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Is It Time For The Prodigal Son To Return?

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Is It Time For The Prodigal Son To Return?

It's time.  I'm throwing the gauntlet early, probably way too early for most Packer fans, but I'm going to throw it anyway.

It's time to end the Favre War. It's time to reunite the Packer Universe,with Brett at least as a minor satellite.  It's time for us, as Packer fans, to essentially welcome him back into the fold as one of the Packer greats, and drop the knee-jerk reactions to All Things Favre.

Now, if that was hard for you to read, imagine how difficult it was to write.  Trust me, I don't know if I am ready to forgive, much less forget.  But despite my own reservations, I'm convinced that the time for the antipathy to end.

Not for his sake, mind you.  I don't think Favre has done anything that cries out "redemption", nor do I think he's even made anything more than some indirect indications that he wants to be brought back in the green-and-gold circle.  No, we don't need to bury the hatchet for Favre's well-being.

We need to bury the hatchet for our well-being.

Brett Favre has been, in retrospect, the kind of athlete whose polarization powers are right up there with guys like Michael Jordan or Reggie Jackson.  And when he forced his way out of Green Bay, a lot of intense emotion rose up, dividing Packer Nation.  A lot of criticism was directed at Ted Thompson and Mike McCarthy (some of it deserved), as well as Aaron Rodgers (none of it deserved).  There were Packer fans who were, quite literally, rooting against their own team in order to exonerate Favre and prove the Packer regime wrong.

Those were ugly days, a black spot in Packer history.  I am interested in how fans twenty years from now will look back at the events of 2008, with two likely Hall of Fame quarterbacks squaring off for leadership of the team, and one of the best GMs and best coaches in team history making the King Solomon-like decisions.

But it isn't 2028.  It is 2011, and a long three years have passed since the events of that ugly summer, and yet, many Packer fans continue to carry the anger and the grudge to this day.  Many have sworn, even if Favre has his number retired, they will still never forgive him.

And I'm here to say, whether I agree with it or not, we owe it to ourselves to let it go.

Ted Thompson has established himself as a genius, a master draftsman who built a roster that was able to win a championship despite being decimated by injuries.  Mike McCarthy has coached a Super Bowl championship team that reflected his work ethic, a get-er-done attitude that accepts no excuses for a lack of talent or cohesiveness.

And Aaron Rodgers?  Less than three years after being cursed out by 10-year olds on the practice field, he stood with a ring and a championship belt, and is now in the middle of perhaps one of the most perfect seasons by an NFL quarterback in history.

This group...this TEAM...has exonerated itself, proven itself beyond a shadow of a doubt that not only was Rodgers the right guy to go with, but that Favre's own hubris led to his departure from the team as much as anything.  Those three men spend very little time nowadays thinking back to the ugly summer of '08.  Rightfully, they looked forward from that moment on.

But Packer fans have been so wonderfully trained for so many years, we still can't help ourselves when opportunities arise to keep jabbing at our past, as if somehow we still need to champion the Big Three in order to protect them.  When Favre was asked about Rodgers earlier this year, he mumbled something about how he felt Rodgers should have been able to win a championship sooner, given his talent and the talent around him.  Packer fans squalled at the comments, interpreting them as a slight against Rodgers and taking an opportunity to put himself in the spotlight.

Just recently, Favre, who is a man without a team to play for or to love him, made the comment that he might be open to the Chicago Bears if they were interested in his services.  Once again, Packer fans swore that we'd never accept him back if he dared put on a blue-and-orange jersey, and questioned why he was still trying desperately to "stick it" to Ted Thompson.

Heck, I myself fell into the mud a few weeks ago, comparing Aaron Rodgers to Brett Favre.  Yes sir, Rodgers is a better quarterback than Favre at this point in his career, even a better quarterback than Favre in Packer history, period.  I spent an entire Cheesehead Radio segment driving that point home.

Why?  Why do we use Favre as the measuring stick?  Heck, the measuring stick for Rodgers shouldn't be the years of a gunslinging quarterback in the last millennium, but the contemporary examples of high-percentage, low-risk quarterbacks we've seen in the last few years:   Tom Brady, Drew Brees, Peyton Manning.

So, why do we continue to obsess over his every word?  And the better question is,  why don't we get over it already?

Packer Fans Should Be Above It Now

The Green Bay Packers are defending world champions, defying all the odds and coming home with a new trophy for the Hall of Fame.  Furthermore, the Packers are riding a historic win streak, mostly on the arm of the quarterback that replaced Favre, Aaron Rodgers.

So, why live in the past?  There's a lot in common with what 49er fans went through when Joe Montana was shipped out of San Francisco in favor of Steve Young.  Oh, I know that Montana didn't go on FOX News to complain about how he was treated, and Favre wasn't coming off a season on the IR.  But there was a lot of vitriol directed at the general manager, and a LOT of pressure placed on Young.  This was a team that had won multiple Super Bowls under Montana's tenure, and had just won the Lombardi trophy the year before he was hurt.

