The Packers Have 5/1 Odds to Land Antonio Brown

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February 16, 2019 at 11:05 am

No way. Do not trade the picks for a possible headache. Picks we need far more than a WR.

February 16, 2019 at 12:04 pm

Amen TB...Anything more than MAYBE a 4th is lunacy. Since the Steelers would laugh at a 4th, then I guess we don't get Brown in a trade.... DARN

February 16, 2019 at 03:01 pm

Right NP. God I hope not. After all the draft mistakes,years of picking at the end of rounds. To then have a high pick,two in the first round, and trade it all away and continue to ignore the most glaring of needs is.....

I can't even think of the right word to describe that.

jeremyjjbrown

February 16, 2019 at 07:15 pm

No way is right. This Jackass is under contract for 60 million and that's not good enough. One look at his twitter an you can see he's lost his mind.

TheVOR

February 17, 2019 at 08:00 am

Just so fans can relax a bit. This will NEVER HAPPEN! Browns cap number is 22M+, and Davante's is almost 11M.

In no universe is GB going to spend 22M+ on a problem child, locker room and franchise issue. I realize the Packers have a terrible president, but think about this, it took the franchise 3-4 years longer than it should have to discard Thompson. Even if they wanted Brown, which they don't, they couldn't pull the trigger on it. Not happening. Between Rodgers and 2 WR's you'd consume over 40% of the cap. Thats not happening..

The Steelers by the way? What a dumpster fire. They're getting ready to disappear into irrelevance for a decade..

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JonathanSpader

February 17, 2019 at 10:35 am

What does Murphy have to do with whether or not the Packers trade for Brown? I also don't see the Brown trade making sense for the Packers. Obtaining Brown would be Gute the GM's decision though. Murphy didn't sign Graham, Wilkerson, or make offers for Fuller or Mack. Why call Murphy a terrible President because you wanted TT gone sooner?

The Packers were 1 play away from multiple SB appearances. They weaknesses on the Packer's roster weren't exposed until after Rodgers was injured. Murphy has made the Packers more profitable than ever. He hired a new HC, promoted a new GM. He has stuck his neck out in 2019 and we will see what kind of organization Murphy has assembled.

Ferrari Driver

February 16, 2019 at 11:18 am

It made me think back to the Dan Devine trade for John Hadl many years ago; simply the wrong thing to do.

stockholder

February 16, 2019 at 11:20 am

I wish I could give you a 100 likes.

dobber

February 16, 2019 at 01:04 pm

You could...but it would be just giving him 1 50 times... ;)

pooch

February 17, 2019 at 08:48 am

February 16, 2019 at 02:27 pm

Yeeks! The Hadl Trade. That's pretty much the Gold Standard for bad trades.

Ask yourself this question; If Antonio Brown were on the team, would it make us run the ball more? Would it improve our ability to protect Rodgers?

MY HOPE for Lafleur and the Packers is that they protect Rodgers, who stays in the pocket and delivers quickly. I also hope they use the backs more, both in the number of runs (we were last in attempts last year) and as receivers. I don't really see a need for another guy that needs 100+ targets.

Brown is obviously a great receiver, but he doesn't really fit into what I hope the team does.

February 17, 2019 at 08:49 am

Yeah. That had to be our worst trade ever.

February 16, 2019 at 04:45 pm

But possibly not the worst in NFL history. I mean, the Vikings traded half a team for Herschel Walker. That's pretty bad.

February 17, 2019 at 06:22 am

I don't know if you've ever heard Jimmy Johnson talk about that trade (I'm sure you have) but many of if not all of those players represented conditional draft picks if the Cowboys ended up cutting them.

It's called "The Great Trade Robbery" where Johnson talks about that trade. He can't keep himself from laughing since he NEVER had any intention of keeping any of the players which all turned into more picks.

Your right Old School...The Vikings win the honor hands down.

Bert

February 16, 2019 at 11:35 am

Placing Brown on the roster, and making him LaFleur's problem, would be grounds for cruel and unusual punishment. The last thing MLF needs is babysitting an overgrown teenager.

February 16, 2019 at 12:02 pm

"Brown's remaining three years of his contract are structured where he is owed $22.165 million in 2019 at age 31, $18.34 million in 2020 at age 32, and $19.54 million in 2021 at age 33.

