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Packers Question of the day - Cutting Gunter; Blasphemous?

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Packers Question of the day - Cutting Gunter; Blasphemous?

There's a lot of "hawt taeks" brewing around Twitter right about now concerning the Packers' secondary, and I just want to make sure I'm not crazy here.

The theme right now is either cutting Ladarius Gunter, or keeping Gunter and cutting the third-year duo of Damarious Randall and Quinten Rollins. 

Gunter was by far the team's most servicable cornerback in 2016 in a depleted unit that ultimately caught up to Dom Capers and his defensive unit in mid-January. In the playoffs, he was assigned to Odell Beckham Jr., Dez  Bryant and Julio Jones - some of the league's best receivers - in three straight weeks. Keep in mind, he's an undrafted second-year corner who, really, didn't really play poorly.

Cutting Gunter is as crazy as it sounds, as is Randall and Rollins, right? Give me your take.

__________________________

Zachary Jacobson is a staff writer/reporter for Cheesehead TV. He's the voice of The Leap on iTunes and can be heard on The Scoop KLGR 1490 AM every Saturday morning. He's also a contributor on the Pack-A-Day Podcast. He can be found on Twitter via @ZachAJacobson or contacted through email at [email protected].

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Fan friendly comments only: off Comments (58) This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.

zoellner25's picture

They have too much time invested in all 3. You don't cut any. Nobody gets cut this time of year. Come on.

dobber's picture

Yep. Only guys with big bonuses about to kick in are the ones who get their walking papers now.

Amanofthenorth's picture

Love Packers. Dislike most online "expert" fans. In the past year: Cut Adams, Fired MM, TT, DC,; traded ARod, And 4-6 called for throwing games for a higher draft pick ...on and on. Here's an idea, cheer and react don't manage and dictate. You aren't in the business. You could have been from 1973 to 1991. But now, leave it to professionals. Packers have them.

The TKstinator's picture

Come on, man!
Where's the fun in that?
Everybody knows the fans are smarter than the coaches and management!
(Just in case: ~~~~~)

Handsback's picture

Cutting Gunter makes no sense at all. In fact cutting any CB makes no sense at all.

Fmiller79's picture

Crazy talk, you need more talent at CB but you keep all 3 of those guys. Gunter is a #4 and in that role is good. Need to see what you have with Randall next year, is it an Adams scenerio where injuries messed him up and he bounces back? Rollins looks like a Hyde clone, not great at anything but can be used all over. Need to add a top flight CB in the draft and in a different world found a solid vet who can start for you.

Chris Carnall's picture

It's a fair point comparing Randall's year this year to Adams' year last year. I was all set to show Davante the door, and look at what he achieved this year, largely injury-free :-)

Got to hope that Randall fulfills his potential - but next year will be a key one for him. I wonder if Gunter may be more than a #4? In any case, to call for his departure is (shall we say) unwise. He overachieved - the others, not so much!

bsbill's picture

Wow, I watched Gunter miss tackle after tackle. He also spent much of his playing time chasing the receiver from 3 to 4 yards back. The fact that the 3 d-backs made the same mistakes game after game caused me to look at the coaches and the def. scheme. Opponents at times shutdown the Packer receivers by grabbing, holding, bumping, just being physical. The Packer d-backs would play soft, off 5 or more yards. If being physical isn't called by the officials, it's got to be use! That's not coaching rocket science! talent or no talent. Good coaching or poor coaching. Which is it?

carusotrap's picture

How 'bout we cut Dom and Ted, and then see what happens with the players?

RCPackerFan's picture

Why would anyone cut them? That's moronic. Same as the people suggesting that Adams should have been cut last year.

I'm assuming these are the same people that wanted the Packers to cut Adams last year... I would have thought after Adams situation people would be more relaxed on players that have a down year.

Bert's picture

Bad idea to even consider cutting Gunter. He was put in a bad situation and never quit. The kid has some game. If everybody who can't cover Dez and Julio 1-on-1 with NO help from the pass rush, there wouldn't be too many folks CBs left in the league. Geez. Let's get him back in camp and see what he learned.

MarkinMadison's picture

Rollins and Randall performed too well as rookies to be cut. Gunter basically took a redshirt last year, and did about as well as could be expected under the circumstances. The only way I would cut any of them (and really what I'm about to say MIGHT apply to Gunter) would be if their lack of speed made it unlikely that they could succeed regardless of the amount of coaching. Speed at CB is not everything, but there is a certain minimum level that you just can't do without.

dobber's picture

I think your analysis is right (looking at the full bodies of work for these guys) -- and the fact that they're all cheap makes the experiment a doable one. Meaning there's virtually nothing to recoup in terms of cap. More bodies in camp and not fewer. I guarantee that if any of these three were cut, they'd be on someone else's roster as soon as they could be signed.

