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Draft Profile: T.J Hockenson- Making the Case to Draft Him at 12

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Draft Profile: T.J Hockenson- Making the Case to Draft Him at 12

The second piece of this series we will be shifting gears to the offensive side of the ball and examining one of the more popular options at the tight end position.  In this article, I will make the case for why the Packers should select T.J Hockenson with the 12th pick in the draft and avoid trading down a few spots and risk losing him.

A popular scenario proposed in countless Packer circles has been the aforementioned idea of trading a few spots down in the first round to accumulate an additional second or third round pick, and then draft T.J Hockenson with the 15th-18th pick overall.  

Although this sounds like a dream scenario for the Packers, I believe there is a good chance T.J Hockenson would be taken by the time the Packers drafted if they did in fact trade down a few spots to accumulate an additional premium draft pick.  Who knows, at the rate that Hockenson's stock continues to rise, the Packers may have to think about trading up a few spots in order to draft him.    

In short, the Packers could be faced with the decision of whether or not to reach a few spots and draft T.J Hockenson at 12, let him pass and address another area of need, or trade down a few spots and hope he is still on the board.  

To me, this is a simple decision, if Hockenson is on the board at 12, you absolutely draft him.  If Hockenson gets past Detroit at 8, Brian Gutekunst should start to consider using his 4th and 6th round capital to potentially move up two or three spots to ensure that he doesn’t get away.  T.J Hockenson is a top 10 talent and although it is not ideal, Brian Gutekunst should do all that he can to make sure he is wearing the green and gold.   

Throughout the 2018 FBS season as well as the NFL combine, T.J Hockenson has made quite the name for himself throughout NFL circles and has now surpassed teammate Noah Fant as the best tight end prospect available in this April's draft.  Hockenson has emerged as a dual threat both as an elite receiver as well as a dominant blocking tight end who can help in both pass protection as well as the run block.

Hockenson's blocking is second to none as he possesses solid technique in the trenches and can really seal the edge hard, creating running lanes for Aaron Jones and Jamaal Williams.  Pulling the trigger on him at 12 will essentially allow the Packers to improve both their receiving core and their offensive line with one selection.  I encourage you to take a look at T.J Hockenson's film in the trenches.  

The Packers can rest easy even if they consciously reach a few spots to draft Hockenson because he is such a well rounded and dynamic player who can change the complexion of their offense for the next decade.  Hockenson profiles as a Rob Gronkowski type with his ability to run past safeties and linebackers making plays downfield, while still serving as the traditional tight end threat in goal-line situations catching third and fourth down passes in traffic.      

2018 Stats: 49 receptions 760 yards 6 touchdowns 15.5 yards per reception   

When watching the game film of T.J Hockenson it is easy to fall in love with his game. He certainly resembles a young Rob Gronkowski which will make it very tough to pass on him with the 12th pick especially since he will improve the Packers passing attack, pass protection, and run blocking for years to come.

Sound Off:

I want to know where you stand on T.J Hockenson.  Do you think the Packers should trade up to select him if he slides past Detroit at 8?  Should the Packers gamble and trade down a few spots to accumulate another premium draft pick and select him in the 15-18 range, or should they stay pat and select him with the 12th pick?  As always, I look forward to the discussion!

 

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David Michalski is a staff writer for Cheesehead TV. He can be found on Twitter @kilbas27dave 

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Fan friendly comments only: off Comments (178) This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.

cpitt's picture

If they move up from 30 to draft him fine, but to move up at 12 to let's say 10 would be insane. I have no doubt he will be there at 12. And he's still a reach at that spot. Unless, you're convinced he's the next Gronk, you don't draft him at 12. None of the top TE's in the league were drafted in the 1st round.

Gronk -- 2nd
Kelse -- 3rd
Kittle -- 5th
Henry -- 2nd
Graham -- 3rd
etc, etc.

Fine with him at 30 or in the 20s, any higher is a misuse of draft capital.

The TKstinator's picture

Did you run this past Doug?

If T.J. is truly a top ten talent, taking him at 12 is just fine.

mrtundra's picture

I agree. Other teams may try to grab him before #12. I've seen him go as high as #8 in a few mocks. TJ will be the Packer's TE of the future, if we draft him. I'm fine with taking him at #12.

Doug Niemczynski's picture

Hdooray! If you knew before Gronk would not only be a hall of famer snd probably the best TE in the history of the game would he have been any less than a top 10 pck?

And Kelce was converted to TE back in college and I believe was caught doing drugs and cut from the team but his brother who was also on the same college team wad able to get him back on the team, so he was a questionable emotional type player, so again knowing what we know now he also would have been a top 10 pick.

4thand10's picture

Maybe NE will do something silly and trade with us to grab him :-)

meatstyk's picture

No way do we trade up to draft him! Not even sure about drafting him at 12. Trade down to get him I am ok with

jimtalkbox's picture

He definitely should be in the conversation at #12 and I think he will be considering how LaFleur seems to want to use TE's. The only players I would consider ahead of him would be on the defensive side like Oliver, Burns and Gary.

Johnblood27's picture

I would be greatly disappointed if Gute selected Gary at any spot ahead of Hock.

Dzehren's picture

Correct. Gary from Michigan might project better as a 4-3 DE.

Tundraboy's picture

The Devins?

The TKstinator's picture

I too am a big fan of the Devins.

mrtundra's picture

In some mocks I have seen the Devins gone by pick #12. White went at #4 and #5 in two recent mocks.

