope the Packers have to contend for the division or a postseason spot.  

On to the night's best and worst.

Game Balls

Davante Adams

Adams had Vikings cornerback Xavier Rhodes on him most of the evening and still managed to win most of the head-to-head match up's.  Adams had a touchdown catch and is the only receiver on this team that can make something more out of very little or nothing.

Stud.  End of story.

Kenny Clark

Clark mauled the Vikings offensive line all night when he wasn't getting held.  He added a sack on the night because, as usual, the linebackers couldn't get there and do it.

Clay Matthews

Clay made several hustle plays on defense and let's be honest, the curve for "game balls" in this game was very low.  Someone's gotta round out this side of the list.

Lame Calls

4th Down Play Call

Mike McCarthy never learns.  He pulled out the old "end zone run in LA" play call after finally going for it on fourth down like he should have earlier in the game and. . . it was stuffed.

Reason number 896 why McCarthy won't likely survive beyond this season as Packers head coach.  Just awful.

Kentrell Brice

Got dinged up and was removed in favor of street free agent safety Ibraheim Campbell.  Badly whiffed on a few tackle attempts.  The one tackle he did make, he nearly knocked himself out on.  I've seen enough of Brice, have you? 

Tramon Williams

Let's a punt bounce into him and loses possession late in the game.  This guy is supposed to be the sure-handed veteran rock for this team and does that?  That won't do anything to quiet those calling Williams "washed up".

The Rest of the Secondary

Josh Jones, Josh Jackson, Tramon at times.  Injuries forced a very young and raw group into action in this game and they didn't disappoint on what we would have (or should have) expected.

Offensive Line Injuries

Byron Bell, Lane Taylor and David Bakhtiari all missed snaps in this one.  The results were what you'd expect: horrific.  There's a reason back up's are back up's but the Packers severely lack any semblance of depth on the line.  An area of big emphasis this offseason.

2018 Green Bay Packers - Special Mention to Aaron Rodgers

A team that can't play a complete game or step up when they need a big play gets a collective lame call and insert a fart sound for good measure. 

I'm getting tired of watching Aaron Rodgers' disgusted face after every series.  Many of those series end because he's not aware of what he can and can't do effectively.  Apparently, that includes missing wide open receivers in the end zone late in key games.  The question is, is this a 2018 thing or is this life as Rodgers now?

This team is so boring, please send beer.

-------------------

Jason is a freelance writer on staff since 2012 and also co-hosts Pulse of the Pack podcast.  You can follow him on Twitter here

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Fan friendly comments only: off Comments (125) This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.

ollie418's picture

Lame Calls:

NO QB sneak on 4th down.

Packers tackling.

Clock management (again!)

Play calling.

Old School's picture

We don't do QB sneaks because we don't want Rodgers to get another concussion. That's the reason.

I agree that we hurt ourselves with some insufficient tackling zeal. I'm going to particularly single out Josh Jones here.

The plays are fine. We're not executing.

JimR_in_SoCal's picture

I’ve seen other QBs do it. Without concussions.

Old School's picture

Me too. Brady is really tall wilth long arms and he kind of lunges and extends his arms. Brees has a nice jump. Newton is just a good between the tackles runner.

But after Rodgers got a concussion on a sneak against (?Detroit??) the organization made a collective decision on this and decided that they weren't going to risk a concussion for a guy who already had one doing a sneak. Especially when he's so freakin' valuable.

Anyway....President, GM, HC, Rodgers himself, the medical staff, etc. all kicked this around and it's been the consensus opinion that we're not going to do that.

I'm not arguing for or against the wisdom of this; I'm just saying it is what it is.

ollie418's picture

MM gets out "adjusted" EVERY second half. What does he do at halftime? Pull his pud?

Stic's picture

Can't pull what you don't have. Lol

Klincker's picture

Well done, Jason.

Packers0808's picture

Rodgers got his money and seems not to care any more! Seems like he is just playing to get paid! And for McCarthy for what he has really what do you expect him to do magic> He is no Houdini like no coach has! Really believe let him coach through this rebuild and he will be fine!

stockholder's picture

MM isn't Houdini. The special teams must be changed. The DL is a failure. I which we had a ILB. Why hasn't Pet tried CM3 in the middle? This team is going no place even if they do change coaches. The defense had zero turn overs. The blitz was to easily picked up.

sonomaca's picture

The ST is terrible game after game. Do they not practice?

Old School's picture

IMO, they've played a direct role in several of our six losses.

Tramon's muffed punt, plus we allowed a long return.
Montgomery's Boner.
The fake punts.
The multiple missed kicks at Detroit.
The missed kick in the tie at home against Minnesota.

Imagine that if we win two games that we lost and we're 6-4-1, or 7-3?

IF I WERE THE SPECIAL TEAMS GURU

I would fair catch every punt. The return team would focus on not allowing fakes to succeed every time and on perhaps pressuring the punter into a bad kick. We would take no more "blocking in the back" penalties, and we wouldn't get anybody hurt on returns.

Stop returning kicks if you can take a touchback. And instruct Crosby to kick every ball through the endzone if possible, which it usually is for him.

On field goals, I just think that we should go for it more often on 4th down. A TD and a two-point conversion is worth almost 3 field goals.

Minniman's picture

I agree that the D-line that suited up at Minnesota was always going to struggle to assert themselves - especially sans Daniels and Mo Wilk - .... and add in that the EDGE players weren't able to create any counter pressure.

However I'm not saying that this position group is in need of the rebuild that say the EDGE and Safety group is.

dobber's picture

How many times did the Packers rush 3 last night? More often that we'd like...although Clark got his sack on a 3-man rush...

Minniman's picture

Clarifying my point Dobber (in case I misinterpreted you), I think that the D-line with Daniels, Wilk and Clark are formidable, but without 2 of that 3 and a sustained edge presence to offset this then they were going to struggle.

