Packers 2021 NFL Draft: Day One Analysis
Aaron Rodgers distraction doesn't alter first round strategy.
By KenLass
We can debate whether Brian Gutekunst is a good general manager, but I’ll say this for him: he is fearless. He’s going to do what he thinks is best for the long term future of the Green Bay Packers, and he doesn’t care what you or I, or Aaron Rodgers, thinks about it. I like that.
After Rodgers’ camp dropped the bomb on draft day that he didn’t want to return to the team, and after Gutekunst responded with a statement that the Packers remain committed to Rodgers “for 2021 and beyond”, it would be understandable if, with his first round selection, Gutekunst felt pressured to take a wide receiver, or at least a tackle, to demonstrate to Rodgers his commitment to get him some help.
Instead, the Green Bay GM stayed true to his board and used his first round pick on cornerback Eric Stokes, choosing to address a more critical need on the defensive side of the ball. Stokes is a remarkable athlete, with speed and size, who may start immediately at slot corner, or give Kevin King a run to start on the outside.
Most NFL scouts agreed there were only 15 to 18 true first round graded players in this draft. Unwilling to burn the draft capital it would take to move up that high, Gutekunst was content to wait it out and use his own pick at 29. It might have been tempting to go up to the low 20’s for tackle Christian Darrisaw, but either Gutekunst didn’t have him valued high enough, or he couldn’t find a trade partner. When the Vikings picked off Darrisaw at number 23, the decision to stay put became easier.
The Packers lost little ground through the next two picks, running backs Najee Harris and Travis Etienne. There may have been some heartburn at pick 26 when corner Greg Newsome II was grabbed up by the Browns. And Packer fans hoping for receiver Rashod Batemon were disappointed when the acrobatic Golden Gopher went 27th to Baltimore.
After the Saints selected edge rusher Payton Turner with the 28th pick, Gutekunst found himself with a wide selection of options at various positions. Among the players he passed on were defensive lineman Christian Barmore, safety Trevon Moehrig, tackles Teven Jenkins, Jalen Mayfield and Liam Eichenburg, defensive back Asante Samuel Jr. and receivers Elijah Moore and Rondale Moore.
Most draft analysts projected Stokes as a second round prospect. But picking in the 29th slot pretty much puts you in second round territory anyway. Stokes is going to give the Packer secondary a lot of versatility. Scouting reports indicate he can play press or zone, slot or outside. He may even be a candidate for kick returns. One of the knocks on him is a weakness against the run, but if the Packer corners are consistently having to stop runners, they have bigger issues. The NFL is a passing league and Stokes, playing in the most elite of all college leagues, held his own against top receivers from schools like Alabama and LSU. Considering what was there at 29, I find it hard to have serious problems with this choice.
So the Packers wind up with yet another highly drafted cornerback. If Eric Stokes develops as well as most of Gutey’s other first round picks (Jaire Alexander, Rashan Gary, Darnell Savage), Green Bay should finally be set at the corners for a long time to come.
QUOTES FROM GUTEKUNST AFTER THE PICK:
“I think we’ve gotten to the tipping point of being a dominant defense.”
“We had some options to move up into the low twenties, the mid twenties......but the board didn’t fall that way.”
“We might have had a chance to move back if Eric had been taken ahead of us.”
(On whether he expects Stokes to start) “Eric is a pretty quick study and he’ll be in that mix pretty quickly.”
“He’s really got a great upside. He’s a really good football player and the sky is the limit.”
(On his speed) “4.29 (time in the 40) kind of gets your attention.”
(On watching film of him playing against Alabama & LSU) “We always start by watching him against the best competition...I’ve seen those games more than I wanted to.”
“We interviewed him. He’s such a genuine human being. Packer fans are going to love him...As we checked the boxes, he added up.”
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Ken Lass is a former Green Bay television sports anchor and 43 year media veteran, a lifelong Packers fan, and a shareholder.
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Comments (235)
Lare
April 30, 2021 at 06:08 am
I think Stokes is a solid pick. Nothing flashy but we'll all be pleased if he just does his job.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 07:21 am
Yep...it's a low bar, but I walk away from this pick thinking that BG didn't $#!t the bed....AND he still has all his middle round picks to work with.
Razer
April 30, 2021 at 07:24 am
I love it when we pick good football players who show up week-in, week-out. Yes, a solid pick in an area of need.
murf7777
April 30, 2021 at 09:42 am
In addition, a high character person. The man donates his time to the Boys and Girls club. Welcome to the Packers.
WestCoastPackerBacker
April 30, 2021 at 10:26 am
What would be a "flashy" pick at 29?
Turophile
April 30, 2021 at 06:19 am
This yearly nonsense of "15-18 players with a first round grade" just has to stop.
If, over many drafts, the AVERAGE number of players given a first round grade hovered around the 32 mark (sometimes over, sometimes under), then tying the players grade to a round is fine. If you are always miles under 32 players with "a 1st round grade" then you aren't evaluating things properly.
It's the language that needs to change. If you were to say instead, that there were 15-18 TOP QUALITY players in this draft, that is fine, because you have broken the link between player and round. Either change the way you grade players so that over the years the average numbers of players with a first round grade is about 32, or find a different way to describe the top players, in a way that does not relate their grade to the first round,
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 07:22 am
"It's the language that needs to change. If you were to say instead, that there were 15-18 TOP QUALITY players in this draft, that is fine, because you have broken the link between player and round."
THIS...is the draft post of the year.
BradHTX
April 30, 2021 at 07:44 am
Agreed. Someone please buy this man the adult beverage of his choice.
marpag1
April 30, 2021 at 07:59 am
OK, that's fine. But semantics aside, we all understand perfectly well what they mean, right?
Thegreatreynoldo
April 30, 2021 at 08:23 am
I guess we need a marketing person to dream up something catchy. My own thought of 16 guys in Tier One through Tier Three doesn't sound infectious.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 08:25 am
Or...
"The 16 guys your team will never get a sniff of if it's any good"
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 05:17 pm
Sniff and scratch drafting? Not sure that is catchy but it might lead to catching something.
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 09:08 am
Turophile, The language used is not to describe the quality of the players or associate them with a round for selection. The language is purposely selected to create interest (read as ratings for the first day of the draft). They create a drama for the viewers about who is going to get those 15-18 quality players. Who is going to mess up in the first round when they fail to take one of those top 15-18 players.
Remember the NFL Draft is now a TV show. It's a ratings draw for the league and their sponsors. It's part of the NFL's marketing to draw in the casual fan on Day 1. They know that the TV ratings drop precipitously from Day 1 to Day 2 and then again on Day 3. Day 1 is their ratings day and their money maker for the draft so they need to create some drama otherwise it's just a guy up there reading off 32 names over about 4 hours. Otherwise they have a televised snoring festival for 4 hours which I believe they do anyway because who can actually listen to the TV airheads and Goodell for 4 hours. What's the point?
My guess is that in Vegas or more likely online these days. there is a betting forum on which team is going tom take which player with their first round pick. It's not about the players or the draft, it's only about the money.
As for the language it has already changed from legitimate analysis and evaluation to the "top 15-18 players" and who picks them, regardless of how much or how little legitimate talent there is in the draft. Again the league doesn't even realize that by doing this they are in effect watering down their own product. Because as Turophile correctly points out that if there are only 15-18 top players than what does that say about the next 250 players that are yet to be selected. Thanks, Since '61
Turophile
April 30, 2021 at 11:54 am
Well said, 61.
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 06:38 am
Great read and a great pick by the Packers at one of our top need areas. Eric Stokes was 2nd in this CB draft class with 12.1 receiving yds allowed per game, and he’s the fastest CB in the draft. He also went a full year without giving up a TD. Great ST player too. There is a lot to like about him and was a bit surprised he was still there. While he may have carried an R2 grade, those are subjective, and I appreciate he’s always healthy & available. Super smart player too with high character.
While I wasn’t expecting CB with the R1, I can’t deny it was a top need, addressed with one of the best players at the position. He was the Top CB I was hoping the Packers would land. The other side of the field just got shut down. Great pick!
Welcome to Green Bay, Eric Stokes!
Razer
April 30, 2021 at 07:26 am
Good recap and totally agree. I especially liked
...I appreciate he’s always healthy & available. Super smart player too with high character...
As Gutekunst said "it all added up". Welcome indeed.
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 09:12 am
Agree greengold. I'm happy with the pick not necessarily because it's Stokes but because I was hoping that the Packers would take either a CB or WR in Round 1 or trade back.
Now I would to see a WR and a DL with our 2nd and 3rd picks. I don't if there is a DL worth taking on Day 2 but if there is I hope we select him. Thanks, Since '61
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 10:25 am
Since, I'm thinking the Packers knew AR was out, and made a deal with DEN this last week. The Bridgewater trade they made was a head scratcher for the Broncos, but not for the Packers if he is included in a deal that also nets Green Bay either of Jerry Jeudy or Courtland Southerland. Waiting until after June 1 to close the deal saves the Packers about $16M on the cap.
I bet that is why DEN passed on Justin Fields at the #9.
Makes perfect sense for both teams. Bridgewater would give Love a little more time to develop if needed, at a very low cost, and would make a good backup to Love should Jordan win the starting job outright.
Pure speculation. on my part, but the dots kind of connect. If we don't take a WR tonight, you can bet that is probably why... Also, if DEN picks a WR tonight, that might be another indicator of such a deal, because they are LOADED right now at WR.
btw, I LOVE the pick. I think we STOLE Eric Stokes at #29.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 10:30 am
That's a lot of player-for-player there, which doesn't happen much in the nfl.
Don't get me wrong, I'm enjoying this banter, but I just don't see it.
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 10:41 am
Agree it doesn't happen much, and I am not a cap guy, but the AR cap # is a big nut. I would imagine a trade scenario would have to somehow even out in terms of value with other players added to a deal.
Maybe TGR could shed some light on it...???
HankScorpio
April 30, 2021 at 12:08 pm
OTC has Denver at $23 mil under. Rodgers would be around $15 mil of that. That's the hard part.
Assuming this goes down after June 1, the Packers can make it work, too, assuming they are not taking on salary of some of Denver's big earnings guys.
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 10:52 am
greengold I read a comment last evening from CBS Sports online that Trey Wingo formerly of ESPN commented that Gute told Rodgers that they were going to trade him this offseason. Then when the Packers turned down the trade first with LA and then with SF Rodgers became upset with the team because he felt they were playing around with him.
If that statement is accurate then yes, the Packers knew Rodgers was out and they have known for a while.
I'm thinking that Gute did not want to trade Rodgers within the NFC. Then he didn't get any calls from AFC teams or if he did they didn't offer enough for Rodgers. Then Gute tried to offer an extension and Rodgers' agent is posturing that Rodgers wants out and Gute keeps saying that Rodgers is "our guy." I don't know which if either is accurate beyond posturing during a negotiation.
I'm thinking that Rodgers could still end up in GB in September or that you may be correct and a deal is already in place with Denver and that Rodgers agent, the Packers and Denver are working out the details on Rodgers contract when he reaches Denver. It could be the packers are trying to get Denver to pick up some of the dead money hit. I'm not sure. I do know that however this plays out we will never know the entire story.
Thanks, Since '61
stockholder
April 30, 2021 at 10:59 am
It was also reported a trade with Denver was close. Very Close. Someone said NO.
jannesbjornson
April 30, 2021 at 12:47 pm
What compensation would you ask for the League MVP ?
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 05:11 pm
Stockholder, Close is a relative term. I was involved in a Mergers & Acquisitions project a number of years ago and one of the principals said we were very close to a deal and 3 years later the deal finally closed.
In Rodgers case close to a trade with Denver could mean June but hopefully means before TC begins.
Thanks, Since '61
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 05:58 pm
Denver said they were shut down hard before discussion even commenced. Yes, very close ... more BS
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 11:25 am
Yeah, Since'61, I saw a bunch of that too. I'm going more with that maxim: "don't listen to what they say, watch what they do."