Eventually, Young got that monkey off his back with a trophy, and you don't hear anymore vilification of him or the front office that sent Montana packing.  Both are remembered as great quarterbacks, among the best in NFL both Favre and Rodgers will someday be remembered.

So, why continue to fight this battle that Rodgers doesn't need fought for him anymore?  No one (other than Skip Bayless) is challenging his abilities or leadership anymore, and the Packer fans that would still rather have Favre have fallen silent (and likely, come to see reason with Rodgers).  It's a new NFL, and Rodgers is tailor-made for it.

I've often commented on how the fans contributed to Favre's megalomania.  Can't you still name his mother and father?  His wife?  His kids?  His siblings?  We were so deep into All Things Favre that we helped build that monster, as did enabling coaches like Ray Rhodes and Mike Sherman (and admittedly, Mike McCarthy for a while, too).  It's hard to break those habits, even if the love-hate spectrum has completely swung the other direction.

We don't have to forgive the actions of 2008, or forget them, either. We don't have to obsess about the fact that Favre wore purple and beat us a couple of times in a season when we weren't going anywhere anyway.  In the end, Rodgers thumped Favre and his team twice, then went out and won a Super Bowl, while Favre was quietly cut from another team in favor of some young, unproven draft choice.

For us, that emotion is real, and even raw.  But Favre is no longer a threat...and hasn't been for quite some time.  For those who championed Thompson or Rodgers, you won.  For those who wanted to see Favre beat and end his career in disgrace, you won, too.

And, by the way, the Packers are 12-0.   It's time to remember the quarterback who captured our imagination in the 1990's on a team that will be remembered forever.  It doesn't mean we have to go to his steakhouse or wear his jersey.  It means we should no longer let the media-driven spectre of what Favre became dictate how we should remember the player we once fell in love with.

The Media Will Continue to Manipulate Us Until We No Longer Let Them

I've written many times about "journalists" like Bayless, an ESPN tool that has realized, with the digital age, that flash trumps substance in the media jungle.  That's why all through the Summer of Favre, Brett actually had his own ESPN ticker heading.  Not "NFL".  Not "Packers".  "Favre".

And Bayless has realized, since he is a journalist without substance, that he must continue to provoke reactions from his listeners in order to keep himself earning a paycheck.  I understand it, and its no wonder he's gone all-in on the latest polarizing figure in the NFL, Tim Tebow.  By taking an extreme, irrational stance on Tebow, he guarantees that he will always get a reaction.  He could take an extreme stance on Christian Ponder or Andy Dalton, but who cares about them, right?

Thus the reason he continues to provoke Packer fans with his constant (and once again, extreme) stance on Rodgers.  In defiance of any shred of logic, he continues to show disdain for any accomplishment Rodgers has achieved.  It makes no sense, and sends Packer fans into a wild frenzy of comparative statistical evidence and, lacking that, loud derisive commentary on Bayless's lineage and Wonderlic scores.

But this is exactly what he wants, as we've been well-trained to quickly defend Rodgers from any criticism, given what we've gone through since 2008.  After all, Rodgers is our young quarterback who was treated unfairly from Day 1, and as Packer fans, we rose to defend him from all those Favre Lovers.

Which is exactly why Bayless has continued to go to that well, long after Favre is but a memory in the NFL.  He may not be able to champion Favre anymore, but he can continue to provoke a reaction shriller than he can get anywhere else in the league.

But what really convinced me that it was time for Packer fans to bury the hatchet wasn't the regular deliveries of fertilizer from Bayless, it was actually the Rick Reilly piece that seems to have been in response to it.  In fact, one might even speculate that Reilly's pro-Rodgers article was so over-the-top that both Reilly and Bayless may have orchestrated the entire thing for our benefit.

Reilly's article laid bare the entire Favre/Rodgers battle once again, now a full 40 months after the Summer of '08, honoring anyone who is a fan of Rodgers, while essentially telling anyone who is still a fan of Favre, "That's the second unmanly thing you've done today."

It's a sentiment that few Packer fans would disagree with, but why bring it up anymore?  Why tie our masculinity into who we choose to like as a quarterback?  In the end, Brett Favre is going to have his number retired in Lambeau Field and will feature prominently in the Hall of Fame.  It is looking, with each passing year, that Aaron Rodgers may follow the same path.  And yet, we're still being baited into choosing one over the other.

Hacks like Bayless and Reilly, who in the twilight of their journalistic careers struggle to come up with original, interesting storylines, will continue to barrage Packer fans with this kind of silliness.  For their own survival, they will continue to pick at the scars of 2008, refusing to let them heal, leaving deeper and deeper scars that will never completely fade.