To that point, in the context of the whole game it looked like the Vikings O-line were able to preserve a reasonable pocket for Cousins to work in...... and as this isn't a well rated offensive unit, the point magnifies.

dobber's picture

I think we were on the same page. :)

Bearmeat's picture

This team isn't as talented as KC or NO. But it is (or was) plenty talented to make a deep postseason run. It was the most talented Packers team since 2014 for sure. Two men, and two men alone, guaranteed that wouldn't happen this year:

Mike McCarthy and Aaron Rodgers. They both need to be held to account. McCarthy needs to be fired. And Aaron needs to be reminded that he is not in charge of anyone but himself. His play has been very mediocre this year. Dare I even say, Ryan Fitzpatrick-ian without the INTs.

Rodgers needs to take a good long hard look in the mirror this off-season. He needs to come back in 19, ready to play team ball and completely get rid of the Jay Cutler-esque vibe.

Guam's picture

I wish I could be as optimistic as you are about the talent level Bearmeat, but I just don't see it. I believe the Packers have some very strong players, but there are too many holes in the starting line-up and too little depth in too many areas.

RG is a disaster; LG is just adequate; and interior line depth is non-existent.

Graham is just okay, Lewis and Kendricks probably need to go and Tonyan is unproven.

The WR group is really just Adams, an overrated Cobb and a bunch of unproven talent.

OLB is a disaster, starters and depth.

ILB lacks depth.

Safety is a disaster, starters and depth.

And then we have the coaching staff...……..

In preseason I believed this would be a rebuilding year and 2019 would be our year. Now I am not so sure about 2019. Lots of holes and a potentially declining Rodgers. Gute has a lot of work to do this offseason to make us competitive.

sonomaca's picture

McCarthy has a couple nice play calls early, then went right back to: “okay, everyone just go out.”

That’s not going to work with Griffin and Richardson bearing down every play.

Bearmeat's picture

I agree with you about OLB, RG and Graham... But by your reasoning, literally 95% of the teams in the NFL have poor personnel. This isn't Madden and there are no super teams. Every team has holes.

We have promise at FS and SS. Young guys who have shown something. That doesn't mean we can't make efforts to improve there, but there is ability. CB and WR and RB will be bright spots for years to come.

I still think 2019, with a much needed new coaching staff and a traditional GM structure, will be our year.

dobber's picture

"This isn't Madden and there are no super teams. Every team has holes."

This is why good coaching is all the more important in today's NFL.

Guam's picture

I really hope you are right. I am so tired of watching the current mess. I agree a new coaching staff and proper organizational structure could significantly help.

I have less confidence in the young safeties than you have. Jones and Brice take too many bad angles and miss too many tackles for my taste. I believe Pettine is a good defensive coach and a year of his coaching hasn't helped much.

Even with an extra 1st, 4th and 6th round draft choices, Gute will be stretched to fill all these holes and even then it will all be with rookies. He will have to be highly successful in free agency to get the Packers up to the talent level of the Rams and the Saints by 2019.

Old School's picture

Mess?? You don't know what a mess is. Live through the Long Dry Spell of 1972-1992 and talk to me about messes. I LOVE watching this, good and bad. Regardless of what our record ends up being, I got to watch that great comeback in the opener against the Bears. That alone was awesome.

We haven't even had one year under the new organizational structure. If there's something "improper" about it, I don't know what it is yet.

A new coaching staff. That would include Pettine, correct? So we'd have our 3rd defensive coordinator in 3 years and we'd be rebuilding around a 36 year old, expensive QB on the downside of his career....but we'd expect him to thrive under the "new system".

Jones …...I'm disappointed in him too. He really looks like a player but then he whiffs on a tackle or something and I wonder if he'll ever do more than tease. He's not a safety, I guarantee.

Brice....was never supposed to be our starting safety. We released Burnett and the thinking was that Jones would be the guy, except he can't cover. So by the end of training camp, Brice had solidified his spot as the starter.

He's the starter because we don't have anybody better. And the fact that he sucked it up and played hurt in a "must win" game tells me that he's got his priorities in place. I like guys like that. Jimmy Graham did it, too, and some others. Some guys sat with hammy's or something....I don't want them around next year.

We got rid of Burnett, Dix, Rollins, Randall, House, and Whitehead. Did you ever stop to wonder why Brice is still the starter?

Guam's picture

I suspect I am at least as old as you are Old School. I watched the long drought from '72 to '92, but started out watching Lombardi build his great teams in the '60's. I have been around long enough to call this year's team a mess.

I wasn't questioning why Jones and Brice are playing (having let Burnett and HHCD go, the reason is fairly obvious), just that they need to be replaced. They aren't good enough to start for championship teams.

I have questioned the current organization structure many times in other posts and will not repeat myself here other than to say the current structure does not allow for clear cut lines of responsibility and that is usually a problem.

I would like to see Pettine retained, but that is less of a priority than replacing MM. If a new HC wants to bring in his own DC, so be it. I can live with a complete new staff as long as the HC is not McCarthy.

And finally Rodgers. Rodgers is smart and talented. He can thrive in other systems than McCarthy's, just like Brees learned to thrive under Sean Payton.

jeepingmakooi's picture

Wr group is a bunch of rookies and Adams basically all year... The year 2 jump in the play level of this team I think will be huge... Think the DB... Look how many rookies and second year players are on this squad..... We talent.. we just have no one to harness it

Bearmeat's picture

THIS.

Minniman's picture

Yes, the well known Achilles-heal of the 2018 Packers was the step-down to the backup players.

Regarding Rodgers "decline", only time will tell if you nailed that call but at the moment there's factors that muddy those waters:
1) a knee-injury to him that was clearly worse than reported and affected him for a number of weeks
2) the number #3 receiver go on IR
3) the number #2 receiver on extended injury leave
4) the #1 tight end play injured and be on limited snaps

I'm not sure if it's a decline, but Rodgers has always been guilty of having his favored targets. He now has to work with WR #1 and a bunch of fresh faces......which is exposing that philosophy.

One observation is that with Rodgers' proclivity to scramble, I'd like to see the rookie receivers and TE's scramble back to the QB better when he's on the move - but I guess that's the difference between a vet and a rookie.....the knowledge of when to stay in a slowly developing route or bail and give the QB a second-phase option.