Regardless, the whole thing is a PR nightmare. Rodgers is an odd character. No doubt. Seems he really didn't get along with McCarthy, and now, it is appearing he wasn't getting on too well with LaFleur/Gutekunst/Murphy. There's so much we'll never learn. He is without question, a diva. That can be tough on coaches & management.
Being upset about the Packers unexpectedly doing due diligence in adding Jordan Love once he fell 20 draft positions, to me, is infantile BS that is COMPLETELY off the mark.
The whole money thing doesn't make sense to me, because Aaron has made his money. I think he just wanted to call his own shots, and saw how Brady, and Peyton Manning for that matter, turned a completely new scenario into gold, and he wanted the same. New girlfriend who probably prefers traveling to a place like Denver as opposed to GB... all that kind of speculation can be a part of what we are seeing now.
As for the Packers not admitting what is going on, they really can't close the deal and announce a trade until after June 1st. Not sure if that is correct, but I would assume so to get that cap savings. That's probably why Gutekunst chose his words carefully.
The Packers don't have the bottomless pit of $$$ available like DEN does, nor do they have that gunslinger approach to acquiring personnel like Elway. I think John Elway saw this turmoil, and GB's cap crunch as an opportunity to jump on the reigning MVP.
Agree on the Packers not wanting to move him within the NFC. This could be a perfect scenario for the Packers, given the shit storm they are in - all because Aaron wants out. Shocking as it all is, and as disappointing as it is, I'd take a haul from DEN for him, if that's one option, with him refusing to return to GB.
Nate-1980
April 30, 2021 at 01:06 pm
Horrible take as usual green..:)
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 01:08 pm
Greengold, I agree that Gute needs to get a haul
for Rodgers. Regardless of Rodgers antics he is still the league MVP and he can still play at a very high level. We can’t let him go cheap.
To me the issue is that if Rodgers is gone our SB hopes are done for a while even if Love proves to be a good QB. He still has an enormous learning curve regardless of his level of talent. Also trading Rodgers may have a negative impact on the team’s veteran players who see their SB window closing during their current contracts.
Aaron Jones probably stayed in GB to play with Rodgers along with Bak and Clark. The Smiths probably came because of Rodgers. A Rodgers trade could affect the level of play from these and other players. Very tough spot for Gute and MLF.
Thanks, Since ‘61
flackcatcher
April 30, 2021 at 02:25 pm
I think the magic word here is... Tampering. Denver under Elway has a habit of being very sloppy. Gutekunst is dealing with a host of issues that makes trading Rodgers difficult, even under the best of conditions. And Rodgers himself has hurt his own value by reminding teams just how tightly wrapped he is. Why the guy would hurt his own image on the biggest day outside the Superbowl is beyond me.
PhantomII
April 30, 2021 at 10:21 pm
If all this stuff is actually true, he is showing the world why every team did not pick him on draft day until the Packers did. I think Rodgers is a great QB when he wants to be and a good one when he wants to be. The Love pick stoked a fire under his butt and he played better than he has in Years. Football is a team sport. He won MVP because all the other players were doing their jobs also, that's the part most leave out. Rodgers as good as he is has not played like an MVP or taken over a Championship game and won lately. He has shrunk under the brightest lights in the playoffs. Gute is continuing to plug holes and ML offense takes a bit to master but is QB friendly once it is done. His offensive schemes WR's and TE's open. We have a good team. We could use a few more spots filled. Rodgers could have ran it in on 3rd down but he passed it again. He needs to own that one.
If you don't believe in God.....You are prone to love and worship yourself and your God given gifts. That's where Rodgers needs to start....by saying thanks for everything he has attained in life.
PhantomII
April 30, 2021 at 09:59 pm
Yes, 4 picks........and 2 returned for TD's. We need a few more of those back to the HOUSE.
HankScorpio
April 30, 2021 at 06:34 am
We'll never know how much it hurt inside the Packers draft room when guys like Newsome and Bateman went. And it doesn't matter. Gutey has burned through the allotment of round 1 trade ups that can be absorbed for a while. You have to get both quantity and quality from the draft. They have sacrificed quantity to pursue greater quality 3 straight years. They have the star power. They need to fill in depth, I mean, I'd love it if Stokes turned out even better than Jaire. But I'll settle for better than Kevin King.
They stayed put and drafted true to the theory of using draft capital like cap resources. They spent on a position that matters. Hopefully the homework they did in picking Stokes was good and he'll turn into a player. And they can move on to adding players at other positions of value, such as DL/pass rusher and pass catcher.
Day 1 is solid for me. I hope they keep it up on day 2.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 07:31 am
Bateman and Newsome both fell close enough to the Packers that they could've made a bid for those picks but you're absolutely right: when it comes down to it the Packers are pick-rich, but capital-poor. That all adds up to a year where I think we see the Packers staying put and exercising their picks more often than not.
The Packers are in a position where moving around in the early rounds might look like that guy in your FFL who tries to trade for your high-end guys by offering the six players at the bottom of his roster who would never start for you.
jannesbjornson
April 30, 2021 at 08:47 am
Maybe these guys were not worth the move up. I would have only went higher for the ILBs and that was mid-round turf. He can go up in the second if the OT is his next priority.
blondy45
April 30, 2021 at 01:10 pm
I am Stoked for Stokes. A 4.29 speed guy who played in one or if not the best college conference. In the SEC. last year, Stokes allowed less than 10 yards for the whole game, FIVE times. His 40 yard time 95%, 10 yard spit 90%, RAS 9.37 are jaw dropping athletic talent to work with. He is a high character guy, with no know injury risks. Most of all he is a quality CB, a major position of need for the Pack. As the draft progressed I was on edge for picks 20-28 just waiting for "the pick is in" note to pop up on the TV. Thank you Gute for not trading away our much needed draft capital.
What do I really know about who is needed to be THE pick for the Pack. My guy (Zaven Collins) went 16th! I was hoping JOK was going to be the pick at 29, I do not know why he still has not been picked. My fellow Cheesehead pundits were correct about the Pack not investing in a LB early. I became warry about injury history players as the draft neared, Farley, Newsome, and Bateman. On to our next pick. First pick, box checked. I approve.
NickPerry
April 30, 2021 at 07:03 am
I'm fine with Stokes. Long CB wth great speed, athletic as hell...Just what Gute likes. What I like most is Gute didn't flinch with Aaron Rodgers selfish attempt to force the Packers hand in the 1st round of the draft
I'm really torn here. Part of me wants to grant Rodgers his wish and trade his ass but that probably passed after last night. Rodgers planned this last night for weeks, probably started thinking about it the second MLF went for the FG on 4th down from the 8 yard line. Cry me a river Hollywood Rodgers... BTW, You SUCKED as host of Jeopardy!!!
Personally after 3 straight incompletions inside the 8 yard line and THREE STRAIGHT 3 and outs after 3 turnovers by your defense I'd have kicked a FG too. The defense just had to hold like they had for almost the entire 2nd half except Kevin King happened.
Which is EXACTLY why Stokes was a good pick in round 1 for the Packers.
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 07:23 am
Well said, Nick. When DEN passed on Fields last night, it was telling. They needed a QB and passed on one of the best to take CB Patrick Surtain. From the outside, looks like GB & DEN already have the deal in place, and they’ll wait for the big cap savings in June to close the deal.
As for Stokes, he’s a top CB who is adept at press & zone who played against the best WRs the SEC can deliver, week in and week out, with very good results. SOLID. Gutekunst didn’t flinch.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 08:09 am
If the Packers had a deal in principle for Surtain, why would they have burned a first round pick on a CB knowing full well that they have all these other needs and would have to prop up a green, developmental QB?
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 08:46 am
No - sorry I wasn't more clear, dobber. I meant the Packers, just a guess, already had a deal with DEN in place to trade AR after June 1st, when the cap hit changes from $36.1M to $14.3M.
Why else would a QB needy team like DEN not take Justin Fields at #9 overall, instead choosing Surtain II?
John Elway didn't blink when Petyon Manning, coming off neck surgery in 2011, signed him to what at the time was a monster contract of $96M in 2012 as a FA. He hadn't played for a year. Money was no object.
Seems Elway won't hesitate again to add the former, reigning MVP via trade with Green Bay. It appears to be the logical choice for everybody. The Packers could make one hell of a haul in such a deal, while freeing themselves from cap hell. Rodgers' market value has never been higher.
Pure speculation, but it adds up.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 09:10 am
I'm not sure we're disagreeing on some points here. But in general, I do agree that Teddy B won't be an answer for Denver at QB. He's just another piece, but if the Rodgers deal is in place, why does Denver deal for Teddy B on draft day? The general scuttlebutt was that acquiring Bridgewater wouldn't change the Broncos' draft plans, but saying you're no longer interested in a QB would have significant impact on the draft around them and any trade value on their pick.
It seems unlikely, though, that if the Packers have this deal locked up they would still draft a CB at 29 knowing that their green QB would need all the help he could get. I don't think the signals add up...
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 09:43 am
DEN is already loaded at WR with Jerry Jeudy, and Courtland Sutton, along with Noah Fant at TE. Melvin Gordon at RB... That kinda goes into the + column.
I suspect the Bridgewater trade may have been made for the Packers, as part of the deal. Maybe Bridgewater comes to GB to give Love just a little more time, plus a quality backup QB, should Love get the starting nod at some point. Seems entirely possible.
This stuff has been known for months, apparently, by the GB brass. I would not doubt for a second if the Packers wind up with one of Jerry Jeudy or Courtland Sutton in a AR trade deal. We'll know more by how the Packers draft. Maybe... hahaha.
This is bananas, but the scenario is possible.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 09:48 am
Always enjoy the banter!
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 10:07 am
That scenario would not suck. That's for sure, given some alternatives.
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 10:42 am
Agree greengold, any scenario is possible at this point. Thanks, Since '61
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 05:22 pm
One step too far on the theory ladder for me. Improbable.
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 05:22 pm
One step too far on the theory ladder for me. Improbable.
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 10:08 am
It would not surprise me at all if Elway made a move for Rodgers. He understands what Rodgers can do for his team and having once been an elite QB himself he knows how to deal with an elite QB unlike Gute who doesn't seem to be able to deal with the best player on his team. And if you can't deal with the elite players on your team maybe you should not be an NFL GM.
If Gute wants his draft picks and his cap space now (2021) is the time for him to make the trade and move Rodgers out. But yet he continues to tells us that "Rodgers is his guy for the foreseeable future." I need to question why Gute needs to lie about what is really happening.
We'll probably never know the true story but something is not adding up and I think it's because this whole episode is about both sides posturing during a contract extension negotiation. I could be wrong but all we can do is watch and wait. Thanks, Since '61
BradHTX
April 30, 2021 at 10:36 am
I always enjoy your thoughts, S61, but I’m not sure this...
“unlike Gute who doesn't seem to be able to deal with the best player on his team.”
...is entirely fair. Does Gute not know how to deal with Rodgers? Or can Rodgers simply not be dealt with? I think it’s a legitimate question.
Personally, I think not letting the inmates run the asylum is exactly how you deal with a diva trying to force your hand.
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 11:00 am
In reply to your questions I believe that both sides have culpability in the current situation. Some of it is on Gute and some of it is on Rodgers. My point about Gute is that he has been with the Packers for as long as Rodgers has been in Green Bay. After all of this time he should have an understanding of the person he is dealing with.
Almost all of these situations come down to miscommunications. Rodgers may not be easy to handle, I get that. But Gute is paid to handle and effectively communicate with his players. That's just good business/best practices in any business.
I doubt that Rodgers has miscommunicated. He may not communicate the way we like but I'm sure he has let the Packers know where he stands or at least his agent has. Once again, the ball is in Gute's court where it has been all along. Thanks, Since '61
Leatherhead
April 30, 2021 at 11:34 am
No. This is totally on Rodgers.