Clint's picture

Oliver and Burns, yes. Gary? Woof – that's a no for me Dogg.

Rak47's picture

It will be interesting to see who goes first Hockenson or Fant. I know most here believe it will be Hockenson but I'm not so sure after the combine. While both performed at an elite level, Fant outperformed Hockenson in every drill in speed, agility,explosiveness, and even strength, outperforming Hock on the Bench Press 20 - 17. I wonder what the GM's are thinking when it comes to their floors and ceilings. Personally I like Hockenson's all around game but Fant has all the tools to turn into the better player down the road.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

I agree! I consistently have been saying this Rak for weeks now. I truly believe if Pack go offense in Rd 1 it will be Fant. Would significantly give offense a serious lift.

albert999's picture

I think we stay put and take the best player available At 12
He surely won’t last because he is a very good prospect

Swisch's picture

albert, I tend to think the same way.
While I'm open to trading up to get a guy like Hockenson or Josh Allen, my inclination is to stay at #12 -- because we should get a great player at that spot.
It seems at least a couple of the first favorites of fans here at Cheesehead TV will still be around at #12, but that probably none will be around at #30. So we get somebody great at #12, and then start looking at guys who are somewhat less promising but still possibly great.
At the very least, after #12, we're looking for guys who will be above average players in the NFL, or at least solid starters.
At best, we find a couple more stars at #30, and among our other early draft picks.
Should be a fun day, a little bit of Christmas in April. If all goes well, we'll have clinched our division by the time the real Christmas rolls around in less than nine months.

MikeS's picture

Agree , only if he is gone. If there at 12, its a no brainier! We filled the edge rush holes and while Oliver is a value, he is just that. Hock is both a value and a need.

Richard Smith's picture

Oliver is a need as well. He's our Mike Daniels of the future when he leaves in FA next year. What about Lowry. His contract is coming up too. TE at 12 is ridiculous! They take 3 years to develop and those guys can be found later. You know who can't be found later in the draft? Players like Oliver. You don't get many chances to have pick 12 when you are the Packers, so don't blow it by taking a TE.

jannes bjornson's picture

There are TEs in the second and third round. When did Chumura get picked, the fifth. There are no Keith Jacksons or Gronks in this group. Still have to solidify the OT position, DT, Safety, TE. They may take a running back first round if Le Fleur is serious about his zone schemes?

Doug Niemczynski's picture

Hockenson is a day 1 starter!

OnWisconsinGoPack's picture

I'd rather take Jeffrey Simmons at 30, a top 10 talent, then take Oliver. ACL injuries are not the same today as in the past, he'll recover.

Give me Hock or Burns at 12, Winovich or Simmons at 30 and Irv or Adderly/Thornhill/Garndner-Johnson at 44

Minniman's picture

I'm with you regarding Simmons at 30 - he's a far better prospect than that draft position, making him the BPA at that spot.

Re #12 - there's literally 5 players that if the Packers took them at that spot I'd go "fair enough"

Slim11's picture

At #30, GB might have to take Adderley. He's moving up into the mid/late 20s in some mocks. Not sure about Winovich in round one or early in round two. If GB could get a late #2, I'd consider taking him there.

I do know Winovich's father (went to college with him.) so there's a personal interest in seeing him in GB.

Dzehren's picture

Trading up from 12 and sacrificing our 4th & 6th round picks for a non premium position is a bad business decision.

Old School's picture

Absolutely true.

sam1's picture

Read some where he prefers a team in the West or South to play for, interesting statement for sure if that is his preference truthfully!

dblbogey's picture

He was born in Iowa and played at Iowa. I don't believe he'd have a problem playing for Green Bay, a very popular team in Iowa.

The TKstinator's picture

Plus he’s got Daniels and Bulaga paving the way.

Iowapackerfan's picture

Huh? He grew up in Iowa. His family lives in Iowa. He went to school at the University of Iowa. Sounds like a Midwest boy to me.

sam1's picture

Probably the reason he wants to play where weather is better than what the midwest offers! Any way that is what he said according to the FB draft questions I read! It has been said and done by others before.

Tundraboy's picture

The hurdling concerns me.

stockholder's picture

Everything concerns me. Wasted pick. Other BPAs. Now Lets go to Mouse Davis. Remember the Run and Shoot. Nobody had the Dbs to stop it. They still don't. We draft bigger Wrs. They must Block. Game explosion happens with Wrs. A-Rod wants the YAC. Not a blocking TE.

Tundraboy's picture

And if a TE ,I'm leaning towards Fant. Just a hunch from my gut.

The TKstinator's picture

We call that a gut hunch.

LeotisHarris's picture

Gut hunches are all well and good, but we're talking about T.J Hockenson, a once-in-a-generation talent who can stretch the field like only T.J Hockenson can. T.J Hockenson will transform the offense of the Green Bay Packers by being T.J Hockenson. Many coaches and scouts have been praising T.J Hockenson. If T.J Hockenson were to slide past the Lions, then slip past the Bills, and tumble past the Broncos, before finally bouncing (can you imagine T.J Hockenson bouncing?) past the Bengals to land at 12, I would unequivocally state T.J Hockenson will be the first round draft choice of the Green Bay Packers. It would be a no-brainer because taking T.J Hockenson, a top ten talent ,at the 12 spot after all the slipping, sliding, dropping, falling, and tumbling would be the kind of steel-spined move Gute is known for already. Not many people know this, but Gute had a toothpick in his mouth when he fired Winston Moss, spat on the ground and growled "go on, GIT!"