RCPackerFan's picture

This team definitely has talent... It should be better then what it is.

I don't know what the problem is to be honest. Sometimes its scheme, sometimes its the QB. Well actually a lot of time the QB.. But Some of that is probably from scheme.

The writing is changing from pencil to a sharpie that McCarthy won't be back. But regardless Rodgers has to do some serious soul searching. His refusal to simply take what defenses gives him is just gut wrenching.

This is reminding me of 2005 when Favre was at the end of his career and looked washed up. McCarthy came in and corrected Favre's next few years. Can a new coach do that for Rodgers?
Or is Rodgers going to be a shell of himself?
Is Rodgers going to take well to a new staff and scheme?
Look at how much Rodgers has resented new QB coaches and new OC's. How will he handle a new regime?

And if Rodgers struggles in an offense that was built around him and the only one he has ever known, how long will it take for him to get going in a new system?

Either way, they have some talent to work with on offense. And having the 3 rookies getting a lot of playing time, they should be much better next year.

Thegreatreynoldo's picture

I can't pinpoint the main issues. Scheme though is a red herring. If the scheme is good, then AR doesn't play well in that scheme or refuses to play within the scheme. Bye, MM. If the scheme is bad, MM failed to take the scrub brush to it and should be fired. Bye, MM.

Thegreatreynoldo's picture

Bubba had his paw on the keyboard. Deleted duplicate post.

Thegreatreynoldo's picture

Can I blame Bubba for the same post in triplicate? IDK what happened. Deleted anyway.

Old School's picture

If the "scheme" or the "playbook" or the "play-calling" is bad, then how does one account for a total offense ranking in the Top 10 most of the season so far?

The Elephant In The Room is why you would replace McCarthy (with somebody who might well replace Pettine) in order to rebuild around an expensive 35 year old QB with a growing injury history on the backside of his career?

I'm not sure that's a real good plan.

Tundraboy's picture

Not rebuilding we just need to fix the huge hole at head coach and special teams ,to as others pointed to harness the talent we have.

dobber's picture

"If the "scheme" or the "playbook" or the "play-calling" is bad, then how does one account for a total offense ranking in the Top 10 most of the season so far?"

Three words: Garbage time.

Free agent's picture

Two Words

Skip greenBayless's picture

Agree Old School. That's why I proposed the only sure way to keep Pettine is to reunite him with his mentor Rex Ryan and make Rex your next head coach. They become a defensive oriented football team for the first time in a long long time. You change the team's mindset of high octane offense with a young gun Aaron Rodgers and no defense to a dominating defense and either an older wiser move the chains thru run and short passes Aaron Rodgers or find another qb that can. I would prefer getting Rex and trading Rodgers for as much high powered ammunition as you possibly can get.

PeteK's picture

Now we're getting crazy.

Skip greenBayless's picture

What's your sure fire way of keeping Pettine here if you fire McCarthy? I would like to hear it. That's what I thought, nothing.

HankScorpio's picture

Pettine has moved the defense off of being a complete liability. They are not great. They are ok. The defense has been a complete liability for so long that I do understand the sentiment to want to keep him around. I share it. I'd love to see him stay around, just like I wanted Jim Bates to stay as DC back when Sherman got shown the door.

But the reality is that the next HC is going to be hired to get Rodgers back to being Rodgers, first and foremost. Everything else will be a secondary consideration. This team has poured too much cap into Rodgers to play it any other way. As we all know, when MM was hired, Bates did not stick around and his replacement was not nearly as good. But MM got Favre back to playing good football and they were in the NFC CG within 2 years.

dobber's picture

True on Bates, but he also coveted the HC position and didn't get it, right? Pettine has always held to the statement that he doesn't want to be an HC again...maybe that's trying to play politics with an established coach. Maybe he's sincere.

flackcatcher's picture

Talent level there, but as you say RC, injuries wiped out what little cushion there was this year. The main problem is Rodgers on the offensive side of the ball. Even with all the youth at the play making positions, he is not executing. McCarthy is too good a coach not to make adjustments, again that is on Rodgers. (Now with the O line injuries in the third, there were moments when it didn't matter what play was called.) At the risk of repeating myself, the problem is Rodgers age and injuries have caught up to him, and he need to understand that in the future that the offense will not flow thru him all the time. If he gets humble, and corrects his mechanics like Drew Brees, this can be a super bowl team again. Frankly, I wondering if Gute regrets extending Rodgers. With all the injuries I no longer believe McCarthy is the problem because this team did not quit last night. Lots of hard choices coming for this organization.

Bearmeat's picture

I was surprised that we extended Rodgers when we did. We had him locked up for effectively 5 years - until his age 39 year. Who cares if he was pissed? He's an employee. Shut up, do your job, or quit.

I disagree about injuries though. Until the SEA TNF debacle, we were relatively healthy. Injuries haven't helped the past two weeks, but this team has simply underachieved. No excuses.

Old School's picture

Agree again. Our health was OK until recently.

The Rodgers extension, IMO, was a mistake and I thought so at the time for the reasons you stated. We had him locked up for two years and could have franchised-tagged him. Now we're chained to an older expensive QB on the downside of his career with a growing injury history.

There were options available in the draft and free agency last year. There will be again this year. Rodgers might bring quite a bit in a trade.

HankScorpio's picture

"I was surprised that we extended Rodgers when we did. We had him locked up for effectively 5 years - until his age 39 year. Who cares if he was pissed? He's an employee. Shut up, do your job, or quit."

3 months ago, I would have had more sympathy for the argument that a happy Rodgers is in the Packers best interests. That's a tough argument to square against what we've seen on the field in 2018.

And each passing game makes me more and more nervous that he's pulling a Favre....where for each thing on which he doesn't get his preferred outcome, he's going to grow more and more bitter.

dobber's picture

My belief was that they needed to let him play out his deal, then franchise him until they felt he was done. If anything, you put that chip back on his shoulder...or send him into retirement. Either way, you're looking for that next QB proactively before #12 gets too close to the end.

sonomaca's picture

Rodgers can’t scramble like he once did. He’d hold the ball for awhile, evade pass rushers, and pick up big gainers on the ground.