If he wants to play with the Packers, he’s totally welcome.
If he doesn’t, the team will move forward with Love. Rodgers will be traded for draft picks and/or players.
No player is bigger than the team.
croatpackfan
April 30, 2021 at 12:13 pm
EXACTLY!
I think AR is trying to push Packers to losing team after he decide to finish his career, hoping he will become the largest Packers legend for a long time.
To be great person, both privately and professionally, you have to show you care about organisation that allowed you to grow to the top.
Otherwise, you will become just another great QB, mentioning only in the group of Bsrt Starr and Bret Favre.
Whst would people say about AR, if he honestly help Packers to develop Jordan Love to another hall of fame QB. In that case he will be true legend, not only for Packers, but for whole NFL.
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 05:56 pm
Sorry LH but I repectfully disagree. There are always 2 sides to every story.
1. The Packers were not forced to offer Rodgers his contract, that was on Gute and it's unreasonable to blame Rodgers for signing it. In fact many of us here at CHTV felt that Rodger should have been tagged rather than given a new contract with 2 years remaining on his deal.
2. Gute should have informed Rodgers that he was going to take a QB in the first round of the 2020 draft. Even Gute has admitted that it was a communication failure on his part. Which goes to my point in my previous post that Gute should have an understanding of the player he is dealing with.
3. Gute failed to draft a WR during the 2020 draft which was a big FU to Rodgers on top of blindsiding him with the Love pick.
4. Gute failed to sign an FA WR during the 2021 FA period. Another FU to Rodgers after an MVP season.
5. Gute informed Rodgers that he intended to trade him this off season and then passed on 2 trade offers. Granted they were from NFC teams but this is allegedly what has pushed Rodgers over the edge.
6. Now /gute is allegedly trying to work out an extension with Rodgers agent and Rodgers has informed the team that the wants out.
Is this posturing or the actual truth? We don't kn ow at this point.
In each of the above examples the ball was in Gute's court and he either did nothing or mishandled the situation. Now the ball is in Gute's court yet again. Will he either make a trade or get an extension done, we'll see. But whatever happens next is on Gute.
Is Rodgers difficult to deal with? Yes. Is Gute well paid to deal with his players? Yes. If he can't work with his best player maybe he should not be an NFL GM.
Is Rodgers bigger than the team? No, he is the team. The Packers record when he misses games with injuries is pathetic. Regrettably that looks like it will become the norm in Green Bay again if in fact the Packers part ways with Rodgers. Whatever the issues are or have been with Rodgers Gute should have dealt with him much more effectively. This is a relationship issue and relationships are built upon trust and good communications. Unfortunately Gute has not built a relationship with Rodgers during their time together in Green Bay and Rodgers no longer trusts him after failing to communicate with Rodgers about either the Love pick or Rodgers future in Green Bay.
Now you can say that the GM does not need to inform a player about who is going to select in draft and that's true. But Rodgers is not just another player. Given the amount of money the Packers are paying him Rodgers is more of a partner than just a player. When you want to get everyone rowing in the same direction then you need to treat them as though they are important to your organization. Money is not the only factor at this level of any organization.
I'm not saying that Rodgers does not have any culpability in this situation he does, but Gute has screwed the pooch on this so far, as far as I can see. Anything can happen and hopefully this will work out for Green Bay.
But if Rodgers goes elsewhere and wins another SB and the Packers are going 4-12 and 5-11 with Love the Packers will be the choochs in a situation they put themselves into for no legitimate business or football reason.
But hey we have Titletown world or whatever, who needs another Lombardi Trophy anyway?
Thanks, Since '61
Nate-1980
April 30, 2021 at 01:22 pm
I agree 61, well said, I don’t think Gute should be a gm..
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 09:32 am
To play devils advocate, we need two CBs to have a chance to make the defense elite (behind the front). One for the middle and one on the perimeter. Stokes could be the optimal nickel choice now and Surtain the outside replacement for King.
Now on to further improvements... one down and still 9 picks. I’m hoping this shows we are serious about our D this year. Eskridge would make me happy on O/ST.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 09:44 am
But why then take the guy who's really a perimeter CB rather than a guy like Samuel (as an example) who projects as a true slot? There's plenty of those guys, and they can be had well into the draft. You're saying your #29 pick is going to play a position he's not best suited for--and you're trading for a guy to play ahead of him...and you know it when you make the pick. That starts to make you wonder if they plan to resign Jaire...but that's just crazy talk.
Leatherhead
April 30, 2021 at 11:23 am
The Plan is to win a Super Bowl with Rodgers.
If they have to play a “green” QB, they’ll run more, throw short more. We still have a lot of talent on offense. According to the GM, we are at the “tipping point “ of being a dominant defense.
Rodgers is more than welcome to stay....he’s under contract......but if he leaves the Packers will adapt and overcome.
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 11:44 am
Agree, Leatherhead. Plus, Jordan Love's arm didn't fall off, FFS. Seems the national media and a bunch of detractors would have us think so.
He had the strongest arm of his 2020 QB draft class. The kid can spin it, and I think more people who doubt that should watch his 2018 highlights (not the 2019 highlights when he was playing for a new HC in a new system, after losing 4 of his starting OL and 3 WRs). He was accurate beyond accurate.
As a refresher, Jordan Love threw for 3,567 yds with a 64% Comp%, 8.6 y/att, 32 TDs to just 6 INTs -AND- a 153.8 Passer Rating in 2018.
It is possible Love is much further developed coming into 2021 than we know. We'll see soon enough.
Plans change. Winners adapt.
jannesbjornson
April 30, 2021 at 12:39 pm
He would be the guy picked after Lawrence if he stayed for his senior season. His arm is stronger than Wilson's and he creates more than the other three one-read maestros.
NickPerry
May 01, 2021 at 08:08 am
Thank you greengold for pointing that out.
jannesbjornson
April 30, 2021 at 12:44 pm
Maybe because Fields is over-rated.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 07:26 am
"What I like most is Gute didn't flinch with Aaron Rodgers selfish attempt to force the Packers hand in the 1st round of the draft"
Recipe for disaster if they did. You spend months planning a draft and a strategy, looking at contingencies and "what-if?" availability scenarios. I give the front office credit for not f#@king that up at the 11th hour.
Some are talking about Stokes as an overdraft, but based on what I'm seeing out there, he's in this tier of player and if that's the case it all comes down to preference. BG talks about the possibility of a trade-down at this point, but nobody traded up into the picks around the Packers, so there can't have been too much interest there. It was remarkably quiet at the bottom of round 1.
jeremyjjbrown
April 30, 2021 at 11:36 am
There where a lot of nice players on the board at 29. I'm happy Gute got to pick the one they liked a lot at a position that was an obvious fail at the worst possible moment last season.
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou
April 30, 2021 at 07:30 am
Nick,
I'm with you!
HankScorpio
April 30, 2021 at 07:33 am
I'm not exactly Gute's biggest cheerleader. But this is not about Gute v Rodgers. This is about whether the Packers let the inmates run the asylum. I say not now, not ever. I said the same thing about Favre. I'll say the same thing with the next Diva that thinks he's more than just a player getting paid a king's ransom.
Yes, he's the reigning MVP. Yes, they are not sniffing the NFC CG at home last year without him. But he's 38 and very, very unlikely to ever play another season like that again. In fact, the two years prior to this one were no small part of the reason they drafted Love. You are damn right in pointing out that he had plenty of chances in that game to be the MVP. Say all you want about this, that or the other from that game. It's all true. It's also true that they had the ball in the hands of their star player at a star moment. And he didn't deliver. Not once, not twice but thrice.
Give him his wish. Ship him to Denver. But take away the reasons he wants to go there by demanding they give up the bulk of their young and talented WR group. It kills 2 birds with one stone. It's one final, "screw you, Diva". And it helps give Jordan Love the tools he needs to be successful.
Razer
April 30, 2021 at 08:04 am
I agree with you Hank on most of what you said, particularly with "not letting the inmates run the asylum". It is a tough business and a business of replacement. I also think that the Packers have tried to put enough resources behind this team to get us to the Super Bowl and have come up short. And, you are right that Rodgers has failed to rise to the occasion in these big games. If this reporting is true then shame on Rodgers. He needs to grow up. I would give him his wish if we could maximize the return and place him in a conference that doesn't impact us. Overall, the Packers need to stand tall.
BradHTX
April 30, 2021 at 08:37 am
“In fact, the two years prior to this one were no small part of the reason they drafted Love.”
Exactly. In fact, Rodgers had not been playing at an elite level since his last MVP in 2014. In his late 30s, they had every reason to question whether his physical skills were about to fall off a cliff.
It’s well known that Rodgers is a ridiculously talented and intelligent but also arrogant person. If he wants to get his jock in a twist over the drafting of Love, fine. I love you for what you have given us over 15 years, Aaron. Have fun in Denver.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 09:12 am
The ARod run over the last half of 2016 was awfully good...and he did it with a bucket of mouthguards and athletic tape at WR...but your point is very solid.
Leatherhead
April 30, 2021 at 11:46 am
That was a great stretch, and we started off 4-1 and Rodgers got hurt and that was the season.
The next year, Rodgers got hurt in the opener and played through it, but we were sub .500.
The organization saw very clearly that we couldn’t put our seasons in his hands. So we started building a defense and running more and throwing short more. Result? 26-6 and two Championship games.
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 10:02 am
BradHTX what you consider arrogance where I come from we consider that confidence. I don't know about others but I want the QB of my team to have confidence in his ability to run the offense and confidence in the decisions that he makes with the football.
You cannot reach the level of play that Rodgers has without being extremely confident in yourself. Rodgers has tons of confidence plus he is very smart. Same 2 qualities that Bart Starr had, tons of confidence and a very smart player.
As GM Gute is paid to deal with his players and should be able to deal with Rodgers and any other elite player on the team. If Gute can't deal with his best player maybe he shouldn't be the GM. Thanks, Since '61
jannesbjornson
April 30, 2021 at 10:33 am
Rodgers witnessed the later Favre years and saw them stand in deep mud when it came to snagging a couple difference makers like Moss , Lynch or Gonzalez etc. He is smart enough to be proactive in the ring.
stockholder
April 30, 2021 at 10:42 am
Thank You 61. This group didn't know the suffering we went through after the Lombardi/Starr years. Well said.
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 06:02 pm
It looks like those who don't know what we went through from '68 to '92 will soon find out. Thanks, Since '61
Amy Berk
April 30, 2021 at 07:58 pm
Yes ...not sure why do many fans talk about Rodgers as being arrogant? He's confident and because the Packers have won so many times because of him, it's ok to be confident as an elite athlete in the NFL .
If QB was so easy than all those top 10 QB picks would be winning and not sitting as a backup QB.
.
blondy45
April 30, 2021 at 04:55 pm
Rodgers too is paid(very well) to get along with his teammates. He too should have some desire to make the others on the team better. He too should follow the head coaches game plans and not be the only guy on offense that makes a difference.
I thank Rodgers for the time and hard work he has given Green Bay, as well as the winning seasons. If his time is up due to the father time element, or his wanting to be a Jeopardy host, or his perceived deva problem, or wanting to go back to California and start a family, then it is time. In the NFL it is "the next man up" theory. It always has been and always will be. All good things must come to an end. If Rodgers does not want to be here, he will only complicate the goal of the Packers, which is to win.
This is not a GM Gute problem. This is a Rodgers problem. How many times I remember how Rodgers would not even look at some young receivers because they made an error in their assignment. Instead of encouraging and helping his WR's, RB's, back-up QB, or O-line, he built up a wall if anyone made him look bad. He has had problems for many years listening to coaches authority. McCarty got axed(deserved), LaFleur was not respected when he became the coach. LaFleur put his stamp on the Pack with a lot of friction from Rodgers originally. It is LaFleur's system that Rodgers now thrives in. This is not the drop back 7 steps and heave it Rodgers had in the past. We all must know the reason why the Pack with the so called lack of offensive weapons, was the leading offense in the NFL 2020. The major credit MUST go to Gute, and LaFleur! It is time to rid the basket of a bad apple before it ruins more. Since-61, Rodgers is an arrogant SOB, I am "confident" about that statement.