I firmly believe by not trading up to draft T.J Hockenson, the Packers will still draft T.J Hockenson because he is from Iowa and T.J Hockenson likes wearing Wrangler jeans and eating corn. Green Bay will have corn and Wrangler jeans for T.J Hockenson.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

And the articulate Leotis with the quick wit reappears. Been wondering where you have been. Always enjoy your posts!

The TKstinator's picture

Count me among the Fans of Leotis as well!

carlos's picture

That was funny and good Leotis

Doug Niemczynski's picture

I'm a poet, but didn't know it?

Bure9620's picture

Hockenson is NOT a field stretcher. He is NOT scaring defenses getting behind them. That would be Noah Fant.

Doug Niemczynski's picture

I couldn't have said it more poetically

The TKstinator's picture

Not sure you say ANYTHING poetically, Mr. Niemczynski.
~~~~~. :)

Tundraboy's picture

And better than a gut punch for sure.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

Tboy,
Me too!

Blow that offense wide open!

Tundraboy's picture

Yes!

David Michalski's picture

Hockenson is an elite receiver who blocks, not much concerning about that.

jannes bjornson's picture

Hockenson has the best verticle of the group.

CJ Bauckham's picture

No word yet on if this article was co-written and brought to you by Doug Niemczynski

Swisch's picture

This seems almost as shady as the Smollett case in Chicago.
Who in a position of great power does Doug know behind the scenes to make a call to Cheesehead TV?
An immediate and hysterical investigation seems in order.
;-)

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

good one!

Old School's picture

True. I heard a rumor from a guy who knows a guy who is married to the sister of a guy who is friends with a guy who works near Lambeau Field that the Packers were going to take Hock at #12, and then take Hock's Dad at #30, and then come back and take another Hock at #44.

You can never have too many Hocks.

Swisch's picture

The insider news is a hock at #13, a hick at #30, then a hack, and later maybe a huck finn. What the heck is going on around here?

sam1's picture

Too bad you are an idiot for your post thinking it is true. ou see the rumor you heard is correct.

The TKstinator's picture

???

carlos's picture

Not sure why everyone is so quick to get rid of draft picks. I like the idea of all the picks, especially the two firsts. If you can get him at 12 - I think I’d take him. He may be gone by then. I bet the Patriots, who like the later picks, would take him at number 12.

carlos's picture

I wish Devin White would drop to 12. Snatch him in a heartbeat. Highly unlikely though.

wildbill's picture

Want him badly but don’t upset your whole draft to trade up to get him. We have numerous holes to fill so let’s take advantage of this draft because next year we will be drafting 32nd!

stockholder's picture

You sign 3 defensive Free Agents. You still have Defensive holes. Drafting a reach at TE doesn't work. For the future of the players just signed. And for the defensive unit as a whole. Hoek doesn't fit. Argue all you want he can block. The blocking will help A-Rod. Yep, Just Like Kuhn. And now the position is going the way of the dinosaur. And so will Hoek. The talk really has gone to far. The game is speed. Mis- matches. Hoek is old school. Thats all. He won't solve anything. You see a lunch bucket. I see a dumpster. Fant has more speed and would fit the packers scheme better later. Hoek won't be any different then Bubba Franks. Fant @30 is the better pick and brings the bigger play. His speed is better then Allisons. Faster then Finleys. It's game changing ability I thought we wanted.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

stockholder....very much in agreement! Lewis can block and Fant will destroy defenses constantly keeping them on their toes and off balance. I'm all about taking the BPA available that is going to help the Pack the most whomever that is. I am definitely against moving up in the draft at this spot and particularly if for a TE. If we are going to take a TE I sure hope it is Fant. Better athletic abilities in every regard with better hands and speed. Higher RAS score and upside. Fant allows for so much more mix and matching up on offense to obtain great mismatches with Fant. Depending what they do with their slot receiver and than include Fant and the offense would be EXPLOSIVE!

Would I be upset with Hoek instead of Fant? Possibly but Hoek is a good player and I would have to assume Hoek better fits what LF wants for his offense, however in this case I would definitely move back in round 1 to take Hoek and pick up another draft selection which I would use to try packaging with RD 2 selection to try moving up and selecting Simmons at top of round 2 as a stud DL is needed.

Iowapackerfan's picture

Hock is a better football player than Fant. That's why he passed up Fant in Iowa coaches' eyes, and why Fant went whining into the night and skipped Iowa's bowl game. Actually Hock has the better hands, and proved it in games and at combine. Hock is more of a team player. Remember, any track guy can put up good numbers at the combine, but that doesn't make them a football player.

LeotisHarris's picture

What about track guys with good hands at the Combine? And, if I was a projected NFL first round pick I'd sure as hell risk blowing a knee in a bowl game because, you know, team player and all.

Richard Smith's picture

Okay dude. I agree that no TE should be taken at 12, but don't go comparing Hock to Bubba Franks. Hock can run, Franks was a statue. Just because a TE can block doesn't mean he is slow. Gronk could block and didn't run a 4.4. Was he a dinosaur or one of the best TE's ever to play?

stockholder's picture