We knew this day would come, and we now need a scheme which allows for a less mobile QB to succeed. BTW, same thing will happen to Wilson and Newton.

Rebecca's picture

Next year. Next year. Next year. Next year. Next year. Next year. What year is that? 2011 Next year. 2012 Next year. 2013 Next year. 2014 Next year. 2015 Next year. 2016 Next year. 2017 Next year. 2018 Next year. 2019 (Rebuild year 2) Next year.

Next year.

Next year.

Next year.

dobber's picture

2019 should start now.

Get some guys some snaps. Decide who gets the new contracts and who walks. With a new coaching staff (likely) coming in, get some film on these guys so they can assess who can play in their systems before March.

Slim11's picture

Sadly, that won't happen under MM.

Last season, several, including me, wanted Joe Callahan to get some snaps with the starters on offense against the Lions in the final game. MM gave him some garbage time in the 4th quarter with GB already out of the post-season.

I like the idea but MM doesn't do that.

Minniman's picture

Are you channeling your inner Taryn today Rebecca?

Old School's picture

I remember the 2005 season differently.

Thompson had been hired as the new GM. His first draft pick was Aaron Rodgers. Favre pouted his way to 29 interceptions and 7 lost fumbles. Despite an improved defense under first year DC Bates, the Packers plummeted to 4-12.

The HC got fired. The new HC was hired. In 2006 there was a lot of back and forth between McCarthy and Favre about "throwing late and down the middle" and Favre saying "I'm going to play the way I play".

Nonetheless, in the 2nd year of this arrangement, the stars lined up and we found ourselves at home in the Championship game against the Giants. It was Favre's last game as a Packer.

So.....if you think a new HC is going to come in and teach 35 year old, multiple MVP winner Aaron Rodgers a new scheme, and that it'll renew him somehow...…..I'll believe that when I see it.

We are following the pattern of 2005. If it continues, there's going to be change at the QB position, too. We need somebody behind Rodgers. Not Kizer. We've got draft ammo to take a good QB in the first round and let him learn on the bench behind Rodgers for a little while. Rodgers isn't going to get any younger.

dobber's picture

I see the parallels, but the Favre dynamic was very different: he removed himself from the equation by retiring (allowing the Packers to move forward) and was 37 years old at the start of the 2007 season. Maybe the Packers wanted to move on, but I doubt they would have done it if he hadn't made it easy for them. Who knows what happens with this team if Favre doesn't open the door.

To get a difference-maker at QB, it's going to eat up a lot of the draft capital the Packers have acquired and seriously limit their ability to make this team better long-term. They aren't going to pick top-5, and the better QBs will likely be that high. They've committed to the piece under center, they need to secure pieces to put around him to make him as effective as he can be.

ARod is a cerebral QB. I think there's a better chance that he'll accept the challenge of a new system better than a 'fly-by-the-seat-of-his-pants' QB like Favre would. I might be overly optimistic, but in this case it's what we need to hope for because #12 isn't going anywhere and it looks like there's coaching change on the horizon.

sonomaca's picture

You want to get rid of Rodgers. No doubt Gruden would happily give you Carr and some draft capital.

barutanseijin's picture

Favre was more durable than Rodgers. He was an iron man qb. Rodgers isn't that type. It's doubtful that he plays as long as Favre because he's been more banged up.

Old School's picture

I agree with you Bearmeat. McCarthy and Rodgers share in our successes and they share in the responsibility for a very mediocre offensive performance.

If you fire McCarthy, then Rodgers has to learn a new system for the first time in his career and not continue the physical decline he's had over the last two years. If he's going to be successful at 37-38-39 it's not going to be on the run from outside the pocket, and that's been a really big part of his success in the past.

OR, you could just trade Rodgers and get an enormous bucketload of picks and available cap space to put a stronger team around a younger, cheaper QB. Hmmmmm……..

dobber's picture

Who has the draft capital and the cap space to acquire #12 without making it so they can't put a team around him?

People point to Oakland, now that they have all of Chicago's picks, but you have to ask yourself if that's enough for #12.

Is there a QB in the upcoming draft you know is going to be at least a high-end starter if not elite? The bottom line is that the Packers have enough expiring contracts and enough players that they could cut to generate some cap space, and they have enough young players who have potential, to make it possible to build around an aging #12...IF they can get him right.

Old School's picture

All good questions, dobber. I'll do my best to share what I know about this.

According to the website spotrac.com, Rodgers signed a deal that pays him nearly $100 million, guaranteed. His salary is only like one million or so, but the guaranteed is pro-rated over 5 years . Normally, we'd just have to eat the guaranteed but that won't happen, so some type of an arrangement beneficial to Rodgers, the Packers, and the trading partner would have to be made. Perhaps acquiring a player with a similar type deal from another team.....hmmmmm.

An alternative might be to try to squeeze another year or two out of Rodgers while we develop an alternative. Not Kizer.

I have no idea what Aaron Rodgers is worth in a trade. Based on Jay Cutler and Khalil Mack and some others he's clearly worth a high #1 and a player and probably another pick of some type.

I wanted Lamar Jackson in the draft last year and thought the extension of Rodgers was a mistake. Gutes first mistake.

dobber's picture

Shhh! Don't talk Lamar Jackson around these parts. I said some good things about him and got plenty of downward facing thumbs...

HankScorpio's picture

'His salary is only like one million or so, but the guaranteed is pro-rated over 5 years Normally, we'd just have to eat the guaranteed but that won't happen, so some type of an arrangement beneficial to Rodgers, the Packers, and the trading partner would have to be made."

You got it right when you said it won't happen. Rodgers was paid the $57.5 mil signing bonus already by the Packers. Unless he retires and gives it back, the CBA requires the Packers to count that against their cap. They cannot "trade" the cap allocation or negotiate it down.

So if the Packers decide to trade Rodgers in 2019, the CBA requires they take a $46 mil cap hit in 2019 for the SB money they already paid but have not yet counted vs the cap.