This is really TGR's area of expertise but isn't the base salary of $12.625 million in 2019, $11.3 million in 2020, and $12.5 million in 2021 only what the Packers would be responsible for?

With that said I wouldn't want Brown on the Packers. He doesn't play safety, can't rush the QB, and he sure as hell can't block guys like Hunter or Griffin, all areas the Packers need to improve over a DIVA WR who isn't EVER happy.

Just HELL NO!

Edit...IF my numbers are correct as far as what Brown would be owed then offer a 4th rounder TOPS...Anything more for a headache is lunacy!

BTW David...I wouldn't label Gute just yet as a man who "does not have a track record of being able to land elite players via trade or free agency". He's been the GM one off-season and IMO was tasked with one hell of a mess. Thompson BLEW the draft for 3 or 4 straight years failing to replenish roster spots of veterans who were either cut or let go to sign somewhere else or add any depth to once stocked positions like O-Line and WR AND failed misrely to ever fix the CB and Safety positions....And don't even get me going on TJ Watt. Now because most view the last several years of Rodgers career a waste in GB because of Thompsons failures, there's that much more pressure for Gutekunst to do it NOW.

If a HC is given 3 years to turn around an organization then a GM should be given more than one off-season before we label him as someone can't.

February 16, 2019 at 02:17 pm

Your numbers look good to me Nick, but Brown has a $2.5M roster bonus due 3-17-19. Pittsburgh is already eating over $21M if they trade Brown, so I imagine they will want the acquiring team to pay that. Assuming Brown doesn't want to re-negotiate, $12.6M + $2.5 =$15.1M in 2019, then $11.3M and $12.5M are all well under his market value as long as Brown doesn't regress due to age. He turns 31 in July. I have read that Brown is an extremely hard worker in practice, though he's been known to come late.

One moral of this story is there is always some risk in signing guys to big contracts, but here the Steelers compounded that risk by re-structuring his contract to create salary cap space. That's why he has those big $3.24M restructuring bonuses the Steelers have to eat.

February 16, 2019 at 02:39 pm

So he'd be more than twice as much money as Randall Cobb, plus all the potential headache. And he's 3 years older.

Let's see what www.pro-football-reference.com says:

It says that Antonio Brown has caught more passes than any other receiver over the past five years, and only Julio Jones and Jarvis Landry are within 100 of him. The most TDs at 59, and he's fifteen ahead of everybody. He's Secretariat.

Cobb, of course, is not Secretariat. But he's done all right over the last 5 years, too. He has a similar catch percentage, but he gets targeted less (Brown leads in targets over the last 5 years, too).

Personally, if I had about $30 million to spend signing FAs, I'd be looking at spending about $10 million on a safety and $10 million on an OLB and two $5 million OLs. That would add 4 pretty good starters.

February 16, 2019 at 03:37 pm

"Personally, if I had about $30 million to spend signing FAs, I'd be looking at spending about $10 million on a safety and $10 million on an OLB and two $5 million OLs. That would add 4 pretty good starters."

This is EXACTLY what I'd like to see. For example if a guy like Anthony Barr and Landon Collins were signed along with maybe the Guard from the Titans, Quinton Spain I believe and (keeping fingers crossed) Kelechi Osemele if he was cut or better yet the Packers offered a draft pick so the Raiders get something this year, THAT would be a hell of a haul.

I know, I know...I'm not crazy at the THOUGHT of Anthony Barr as a Packer but if he's wearing Green and Yellow and not that putrid purple while he's whooping Cousins ass who cares as long as he helps us win a SB which by the way he hasn't really come close to as a Viking.

February 16, 2019 at 04:57 pm

Interesting that we shared the frequency on this. I wouldn't necessarily want Barr for that, but there are others, like the guy from Washington whose name escapes me. Hell, Jadaveon Clowney would only be about $15 million a year.

And there's only about 2-3 top, young FS available in free agency and they're going to all be about $10 million a year. We could get one, like Collins, and still add a guy like Tre Boston for under $15 million total. Two new starters at safety with half our FA money.