Dragon5
April 30, 2021 at 06:55 pm
I finally got around to watching "The Last Dance" on Netflix this past week, depicting the subversive tactics of GM Jerry Krause vs Phil, Scottie, Michael.
Ironic we're living the ~football~ redux now.
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 08:58 am
Yeah, Hank. We've just had the curtain pulled aside to reveal AR. Many of us didn't want to admit the diva thing was that real, that overt. A lot adds up now.
Some people need to see it, and, we saw it. We all saw it yesterday. wow.
Looks to me like Gutekunst did exactly what Lombardi would have done, and shipped him off to DEN already, based on their passing on Justin Fields with the #9 pick, being a QB needy team. Most likely waiting until after June 1st to close the deal. Elway pounced on Manning. He pounces again, this time on Rodgers. I think it is done. Packers should get one hell of a haul in this one.
HankScorpio
April 30, 2021 at 09:14 am
I have no idea if that is done deal on June 1. If so, that won't be kept secret for long. I'm spiteful enough to be serious about demanding Jeudy and Sutton in return.
One thing is absolutely true. Aaron Rodgers will never have a return value higher than today. It will go down from here. So if he's not 100% fully committed, get him out and get as much as you can in return.
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 10:35 am
Totally agree. They have KJ Hamler too. Gadget. We'll know soon enough, and might have more tea leaves to read once this draft is over. DEN is loaded at WR. If they take another, it will probably be to replace one of their current roster players pegged as part of a trade, or it may be a Packers choice to be thrown into a deal.
HankScorpio
April 30, 2021 at 11:32 am
Yup, Hamler, too. And somebody reminded me that Noah Fant is on that roster, too. It is crystal clear to my why Denver made the list along with the 2 teams near home for AR--both of which also have young talented pass catchers.
He's smart enough and calculating enough to have selected that carefully.
Bure9620
April 30, 2021 at 11:46 am
Agreed. Gute and the FO took into consideration even before drafting Love, Rodgers could ball out in 2020. He did. It also doesn't change the future. And to your point, it is unlikely Rodgers duplicates 2020. Even he knows that. I have been saying over and over Love will be the starter eventually. I did not neccesarily think it would be due to Rodgers "unhappiness" this offseason. I actually think Rodgers plays this year in GB...Then its done.... And this is Love's offense.
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 05:34 pm
I think that is more likely now than last week. I step back and look at this and ask myself does Rodgers really have a legitimate beef?
A lot here assume that the non signing off a player who would otherwise have been taken with the Love picked enough.
The more I think about it, if that is the real issue here, Rodgers is on the wrong side of reason and a lot more petty than I would have imagined.
Negotiate hard on a contract certainly, but unless this was badly mishandled, this isn’t that and it’s actually preventing the team from adding talent. As a Packer person I can see neither justification nor sufficient cause to hurt the Franchise he is the face of at this point. Rodgers got this wrong or his people bungled it.
Rodgers will always be a Packer in most people’s eyes after all these years. He is close to the point where his “brand” is more valuable than his current contract. An odd way to protect it.
Difer
April 30, 2021 at 10:55 am
Yeah, Rodgers sucks. Now, with him gone to Denver (if that happens), the Packers fans will get the team they deserve. Enjoy.
Leatherhead
April 30, 2021 at 11:29 am
That would be a team with Adams, Jones, Dillon, Tonyan, Bakhtiari, Jenkins,Amos, Savage, Alexander, Z, Gary, Clark, etc. I can see why you’d automatically assume that we’d suck without him.
Me? I think that we’re still competitive in the division.
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 06:27 pm
Except your missing the point about why most of those you guys you mentioned are on the team.
Adams will go to FA without Rodgers in Gb and probably follow him to his new team.
Jones probably re-signed with the Packers because he saw Rodgers as his best chance to win an SB during his second and maybe last contract.
Bak probably remained to play with Rodgers as well.
Alexander will probably go to FA without Rodgers because why stay in Green Bay with no reasonable expectation of an SB for the next 3-5 seasons at least.
Clark will probably wonder what he is doing in Green Bay without Rodgers.
Same with the Smiths.
Yes, these guys have contracts but will they play as hard knowing they no longer have a shot at an SB under their current contracts. Why? Remember how the team went through the motions after Rodgers went down in 2017. The same can happen for the next 2-3 seasons. And try to get FAs to come to Green Bay without Rodgers. Why would they? Beyond that players like Gary, Jenkins and Savage may prefer to go to FA after their rookie contracts expire and try to give themselves a chance at an SB.
Even if Love follows Rodgers trajectory as a starter we are at least 3 seasons from an SB. If he follows Favre's trajectory we're 5 seasons away and that was with Reggie White on the team. And beyond that there are more variables than we can count that will keep the Packers from an SB even if Love proves to be a good QB.
We may not suck but we certainly won't be considered SB contenders for a while, maybe a long time. MLF and Gute will be long gone by then. Thanks, Since '61
HankScorpio
April 30, 2021 at 11:35 am
It's not that he sucks for me. It's that he's deliberating damaging the team I root for. "Don't ever take sides against the family again, Fredo"
Nate-1980
April 30, 2021 at 01:39 pm
Yeah I hope all these posters that can just move on from Rodgers and insert love get exactly what they asked for..When the team is crap and can’t make the playoffs maybe some of you will actually understand how valuable he is..Its a joke you think love will just be able to come in and we won’t miss a beat, hof qbs grow on trees ha..
PeteK
April 30, 2021 at 05:09 pm
We don't want him to leave. He wants to leave because we drafted a developmental QB. Wow, what an insult for a 37 year old 16 season vet.
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 05:53 pm
You sound a lot like the people who proclaimed that they were Favre fans not Packer fans when that was going down. Your hero is infallible, unimpeachable. You can believe that. Just don’t insult others who don’t.
packerbackerjim
April 30, 2021 at 07:25 am
The writer of the article is supportive what he suspects is Gute’s indifference to what AR thinks. If true, they both have rocks in their heads. How do you fuck up a situation with arguably one of the best QBs ever? Stupidity.
leche
April 30, 2021 at 07:32 am
Arrogance
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 07:33 am
...or it's possible that the GM knows that there's not nearly as much fire here as people are saying.
HankScorpio
April 30, 2021 at 07:43 am
The most sure way to screw it up is to let the QB have GM powers.
jannesbjornson
April 30, 2021 at 10:40 am
Like Brady?
PeteK
April 30, 2021 at 11:25 am
Certainly , not in NE, and would get annoying in Tampa real quick.
HankScorpio
April 30, 2021 at 11:38 am
You think Brady ran the show in NE? Fat chance. That's why he was let go to TB. I have zero clues how Brady is treated in TB. I do know he jumped on a roster that was loaded with years of early round draft picks.
And he threw 3 ints in the NFC CG that should have cost TB a shot at advancing if the Packers only could have figured out a way to avoid shooting themselves in the foot.
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou
April 30, 2021 at 07:44 am
The Packers have treated Hollywood Rodgers extraordinarily well. Let's start with the contract he signed at the time making him the best paid player in the history of the league. Let's remember Rodger's had issues with MM that to a large extent is why MM (fortunately) is in Dallas.
Gute doesn't tell Rodger's how to play, nor should Rodgers dictate to Gute how he does his job. The selection of a promising young QB last year was a wise investment in a QB driven league, particularly after three consecutive just okay to good season performances by Rodgers. Rodger's is a prima donna and IMHO very calculating. For this upcoming year I would not trade Rodgers, however I'd insert Love often on the back end of games preparing him for the future.
leche
April 30, 2021 at 07:54 am
The love pick was incredibly stupid at the time and as of yesterday looks even worse... Gute had an incredibly obvious roadmap ahead of him through 2023 (including last season) that was basically max your short term talent to try to win as many Super Bowls in that time frame, then blow it up and get your next franchise QB and let Rodgers walk (or retire) and do the 'Gute plan'... The decision to accelerate his own plan and focus on getting his guy earlier than needed came at the expense of the current team's talent and ability to win now.
I know Packers fans love constantly winning the division and making the playoffs... But this team isn't winning a Super Bowl if it's always planning 4 years down the road like it did with the Love pick. And if the Love pick is the catalyst that pushes Rodgers out the door before his time in Green Bay should be up and we lose that opportunity to win with him too, it gets even dumber.
We had an opportunity to win now, then rebuild, then win later, and instead we opted for winning in the middle... And that just never made any sense. And it's never going to.
PeteK
April 30, 2021 at 11:37 am
Your scenario is a closed case now because we had a good chance to beat Bucs . The loss was not a case of not drafting a WR. Rogers should have realized that the Love pick was for the future which is 3 yrs away because he went through the same thing. If he doesn't want to lose the top QB position than continue playing very well and Love sits.
Nate-1980
April 30, 2021 at 01:48 pm
Well said leche, I agree..
Thegreatreynoldo
April 30, 2021 at 11:40 am
The Love selection looks to me like a miscalculation of epic proportions. We still have to wait to see if the pick himself can play football. If Love is good to great, that can salvage the fiasco. Strategically (nodding in the general direction of Coldworld) the Love pick was and is a terrible pick. The timing was bad. The cap was all wrong.
Grammarly indicates this comment sounds joyful and optimistic.
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 05:46 pm
Looking back, The Love pick seems wiser since yesterday and Rodgers seems very insecure, or just badly represented. For the first time, I’m glad we have a genuine prospect on our books. If this is the behind the scenes Rodgers, it might explain why.
cpabandit
April 30, 2021 at 08:44 am
This is from this morning's Bleacher Report:
Eric Stokes, CB, Georgia
Strengths: Blazing speed, press-man coverage, plays the ball
Weaknesses: Straight-line athlete, slight frame, poor run defender
Speed matters. NFL evaluators want athletes who have the tools to autocorrect even when they do something wrong, giving them a greater margin of error.
Eric Stokes is easily one of the fastest men in this year's draft, with an unofficial 4.25-second 40-yard dash at Georgia's pro day.
His speed isn't surprising, though. The former track athlete can clearly run with any wide receiver. In fact, he excelled when locked onto a target. According to Pro Football Focus, Stokes was the fourth-best cornerback in man coverage last season.
When passes did come Stokes' direction, the first-team All-SEC performer often got his hand on the ball. He recorded 22 pass breakups over three seasons along with four interceptions a year ago.
The 6'4", 194-pound Stokes isn't the biggest or most physical defensive back. He can be a liability against the run. His transition through his backpedal is somewhat concerning as well. But no one can take away his recovery speed.
For some unknown reason, the Green Bay Packers will not draft a first-round weapon for the league’s reigning MVP, Aaron Rodgers.
Insert the Mal from Firefly confused-look GIF.
In a vacuum, Stokes makes sense with the 29th pick after Kevin King was torched by the Tampa Bay Buccaneers in the NFC Championship Game.
But the team doesn’t operate in a vacuum, and the front office hasn’t done enough to appease its star signal-caller.
This is from this morning's Bleacher Report:
A year ago, general manager Brian Gutekunst rationalized his continual passing on wide receivers by basically saying the board didn’t fall in Green Bay’s favor and the team liked the younger options on the roster.
That excuse no longer flies. The Packers could have chosen LSU’s Terrace Marshall Jr., Ole Miss’ Elijah Moore, North Carolina’s Dyami Brown or Purdue’s Rondale Moore.
Gutekunst is being stubborn for stubborn's sake.
Grade: F
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 09:19 am
Reports were Terrance Marshall pulled up to the draft sporting a knee injury.