Old School's picture

All good questions, dobber. I'll do my best to share what I know about this.

According to the website spotrac.com, Rodgers signed a deal that pays him nearly $100 million, guaranteed. His salary is only like one million or so, but the guaranteed is pro-rated over 5 years . Normally, we'd just have to eat the guaranteed but that won't happen, so some type of an arrangement beneficial to Rodgers, the Packers, and the trading partner would have to be made. Perhaps acquiring a player with a similar type deal from another team.....hmmmmm.

An alternative might be to try to squeeze another year or two out of Rodgers while we develop an alternative. Not Kizer.

I have no idea what Aaron Rodgers is worth in a trade. Based on Jay Cutler and Khalil Mack and some others he's clearly worth a high #1 and a player and probably another pick of some type.

I wanted Lamar Jackson in the draft last year and thought the extension of Rodgers was a mistake. Gutes first mistake.

barutanseijin's picture

That sounds like a great idea but who's going to want to pick up his contract?

HankScorpio's picture

Picking up Rodgers contract would be a steal for the team acquiring him. They get him on cap hits of $15 mil-$21 mil-$22 mil for 2019-2020-2021.

He'd be 38 when that is up. If they want, they can keep him at $25 mil/yr for each of the next 2 seasons.

Total= $108 over 5 years for a HoF QB. They can walk away with no dead money at any time. That's a GM/capologist dream.

holmesmd's picture

I didn’t watch the post-game pressers yet. Can I look forward to hearing about “ pad level, injuries being part of the game, execution, and everyone needing to coach & play better”? If so please let me know and I won’t wast my time. Cousins looked like a Bozo against the Bears but like Unitas against the Packers?! Please blow this thing up....I mean a complete tear down. Screw “re-tooling” BS. Flush the toilet please!

Rick F's picture

The problem is this staff doesn’t adjust. I said it last week, that was the game they needed to win. 2-10 on third down and 0-6 on the road. This is a coaching problem not having them prepared. The offense is a mess and Rodgers is to blame also. You can’t be a serious contender with these inconsistency. You must evolve or fall behind it is that simple. MM has replaced coaches and got TT out and a voice with Murphy. Gutekunst needs to be the boss and make all the decisions. This structure sucks and overhaul is needed. Harlan let Wolfe run the football operations and he stuck to football business. They can turn it around, but MM can’t be part of it because the relationship with Rodgers is broken. New coach and let Gutekunst rebuild the roster is what is needed to win with Rodgers.

Old School's picture

You think we should rebuild around an aging, expensive QB with an injury history and have him learn a new scheme? And would the new HC replace Pettine, too.?

I don't think that's a real good plan.

Rick F's picture

I would build around Rodgers yes. Get a coach that can take back the team. TT previous draft had little impact and bad signings 18 bum 53 disaster. Give Gutekunst another offseason to gather more talent and weed out the project players. He has cap space and some higher round picks that will help get better talent.

dobber's picture

Who's to say that the new HC won't bring in a DC who is as good as Pettine or better? I like Pettine, too, but I don't think he's the best they could do. Bottom line is that I think the mental challenge to #12 of learning a new offense and playing well in it might be what he needs to get his head on straight.

Like it or not, the Packers are married to #12 for the near future. They've got to find a way to win with him, even if he's not up to his old standards. I don't think you can let those other arguments let you wallow in a dynamic that you know isn't working well.

Guam's picture

The Saints just did it with Brees.

Since '61's picture

And Brees is older than Rodgers. Thanks, Since '61

jeremyjjbrown's picture

I'd love for recievers to begin standing there glowering at Rodgers with resting bitch face every time he misses or fails to find the open man. Why not? He did it to them for years. Arrogance is killing Rodgers and McCarthy in 2018.

That stat the NBC showed regarding how going for it would work ~60% of the time after McCarthy punted. Ouch. This guy has no knowledge or respect for real data and it shows on the field week after week. We need a coach who knows the probabilities and is able to be creative. Sadly, that's never going to be Mike.

daveh's picture

This will elimanate any post seasons embarrassment.This team judt isnt of playoff calibre. Time to reboot clean house starting with Murphy.

nostradanus's picture

Game Balls

*Adams - Pro Bowl Worthy
*Aaron Jones - Is a star in the making
*J. Alexander - This kid is going to be a great one
*Clark - Stud, need more like him
*Martinez - Brings the lunch pail every game
*Antonio Morrison - he may be a tick slow but dude brings it with attitude every play, need more of that

Lame Calls

*McCarthy - Has lost this team, it's over
*Rodgers - Danika is a Bears fan, is Rodgers throwing games on purpose to show how much he cares?
*Play calling (see McCarthy above)
*Injuries (we as fans have been saying this for years) a complete house cleaning of the training staff, weight room program is needed along with a new direction.
*Josh Jones - non-instinctive, poor tackling, pathetic
*Kentrell Brice (see Josh Jones)
*Offensive line depth, the cupboard is bare

It sure looks to me like a bunch of the players (including Rodgers) are tanking the season. It doesn't matter what they say to the press in their "canned" responses. The team has lost faith in what McCarthy is preaching and many look like they are just collecting a paycheck.

This is a dumpster fire and bold moves are needed at seasons end! Will Murphy and Gutekunst have the stones to do what is needed from top to bottom?

LambeauPlain's picture

Gute has the stones to make performance based changes.

Mike Murphy is Howdy Doody. He's like the other MM...soft and squishy.

MarkinMadison's picture

I was giving #12 a pass earlier in the year because of the injury. He looks pretty healthy now (by NFL standards) and he is just plain off. I've been questioning his attitude/leadership/style for several years now. I get that this is his job, but who likes the supervisor/lead worker/insert other term here who is a jerk? This off-season his memorable comment was about his "clout in the locker room." You're a smart guy who chooses his words carefully. How did that work out for you A-a-ron?

Slim11's picture

I agree.

AR is definitely off. Is it just me or is his throwing motion different this season? I think he may be having some problems throwing on the move because of the broken collarbone from last season.