The only way I cut any of these three is if they get outplayed by a wide margin by someone else in camp. To do so otherwise is to say, "Hey, you know that CB position where we're going to lose our #1 CB permanently? Let's dig a bigger hole in our depth by pre-emptively cutting anyone who has even an outside chance of being #1-4 next year."

MarkinMadison's picture

Musburger is retiring! Thank God. I've been sick of that front-runner worshiping dinosaur since the 80s.

egbertsouse's picture

Cutting them at this point is crazy-talk. Counting on them to cover the other team's No. 1 would also be crazy. Rollins and Gunter look like serviceable nickel and dime guys. Randall, however, needs an attitude change before next season to hang around, he looks like he quit on the team this year.

DrMixerGED's picture

I said the same about Randall and got ripped for it. He needs a major attitude adjustment.

4zone's picture

Nickle and Dime are Gunter and Hyde. Randall a #2 CB at best, Rollins 4th Safety behind HaHa, Burnett and Brice.

We need a #1 CB and possibly a #2 as well. I would prefer a FA cabable as a #1 and we could draft our #2.

No one gets fired. Must be really slow in the office to try to walk this lame dog...

4zone's picture

Nickle and Dime are Gunter and Hyde. Randall a #2 CB at best, Rollins 4th Safety behind HaHa, Burnett and Brice.

We need a #1 CB and possibly a #2 as well. I would prefer a FA cabable as a #1 and we could draft our #2.

No one gets fired. Must be really slow in the office to try to walk this lame dog...

Duke Divine's picture

Fanatics always want to cut somebody!
Thanks goodness they're not in charge:
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000778754/article/desean-jackson-am...

dobber's picture

Interesting...

I wonder if the Redskins will look at this data when deciding whether or not to give Cousins the huge contract. He's throwing to receivers who consistently get separation. I wonder what Jordan Reed's numbers look like.

Finwiz's picture

Gunter is quite possibly one of the worst cornerbacks ever in GB. I'd take Ahmad Carroll over him, at least he had speed. They could cut Gunter today and never miss him one bit. Any drafted corner can be just as good, and likely much better.

Ferrari Driver's picture

IMO, the Packers need to sign/draft a number one CB to replace Shields. Gunter if a fine backup.

TXCHEESE's picture

Ahmad Carroll had great hands also. Just asked the 102 receivers he held during his awesome career. Gunter is a baller. Sit back and realize what he was asked to do as a second year undrafted player. I will say, Randall better have been injured. Dude needs to look in the mirror and hit the weights this offseason. He is the worst tackler in the entire DB group.

Colin_C's picture

No way. Cutting anyone this time of year is flat out stupid. I gave Adams the benefit of the doubt when playing injured, so I'll do the same for our young CB. Sadly, unlike Adams, I don't think all three of them will become starting caliber players necessarily.
Rollins will be a legit #2 corner next year, mark my words.
Randall should be playing safety, and will continue to struggle in coverage until someone in the front office switches him back to his real position. Look at Bama's Eddie Jackson. Sucked as a CB, but is one of the best FS in college football. Let Dix and Randall fight for the starting safety position.
Gunter isn't bad anyways, but just doesn't have to the speed to stay with the Julio Jones of the world. Still, I think he'll be a decent #3 next season.

stockholder's picture

Dump everyone behind those three. These guys don't have the size, to be a shut down corner. Their back-ups. Plain and simple. We kept Bush; Gunter and Rollins can't do worse. Only Randall looks like he could be a starter. But he just doesn't have that Size , when tackling the bigger back or WR. ( It's IR for 3 years. on and off ) The WRs are getting bigger and faster. Get some speed and a veteran that can blanket a Julio,Bryant, Becham, etc. These guys just can't keep up. And like shields, he couldn't tackle for years. With Capers scheme they must tackle. These guys cannot do both.

dobber's picture

Jeff Janis is the WR foil to Jarrett Bush: guys who contribute almost exclusively on special teams, but need a regular position to merit a spot on the roster. Bush made a couple good, splash plays on defense in his career and filled in OK at times, but otherwise you winced when he was taking defensive snaps. Janis is the same, only at WR.

What surprised me somewhat was that Dimitri Goodson was as serviceable as he was at CB when he got that brief stint of regular playing time this season. Was he someone you want as a #1 or #2 CB? Nope. But I thought he was better than he's been in the past.

Maybe the CB play on this team late in the season has made me look back wistfully at Goodson's play...egad.