I don't buy the "Packers didn't give Aaron Rodgers any weapons," arguments at all. He had the #1 WR in the NFL, the #1 OL and the #1 RB. He has failed to close the deal for 9 years running since SB LV. There is far better WR value tonight and tomorrow.
While you've chosen to share the negatives on Stokes, here are some positives:
Stokes gave up only 3 TDs in his 3 years at Georgia, facing DeVonta Smith, Jaylen Waddle, Ja'Marr Chase, Jerry Judy, Henry Ruggs and Clyde Edwards-Hilaire with regularity in the SEC.
Teams throwing against Eric Stokes had a completion rate against him of just 38.1%.
Stokes allowed just 16 completions and 1 TD in all 10 games and 299 coverage snaps as a starter in 2020 with 4 INTs, 2 returned for TDs...
Sports Info Solutions ranked Eric Stokes #2 in the 2020 CB draft class with 12.1 receiving yds allowed per game.
From what I understand, at least 12 NFL teams had 3-5 zoom meetings each with Eric Stokes. He was highly sought after, and the Packers may have gotten a steal with him at #29. We'll see, but there certainly is a lot to like about him. 6-1 194, 32 3/4" arms, with 4.25 clocked speed at his Pro Day. wow! I think he was a very good pick, and his numbers show some scouting report comments to be questionable.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 11:35 am
"That excuse no longer flies. The Packers could have chosen LSU’s Terrace Marshall Jr., Ole Miss’ Elijah Moore, North Carolina’s Dyami Brown or Purdue’s Rondale Moore.
Gutekunst is being stubborn for stubborn's sake."
So Stokes is being graded for who he's not.
I feel bad for this kid. Here he is and he should be celebrating his accomplishments. He's a high-end player at his position being recognized with a high selection in the draft and virtually all the thunder is stolen away by this shitty drama.
Welcome to GB, kid.
PeteK
April 30, 2021 at 11:47 am
Also, going to a very successful team and pairing up with a very talented CB. Rogers didn't seem too upset 2 seasons ago when he said ," We got a defense". Especially since Niners shredded our D. Fastest way to a championship is improving our defense. Remember we gave up 31 pts to Bucs and it was their D that won the game.
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 05:39 pm
Well said. There is far more room to improve on D than offense at the moment. Anyone who watches should know that. Much harder to improve the offense significantly this year. The biggest help might in fact have been at tackle.
This player will play plenty of snaps. Good pick. The true first round receivers had long gone (few this year).
Nate-1980
April 30, 2021 at 02:12 pm
I agree cpa marshal and Moore were sitting there and both would help our team a lot, that’s a lot of downvotes for truth..
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 05:42 pm
They were there, true. They still are 3 picks later. How many snaps they would get this year in your mind does sound like fantasy.
Wonder if Moore will make round 3.
barutanseijin
April 30, 2021 at 07:16 pm
So they’re supposed to draft a receiver to placate the guy who says he won’t play for them? Now that would be stupid.
egbertsouse
April 30, 2021 at 07:33 am
I am not a draftnik but I keep reading that he is stiff and lacks agility. Has trouble changing direction. That doesn’t sound like a good slot corner.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 08:13 am
I don't think he's being drafted to be exclusively a slot CB, but that might be the ticket to most of his snaps in 2021. This guy's a perimeter CB and that's where his future is, so if you're judging the pick mostly on his ability to play slot, you're reaching. If you're looking at Chandon Sullivan's performance in 2020, he wasn't a very good slot corner either. Guys who can play the slot can be found throughout the draft.
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 06:16 pm
I think he can contribute immediately in the middle while he is developed outside. That versatility is a plus, but I agree, that he’s a perimeter prospect, perhaps even later this year. His ability to contribute in both roles is one reason that I liked this pick for value.
PeteK
April 30, 2021 at 11:51 am
When you have 4:29 speed you can afford to change direction a bit slower.
MarkinMadison
April 30, 2021 at 07:35 am
#12 drama - I blame both sides. I still remember the nervous laughter on MLFs face right before the pick was announced. The look on his face said to me, "People are going to lose their minds. Buckle up. Here we go. Let's do it." Rodgers has always been the same guy. He holds grudges. He is demonstrably critical of others in a way that some guys will not accept. He is also calculating and smart as F. The only wild card here for me is I don't know how much money the Packers put on the table for him. If he is rejecting a strong offer because he is pissed, then I'm going to be more critical of him. If he is rejecting a fair offer because he'd rather be closer to home as he starts a family and starts pursing his non-football interests with more vigor, then fine, let him go and wish him well. Find a good trading partner and let's all move on.
Stokes pick. He wasn't really on my radar. I haven't even watched highlight films of this guy. With his speed and his stats in the SEC, at worst, the coaches may have to make sure they are playing to his strengths. At least he seems to have a clean injury record, so please don't call him King 2.0.
Next picks. Eichenberg would require a move up. Cosmi and Creed Humphrey could still be in there in the later parts of the second. I'm not sure that any of the potential second round receivers are going to interest the Packers. I think they go OL.
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou
April 30, 2021 at 07:46 am
I too think OL in round 2, particularly OT.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 08:32 am
I think OL is a real possibility, but if it's an OT, it tells you that all the positive we've been hearing about Bakhtiari's rehab (supposedly ahead of schedule) might be fluff.
If Bakh is coming back quickly, that OT is a swing tackle and doesn't have a starting spot until at least 2022 (and that's if they cut/move Turner). You can find that guy later in this draft.
Thegreatreynoldo
April 30, 2021 at 11:43 am
Or, they might just not know when he's coming back or aren't willing to risk a setback.
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 05:56 pm
By now they should have a pretty good idea if all stays on course, but as you point out, there can be set backs. Personally, I think we are better set up to cope in the regular season than many.
LambeauPlain
April 30, 2021 at 10:14 am
Good post. With Aaron, it seems he struggles in relationships with people close to him. His Mom, Dad, brother girl friends, coaches, management. He is very arrogant and holds grudges and harbors resentment. I think he makes mountains out of molehills and he cannot forgive or let things go.
Great player and I hope he is QB for the Pack this year...but frankly, his MVP was also due to MLs coaching and strategy to scheme guys open with motion illusions of complexity...and get chunk plays on the ground to keep Ds off balance. He was starting to look very average the last years of MM.
Would Love thrive in the ML run/pass crafty system ? I think so.
Razer
April 30, 2021 at 07:39 am
I like our pick and I like that we didn't panic - on any front. Stokes will be a great addition and our secondary will be solid. I also like what Minnesota did in trading back. It was my hope in this draft. Unfortunately, we didn't have the draft position to trade down in the 1st round - get a starting Tackle, an extra second rounder and an extra 3rd rounder. Both Detroit and Chicago also nailed their picks.
As for Aaron Rodgers, I prefer to wait until I hear the truth. Lot of reporting but little confirmation. If true, this would be a very unfortunate way to wrap up a great career. Becoming a public spectacle like Favre did was childish and egotistical. Let's hope a better way is taken.
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou
April 30, 2021 at 07:48 am
Be a simple thing for Rodger's to issue a clarification if not true.
Razer
April 30, 2021 at 08:10 am
Yes it would. I get it that players and organizations don't want to scurry about at the media's whim especially for reporting out of CBS Sports. If true, this would make Aaron Rodgers look very small. I will give him the benefit of the doubt over CBS.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 08:15 am
Rodgers is a smart guy and is judicious in his words and media exposure. He's going to let this play so long as it doesn't start to kill his brand. If he issues a statement, it will be because he doesn't like how the publicity is impacting his image.
Leatherhead
April 30, 2021 at 08:19 am
Yes, it would, and he hasn’t.
The foreseeable future was three days.
The Packers shouldn’t have anybody on the team who doesn’t want to be a part of it.
Stokes is a solid pick. And the cheeseheadtv crowd whiffed.
Thegreatreynoldo
April 30, 2021 at 08:44 am
Not sure what you mean by the CHTV crowd whiffed.
You might be getting what you either 1) wished for, or 2) at least predicted when Gute moved up for Love. We shall see how this all works out.
Leatherhead
April 30, 2021 at 09:20 am
None had Stokes as the pick. That’s a whiff. Not only the writers, but nobody else really said Stokes would be the guy.
If Rodgers doesn’t want to be part of the team, he shouldn’t be. I’d rather Love had another year to develop, and I think we have a good shot at the Super Bowl with Rodgers this year, but if Rodgers doesn’t want to be part of it then we need to move forward ahead of schedule.
The team is much bigger than any player.
jannesbjornson
April 30, 2021 at 10:49 am
Old School.
HankScorpio
April 30, 2021 at 11:46 am
Leatherhead,
We don't see many things eye to eye. This one, we do.
You can always find common ground with everyone. No matter how much you disagree with them on other things.
Leatherhead
April 30, 2021 at 12:20 pm
We agree more than you think. I just don’t comment when I agree very often
This Rodgers stuff saddens me. Apparently, Rodgers believes that the team had agreed to trade him this offseason and has reneged. I don’t think this is going to end well.
Thegreatreynoldo
April 30, 2021 at 12:06 pm
Yeah, then we all whiffed. I had Stokes going in the forties. I had Newsome as CB 4, Melifonwu as CB5 and Stokes as CB 6.
Leatherhead
April 30, 2021 at 12:27 pm
We all whiffed. Stokes at #29 never occurred to me.
jannesbjornson
April 30, 2021 at 12:57 pm
His Pro Day moved him up. He and Joseph from Kentucky were guys who could stick with the "Bama crew and the LSU arsenal of wideouts.
MarkinMadison
April 30, 2021 at 08:06 am
Rodgers: Trade me. I don't want to be here. Trade me someplace closer to home. I'd like San Fran. Or if you don't want me in the NFC Denver will do fine.
Packers: We're going to the Super Bowl with you this year, no effing way.
Rodgers: .......
He played the only card he has to play to try to leverage his way out of town.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 08:27 am
I don't think he's trying to leverage his way out of town. If he was, his reps wouldn't be negotiating with the Packers still. If any of this is really on him, I think he's trying to jump-start those contract talks.
packerbackerjim
April 30, 2021 at 08:41 am
Some bells you can’t un-ring.
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 09:23 am
Excellent point Dobber and I agree. I think this is Rodger's agent trying to push the extension negotiations forward. I'm hoping this all blows over and that Rodgers is still our QB in September.
Gute and the Packers have, for some reason, done everything they can to screw up their relationship with Rodgers. If you're a GM of an NFL team and you don't know how to deal with your team's best play and an elite NFL talent then maybe you (Gute) should not be an NFL GM. Thanks, Since '61
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 09:36 am
If this is his agent, we’re I Rodgers, I’d be pretty pissed and I think might end up changing. As was pointed out by TGR, Rodgers “brand” is getting to the point of being more valuable than anything at this point. It just got tarnished, the only question is how much.
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 10:41 am
I'm not sure how or why Rodgers brand has been tarnished. People have short memories. If Rodgers goes on and wins an SB with either the Packers or his next team do you think anyone is going to remember what is going on now? In fact if the Packers trade Rodgers and he wins an SB with his new team it will more than likely be the Packers brand which is tarnished for unbelievable stupidity rather than Rodgers who will be seen as a SB champion and maybe another league MVP.
Gute is the GM. He is paid to handle issues with his elite players. If he can't handle the best player on his team maybe he should not be the GM. He has done as much to create this situation maybe more than Rodgers. We'll probably never know the whole story but there are always two sides to every story. Thanks, Since '61
jannesbjornson
April 30, 2021 at 12:32 pm
Agreed. Best to wear Ray Bans, not green and gold glasses.
Nate-1980
April 30, 2021 at 02:33 pm
You’re on fire today 61, I agree 100%, great post..:)
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 06:12 pm
Handling doesn’t mean acquiescing. I wasn’t talking if Rodgers sporting prowess, rather his reputation as an individual. If Rodgers wants to run the team, handling him is certainly not coddling. That would be the opposite.