Offensively, we could probably get TWO starting quality offensive linemen (guards) for about $10 million.

Two experienced, dependable, offensive line guys, two new starting safeties, including a $10 million man, for $25 million.

I think this would make the team a lot stronger on both sides of the ball.

February 16, 2019 at 03:38 pm

I was wondering about that TGR...I saw the $2.5 million but wasn't sure exactly how'd that apply. Thanks for responding!

jeremyjjbrown

February 16, 2019 at 07:17 pm

I don't want him for free. In fact given the choice between having him for free and paying him 10 million to go the f#$k away, I'd pick the later.

KevinGibson

February 16, 2019 at 12:01 pm

Spot on.

Roadrunner23

February 16, 2019 at 12:10 pm

No thanks after the way he did the Steelers last year.
DIVA

if it’s brown flush it down

That is all...

Skip greenBayless

February 16, 2019 at 12:13 pm

Shirley you can't be serious. A 31 year old receiver? Ah, no. We have probably the next best upcoming superstar receiver in the NFL on our team. You all probably think Davante Adams. Think again, I am talking about MVS. Davante is a great receiver but MVS could be even better and I say he breaks out this season. Last thing this young team needs is an over the hill over paid diva receiver taking away reps from the younger guys. MVS and Davante is all the star power we need and both are quiet lunch pail types. Perfect!!

Dash

February 16, 2019 at 12:35 pm

I'd add in EBS as a receiver who could break out as well Dash. I REALLY like both these kids and actually believe one or hopefully both takes a big jump. I say by week 6 or 7, once the offense is really starting to click in MLF offense one of those kids really takes off.

There's something about EBS I really like. Maybe it was that shot he took, cheap shot at that where he suffered a concussion BUT hung onto the ball, maybe something else. I know I was screaming for the Packers to take him in the 4th and 5th rounds and couldn't believe Gute landed him in the 6th.

Skip greenBayless

February 16, 2019 at 02:41 pm

I do like ESB as well but i can't pick both to be superstars though it could happen. I give the nod to MVS because of his blazing speed and his quiet professional demeanor. He was the first receiver last year to separate from the pack and got the most playing time early on. I just think there's something special about this guy. He has every physical quality you want and he's highly intelligent and mentally sound. ESB could also become a special player. Comes from a family of high achievers. Good stock. Either way, it should be a totally different feel this season from this receiving corp. Even J'Mon Moore could blossom. Not worried about Kumerow. God is on our side.

Dash

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February 16, 2019 at 03:09 pm

Yeah, but depending on what Gute thinks about the WR prospects and how the draft is going to fall, you're betting our 2019 season (well, maybe) on at least one of these two rookies to develop, with one developing big time.

I've been against AB given what I think the Steelers will get for him. I do think we need to sign a FA WR. I like Beasley, Crowder, Humphries, and I'd inquire about Tyrell Williams. Heck, I might try to pry Hogan out of NE, though we do have Allison assuming we tender him.

"Overconfidence. Another robust finding in psychology ... is that people are overconfident in their judgments. Furthermore, overconfidence is exacerbated by information—the more information experts have, the more overconfident they become. NFL teams face a related challenge – making judgments about players while accumulating increasing amounts of information about them as the draft approaches."

The article suggests that people who are paid based on their ability to evaluate players better than the average person/scout are especially prone to over-rely on scouts and their own judgment.

I've had a long-running "conversation" on APC over this and other studies by Massey and Thaler. Nod to Old School for mentioning it here. Here is a link. hs needs to be https of course. Just hit the open PDF in Browser button to read it for free.

hs://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=697121

Hawg Hanner

February 16, 2019 at 12:15 pm

The anti-Gutekunst posture continues. Point 4 is a pointed barb: "Brian Gutekunst does not have a track record of being able to land elite players via trade or free agency: Gutekunst spent his first season as general manager striking out on his two biggest targets, Khalil Mack and Kyle Fuller. " Well one year is not much of a track record, but are you so smart that you know he struck out, or did he go as far as common sense and good reason would allow? Were these failures per se? Arguably not.