Lphill's picture

I feel better about Gunter than I do Randall . Funny how we all thought before the season that the secondary was our strong point. We can't draft 3 corners and put 3 rookies out there next season we need a Free agent with experience to help out I don't know who is available but there has to be someone worthwhile .

fthisJack's picture

don't cut...add in FA and the draft...2 CB. also, this team needs to get some PASS RUSH to help the DB's. need a great edge rusher and a DL that can push the pocket to team with Daniels.

Lphill's picture

I know Randall played saftey in college but he does not seem to have the size for a NFL saftey , I like Brice better anyway.

dobber's picture

Brice isn't markedly bigger than Randall: about a half an inch and 5 lbs.

There was a significant difference in their workout numbers at bench (14 vs. 21), and Brice has slightly better straight-line speed, but Brice's cod numbers were gosh-awful. I think he's pretty much a downhill safety, and he's been exposed in coverage at times, too.

rdent's picture

Chuck Cecil anyone? A hammer in the middle but struggles in coverage.

fthisJack's picture

he hasn't played that much so you would think he will get better in coverage as he gets more experience. they also have Hawkins, Evans, and Dorleant so it will be interesting to see if someone makes the jump next year.

rdent's picture

I like Hawkins, he has a lot of the same mesureables and speed of Shields, Brice also, 5'11 200 lbs 4.39 40 and even though they are set at Saftey it would be great to see him improve but I bet they still draft a CB in the first 3 rounds.

RCPackerFan's picture

I really like Brice. With his tackling ability, I wonder if they might try making him learn the hybrid S/ILB that Burnett played this year.

Rossonero's picture

Whoever is spreading this BS rumor is guilty of shoddy journalism or just some hot heads blowing steam. Either way, you don't cut any of these guys. Duh.

fthisJack's picture

right, not many guys come in and set the world on fire in their first and even second year. some guys take longer and there are injuries to consider here.

croatpackfan's picture

Ah, I think I will just read from time to time this fan site... Cheesehead TV start to sound ridiculous. Fire everybody and everything. I think we should fire that guy who take care of players helmet. Did you notice how TJ Lang helmet went wrong? He is guilty that Packers did not score much in the second half at Dallas...
I think that one of the biggest mistake Packers did last season were that they did not cut Davante Adams. He is pure bust!
REMEMBER PEOPLE! CUT ADAMS -HE IS TT MISTAKE!!!!!

fthisJack's picture

and Perry was a bust too....should let him go in FA.

stockholder's picture

So you want to justify 3 years of tutoring. Yes Adams finally became a NFL WR. No one would have traded for him unlike now. But TT did make a mistake. And many more when you look at his drafts. He should have Taken defensive players like Kony Ealy. And saved many DE (ETC>) picks since. But the truth is he could have kept James Jones WR! And gotten more production. And since 2010 this defense has had band -aides, instead of getting promising defensive replacements. So you can say TT was right about Adams. But TT lost A-Rods and many other player's window, to prove Adams was a good pick. TT only fell in love with his speed. Adams was a mistake! (borderline bust period. )

dobber's picture

What happened to the Stockholder who said that he'd come around on Adams and now is a fan? I liked him...sigh.

stockholder's picture

Adams was timed at 4.5 and said his shoes had something to do with the slower Time. I have never been a Fan of the Adams pick. It got me booted off Football futures, and more than likely had something to do with Acme temp. ban. ( Just being honest.) I'm glad for the packers and you as fans he made it. But I still feel he was not worth the wait. TT once said the worse mistakes by a GM are WRs. Well I just don't feel Adams will ever be in the same class as a Nelson or cobb. He helped a lot this year. But I believe the signing of Cook had something to do with Adams year too. I think we can agree it really helped A-rod. So try not to use your imagination so much.

Nick Perry's picture

The thing about Adams is he was so young when drafted, 21 years old wasn't it? Personally I think he was smart as hell to come out when he did. Carr was leaving, he'd caught over 100 balls his last 2 years, his stock would never be higher.

stockholder's picture

Adams was rated a 3-5 rd. pick by most scouts. They compared him to Jones. TT reached liked most of his picks. Especially in 2014. ( Of course a-rod and Bulaga fell to him.) Still does TT care about winning anything more than the division?

rdent's picture

I can't understand how anyone could even suggest that!? Randall and Rollins,call it a sophomore slump,or injuries or both as to why they played poorly in their 2nd year but you just don't cut a1&2 after 2 seasons plus the secondary is depleted enough ,at least give them 1 more year to prove if they suck or not and I think Gunter can be a good Nick or Dime back, thrust into what he was asked to do,the guy did the best he could on the outside, plus I can't wait to see if Hawkins can make a jump next year,they have a very young secondary we'll all know more after next season and let's pray the injury plague passes them by next training camp and season.