Bubba Franks was strongly criticized by Favre. Turning the wrong way on routes, etc. The comparison with Gronk is a fit for the Patriots. Not the packers. Brady is exceptional at getting people the ball. As he was with Gronk. You can't turn Arron Rodgers into Brett Favre or Brady. Rodgers is after Yards. Fant would be better for Rodgers then Hoek. Hoek would have been perfect for Favre. Drafting a Te must fit the QB. Favre ran the west coast to perfection. Arron doesn't have to. Until I see Arron Rodgers change, and his chemistry with a new coach. Pass on Hoek. Graham, Finley and Jared Cook were better matches. Is Rodgers going to retire? No. He must have a Te that run routes properly. Is experienced. And has that separation speed. I can't see Fant @12 either. But if he's there @30. He is the only TE I would want.

jannes bjornson's picture

Mccarthy's offense doesn't live here anymore. There are west coast guys that can get the job done too at TE. I doubt Hock makes it to #12. Fant will go in the 20s. Warring is a bad boy and Sternberger matches athletically to Fant.
You need to get two guys that are going to contribute through two contracts for this team from the first round. Nobody should feel safe with the current O line group staying healthy all year. Succession plans are in order.

Renllaw's picture

I agree with you on where Hock and Fant will get selected. But sorry Jannes, Fant and Sternberger DO NOT Match athletically, Fants RAS is 9.89 and Sternberger comes in at 5.17. That doesn't mean Jace wont be a good NFL TE, just saying that Fant will be far more explosive after the catch.

Old School's picture

You do know that Bubba made the Pro Bowl three straight years ?

stockholder's picture

Yes old school. I do know Bubba made the pro Bowl.

Swisch's picture

Interesting point, stockholder.
I'm wondering, though, if tight ends are becoming obsolete, why not just employ a wide receiver such as Jake Kumerow in just about the same way as a TE, instead, or a running back such as Jamaal Williams?

stockholder's picture

Jake Fisher? The Tight ends are becoming Lts. And Yes, many college Wrs go to TEs now. So Kumerow or Allison could be tried at TE.

Old School's picture

The point in running a double TE set is that it spreads out the defensive front. There are two A gaps, two B gaps, and now two C gaps as well. There is no true "strong" side.

So that's six gaps, meaning you've got to put six bodies in those gaps to stop the run. And it means you've got 7 blockers against those six gap pluggers. So you have to bring up a safety, leaving you with 4 guys to defend the pass.

Adams requires the attention of two guys a lot, meaning everybody else gets single coverage quite a bit of the time. And the defense has to put two guys out there who can handle a TE in the run game AND cover him in the passing game. That's a tough matchup.

jannes bjornson's picture

Three TEs is even better for the overload and one can go in motion if you want to leverage the LBs. The Hock as blocker-receiver now creates a world of pain for a safety covering his side and the running game can spring either way Lazard may stick as a big WR blocking downfield..

David Michalski's picture

I really encourage you to watch the tape on Hockenson provided in this article as well as some of the longer tapes on him. I think you’ll see his ability to make big plays down the field, get YAC, and lay people out in the running game which will pay dividends immediately with LaFleur’s philosophy on the rushing attack. To say Hockenson’s position/value has gone the way of the dinosaur is selling him short, and that’s not just my opinion.

Old School's picture

He can get open down the middle of the field against some guys who are going to be teaching PE for a living. That's the trouble with college tape.

Old School's picture

He can get open down the middle of the field against some guys who are going to be teaching PE for a living. That's the trouble with college tape.

The TKstinator's picture

So, to summarize: Stoek is anti Hoek.

stockholder's picture

Yes @12. And if I had my choice between Fant and Hoek. It's Fant who is #1. I'm sure both can make the pro Bowl. But I like the separation and speed of Fant. I believe he' more the game changer watching his tape. I also want Oliver more than any player @12.

Swisch's picture

Is this a case of damning Hockenson with Fant praise?

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

LOL!

One of my favorites Swisch!

Donster's picture

Right Stockholder. And George Kittle hasn't accomplished a thing in San Francisco. Hockenson and Kittle are clones.

That said, I wouldn't trade a pick to move up to get Hockenson, or any of the defensive players available. Stay at 12 and keep the draft pick. The team has to many needs. Take Hock or one of the Devins or Oliver or Burns. I think most of us here agree any of those guys will improve the team. If Detoilet grabs Hockenson, grab Fant. I don't believe you lose picking one or the other. But Hockenson brings more all around play, guts and heart than Fant.

jannes bjornson's picture

Or trade for Rudolph before Belichick makes the call to Spielman.

PeteK's picture

I'll take old school on a frozen tundra .

GLM's picture

I agree with you, but I don't think Fant will be on the board at 30.

OnWisconsinGoPack's picture

What's the argument that he's not explosive? Please tell me it's not the the 40 because that's lazy. Did you see his combine? His 3 cone, shuttle, broad jump we're right there with Fant and better than a lot of WRs. Please tell me how he's not explosive?

Versatility is the key. Yes, I like Fant, but not nearly as much as Hock who average 15+ yds per catch last year and can block. Pretty damn good for a TE if you ask me. Fant is a little more one dimensional.

How did Kelce, Greg Olsen, Zach Ertz, Gronk, Gates,Gonzalez score compared to Hock?

Packer Fan's picture

Hockenson is a great value. But we will have to leave it up for Gute to figure it out. Can he trade down and still get his guy like last year, or let him go earlier and pick Fant or the Bama guy, or trade up to get him. I wouldn't want to trade up. So in the end it is Gutes choice. So far he has done well

Bert's picture