February 16, 2019 at 12:37 pm

2 Thumbs up Hank! Well one here and I'm giving 2 here at home.

Lare

February 16, 2019 at 04:04 pm

Actually, suggesting that Gutekunst is dumb enough to blow a big chunk of his salary cap to bring in someone like Brown is criticism in and of itself.

Rossonero

February 16, 2019 at 04:14 pm

Hawg laying down the hammer! Hawg sent that with SLAM effect. Agree with you. Give Gutekunst a chance.

February 16, 2019 at 12:19 pm

The only comparison from the good side of the brain is Andre Rison. Brown's age negates the big dollar deal. They already wasted CAP on Graham etc.

Qoojo

February 16, 2019 at 12:33 pm

I can't imagine any sane GM trading draft picks for the opportunity to overpay this guy.

"Brian Gutekunst does not have a track record of being able to land elite players via trade or free agency"

One year track record, and Mack came down to projected draft position. /facepalm

CAG123

February 16, 2019 at 02:16 pm

How would that be over paying? He isn’t some 4th year player that just came off a couple of good seasons he leads the NFL in TD receptions over the past 3 years. Is he a diva? Yes of course but don’t confuse that with the talent he possesses and the contract that he earned.

Doug Niemczynski

February 16, 2019 at 12:42 pm

Don't need him.

Packer_Fan

February 16, 2019 at 12:45 pm

Agre, don't sign Brown. Don't sign Bell. Over priced trouble makers

Lare

February 16, 2019 at 04:07 pm

Both great players, how many Super Bowls did the Steelers win with them?

carlos

February 16, 2019 at 12:46 pm

No way on Brown. Develop our young receivers who have loads of potential. Watch the clips of Brown throwing tantrums on the sidelines. Look at the faces of his teammates. They all seem so sick of his antics and I don’t blame them. I wouldn’t give up even a 7 th round pick for him. Nothing but trouble.

4thand1

February 16, 2019 at 01:22 pm

Dam off season. We have to spend time talking about players like Brown who don't deserve the time of day. He's turning out to be another T.O. and would hurt the Packers more than help them. If the Pack is going to stretch the cap, do it on defense or the o-line.

JohnnyLogan

February 16, 2019 at 01:27 pm

If Brown can be had for a 2nd or less do it. All of you refusing to sign the best receiver in football of the last six years remind me of the same poor souls who railed against signing Randy Moss when he wanted to play for us and instead caught over 20 TD's for New England... or The Beast, who wanted to play with Rodgers but instead went to Seattle and took them to a SB. Football isn't about having a team full of nice guys. Divas are a problem, but usually, they're really good football players too. I for one would love to see Adams and Brown lined up together. But let's go with what we have. No question MVS or EQ will be almost as good as... the best receiver in football. Double teams on Adams and Brown leaves TE's open and running back screens unprotected. Rodgers would set NFL records with those two. How often is the best receiver in football available? No, let's hold on to that 2nd round pick that will land us a Pro Bowl TE or safety. Or... land us another Josh... Jackson or Jones. For once I'd like this team to have the guts to sign a real difference maker. One SB with Rodgers and we want to be a team in a rebuild? Sign Brown!

February 16, 2019 at 02:27 pm

Yeah, I am on board * for #75. IDK about #44.

*Gute is going to have to be allowed to talk to Antonio Brown and do some due diligence to get to the bottom of things. One story is that Big Ben called out AB in practice, but AB is known as an extremely hard worker in practice, and as a veteran, Rothlisberger might have been out of line depending on what got said and how. Lombardi knew how to do it. Some guys you call out but not others.

February 16, 2019 at 03:10 pm

I would drop a #4 for Brown w/out hesitation.

ILPackerBacker

February 16, 2019 at 01:27 pm

NICK PERRY!!!

If only the player had your level of excellence!
ESB reminds me of times of a young james jones. A flat out tough kid. Only I think I would give an edge to ESB as an athlete.

carlos

February 16, 2019 at 02:58 pm

ESB is faster than Jones. Really enjoyed Jones as a Packer.

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February 16, 2019 at 03:10 pm

Yes. Jones made some ridiculous catches, and almost all were in pivotal situations as I recall.

JonR005

February 17, 2019 at 01:13 pm

1 - your numbers are wrong. The packers wouldn't be paying the signing bonus which would put ABs salary (3 yrs/38 mil) as a discount compared to sammy watkins - who we tried to sign last year.