Again, all this assumes face value, something I seriously question. Again, my guess is that this is a mishandled negotiating tactic. If so, only Rodgers can walk it back.
Ultimately there will be a Packers team without Rodgers. I feel sorry for those who find that too painful to accept. Personally, I doubt that it’s at that point, but I do think it may come back to speed it in future, and that is an unnecessary shame over what? A QB who has never taken a snap? Seems as dubious a basis in reality as it is as easy for the pundits to latch on to.
leche
April 30, 2021 at 09:27 am
Packers can't really entertain giving Rodgers an extension because doing so makes Love superfluous, which means we should have traded him yesterday (both figuratively and literally)...
We just don't get any real value of keeping Rodgers and Love around for the 'long haul'. We need to pick a lane. And we need to do it soon...
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 09:34 am
Gute is telling us that he has picked a lane and that "Rodgers is our guy for the foreseeable future." The problem is that Gute said that with already knowing that Rodgers wants out of GB. So the question becomes why is Gute lying and can we trust anything he tells the media or the fans? Thanks, Since '61
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 09:38 am
Yup. I doubt anything that came out yesterday was news to the Packers' brass. Everything that's been happening between the two parties is well known to both.
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 09:40 am
Because Gute represents the team and the team does not want to trade him. Very logical statement in terms of football and negotiation.
Thegreatreynoldo
April 30, 2021 at 12:16 pm
It looks like Gute picked a lane verbally but didn't pick a lane contractually. Or at least the foreseeable future did not mean through the 2023 season, which is the commitment needed to deal with the cap crunch.
I don't think AR wants more money per year. It is about commitment and even respect.
blondy45
April 30, 2021 at 12:23 pm
Gute is not lying. The for seeable future is what he stated, yes it just moved up dramatically time wise now. Gute did not move that time line up, Rodgers apparently did. A GM's job is to supply the team with as much talent as he can get and afford, for the present AND the future. Gute has done that. In Gute I trust.
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 06:33 pm
Rodgers contract would be Ball and perhaps Murphy I would think. Gute’s job is to want him.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 09:37 am
We've seen one way this path can turn out with Brady in NE making Garoppolo expendable. This script is writing itself as we watch, and I don't think anyone knows how it will turn out....except I feel pretty confident that the latest both of these guys will be on the roster is the 2023 draft. I don't think ARod moves until after 2021 at the soonest.
If they commit to ARod long-term, they'll do it before the season starts, and they'll showcase the hell out of Love in camp (which will likely happen, anyway). They need to make him look good in an NFL uniform before they'll be able to drum up much demand. Love had little value yesterday compared to what the Packers put into him. Maybe they deal him today for a 2nd?...who knows? That wouldn't play well for BG in GB. But if they do, they're saying that ARod has the keys to the franchise from here on.
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 06:14 pm
Yes Dobber, if the Packers do trade Love either during the draft or after showcasing him during the preseason then the Packers will be committed to Rodgers longer term. I just don't think that Gute will do it because that makes him look really bad for selecting him in the first place.
However, anything can happen and that would be a way out for Gute and the Packers. Could be the best thing for Love as well because if Rodgers does stay and remains healthy Love doesn't see the field for another season at least. Yet another interesting scenario to come out of this situation. Thanks, Since '61
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 09:37 am
Yes they can. Love is cheap. The pick is spent.
leche
April 30, 2021 at 10:06 am
Opportunity cost, bro
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 06:36 pm
Sunk cost Honey
stockholder
April 30, 2021 at 11:10 am
I don't - I believe he really wants out. I'd protect my image, etc. And the future wife.
HankScorpio
April 30, 2021 at 11:48 am
I don't think it is just the money part. That is an important part, I do believe. But any day is fine for that. Why on draft day? Surely that day was calculated to force Gute's hand to pick WR in round 1.
PeteK
April 30, 2021 at 05:14 pm
At least Favre waited a few seasons after Rogers was drafted and we saw that we might have a talented QB.
SugarCain
April 30, 2021 at 07:45 am
Stokes had the fastest 40 time on the Packers roster (4.25) and as athletic as Jaire. I hope Gutey continues to draft speed in this draft as the Packs defense has a huge need for speed.
Time to say “Thank you..Next” to Aaron Rodgers. Lets go win with JLove!
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou
April 30, 2021 at 07:52 am
One would think the Packers by now should have one of the fastest if not the fastest backfield in the NFL assuming Stokes starts. Can anyone verify?
The middle of the Packers defense now could use better speed at ILB.
Houndog
April 30, 2021 at 08:17 am
SugarCain,
"Time to say “Thank you..Next” to Aaron Rodgers. Lets go win with JLove!"
Are you insane, are you talking about the same "JLove" that couldn't make the active game roster last year?
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 09:42 am
Team never wanted him to play last year. What did Rodgers spend doing in year one?
Since'61
April 30, 2021 at 09:30 am
Sugar Cain, Really!!! When exactly do you think that the Packers are going to win with Love? Maybe by 2025.
And that's assuming that Love can actually play QB in the NFL. Since he didn't even put on a uniform in 2020 he is now a year out of actually playing football.
Even is Love follows the same trajectory as a starter that Favre or Rodgers had we're 3 years at best from a Super Bowl (Rodgers) or 5 years away (Favre). Love could prove to be a very good QB and still not get us to an SB. In any if I were a betting person which I'm not I would not be placing any money on Love any time soon.
Thanks, Since '61
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 09:46 am
Never value the bird in the bush more than that in the hand, I agree. Love could be stellar or not.
The only reason to doubt that is if the one in your hand becomes a diva and won’t fly. If that happens then all calculations would change.
leche
April 30, 2021 at 09:38 am
I'll never understand the eternal optimism of Packers fans assuming that the next guy in line is going to fill in for an all-time great... We got lucky with Favre. We got even luckier with Rodgers. That luck is running out sooner rather than later.
Maybe Love can continue that trend. That'd be effing amazing. But it's just so unlikely that wanting to push Rodgers out to get there is born out of pure ignorance and/or arrogance.
The best chance to watch this team win a Super Bowl is by them doing everything they can to build the best team around Aaron Rodgers in the short run.
If you'd rather not win than have that happen, I'd suggest you find more Lions fans to hang out with to realize how foolish you sound.
jannesbjornson
April 30, 2021 at 10:57 am
Let them both play press/man and stay out of quarters. LeRoy Butler likes Savage coming down as the "Star" guy and I agree. Move King to FS where he played one season at UWash.
Swisch
April 30, 2021 at 11:10 am
jannes, I like the creativity. Try to find a way for these talented guys to succeed, if they are truly willing to keep up the effort at improving. Let's hope King and Jackson and our other DBs get a fresh start with our new defensive coordinator that helps them to reach their fullest potential.
jannesbjornson
April 30, 2021 at 01:07 pm
Get better, no more square pegs theory.
Houndog
April 30, 2021 at 08:01 am
These morons, (Murphy, Gutekunst, and Ball), can tout their 1st round pick and spin anything they want to spin all day long. This game they're playing with the league MVP goes beyond stupidity.
The bottom line today is that without Rodgers this team goes nowhere, they're no longer an "automatic" contender, and they've cost themselves a degree respect from players, professionals, and fans around the NFL. Rightfully so!
I hope the executive committee is seething, it's time to run these idiots out of town!
Somewhere, Bob Harlan is shaking his head in disbelief!
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 08:07 am
Let's not lose sight of the fact that throughout all of this, ARod's people are at the table negotiating with the Packers and working out contract numbers. It's not as if he's gone home and cut things off. There's a game being played here, and mostly in the media and with the fans. Those are the dice ARod is rolling right now. People need to chill a little on this front.
Thegreatreynoldo
April 30, 2021 at 09:32 am
Are they at the negotiating table working on numbers? Even if they are or were, I think you did not address the fundamental problem. It isn't that AR wants more money, it might be that GB does not want to even change the numbers by moving them around. GB wants to keep their options open - that's the problem - because it means no FAs in 2021 or 2022 (other than Jaire on a 5th-year option).
To ease the cap crunch for 2021 and 2022, AR's potential dead money in 2022 and 2023 (almost) has to greatly increase. That dead money can be cap space that absolutely will be charged to the Packers if signing bonuses are employed, or it can be dead money that another team might be able to take on if a guaranteed roster bonus is inserted in say 2023 since guaranteed money that has not yet been paid can be traded and become the responsibility of the acquiring team. If the Packers are protecting themselves from a possible physical decline, they might have to eat a guaranteed 2023 roster bonus or take the route Carolina went with Bridgewater. The Panthers converted $7M of Bridgewater's $10M guaranteed base salary to a signing bonus (thus eating that as dead money) and then traded him to Denver, who accepted responsibility for the remaining $3M in guaranteed money. IOWs, the two teams negotiated how to divvy up that cap space.
In GB, the problem might not be that AR wants more money. It might be a matter of showing respect albeit at some risk to the Packers. For example, agree to guarantee $20M of AR's $25M base salary in 2023, and add a dummy year in 2024 at an unguaranteed $40M or even just a void year would work well. Converting AR's Roster bonus and most of his $14.7M 2021 base to a signing bonus or to a guaranteed option bonus in 2022 frees up over $14M in cap space. GB could sign for example Jarran Reed at $5M, add $5M at CB and sign a real CB for 2021, and have $5M left over.
That takes trust and the belief that AR is going to be the QB in GB for the next three years. And that respect is not there as far as I can see. [Now I am going to go watch reruns of the Goodfellas and the Godfather.]
flackcatcher
April 30, 2021 at 04:18 pm
TGR. The numbers don't lie my friend. Rodgers and the Packers both knew that his contract put them in a box. Their only conceit is both parties thought they would have time to wiggle out of it. Only a Black Swan event would shut the lid. Along come Covid-19. BLAM! Lid shut. Let's not kid ourselves here. Russ Ball, Brian Gutekunst and Mark Murphy have been running the numbers pass the executive committee since the Pandemic swept the nation. No matter how it's spun it still is pretty grim. But we on CHTY have known that since before last season. And yes, it is clear that the Packers brain trust wanted to honor Rodgers contract right up to the end, and then go forward from there. What Rodgers wants is unknown. Not that it matters. Beyond this season it would hard to keep Rodgers in his current contract. Not impossible, but Russ Ball would be playing 'money ball' at an very high level, with pretty serious long term impact for the entire organization. To think the executive committee would put the Green Bay Packers at risk for one player, no matter how valuable, is to be blunt, beyond stupid. So the transition begins. Now maybe the Packers come to some sort of agreement with Rodgers that ends his contract with his release or trade this year or next. This was going to happen no matter what we as Green Bay Packer fans want. Rodgers sealed his own fate the minute he signed his contract. End of story.
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 09:50 am
This sounds so like the day after Rodgers was drafted and the that Favre departed. Frothing , empty abuse for TT.
marpag1
April 30, 2021 at 08:08 am
I am very, very, very, very glad that the GB Packers did not go against their better judgment and select one of the micro-wideouts that people are calling proper receivers. There is no way I wanted a 5'7" 170 pound dude as a first round draft pick.
I like the way the draft is shaping up. Even if the Packers sit tight in round 2, I think there is going to be a quality player waiting to be had.
Last comment.... I loved Greg Rosenthal's tweet: "If the Packers won’t trade Rodgers, I just hope they finally get him some help beyond his All Pro LT, All Pro WR, top-10 RB, 26-6 coach and top-scoring offense."
Pack66
April 30, 2021 at 08:17 am
Well..well..well..."spud fell in the well.."
Where are all the "Aaron Rodgers is a TRAITOR posts"????
He's a SELFISH PLAYER...ME...ME..ME..
blah blah blah..
Very interesting...
Could it be possible that the BELOVED, Aaron Rodgers is pulling a FAVRE...???
The Chickens have come home to roost!
C'mon...where is the "How dare he hold the Green Bay Packers HOSTAGE"...posts?