He's clearly at odds with McCarthy (and Philbin?) over the play calling and the direction of the offense this season.

blacke00's picture

This is not just a OL line depth issue! This a total OL problem. Stop blaming MM for bad calls when the OL can't execute! Big time upgrade needed!

jeremyjjbrown's picture

Did you see how banged up they are? Shouldn't MM know this and adjust his play call?

packergal's picture

In light of the fact that December is almost upon us and Packer fans are wishing for a “new coach” for Christmas…

AROD needs to be visited by the 3 Ghosts of Christmas.

The Ghost of Christmas Past, should take AROD back to the 2010 game versus the Falcons, where a 48–21 blowout victory ON THE ROAD demonstrated how moving the chains on 4 drives of 80 yards or more (versus playing homerun ball) benefited the team and eventually evolved into the SB win versus Steelers.

The Ghost of Christmas Present should take AROD to HIS 2018 highlight reel, which illustrates consistent inconsistency from QB1(missing open check downs, throwing into dirt on 3rd and short, holding the ball too long and evolving into sack after sack after sack, sitting alone and looking bored and angry on the bench after a dreadful series and acting passive aggressive in the post-game pressers with very cleverly disguised subtle shots at MM).

The Ghost of Christmas Future should present AROD with dire visions of 2019 IF, IF, IF EVEN AS MM IS FIRED and a new offense is installed, "starting to gray beard" AROD REFUSES to learn and act upon what he has witnessed from the Ghosts of Past and Present.

Oh wait for it—THE galvanizing moment.

Did I mention that AROD’s four-year extension with the Packers worth $134 million and a $57.5 million signing bonus will let him sleep well enough to prevent "nightmare visits" from the 3 Ghosts of Christmas?

Sorry to be snarky.

croatpackfan's picture

Jasone, I agree on your observation, except on 4 and inches call. That call was OK, but was not the execution. That one play comes on Davante Adams shoulders (put aside that I'm big Davante Adams fan) because he had to block that CB and Aaron Jones would have 1st down.

I just wonder why did not Aaron Rodgers made QB sneak for inches!

Tundraboy's picture

Sneak? Good luck with that.

The TKstinator's picture

When I was a teenager I used to sneak all kinds of things.

Minniman's picture

Funny, watching that live I was thinking 2 things:

What is Adams doing there instead of Lewis, Tonyan or Williams (i.e a blocker on Harrison)

or if he was an intended receiver why wasn't he lined up out wider to draw attention away?

...... I don't claim to read the game live with any talent, but that one for some reason stuck out to me

Pierre's picture

Rodgers is no longer an elite QB and is actually being outplayed by the opponents’ QB in these games. Not a good situation when you just extended him for 4 more years and over 30mil per year!! Packers will need to make a tough decision to find a way to move on to a new QB with potential to lead this team going forward. Kizer and Boyle should be given playing time for the rest of this dismal losing season. The Bears and Vikings have both moved ahead of the Packers now, who are in the rear view mirror and fading fast with Rodgers at QB. What a disaster it may prove for Gute extending Rodgers when he physically and cognitively looks unable to perform at anywhere near an elite level QB. Not much of a future in Packerland unless they can find an alternate plan at QB. That’s just the way it is...you’re seeing the poor QB play week...after week...after week..and your eyes are not lying to you!!

LambeauPlain's picture

MM has lost the team.

I also believe AR has lost the locker room.

The $135 million man's shoulder shrugging, finger pointing, arrogant demeanor must be getting old and very grating after these losses when he completely disappears after halftime.

"I don't think I missed many throws." 34 plays and 135 yards after the first 17 plays and 119 yards. 3 points total after 14 in the first two drives?

It is like AR is trying to get MM fired. I would not surprise me if he actually thinks he has the leverage to do so.

He is so arrogant. Arrogance is not helpful for a team game.

dobber's picture

MM is losing games, but his team is still playing for him. I'll credit him that.

badaxed's picture

Poor coaching, players not playing to thier "potential". Poor tackling, poor blocking, lack of execution of basic plays (short passes). This is a bad team. Time to reset the team from the top down. Seperate the wheat from the chaff at all levels. Send a message now Murphy, not later. Take the Pittsburg doughboy to the train staition and buy him a one way ticket.

BoCallahan's picture

When TWill was with the team on his 1st tour I would yell at the TV insisting that he not be allowed to field punts. He consistently allowed the ball to bounce. Now, on this tour he has been doing the same thing. Just step up and fair catch it. Unfortunately the TV doesn’t relay my expert insights to anyone outside the house.

Why wasn’t 30 in the game on short yardage (inches) plays?

Was I just seeing things, or did 69 have 1 eye closed during his intro?

mrtundra's picture

On both running plays where we had inches to go, where was Jamaal Williams? Those short yardage plays are in his wheelhouse. We needed to pound the ball straight ahead and couldn't do it with Aaron Jones and the viking defense ready for him.

Old School's picture

Apparently you haven't read the thousands of articles/posts about how the Packer offense would be better if we just gave Jones the ball more. So we gave him the ball more. That's why our offense was so good.

Oh...wait a minute....

Thegreatreynoldo's picture

Apparently you haven't read the dozens of articles bashing MM for playing his RBs by series instead of substituting according to the situation. It goes all the way back to Starks taking a hand-off at the goal line instead of using Lacy. But snark has a place.

Since '61's picture

Game Ball: Jaire Alexander

Lame Calls: Just about everyone else besides Alexander.
Failure in all 3 phases of the game. Offense, defense and Special Teams yet again.

I've been saying it since the 2016 NFCCG in Atlanta. This team needs better players almost everywhere.

Offense needs 2 starting guards and a RT. Still needs a legit TE. Need at least 2 more starting WRs. MVS and EQ might continue to evolve or they may not. Jones is a good RB but not a game changer. SMH over Aaron Rodgers.

Defense needs another DL at least. Clark is a keeper.
2 OLBs. Fackrell disappeared and CM3 ran himself out of too many plays as usual. Martinez OK, need at least 2 ILBs. DBs, Alexander is great but we need another CB that can stay on the field, Safety needs a complete redo.