2 -can we cool it with this "diva" narrative. Yes, there has been drama the past couple of years in pitt. Thats caused by having a talented team that just can't quite win it all and sees their window shrinking. He's one of the best ever at the position and just flat out wants to win. As long as Rodgers/him/davante can get along i don't see any reason he would be the "cancer" that you guys are trying to peg him as.

3 - i wouldn't give up a 1st or 2nd. But after that, I would give up a 3rd and 4th to immediately make this offense elite

4 - the length of his contract works perfectly paired with MVS and EQ. if we want to extend them after their rookie deal it will come the same year this salary goes off the books.

5 - we'll still have room to sign 1-2 free agents (S and either OL or EDGE)

CAG123

February 16, 2019 at 03:24 pm

Let’s just imagine for a quick second shall we......
WR1A.Adams
WR1B.Brown
WR2.Cobb
WR3.MVS
WR4.ESB
RB1.Jones
QB1.Rodgers
Now if that doesn’t get you excited just a little bit then I don’t know what to tell you. Have fun matching up against that comp of receivers.

4thand1

February 16, 2019 at 04:40 pm

Fine if the o-line can block and hold up.

February 16, 2019 at 07:03 pm

Yeah, minor detail.

CheesyTex

February 16, 2019 at 09:32 pm

Works for me IF the Packers trade Graham for Brown, no draft choices. Maybe even throw in Perry too.

Dream scenario to dump big cap $, lose no draft choices, and shed questionable players. If Steelers get desperate enough...

CAG123

February 16, 2019 at 09:47 pm

Let’s at least try to be reasonable. Draft picks are good but even thinking about holding on to a second or third instead of giving that up for AB is complete lunacy.

February 16, 2019 at 10:00 pm

Even if you get a sports car at a bargain price, it may not be worth the maintenance and repairs and fees.

February 16, 2019 at 10:31 pm

Yup.

pooch

February 17, 2019 at 09:02 am

Of course strike Cobb cause he can’t stay healthy

rstain99

February 17, 2019 at 09:05 am

one ball to go around AB is awesome but WR is not GB problem, Oline is as well LB. At 31 still good sure but 20 mil plus not sure. Lets tweek that defense as you all can see thats the bottom line. Make it a top 10 defense and the offense will be fine AR has 3-4 left, lets not waste it. Trey Flowers in NE is a free agent he can get after QB and is young. Maybe softy King will finally put together a complete season with Jaire Alexander on the other side Breeland in the slot Josh Jackson at safety. Tramon Williams on the TB12 method never ages pretty formidable def backfield. Another year for Pettine to be creative may have something. Now back to my other favorite team Boston Bruins.

Rossonero

February 16, 2019 at 04:16 pm

Brown is like Terrell Owens: very talented, but a locker room cancer. Let someone else blow their money and/or draft picks on him.

jww061356

February 16, 2019 at 04:23 pm

No interest in this guy for several reasons: 1)Too expensive to obtain and keep 2) Diva 3) Too old 4) A potential headache for a young first year HC. Just to name a few.

February 16, 2019 at 06:30 pm

If Brown was 27, it would be harder to not try for him -- but still probably a no.
Another concern is having two receivers who are elite in Adams and then Brown. If we want to develop a short passing game with slot receivers, tight ends, and running backs, then we may not want to have two all-pro receivers who want 100 catches apiece.
I like to think that at least a couple of our receivers already on the roster are going to step up this upcoming season to be highly effective complements to Adams.
I'm truly hopeful of having a top-ten offense with lots of variety and excitement.

bbarryirish

February 16, 2019 at 04:26 pm

Vegas has the wrong “Bay”.
It’s Tampa Bay. Reunite with Arians.
They have a strong history.
Please not our “Bay”.
Go Pack Go !

February 16, 2019 at 06:30 pm

Could be on to something there and DeSean Jackson rumored to be moved out.