As long as we get good value and a blue chip player at #12 I could care less about position. We need to rebuild the roster via the draft and that takes patience and great scouting. Gute has done an excellent job filling immediate needs via FA. Now step 2 is roster building for the future via the draft. And you sum it nicely Packer Fan: "So far he has done well"

Old School's picture

Trading down is my favorite sceanario. I would love to Trade #12 to the Steelers for #21? and #52? (Sorry, can't recall the exact spots). That would leave us with 4 picks between #21 and #52. Four of the Top 52.

Guam's picture

Oddly I was thinking of the same scenario a couple of days ago. The Steelers might want to move ahead of the Dolphins and grab Haskins as the eventual replacement for Rothlisberger and the Packers would be perfectly positioned to help the Steelers and pick up an extra second round pick in the process. I would make that move in a heart beat.

I would prefer to see the Packers pick one of the many good Safeties or D-linemen at #20, but would be okay picking either Hock or Fant at #20. I think Hock and Fant are good talents, but I just see greater needs elsewhere. With Graham and Lewis already in the fold, I don't see that much playing this year for a rookie TE, no matter who it is. A rookie safety or d-linemen would see much more time on the field than a rookie TE.

Old School's picture

I've been looking at the Haskins angle too.

Murray will be the first player taken. It is said the Broncos like Drew Lock at #10. So then Haskins becomes the best QB still available. The Giants, at #17, could use a QB. So could the Dolphins. And the Steelers are at that point as well but they'll almost certainly have to trade up ahead of Miami and NY to have a chance at him.

4thand1's picture

A TE who can do it all, sure, but don't give up picks.

MikeS's picture

Hock is a vital cog for the Packer offense of the future. When you have a once in a decade chance to grab a player of his caliber, you do what you need to to get him. If it were Belichek drafting, there would be no question. Give AR the weapon he desperately needs. Gute needs to make this call.

Dzehren's picture

Bill Belichick has drafted 1 TE in the first round in the past 20 years. That was Daniel Graham in 2002. Belichick also selected 2 other TE's in the second round since 2000- Gronk & Ben Watson. Selecting TE's in the first round is not the Patriot Way.- source pro football reference

The TKstinator's picture

If Belichick KNEW Gronk was going to be as good as he was, would he have waited until round 2 to pick him?

Would Brady have lasted till the 6th?

Or, for other teams:
Terrell Davis in the 6th?
Richard Sherman in the 5th?

Thegreatreynoldo's picture

Even if BB knew how good Brady was going to be, if he also knew that NE could wait until the 6th round to select him, then BB certainly should wait to draft Brady until then.

Richard Smith's picture

How do you know he can be a player of that caliber. Maybe teams were rolling coverage all game to Fant. You ever think of that? That's why Hock had better numbers last year.

Old School's picture

So it is your opinion that Hock is the best TE in the draft in the last decade? I'm not so sure about that.

Never fall in love with a player before the draft. It'll color your judgement.

4thand1's picture

TK, Ron Wolfe said one of his biggest regrets,one of his scouts was pounding the table for the Packers to pick T. Davis in the draft. That scout was John Dorsey.

Coldworld's picture

I don’t follow college games enough to have a strong view. I will say only this, that each year there is is a player or two that people are writing into the hall of fame in the lead up to the draft.

These two individuals seem to epitomize that. Not many of these late winter anointed ones become stars. For that reason, I instinctively harbor strong doubts as to the objectivity of much of this discussion.

The TKstinator's picture

Dorsey knows football.

MarkinMadison's picture

I'm not sure about the Gronk comparison. Young Gronk was 15 lbs. heavier, an inch taller, and had another couple of inches on each arm. The blocking is impressive, but the ability to carry NFL defenders on his back may be a bit of an overstatement.

All of that said, I'd love to see the Packers draft either Hock or Fant. If both are on the board at #12 I'd have no problem with the Packers trading down a few spots and seeing which one is left. I don't see Hock falling out of the top 20, and I don't see Fant falling out of the top 30. Drop back to maybe 17 or 18 and you'll still get one of them.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

No matter what happens the Pack will end up with a top player with the #12 pick. This selection needs to be without question a player the team can build around for years to come. I'd take Oliver or Burns (possibly White depending on who else is available) on defense, or Fant for offense with the first pick.

Tundraboy's picture

I'm kinda feeling the same way. Either way this will be an opportunity to add some serious talent,and especially where we need it most.

ILPackerBacker's picture

Amazing how many believe 'draft capital' is like money in a bank with a consistent value.

Hawk or TJ?
D Sherrod or TJ?
trade with seattle to get DL or wait for HOF guard?

How many have egg or something more disgusting on their faces by waiting to take Rodgers or Brady when there 'was value'.

Stuff like this only demonstrates how little people understand. It is entirely meaningless and made up by people needing to fill time or paper and who have actually not watched the film on players and can not speak intelligently about them

4thand1's picture

Tom Jones?

The TKstinator's picture

She’s a lady

Old School's picture

Despite the fact that just about every top TE over the last decade was taken after the first round, and despite the fact that 15 out of the top 20 TEs last year (by yardage) were taken after the first round...…….

Only 3 TEs since 2000 have been drafted at #12 or higher: Vernon Davis, Kellen Winslow (junior, not senior), and Eric Ebron. Winslow was a bust, and a disgrace. Ebron has never been on a team that won a playoff game, and Vernon Davis had the best career of the bunch and it wasn't that fantastic. Despite that...…….