"Nobody is ABOVE the GREEN BAY PACKERS....
hahahahahahahahahhaa
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 08:18 am
Is this some kind of new-fangled, spoken word poetry I'm unfamiliar with?
Leatherhead
April 30, 2021 at 08:21 am
Most of us realize that this is just words and that Rodgers will be our QB this year.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 08:23 am
Yup. Wake me up when something of substance happens on this front.
Thegreatreynoldo
April 30, 2021 at 09:41 am
Sometimes I am saddened that gifs don't work on this site.
mrtundra
April 30, 2021 at 08:37 am
Packers fans have been there and done that, with Favre, in 2007, or whenever it was.
mrtundra
April 30, 2021 at 08:29 am
Welcome to the Green Bay Packers, Dirty Red! I'm betting Dirty Red gets the first Pick 6 of the season, this Fall. I LOVE this pick!
Handsback
April 30, 2021 at 08:36 am
Everyone was in the Newsome camp and rightly so because he has great attributes. The problem with Newsome, and Farley are injuries. Stokes is an ascending talent in that he’s gotten better every year. Another ascending talent pre-draft was Alexander. To me, not an expert, but Alexander and Stokes are similar players in their talent and style. Alexander was just further along in his development timeline.
I thought Green Bay would trade up to get Stokes in 2nd round, but got him in first. I thought it was a great pick. Would have preferred Moehrig, but Stokes makes a lot of sense.
I think Rodgers, the Packer brass, and coaches believe 2021 is last year with Rodgers and GB. He wanted more, they said no.Throwing a fit doesn’t serve much of a purpose except get the team ready to move on without Rodgers as QB.
Razer
April 30, 2021 at 08:50 am
Thank you for the clarity on Stokes, particularly when framed with the alternatives and injuries.
I hope you are wrong about the Rodgers scenario. It seems plausible. I am still hoping that it is bad reporting. If not, it would be damaging for both parties but particularly for Rodgers who could not look smaller.
dobber
April 30, 2021 at 08:51 am
Here's a draft profile -- the negatives -- from NFL.com:
"Gangly frame unlikely to carry much more good weight
Injuries and missed time make 2017 tape tricky to evaluate
Avoided excess contact with blockers and appeared to lack his typical brand of aggressiveness
Needs to play with better knee bend from press
Read routes and created opportunities to attack throws but defaulted to the safe play
Can get grabby in man coverage
Allows base widen and loses balance during transitions from time to time
Gave up too many redzone touchdowns in 2016
Inconsistent getting head around in time to find the football
Inconsistent finisher as tackler and may struggle to get off of NFL blocks"
This is from Jaire Alexander's profile, not Stokes...but it does sound familiar, doesn't it?
LambeauPlain
April 30, 2021 at 11:02 am
Yeah....and Kenny C was rated to be a 3rd, 4th rounder and M Adams was one of the highest rated DTs in 2017 draft class.
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 06:48 pm
Barmore reminds me so strongly of M Adams
jannesbjornson
April 30, 2021 at 11:05 am
Never let the Fans draft your players.
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 09:33 am
Not everyone. I wanted GB to stay far away from both players. Stokes was an amazing value at the #29, and is arguably better than both Newsome and Farley. Stokes' level of WR competition in the SEC was far superior to what either Newsome or Farley faced in the Big 10 or the ACC.
Stokes had more tackles, more TFL, more INTs, more PDs, more FFs and more TDs than Newsome. Same with Farley, with the exception of INTs where Farley had 6 to Stoke's 4. Plus, Stokes showed himself to be healthy and available for all of his games at Georgia.
LambeauPlain
April 30, 2021 at 11:00 am
4.29, 6' 1", with a resume of being one of the best CBs and against top WRs and....an empty medical file. 4 down player too as a gunner, returner, gunner defender.
Defense got better yesterday.
Safe pick with a huge upside.
Packerpasty
April 30, 2021 at 08:44 am
what was supposed to be a fun day got totally sabotaged by the worlds Best Grudge holder...carefully planned out since day one of last years draft...I almost feel sorry for Packers management..."almost"....now Im sure Rodgers will say he had nothing to do with the supposed "leak" but everyone knows...Love better be up to the task or its bye bye upper management....and that first round pick...could have had him in the second round, his stats remind me of other Packer greats like Ha Ha Clinton Dix and Kevin King...
PackfanNY
April 30, 2021 at 08:56 am
I am certainly no draft expert but from watching Georgia and from the tapes I’ve seen I have no problem with the pick. Stokes can certainly fly and is thought to be a solid cover guy. He also seems to be physical. The Packers secondary is looking very strong.
Hopefully, we are looking at the O-line and D-line today and tomorrow. Based on the fact that the Packers have only one WR under contract after this season, I would expect that we will draft one as well. Given that Gute has ammunition (2 picks each in the 4th, 5th and 6th rounds) I suspect he will be moving around for targeted players.
I trust Gute and the Packers are going to have a solid couple of days. Keep the faith and GPG!
frankthefork
April 30, 2021 at 08:57 am
I like the choice also...go Defense. I expected a WR, but Batemon was picked and Marshall a reach. JJ is a waiver wire cut in Sept.?
As for Mr MVP I put this on Acme...
AR12 Mr MVP is no Reggie White. By that I mean a humble leader who puts team before self.
I knew when we drafted AR, he was headstrong and pissed he dropped in the draft. He learned from the master of "tractor watch"..now it's Jeopardy- watch and wait! Maybe AR wants better NFL draft ratings, but there is not a team leader attitude in AR's head right now.
Heavy is the head that wears the crown, but be humble Mr MVP, you got paid and signed a contract to be an entertainer on a football team! Entertain us in Green Bay.
AR12 can go anywhere-maybe, but the Packers will always be in Green Bay!
Archie
April 30, 2021 at 09:49 am
Anyway you look at it, drafting Love last year was a slap in AR's face. Like it or not, management is getting what it asked for. I will be surprised if 12 ever puts the green n' gold on again. Gutey is whistling in the graveyard with his happy talk to the contrary. I just hope we get a great return in a trade. It is quite possible the Denver deal is done and we will hear of it after June 1.
Coldworld
April 30, 2021 at 09:52 am
Yesterday finally convinced me that it was the right move to take Love, not merely one I could rationalize.
LambeauPlain
April 30, 2021 at 10:45 am
I agree. I wish this were not so, but the whole thing on draft day is so contrived and manipulative. It is not a good look. And contrary to many fans who were angry at Gutey for ignoring #12, it seems he has been trying to extend him since the NFCCG.
Love pick is looking wiser by the leak from Camp Malcontent.
Coach Matt has had good success with QBs. I see no reason why Love will not succeed under him the way Rodgers did who was starting to look very average during MMs last few years.
Difer
April 30, 2021 at 11:15 am
I think the draft day news release was pay back for the poor way "Gutey" handled communications with Rodgers when he traded up to draft Love (which Gutekunst admits). On the bright side, it alerts Gutekunst to go heavy on defense for the remainder of the draft, since defensive depth will be critical for the foreseeable future.
Thegreatreynoldo
April 30, 2021 at 12:33 pm
Just to make myself unpopular :)
drafting Love is the 2nd or 3rd biggest reason GB didn't win a super bowl in 2020. The Love pick has a chance to be the number one reason if they don't win the SB in 2021.
Leatherhead
April 30, 2021 at 12:43 pm
An interesting way too look at things. From another perspective, Aaron Rodgers is a big reason we didn’t win and would be a big factor if we failed this year.
This is like saying Rodgers was responsible for Favre throwing 29 picks when Rodgers got drafted. Do you believe Rodgers was responsible for that 4-12 season? Of course not.
10% of Life is what happens, and 90% what you do about it.
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 02:31 pm
OR - the Love pick has a chance to be the number one reason why the Packers win a SB in 2021. No one knows how his development is going, but it could be rock solid.
Again, his 2018 number are for real:
13 games, 267 Comp, 417 Att, 64.0 Comp%, 3,567 yds, 8.6 Y/A, 32 TDs, 6 INT and a 158.3 Passer Rating - ACCCURACY!!!!!
In 2019 he lost his HC, 4 of his starting OL and 3 starting WRs... that is why he was running for his life in a new system and why his numbers dropped.
Jordan Love had the strongest arm in the 2020 QB draft class. He can literally make every throw - AND he can run!!! He rushed for 9 TDs at Utah St. If he comes in developed and ready, with an improved Packers Defense, LOOK OUT!
coolhand
April 30, 2021 at 04:35 pm
So what Archie? As long as Rodgers is the qb in GB the team can't draft a qb? What is that? Should Adams get all pissed if the Packers draft a receiver in the 1st round? Or any other player? That makes no sense. If Rodgers can't handle it, that's his problem. He is paid very well to go out and perform to his best every game.
BJP
April 30, 2021 at 09:52 am
I love the pick. It used to drive me crazy when the other team had faster players. Green Bay is building a roster with elite speed.
LambeauPlain
April 30, 2021 at 10:17 am
Thanks Gutey. He "master at going faster."
Wrongbayfeldlman
April 30, 2021 at 10:13 am
Pretty clear watching AR over the years, his professional and personal life, he is a dick. State your position publicly don’t use someone else to start rumors on draft day.
If you don’t like the Love pick, beat him out on the practice field.
Is Rodgers a team guy?
Should management restructured/ extended AR after last year? Probably but it wasn’t a normal year. The Chinese threw a wrench into everything. Revenue, salary cap issues should have figured into ARs thinking.
I am of the opinion that mortgaging the future salary cap is not the way to win now or keep winning in the nfl.
I don’t like ARs tactics. He does deserve an extension/ restructure though.
I wouldn’t mind seeing him traded, 3-1s and two 2s let him go.
barutanseijin
April 30, 2021 at 07:30 pm
The Chinese?
Spare us the racist nonsense & stick to football.
Wrongbayfeldlman
April 30, 2021 at 11:47 pm
Yes, the Chinese, you know, where the wuhan virus came from.
Racist ? Pointing out that it was the Chinese who infected the world? The Chinese who shut down their own country while allowing infected people to fly to other countries. Go f yourself with your weak ass racist charge. I don’t give a f what or who you think is racist.
My daughter and my wife are of asian descent you weak ass poser, go f yourself.
LambeauPlain
April 30, 2021 at 10:19 am
3-1s and 2-2s? Thats a good deal. I take that deal!
Swisch
April 30, 2021 at 10:22 am
A compelling case made by Mr. Lass, and by Gute.
Given all the circumstances, it seems Stokes may well be a winning pick.
If he has performed well against the likes of Bama and LSU; if he has made impressive strides of improvement as a college player; if he has incredible talent that continues to ooze out on the field; and especially if he has a good attitude coming in to play with the Packers -- well, I'm starting to get a little excited in a cautiously optimistic way.
It appears Stokes may well be able to give us some significant snaps this season, especially as he gains experience along the way and into the playoffs. By year two, he may be ready to mature as a starter.
My early impression is that he is indeed a guy who is really getting better and better. The Packers may have picked him as a fruit about ready to ripen into something really sweet.
All the best to Eric Stokes as a player and a person. Welcome to Packerdom! God bless!!!
stockholder
April 30, 2021 at 11:43 am
I was against the Newsome pick. And I'm against the Stokes pick. I'm telling you that Gute does not care if he wins or Loses. This was a bad pick if you "want to win it now". 2. King is done. And as it stands right now. They can't afford Alexander. So more people will have to go. causing more holes. It's been 10 years since a Super-bowl. The chants of the "Pack will be back" will return. But the worst thing that has happened, has, " its this team is now divided". The packers are bigger then any player . As long as people continue to go for these bad picks. The more they will dig a hole they can't get out off. Gute has made suckers out of everyone. And my beloved packers, have me thinking I will never see the packers win another super-Bowl. Thank You Mr. Rodgers. But there was only so much you could do. Stokes will never be an All-pro. But it doesn't matter because the guys he's replacing weren't either.