Donster's picture

Can't cut any of the three. Gunter played better than Randall and Rollins. Randall and Rollins were draft picks, so TT wouldn't cut them, because that would mean he made a mistake. Secondly, both were injured of and on during the season. Third, they were really thrown into the fire with little experience. Fourth, with no pass rush in almost every game, All Pro corners would be getting burned. And I don't know if they aren't being coached properly or not. That could be a factor too.

Free agent's picture

I'd like to hear Murphy's honest view on the current state of the Packers. Hopefully changes are on the way regarding GM, DC and Free agent philosophies. Ready for an eventful and exciting offseason for a change.

Doug Niemczynski's picture

I agree. Come on guys. This ONLY Demaryius Randall 2nd year and Quenton Rollins 2nd year. This is basically, LaDarius Gunters 1st year since he only played like one game in 2015 and yes he did not need to be covering Odell Bechham, Dez Bryant or Julio Jones in the the 1st dang place and Josh Hawkins (rookie) is only in his 1st year. Again , it is the BAD coaching of Dom Cappers. My lord, how many times, how many times, how many times do we have to say it !!!! FIRE DOM CAPERS NOW !!!!!!! Please !!!!!!!!!

dobber's picture

...and this is only Rollins's third year of high-level football.

rdent's picture

Basketball player initially, might have to be patient with him but don't wait too long

Doug Niemczynski's picture

We have given DOM CAPERS 1st round pick after 1st round pick after 1st round pick !!!!! NO MORE !!!!!!!
We have gave him all defense practically last year !!!!!! No more !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

2017 Draft will consist of ALL offensive players !!! Every dang pick !!!!!!!!
1. RB
2. WR
3. TE
4 RB/WR
4. Tackle
5. Guard
6. Tackle
7. Guard

Doug Niemczynski's picture

We have sacrificed on offense every year and have depleted out back up help on the front offensive line.

Fire Dom Capers. Draft all offensive players
and hire a coach who has had the exact players Dom Capers had in 2016 and I bet he will do a whole heck of a lot better than Capers did.

Doug Niemczynski's picture

All we have on offense for 1st round picks are 1st round Aaron Rogers and 1st round pick Bryan Bulaga !!!!! That's it.......Everything every years since Capers has been on the Packers has gone for Defense and Capers still sucks !!!!!

Andrew Lloyd Peth's picture

Cut none of them. They're young, cheap, injured, and learning.

Bring in one more to replace Shields, butlet's not start panicking by dumping young talent.

Since '61's picture

I don't see any reason why any of the three CBs should be released. I would not say that Gunther, Randall or Rollins are starting caliber CBs but they can are valuable backups and nickel/dime DBs. Rollins is probably the best of the bunch and Randall played hurt for most of the season. Gunther was never expected to be a full time CB never mind a #1 CB. The Packers should retain all 3 sign an experienced FA CB and draft at least one more CB and maybe 2. This season demonstrates what happens when you consistently draft at #25 or higher every season or try to fill in with UDFAs. It is not reasonable to expect players drafted at 25+ to remain competitive with players drafted in the top 10 like Dez Bryant, Julio Jones, OBJ, etc... especially when they are in their first 1-2 seasons. Lack of a consistent pass rush does not help either. I don't expect much help from this year's draft since we have the #29 pick. TT it's time to seriously consider FA help for CBs and pass rushers. Thanks, Since '61

croatpackfan's picture

This sounds very reasonable to me...

GeorgiaCheesehead's picture

1. Sign a FA VET shutdown CB
2. Take a CB 1st Round
3. DL pass rusher 2nd round
4. ILB 3rd round

bsbill's picture

The d-backs are not pro-quality! Gunter draws the best receivers, not because he is an outstanding back, but because the others are that bad! Gunter is a hitter if he can be in position. Most of the time, that isn't the case. The Packers have had a poor defense for several years. It just doesn't improve! Who's at fault?

LeagueObsrvr's picture

It would be nuts to cut Randall and Rollins, and I certainly don't think the Packers have it in their plans to do so anyways. Both players need time to grow, and this year they took their lumps. I fully expect both players to learn from this season and begin to pay dividends in future years as they continue to develop and mature. Besides, I don't think the problem resides completely with the secondary. The real problem starts up front, where the Packers have been unable to generate any kind of consistent pass-rush that scares anyone. Fix that, and you'll see the secondary begin to blossom.

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