Sorry. I'm not on the Hock bandwagon. I think he's a damn fine player, but I also think I can get a TE with our 3rd round pick who'll be a really good player, too. I think there are other players at #12 that will help the team more.

We have no starter at safety opposite of Amos, and we have no starter at ILB opposite of Martinez. Needs have to take priority over wants.

Pass on Hock at #12.

Johnblood27's picture

School, I also like Hock a lot, but I agree with you on NO at #12.

There are only so many athletic BIG men.

IF one of the gifted BIG men is available at 12 I would pass on ANY TE, S, ILB, WR, RB or OG

I would prioritize a DL, OT or physically gifted EDGE at 12.

Everything else can be at 30 or 44 or trade for value to get other positions.

Thegreatreynoldo's picture

Kellen Winslow Jr. wasn't a bust. He averaged 50 yds per game. He got injured his first two years. He broke his leg in his 2nd game. The next year he had a motorcycle accident that caused an ACL injury.

Then he had 875, 1106, 428 (inj.), 884, 730, 763 yard seasons. Those are good numbers for a TE. You keep writing that Graham's 636 yard season is good, ranks him 7th or whatever for the highest paid TE in 2018. Winslow put up his numbers in 2004 through 2010. Is that worth the 6th pick? Probably not, but it isn't bust label worthy.

Your obsession with players who didn't play in playoff games is odd. It isn't Winslow's fault he was drafted by Cleveland and then traded to Tampa Bay. Football is a team game. He did lead Cleveland in receiving yards and pull that awful franchise to its first double digit win season in 13 seasons; Cleveland was the only 9+ win team (The Browns went 10-6) not to go to the playoffs in 2007. He led Tampa Bay in receptions and receiving yards in the 2009 and 2010 seasons.

He has recently been charged with some terrible crimes, including several rape charges, drug charges, and elder abuse. He doesn't sound like a nice guy. Definitely a good football player, but apparently a terrible person.

carlos's picture

I am intrigued with the comments. I agree 12 is early for a TE and I honestly haven’t watched the tape, but will. Most on this site are very knowledgeable and have me thinking. We do need speed in the middle on defense who can tackle. No more Ha Ha types who ended up being disappointing. I was excited when we drafted him. Our division has a lot of speed the Packers need to match. Haven’t even mentioned offense, other than TE, which has holes also.

EdsLaces's picture

I'd rather go stud defender 1st pick and see what tight end we can get at 30...

ILPackerBacker's picture

Say hello to AJ Hawk

how did you like Bulaga over Gronk?

EdsLaces's picture

Hock is alot of things, but Gronk he is not..

draftpete's picture

The opportunity to trade down from #12 may give us the right capital to move up from #30 to get Fant or Hock later in the round if one of them falls that far. We get a top defensive player, a TE, and don't lose any of our original picks. It all depends on the number of QB's taken in the top 10 or so. I do worry about the capital that NE has to do maneuvering with. May see them jump up several to get one of the top TE's.

carlos's picture

New England knows what a TE can do. Old school or not. Can’t have enough good players.

jannes bjornson's picture

The CBSSports three round mock with 20 trades going on should get your melon percolating. Belichick could be on the move with three in the third rd. Could be a wild ride in round one if the QB and Edge frenzy takes place.

Duneslick's picture

Packer Greg says draft best available player at 12 and package 30 and a 3rd or later pick to move up and draft fant

LeagueObsrvr's picture

As I commented in the mock draft thread yesterday, I think if the Packers want Hockenson, they're going to have to take him at #12 for trade down a few spots, but I don't think he would be available at #30. It's highly conceivable that should he start to slip into the #20 - #30 range, New England will trade up and take him.

4thand10's picture

Nope, I prefer to stay one step ahead of Minnesota the whole way through the draft, screwing them at every turn.

ShooterMcGee's picture

The difference between Hock and the other TE's is negligible. That is not the case with Oliver, Devin White or Devin Bush, Brian Burns and Montez Sweat. The drop off is huge from these players to the next level. Their athleticism sets them apart. At pick 12 we should take 1 of these 5 players because a comparable player does not exist. In the TE class there are numerous good propects like Noah Fant (better athlete than TJ), Jace Sternberger, Kahale Waring, and Josh Oliver, all of whom compare favorably to Hock. Just wait Gutey and let the draft come to you.

ILPackerBacker's picture

Not only are you comparing apples to oranges but totally confused about DL and LB. they are not the same.

You literally are cherry picking from 3 different units of the defense which has FOUR different roles.

Nobody at TE compares with TJ, nobody.

JohnnyLogan's picture

This is a draft loaded with stud defenders. Take the best one at 12. Get Arod weapons later. He's already got a good RB, a top five WR, and some young receivers who have a year of experience. Oliver, Burns, White... if one of them is there at 12 you take him.

4zone's picture

It's easy to throw Gronk's name around but until he proves himself in the NFL Hockenson is still a crap shoot. With probably better odds than many others but still no guarantee. Having said that, I like him a lot.

Question is, how much did he benefit with Fantastic on the field with him? How will he fare as the main guy in the NFL?

I like him because he can block so well and is still dangerous as a pass catcher. It's hard to justify him at #12, especially if you have someone like Oliver, or White still on the board.

I am sure Aaron and L'F would love to have him. I think this year, more than recent years, the top 10-11 could go many different ways without as solid a QB class this year. If we end up with him, great. Somehow I doubt it though.