LambeauPlain
April 30, 2021 at 10:35 am
I know! Alexander, Savage, Jenkins, Gary, etc....man those players are all JAGs....not a single NFL team would even have them on their rosters.
stockholder
April 30, 2021 at 10:55 am
Lets see who gets signed next. And you'll have second thoughts when Rodgers leaves. Every heard a great player can make everyone around him better?
packer132
April 30, 2021 at 11:45 am
I wish I had your crystal ball and intelligence! You already know that Stokes was a bad pick and will never be all-pro. Funny, as the NFL scouts and experts rate him very highly and most everyone (but you) see this as a good pick. Why are 9 out of 10 posts from you negative? Had the Packers drafted a WR, DL, OT, or LB, you would have had bad things to say about that pick. Why do you follow the Packers? Is it just to criticize?
stockholder
April 30, 2021 at 12:18 pm
( 9 out of 10? ) Sorry if you feel that way. My feelings are that the club is moving in the wrong direction. That better choices were, and are available. I feel it's Ok to disagree. Especially since it's been 10 years since we won a Super Bowl. 10 drafts. No Lombardi. This isn't Facebook.
packer132
April 30, 2021 at 01:14 pm
That's fair. You have your thoughts and I have mine. I don't agree with everything the Packers do, though I still continue to support the team. I would not want to be the GM or coach, as its a tough business to run. I am hoping for a good 2nd and 3rd day of the draft and maybe signing a cheaper FA or two before week #1. Go Pack Go
stockholder
April 30, 2021 at 11:45 am
Newsome was a written. Changed to King is Done.
LambeauPlain
April 30, 2021 at 10:29 am
I fell asleep and awoke at 4 and turned on my Ipad was stoked to read about the Stokes selection. Alexander the Great and Eric the Red on the same field.
And he's an immediate 4 down player. Slot in nickel, dime, boundary....gunner/gunner defender, returner. Cannot teach speed or size. And "Dirty Red" seems to be a great student and teammate.
He was probably the safest upside CB in the draft...empty medical file.
He's gonna love learning from Coach Gray and emulating Alexander. And with his closing speed, he should play well in the zone.
stockholder
April 30, 2021 at 10:51 am
No- he wasn't the safest upside CB. It was wrong to take a CB when Barmore was there. Not to mention OWeh who just went after. How many more CBs will we draft. My comparison is Randall without the tackling ability.
mbpacker
April 30, 2021 at 10:36 am
Ever try putting toothpaste back into the tube? You can get some in but not all and it sure is messy! The best thing is never having to do it in the first place. Go Pack Go!
splitpea1
April 30, 2021 at 11:12 am
On Stokes: You really have to love the speed. If he bites on a move going downfield, he might be able to recover and make a contest out of it. Also, on third downs, I hope our DBs don't continue to line up well beyond the marker, but if they do, we have good closing speed here. He's also very sticky in coverage. One of the knocks on him is his poor catching skills when the ball is up in the air; a couple of his INTs sort of came to him as they were bobbled and were more of less caught by his stomach.
On Gute's comment about being close to a dominant defense: Well, we have a little more work to do, don't we? Let's make sure we grab the best DL prospect we can by the end of Round 3.
Packerpasty
April 30, 2021 at 11:32 am
Holy wah, Stephen A. and Kellerman both just ripped into the Packers organization...wah...they said Rodgers should walk away, don't even answer the phone.
Packers0808
April 30, 2021 at 11:37 am
Gute will get the boot before Rodgers will, I would almost bet on it!
PackfanNY
April 30, 2021 at 11:50 am
I think we should start pointing out some of the “misinformation” that was being passed around as FACT yesterday that has since been best been characterized as false. At worst, someone may have been making stuff up. I am NOT defending Rodgers or the Packers here but am trying to sift through facts and bullshit.
1- Mark Schlereth openly claimed that Denver was “close” to a deal. Denver reporters and the Denver GM denied there were even discussions let alone a deal. In fact, Gute indicated only ONE team contacted the Packers. The 49ers admitted as much and said they were quickly rebuffed. I’ll assume 49ers calling is a fact.
2- Trey Wingo claimed the Packers “promised to trade Rodgers this off-season” then backed off. Gute denied unequivocally this ever happened. I believe Gute here because there is zero benefit to promising to trade a player. Zero. Someone seems to be looking for clicks to jumpstart their relevance here or received really bad information.
3- NBC and within their story cited Chris Mortensen that Packers were “open to reality” of moving Rodgers and that Denver was the likely landing spot. That seemed to leverage Schlereth’s erroneous report. Hours later Gute reiterated that Aaron Rodgers will NOT be traded. Doesn’t sound like a man open to reality of trading Rodgers. Not yet anyway.
Not sure if I missed any. Not a good day for the “media” if you ask me. As always, things could change and the one thing for sure is that Rodgers is pushing for something. That is the one nugget of truth in a sea of lies? Willful distortions or planted stories?
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 12:00 pm
Hey PackFanNY! Well said.
I'm thinking the Packers can't just come out and say they have a deal done with DEN, as they would have to assume a very different cap hit by doing so now, vs. waiting until after June 1 to close the deal, when the hit drops from about $36M to $14M.
I could care less what Gutekunst says, or has to say right now. The AR driven stuff popped into draft night because AR told his agent to release it to Schefter. I think Demovsky confirmed that last night during the draft party, if I'm not mistaken. OK. Genie is out of the bottle. We fans had to learn of this somehow, sometime. Fine.
I do think DEN, being a QB needy team, chose not to take Justin Fields at #9. Thought that alone spoke volumes. The Bridgewater trade consummated the night before the draft was most likely a chip thrown in for the Packers, possibly at the Packers behest if this scenario is true. It would make sense, as he'd be a solid, cap friendly backup/starter. We will find out soon enough.
PackfanNY
April 30, 2021 at 12:10 pm
Yeah, green gold. You can’t discount that maybe they have something lined up with Denver. Anything is possible. However, people were assuming that when Denver took Surtain that he would be part of trade to Packers. Then of course Packers took Stokes another CB so that makes no sense.
Also consider:
1- Very unlikely Packers/Broncos could put together a deal of such magnitude in hours.
2- If you are trading Rodgers, I am holding an auction. Gute or any GM worth his salt would solicit 5-10 teams minimum. That will not be stealth. It would be the worst kept secret in football.
wiremans12
April 30, 2021 at 12:00 pm
A good GM knows when to trade up and when to stand pat this was the time to
trade up he may not care what i think as this writer stated but tough what i think is
this GM is clueless and should be fired this is the 3rd year in a row our 1st pick will not
be a starter as far as i'm concerned that is beyond awful .
greengold
April 30, 2021 at 12:04 pm
Yeah... OK.... whatever, wiremans12...
R1 Eric Stokes 6-1 194 32 3/4” arms
4.29 40 time 20 tackles, 4 INT, 4 PD and 2 TDs in 2020.
Opposing QB completion rate 38.1%. Against receivers like DeVonta Smith, Jaylen Waddle and Ja'Marr Chase, Jerry Jeudy, Henry Ruggs, etc in the SEC.
Gave up only 3 TDs in 3 years.
Teams throwing against him in 2020 experienced a negative expected points added rating of -16, higher than that of Alabama’s Patrick Surtain II.
Stokes allowed a total of 16 completions and one TD in all ten games as a starter in 2020... Out of 299 snaps in which he was in coverage... and had 4 picks, 2 of them returned for TDs. Opposing QB's had a rating of 43.6 when throwing his way in 2020.
According to Sports Info Solutions, Stokes ranked second in the draft class with 12.1 receiving yards allowed per game.
Played TOP SEC WRs week in and week out with very good results.
packer132
April 30, 2021 at 01:01 pm
Great post Greengold. Some fans just like to be negative and have no clue. I am excited for Stokes, and hope he gets plenty of playing time this year. I can't think of a better pick at #29.
Fabio
April 30, 2021 at 12:15 pm
I find it amazing how we managed to let go of the most incredible Q of all time ..... only we could do it.
Swap Love, let DA leave or anyone else, do anything but don't let AR go !!!!!!!! (at least for the next three years)
There are teams that are looking for a Q for a lifetime ..... We prefer a fake GM who lies saying "he is our boy" when he knows perfectly well that he asked to go because of his and his choices !!!!! !
Thegreatreynoldo
April 30, 2021 at 12:39 pm
“We might have had a chance to move back if Eric had been taken ahead of us.”
What does that mean? GB could have traded back but elected to stay put and take Stokes? I am okay with Stokes but really felt a trade back would serve GB better. I just assumed that every other franchise thought trading back was a better option as well.
Thegreatreynoldo
May 01, 2021 at 07:42 am
Okay, I listened to the presser. This is just GM-speak. Another way of saying that if Stokes had already been selected, then GB would have traded back.
So another way of asserting the Stokes was by a noticeable margin the best player available on their board.
I think they should have traded back, but I am okay with Stokes. Not stoked, but he is okay.
CoachDino
April 30, 2021 at 02:45 pm
Great Board -Stokes might be the fastest guy in the draft and now on GB. That's 3 guys that run in th 4.3's or better out of your base 4. positives
Dude played in the SEC against all the best rec as a starter for 3 years
Speed 99 percentile
Hgt and Wgt
Arm length is incredible - Thats a big deal
So he has all the best Athletic traits and played 3 years against the best and held up very well. To me that's a very safe pick for a CB
I heard he was very good against the run and his missed tackle stats I see are very good
I heard as well that he's not a slot guy due to some of his lateral ability
Foot work issues -that can be coached and speed can make up for that. Point being when he gets beat off the line due to footwork its not going to be a big play but a completion and tackle.
Jlofton83
April 30, 2021 at 03:14 pm
No one player is bigger than the Green Bay Packers.
Let him go and get some draft capitol & Drew Lock ... who Gute was big on 2 years ago.
frankthefork
April 30, 2021 at 05:27 pm
When the Stafford trade went down....some laughed when I said move on from Mr. MVP get the picks and start the LOVE fest.
As of 5pm it looks like the Packers will get NADA...no draft picks or comp from AR12; he wants out and says he'll pay the coin.
FO is in a mess of a hole...sources say trade looks near impossible and challenging.
GB has up to June 1st but IMO get something back in picks/players for right now. But this is changing by the hour.
Suck it up FO and Gute. Trade him tonight! YOU PISSED OFF MR MVP!
Thanks for the memories AR12, but this is not a professional way to doing things!
Packerpasty
April 30, 2021 at 07:32 pm
Rodgers can be a vindictive jerk for sure but he's also a very very good QB...Gutekunst is blowing this whole thing and also last years draft was just terrible. I believe he was going to trade Arod why else go up to draft Love..to sit for five years?? Two stubborn cocky guys, ones good at what he does the other sucks...at least the draft will be fun when they are drafting in the top ten in a year or two..
Wrongbayfeldlman
April 30, 2021 at 11:55 pm
AR is butt hurt. Wants to take his ball and go home.
Thegreatreynoldo
May 01, 2021 at 07:50 am
GB probably has until the start of training camp to explore trades. Could be longer but that would help him get up to speed in a new offense.
Wilment
May 02, 2021 at 04:58 pm
It didnt affect the draft, as well as it shouldn't have. Whatever the issues between Aaron and management, they will be worked out without the muckraking dolts at ESPN, who tried to turn the draft into the Aaron Rodgers drama hour. A guy I believe a whole lot more is Mike Tirico who I trust a whole lot more than some of the ESPN boys, spoke to Rodgers briefly at the Kentucky Derby. Rodgers affirmed his love for the fans and organization, and expressed regret this became an open sore to pick at on draft day. I believe the man was embarrassed. The packers management, pros that they are, conducted themselves and the draft as planned. I think it was a great, if not flashy draft, with some nice new pieces added. Most grades were A's and B's from the pundits. I think they did great. Love my Packers!! GO PACK GO!!