Special Teams are chaos. Fire Zook, start over except for Crosby and Scott.

I've been an MM supporter but I think the time has come for a change. This team has been bad in all 3 phases of the game almost every week. Lack of early draft picks has stripped the offense of its potency. defense has made some improvement with Pettine but too many injuries combined with poor tackling prevents them from getting off the field on 3rd downs. Special Teams have become a cluster f*** on their best days. Moving on. Thanks, Since '61

sonomaca's picture

When the ST goes out there, I close my eyes.

mrtundra's picture

You can almost always expect a flag on our ST when they are on the field.

pooch's picture

That's what happens when draft 6 db/safties in 3 years

ShanghaiKid's picture

Pooch you’re not lying. To use that many picks for the same position group and come out of it without a dominant bunch has crippled this team.

The TKstinator's picture

23 is my new favorite player, followed closely by 33.

holmesmd's picture

Was the pad level “what you’re looking for” last night? I was just figuring it wasn’t seeing as GB got rolled again. I guess it could have been “needing to coach & play better”? Not sure...SMH

zoellner25's picture

We have the same record as the Cleveland Browns. This team and MM make me wanna puke

Ustabeayooper's picture

I have an issue with the 4 th and 1 situation. First MM should have requested a measurement If the request was denied, throw the red flag and challenge the spot rather than just take a timeout. You have 2 challenges and this would give you plenty of time to consider your options. The whole situation was rushed and we didn't know exactly how much yardage was needed. I really don't understand why the Packers don't get Jones in open space one on one with a pitch play. Everyone in the world knew what play was coming.

mrtundra's picture

Williams should have been the RB at that point as he is the bigger bruising back on short yardage.

Guam's picture

Not only should Williams have been in there, but there either should have been a full back or H-back as a lead blocker or it should have been a quick hitter. You can't run a slow developing play without a lead back in short yardage due to the risk of defensive penetration. Loved going for it on 4th and short; hated the play call.

RCPackerFan's picture

Game Balls:

Alexander - Between Clark and Alexander they are our best defensive players. Build around them.

Clark - Truly a beast. They should have called holding so many times against the VIkings. Clark was being held most of the game.

Adams - He is truly special. Even though it likely would have been meaningless, that should have been a TD at the end. Rodgers overthrew him again.

Lame Calls:

McCarthy/Rodgers - Who do we blame? I have no idea. Its the combination of the 2. But they are the reason we are where we are.

Injuries - While we made it through camp healthy injuries have hit us hard lately.

Mojo's picture

Someone mentioned Josh Jones and poor tackling. Overran a number of plays. Looked like he was in position and for whatever reason the Viking player just waltzed right by him. Took terrible angles The worst instincts on a team of players with bad instincts.

Old School's picture

I noted a couple of bad tackling plays involving Jones.

On the long pass, where he just went streaming by while the receiver caught it.....dude, go up and drill that guy when he catches it. Bust it up. Hit him. Don't just dance past him. Then there was the play in the flat where he got juked out of his jock and barely laid a finger on the RB. And on a sweep, he took a crappy angle and ending up chasing from behind..

I like Jones, but there is no position for him right now. He can't cover well enough to play in the secondary, He actually might be a pretty effective edge rusher. on blitz packages.

jhalwas611.com's picture

I cannot totally get on board with Adams as a game ball winner. His job is to get open and catch passes, which he did. But he's also to block. Such as on a 4th and inches play when he watched Harrison Smith run past him and tackle Jones. Even a half hearted attempt at a block and it's first down!

Clark is definitely a winner as is Alexander. But maybe the biggest winner was the punter Scott. How many times did he put the ball inside the 20?

The coaching remains a problem. Depth can be blamed but it's coaching the backups to be ready that makes a team sound. The season long problems of clock management, bad penalties, tired play calling and failure to hold "star" players accountable is truly growing on the team and fan base.

JimR_in_SoCal's picture

Packers should be acquiring/grooming Rodgers’ replacement soon. But first, time to go MM.

4zone's picture

Wonder if we can trade Rogers for the #1 pick this year and that team"s first rounders for the next two years. . . hmmm

JimR_in_SoCal's picture

That would be great if not for the cap hit.

ILPackerBacker's picture

Facts: Instead of raving about Adams and blaming Rodgers is it to much to ask of a self proclaimed # 1 WR and one of the best in the league to be able to stay in bounds on a 3rd down when he is open in soft zone? Not doubled, not press or man to man coverage?

can a # 1 WR block? Or should it be expected he would wiff on a key play in the game.

Lombardi said most key plays are not known in advance but that one was. Our "STAR" choked.

Is it beyond OB Jr or a real # 1 Wr to make the catch in the end zone at the end of the game? Or does Rodgers have to be perfect?

Since '61's picture

ILPackerBacker - that is the problem!!! Given the roster around him Rodgers needs to be perfect. He hasn't been perfect this season and the rest of the roster cannot make up for it. They are just not good enough. If Rodgers doesn't play perfectly this team loses. So it all falls on Rodgers, the Good, the Bad and the Ugly. Thanks, Since '61

ILPackerBacker's picture

Agreed. So clearly obvious yet guys like Adams get lauded for a game where they missed a ball in the end zone, missed a key block on 4th down and inexplicably go out of bounds when uncovered in a soft zone.

One guy is applauded but Rodgers did not make 3 mistakes like that. But he did get hit and beat up.

Old School's picture

I disagree vehemently.

Adams is a legit #1. Graham is an HOFer. Jones is one of the leading rushers in the league and the Packers are one of the most effective rushing teams in the league.

Look at how PFF ranks our offensive linemen...they're all ranked well above average at their position with the exception of Bell. Footballoutsiders.com ranks our offensive line as being pretty good. So this notion that Rodgers is just surrounded by talentless stumblebums is just nonsense. Please stop this. I went through it with fans of the previous QB......you can't make him smell better by smearing crap on everyone else.

jlc1's picture

The comment on going for home runs rings true for me. I got nervous when it was reported at the half that MM said they had did not take some long throws that they could have. And then ARod does exactly that on almost the first man coverage he saw. It wasn't even close. Which then left the team in 3rd and long.
So who do we blame that on? MM for scheme? ARod for execution? Seems like they are both on the same page of that part of the game plan at least.