ILPackerBacker's picture

And if White and Oliver are gone?

then polite?

Johnblood27's picture

Oh dear God, NO!

stockholder's picture

Wilkens!

4zone's picture

If White and Oliver are gone, what OT's are there? Were any taken at all? Or WR's? I think we can get real improvement ant most positions at #12. Kinda like a kid in the candy store but only $1. What do you chose? No matter what, someone else is gonna get who we don't pick. The trick is maximizing the impact.

4zone's picture

The last time we took an offensive skill player, besides AR in the first round was 2002, Devon Walker. Two years earlier, Bubba Frank's.

Old School's picture

That would be Javon Walker, WR.

4zone's picture

I hate auto spell checkers.

NMPF's picture

Maybe I'm over thinking this but with the major jump into 2019 FA , this probably is the most key Packer draft in awhile. Looking at the very possible loss of contributing URFA in 2020(Daniels, Martinez, Bulaga, Tramon, Lowry) and very possible under preforming contracts of (Graham, Taylor), this does not look like a year to be throwing around draft capital like some drunken sailor on shore leave. The need to hit on the majority of this draft is imperative to the Packers relevancy the next 4-5 years.

Tundraboy's picture

No, I think you're nailed it .

dudejcb's picture

take BAP at 12 ... hopefully Hockenstein or White (a guy can dream) and take Nasir Adderley at 30.

MarkinMadison's picture

You think Adderley is worthy of a 1st round pick? Won't he be there at #44?

jannes bjornson's picture

no.

Bryan Chisholm's picture

You trade up for White, Williams/Allen if he slips past 5 somehow.. and I'm iffy on trading up for Williams with the potential of Oliver falling. Praying for a run on QB's in the top 10 too, that would really set us up nice (don't think it's likely). White is my only sure trade up I feel comfortable going to get.. but I'd feel the need to go get Tre Boston or someone of that nature if this is the case. White would solidify the LB core with Martinez and (hopefully) a average jump from Burks.. the line is already looking formidable, with Amos and Boston back there. Then take Adderly or Hooker at (#44) and I'd say we have some true fire power to match the North.. then load up on offense IDC lol

Johnblood27's picture

Boston???

Did I miss a signing?

Bryan Chisholm's picture

Earlier in that comment, I spoke hypothetically about Boston coming to GB.

albert999's picture

Do you guys see N’Keal Harry wide receiver at Arizona States pro day
PRETTY FRICKIN IMPRESSIVE
I hadn’t heard of this kid but we shouldn’t count him out

jannes bjornson's picture

You have watch PAC 12 games in the 7 to 11 PM time slot. A lot of people on this site are sawing logs by that time. Harry chewed a lot of teams up. Herm Edwards ran a pro style offense. The Stanford guys are solid also, but not spectacular, that is, football players. I would take Harry over Metcalf.

albert999's picture

when do u see Harry going?
over Metcalf.....really...wow
His pro-day highlights were really good

jannes bjornson's picture

He is a more complete player. AJ Brown is better as a slot WR than Metcalf.

oceanstrength's picture

Gronk had faster combine 40 than Hock, out-weighed him by 17 pounds, was 2 inches taller, had hands a full inch bigger than Hock, had arms an inch and a half longer, and caught more balls in college for more yards than Hock. Hock is no Gronk.

Johnblood27's picture

Hock is the Flava-o-dah-day.

There are 3-4 pretty nice TE prospects in this draft.
Hock, Fant, Sternberger, xxxxx

I do not like the Bama Smith at all.

We can get one of the good TE with a late 2 (through trade) or 3rd round selection

Doug Niemczynski's picture

But as far as Gronk goes your comparing Hock to the Greatest TE in the game. And, for that reason I'm taking Hock again at #12.

Doug Niemczynski's picture

NFL Draft analyst Daniel Jeremiah: "I love (Iowa TE) T.J. Hockenson. I think he's the safest player in the draft." Says he evaluated Hockenson the day after Gronk dominated the Chargers as a blocker in divisional round and saw the same mentality from Hockenson.

stockholder's picture

It's marketing. The La Rams go to the super-bowl again because you fell in Love.

The TKstinator's picture

Hey Doug,
Do you have any thoughts on Hock?
Sincerely,
Every Single Reader of CHTV

Lphill's picture

If Hockenson and Devin White are there at 12 who do you take?

albert999's picture

Devin White all day

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

White!

Doug Niemczynski's picture

Haven't given it much thought.

Holecrap's picture

Hey if we draft him at 12 we got a solid player for quite a few years. This team needs a lot and no one at 12 and 30 will solve all the problems. Take quality to fill a need and you did it right.

sam1's picture

Dru Samia ILB interesting player!

OldPacker's picture

I'm Confused .. we have 3 TE's now .. will there be enough balls to justify a fourth TE unless they trade J. Graham for a pick ( remember he's 32). Protecting AR is the # 1 priority .. Yes running the ball more will have a huge impact on AR.. Health and Performance! for 13 years all we heard from MM is we have to run the ball.. .. and what did we get .. 12 attempts a game.. or some silly amount of run plays ... All things considered ..long term we have 1 young TE .. 2 that can't play ST's .. so I guess go get him.. I just talked myself into drafting him..:)))

AgrippaLII's picture

I don't think it's wise to become fixated on a particular player to the exclusion of all the other talent that will be available at pick #12. I've got to think Gutekunst has evaluated the TE group and has identified several that will fit the Packer's needs at that position. I'm thinking he won't even draft a TE in the first round.

PAPackerbacker's picture