February 16, 2019 at 06:13 pm

The only way I'd pick up a veteran receiver in the off-season is to get a slot guy who is quick enough to get open for first downs -- and who would be a good transition until our younger receivers get more experience.
If Cobb can do it, then all the better. I'm a big fan, but he seemed really slow last season -- although that may have been due to nagging injuries, or bad perception on my part.
I'd also be open to picking a wide receiver late in the draft who seems like a sleeper who was overlooked -- particularly a shifty slot guy who may be also able to help with kick returns.
All my best to Antonio Brown, but I wouldn't take a chance on him with the Packers.
I'm actually excited about our corps of young receivers to go along with Adams (and maybe Allison) -- MVS, ESB, Kumerow, plus I'm not giving up on Moore -- although, again, a quick and shifty veteran for the slot may be a good addition.
We have to make sure any veterans set the right tone for so many young guys on the Packers, offense and defense.

February 16, 2019 at 06:38 pm

The thing about dislikes is wondering what I wrote that was so bad -- or if it's a matter of personal dislike. That's a concern about anonymity.
Oh well, gotta be tough to play football commenter -- or go home if it's just not worth it. I guess there's also becoming a free agent.

February 17, 2019 at 11:00 am

I appreciate the comments about likes and dislikes.
My main takeaway is to not get too concerned about them.
Still, the giddy thrill of the chase for the most dislikes does seem enticing.
I enjoy the discussion here to learn about things I don't know, as well as to get different insights about things I do know, at least partially.
There's also a lot of good humor sprinkled in.
I wouldn't want a discussion about football to be too prim and proper, and think some bumps and bruises and scrapes in the course of commenting is generally a good thing.
I would guess most of us come here for the shared enjoyment of the Packers, even a passion for them, plus a camaraderie in our common cause.
It seems a rugged debate is desirable, as long as it's respectful, and we are mindful of the great worth of camaraderie.

WinUSA

February 16, 2019 at 10:42 pm

Y’all keep talking about some idiot suggesting Brown was even on the Packers table is hyperbole . And all the subsequent possibilities of our receivers blossoming.... it won’t mean a hoot if we don’t put someone in front of Rodgers to keep him VERTICAL !!!!! An A Grade right tackle would cure a lot of Ill in the running AND passing game. Jonah Williams would be worth what it would take to get him. Not sexy...and giving the likes of Spriggs image to the state troopers ....to prevent his sorry ass from ever coming back to Wisconsin ....would be worth the price of admission. The addition of a REAL offensive lineman playing next to Bulaga (moving to guard) and Bakhtiari on the other side...would absolutely rejuvenate Rodgers!!

Minniman

February 17, 2019 at 03:26 am

Whispers are that the 2020 WR Draft crop has great potential - a number of freshmen and sophomore receivers had very good seasons last year in CFB.

As good as AB was at Pittsburgh, the proverbial farm should not be mortgaged to acquire his services. There's too many questions that need answering.

As many have already posted, there's also much that can be done to give the present crop of Packers receivers every opportunity to succeed

Lphill

February 17, 2019 at 08:05 am

Stay away from Brown , he is not half the man Davante Adams is.

Gforcetrivers

February 17, 2019 at 08:14 am

Why waste three more years of Browns and ARs careers developing TRUST...just draft develop and waste it that way. Tired of the same old trust excuses. Brady and Drew don't use that excuse.

mrtundra

February 17, 2019 at 09:09 am

If we are going to spend tons of money on a player, I'd rather it be Earl Thomas or Landon Collins than Antonio Brown. Neither Thomas nor Collins would be half the headache that Brown would be for us and we would also be getting solid help in a position of need.

February 17, 2019 at 09:22 am

Dougherty wrote that Brown wants a trade and a new contract.

That is a conversation stopper.

February 18, 2019 at 05:34 am

Thanks TGR... I think everybody assumes Brown will come in and play for the contract he currently has. He's almost certainly going to want to renegotiate and I doubt he'll ask for any less.

I mean JUST the money a team has to pay Brown now is pretty damn substantial...Especially with the wear and tear and being on the wrong side of 30. His YPR dropped a bit this year too. Maybe that's a sign of things to come.

BadgerMan

February 17, 2019 at 10:55 am

Brown would definitely be a wrong move for Green Bay. Considering all of his me first issues. I would like to see them go after Earl Thomas in free agency.