4thand1's picture

It wasn't long ago that the Saints were in this same boat. Back to back 7-9 seasons, and talk of firing everyone. They drafted great over the last few years and are SB favorites, with a 40 year old QB who is the front runner for MVP. The Pack has to have another good draft, shore up the o- line and OLB. Wait til next is all we can do.

Old School's picture

I see the comparison.

I think what makes the comparison with Brees, and Brady, not accurate is that these guys hurt you from inside the pocket, whereas Rodgers does a lot of his damage outside the pocket. The older he gets, the harder it's going to be for him to get outside the pocket.

Slim11's picture

The big difference is the coaching.

Sean Payton makes in-game adjustments McCarthy can't or won't. I'm still not sure which it is although I'm leaning toward won't.

Another difference is conditioning. Every team, every season deals with injuries one way or another. In GB, it seems to be a huge factor EVERY season. Mo Wilkerson is gone, Nick Perry is gone, Mike Daniels is likely done for the season. ILB Jake Ryan went on IR in preseason. Allison, Kyle Murphy and Davon House are also in IR. This kills depth.

Some will say Nick Perry's absence is addition by subtraction. It probably is. All the other losses were players being counted upon as key starters or strong backups.

D Ernie's picture

Lame calls, the 4th down play. That was the season and yet mike never did anything when Smith was on the line with absolutely no one to block him. What an idiot.
For me Goodbye Mike or goodbye packers. If the Packer Org goes on a mea culpa "oh we had so many injuries thing poor mikey", I for one am done. It means no rebuild tune in for same old same old next year

Game balls to Rodgers for surviving the onslaught. Again, Mike should understand that whenever, ever ever ever Zimmer gets a lead he starts to blitz the crap out of his guys thinking, we know you got to pass sucker and were not going to let you. Batiari for being forced to go out and play hurt. Jones for doing an ok job, and adams of course.

cheesycowboy's picture

I was lambasted 4 weeks ago predicting a 7-8-1 season. I now stand corrected. 7-8-1 seems to be a pipe dream. This team has no leadership or foundation. Hard to fire a 35 year old superstar for taking the money, hard to defend unwise multiple bad contract extensions, hard to fathom mediocrity being the new normal.
You are what your record says you are and this edition of the GBP is putrid at best. Changes need to be made and now. F giving this coaching staff 5 more weeks to defend itself for putting this shit show. on full display. every week.
Mark? you never answer my take 5 questions. Does the Truth hurt bud?

byu.tech's picture

everything start from the head.
murphy is the first bust. not 1 decision in years.
he removed ted too late and just because he was sick.
now we have mccarhty because murphy did not have the courage to remove him after seattle mealtdown.

Oppy's picture

When someone finally publishes an article that summarizes what you've been seeing for the last 3 1/2-4 years, and says it so much better than you could:

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/debunking-myths-mike-mccarthy-aaron-0651019...

croatpackfan's picture

Oppy, nice finding...

Several people here (including me!) were warning on those signs from the beginning of the season.

At first I suspected those kind of throws were result of preseason. Not playing enough snaps in the preseason for Aaron and the rest of the offense.

Then I was caught into Mike McCarthy bad schemes and poor OL plays...

Finally, at the beginning of the October I noticed problem with Aaron behavior (I was mentioning his cocky personality!), then with the lack of side vision and missing obvious open receivers on the all parts of the field. I'm not saying that there was no plays were opponent coverage were good. But Aaron's decisions, changing called plays and "extending" plays to be able to make "hail Mary" throws, shows that he is bored with the regular game and game plan... Cocky and bored - not a good companion for great results...

If Mike McCarthy can not put Aaron in his place, I agree he should go.

And, if I defend Mike McCarthy against, very often very low, comments full of hate it is not because I do not see Mike McCarthy's flaws. Every person has flaws. It is because I believe the problem Packers have, is not on one man, no matter how high in hierarchy that person is.

When you are underestimate problem(s) by believing that you can solve them by one simple move, you'll make those problems much, much worse.

Oppy's picture

I agree with you Croat. Placing all blame on one person and ignoring all other contributors to the problem will only delay a true solution.

By the way, please do not take offense to my correction. The English word for an imperfection or blemish is "flaw", spelled with an "a", as in "Character Flaw". The definition of "flow", spelled with "o", is "movement, usually of a fluid". Just trying to help. :)

croatpackfan's picture

Thanks for correction. Please be free to do that in future. I ask that anyone here. That will improve my English...

Oppy's picture

.

Slim11's picture

This was an interesting article. It doesn't deal with a couple of things which I remain critical of MM about.

First, his insane loyalty to "his" guys whether they are coaches or players. His loyalty to Dom Capers, Shawn Slocum and Ron Zook is absurd. If MM is fired, I suspect Zook will be gone and Pettine might be gone as well. My gut says Pettine goes because of two things...he supposedly doesn't want to be a HC again and a new HC wants to bring in his own DC. His loyalty to some players who clearly aren't as good as he believes they are is equally ridiculous. Last season it was Hundley and this season, before the trade, Ty Montgomery. BTW, SI ran an article about McCarthy in 2016 (maybe 2015) which noted the loyalty McCarthy has to his assistants which was described as well known in the league.

Second, his RBC decision at the beginning the season. When it became blindingly obvious Aaron Jones was the best of the three RBs, McCarthy insisted on the RBC approach. Why? See his insane loyalty above.

Third, his inability/unwillingness to make in-game adjustments is beyond insanity. I tend to believe he's unwilling to make changes because doing so, in his mind, will be an admission he was wrong about something.

AR has his share in this, too. But, by far, the worst culprit in this mess of a season is McCarthy.

Spencer2101's picture

Pettine deserves some credit for taking this motley crew of backups and rookies and keeping the Perps to 24 points. My game ball goes to Jaire Alexander, who better be in the converstion for rookie of the year. 196 pounds that plays like 240.

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