If Hockenson is there at #12 I'd like to see the Packers take him. If not then take a top edge rusher, maybe Burns or Sweat. or OL, like Risner or Ford. Then take the next top ranked TE at #30. It will be fun to watch the draft this year regardless of who the Packers select. There's a lot of talent at the DL and LB positions in the draft. Good choices to be had at the #12 and #30 spots as well as the later rounds. The Packers should be able to fill some holes with the selections they have. Let's hope the selections they choose are as good in pro football as they were in college. And maybe they can get a gem in the later rounds, like a Donald Driver.

James Martins's picture

Given LaFleur's new scheme, which runs double TEs a lot, and Graham getting older, this is the most important position to draft in the offense, not a doubt, It is pratically a full-time starter. OL is not a good class this year, we have promissing young WRs and RB is the second most important need, but as we don't plan to have a workhorse RB, there is no need to draft one early though. Given that, we can expect a TE whithin the first 2 rounds. I personally don't like the idea of drafting a TE that early, but we can put the blame on LaFleur's new scheme, he needs a good TE, and Gutey will try to get one for sure. Out of the 3 most popular choices (Irv Smith, Noah Fant and Hock), none of them have a combination of being a good blocker, receiver and fast enough, though I personally like Foster Moreau. I expect Gutey to draft one in the first round, maybe even trade up from 30 to get one.

stockholder's picture

If Hoek (Hock) is there. Bet he trades down." When the fans think their right. And the scouts say NO. The Gm trades down. Then takes the player as advised. Especially if he finds that trade partner." Sincerely Ted Thompson.

jannes bjornson's picture

Was he referring to the King trade over selecting TJ Watt or the Datone Jones selection?

stockholder's picture

TJ Watt. Just about everyone thought Watt.

Doug Niemczynski's picture

All signs point to Hockensonat #12

T.J. Hockenson, TE, Iowa
The Packers addressed their needs on the edge (Za'Darius Smith, Preston Smith) and at safety (Adrian Amos) in free agency, so here they give Aaron Rodgers one of the best weapons in the draft. They can use Hockenson in two tight end sets with Jimmy Graham, split either or both of them out wide, or even cut ties with Graham and let Hockenson run with the job.

stockholder's picture

Needs ? ILB.? Who took Wilkerson's place. ? The only thing that matters to you is Arron Rodgers stats. That Graham gets cut. You can't give me that 2 tight end set, when you want Hock taking his place. Gute will not draft Hock @12.

Doug Niemczynski's picture

I hope the Green Bay Packers let Jordy Nelson announce the first round pick for the Green Bay Packers at number 12 and select TJ hockenson the University of Iowa that would just be awesome

jannes bjornson's picture

You win.

sam1's picture

Lions are at 8 and showing big interest it sounds like in this Hockensin.

stockholder's picture

Lions have 4 needs. 1. besides Flowers, pass Rusher, 2,Top Tight end available, (But just signed 2) 3. Nickel Corner, 4. Slot Wr.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

Hope Detroit takes Hock at #8 helping to allow for either Oliver, Burns, White, or Fant to be available.

BoCallahan's picture

Is there any way we could get Old School to be a contributor on this site? I’d put money on it that he would be KILLER on Pack-A-Day!

DragonSilk's picture

If he's there at 12 I say grab him, but don't go up and get him. Of course it depends on what you would have to give up but I'm sure it would be too much. Having #12, #30 and #44 is to good a chance to get 3 top talents.

albert999's picture

If we move up at all it should be to get Ed Oliver not Hock

SterlingSharpe's picture

If Big Hock is like Kelce or Zach Ertz, and Devin White or Bush is like Bobby Wagner, which guy would you take?

draftpete's picture

It sounds like Oliver may be moving up on some boards but I believe, depending on the QB interest, that players like Burns, Bush, or maybe even Ferrel would be available at @12. As much as I like Hock or Fant take a TE later in the draft as there is good quality in the TE's this year. Look at ILB, O line or Safety for #30 and possibly move around in the 2nd round for one of the other TE's.

For some reason I like Bush over White. Wouldn't trade up to get White. I'd rather see us trade up in the later round for better talent in the 2-5th rounds.

It is going to be interesting as to how it all falls. It only takes a couple of unexpected picks or moves in the top ten to really change things. Guty needs to be patient and smart this year.

stockholder's picture

The CBs are being ignored. I see 2 going in the top 12.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

SH,
You see 2 DB's in top 12?

I dont see it! I hope you are right as better talent available for Pack.

Archie's picture

2 DBs in top 12 would surprise me a bit but they will probably start leaving the board mid to late teens.

Only player that *might* get to us that I would trade up for is Ed Oliver and even then, only 2 or 3 picks and if the price is right.

Faced with Sweat, Brown, Bush, Gary and Hock, I might pick Hock. But maybe Gute trades down a few slots, knowing he will still get one of them. Gary scares as a Ted Thompson type pick i.e., a 4-3 DL that busts on a 3-4 team.

AROD needs help and Hock and good OL at 30 or 44 would excite me. But no way could I pass on Oliver.

Slim11's picture

I don't think GB should move down from #12. Moving up, if necessary(!), might be okay.

Trading #30 for an additional #2 or high #3 , plus a #4/5/6 is worth considering. Trading #30 might cost GB a chance at Adderley. He might not last until #44.

KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

I'd like to see the Pack trade up early in round 2 and take Simmons if still there. Otherwise, I would love to see Simmons at 30 and Oliver at 12. How great would that be?

Still like Fant!!!

Severo Henry's picture

I say let's do it! Again this will always depend on who is sitting there at 12 but.... if he is the BPA available then definitely hell yes.

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