As Packer fans, we are better than that.  When asked to subsidize an expansion of our stadium, we willingly purchase worthless stock just to feel that we are part of the organization for life.  We are approaching our 300th straight sellout, to be celebrated on Christmas Day against the Bears.  Packer fans exude class and loyalty throughout the nation and the world.

So, why continue to allow those scars to linger any longer?  We may not be ready for it, but the time has come for Packer fans to come back together and unite as one, no longer allowing ghosts to define our fandom (or, apparently, our masculinity).

Just like the neighborhood bully, its time to ignore the Baylesses and Reillys of the world, and get back to being Packer fans.  2008 will linger in our memories forever, but it no longer has to define us, or our quarterback.

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Fan friendly comments only: off Comments (118) This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.

BadgerDave's picture


packsmack25's picture


Mojo's picture

THIS to the nth power.

O'Neill's picture

This this this this.

Bob's picture

This guy sent a message through his agent that he was willing to listen to offers from the Bears. Please, enough is enough. He is a bitter old man, who should never be considered as a real Packer. All he wanted to do with that offer was stick it to the GM, Headcoach, and Quarterback and put and end the the perfect season. He stopped caring about Packer fans a long time ago. It's time for them to forget about him.

Steve's picture

Amen. Favre might never apologize, but I think it's finally safe to say he has retired. Welcome back to the family, Brett. Greatest packer of my lifetime, for now.

Steve's picture

Different Steve here - are you kidding - greatest idiot of your lifetime. No class. He should be a lifetime example of what happens when you diss and disrespect the Packers and their fans. Go away and never come back.

fish/crane's picture


Gabe's picture

I'm thankful that I had the opportunity to see Brett Favre play quarterback for the Green Bay Packers. Brett was the most exciting and entertaining quarterback to play the game. He is and always will be a legend of the Green Bay Packers and football. I enjoyed watching Brett's rocket arm throws to his receivers, the flips and underhanded passes, the long throws downfield, the chances Brett took that left me on the edge of my seat, the way Brett showed his emotions by wearing his heart on his sleeve, and showing his love and passion for the game. It was sad the way things ended for Brett in Green Bay. I'm a Packers fan but I still enjoyed watching Brett play with the Jets and Vikings. I don't agree with everything Brett did, but we all make decisions and mistakes in life. We are human. Brett helped Green Bay have many successful seasons for the Green Bay Packers and will always be apart of Packers history. There are some people who didn't enjoy watching Brett or like Brett as a football player which is fine. However, I pray that people respect, love, and show kindness toward Brett, because this is the way you would want to be treated.
Sorry for the grammar errors

jmac34's picture

I would say agreed but then he went and made those asinine comments a few months ago saying he was surprised the Packers hadn't won the super bowl earlier and that Aaron had been dropped in a good situation. He basically tried to dampen Rodgers importance to the team. He can come back once he stops being so bitter

IowaPackFan's picture

Those comments were taken out of context.It was more of a sarcastic remark meaning that he (and the team) are so good that he's surprised they didn't win a SB right out of the gate.

NJ's picture

Maybe you're right ... oh wait, what did I just hear? Favre has said he's open to come play with the Bears if the offer is right?

Nevermind. Cold-war back on.

Donna Wolter's picture

Ditto- When Favre can shut his mouth and apologize I MIGHT think about it. Just remember what Steve Young said- "we don't know the half of it"- describing Favre treatment of Aaron. Maybe they should let that crap out on the table and see if people are ready to let bygones be bygones. Favre comments are like toothpaste- once you let it out you can't put it back in the tube

thehatefulnerd's picture

LeRoy Butler made a comment like this too. That there's much more about which the public has no idea.

Kendra's picture

Jason Wilde said something like that the other week too.

Ceallaigh's picture

CD, you know I am a bitter girl with a long, long memory. I was almost ready just just let let it go.

But to start waving his hands at the Bears saying, <i>Pick me, pick me!</i> just smacks of a vendetta that Favre has yet to drop. Luckily the Bears said thanks but no thanks and ended his attempt to extend his vendetta tour.

That wasn't a graying QB offering to help a floundering team with his wisdom, skill and expertise, that was a narcissist looking for one more way to wound the GM, Coach and current QB in a game of one ups manship. It is childish and proves that Brett Favre stopped being <i>All About the Football</i> and more about revenge and Brett Favre a long time ago.

And the above post is right. We're only hearing <i>Favre's</i> side of the story. He's the one that boo hooed to Greta Van Sustern about the Packers kicked him to the curb. He's the one that wanted to shop insider information to any and everyone in the NFC North that would listen to him. This is the same asshat that told the Bears that he hoped that they would knock the Packers out of playoff contention last year.

That isn't the behavior of a prodigal son that deserves to be welcomed into the fold as a hero returned. That is a petulant toddler having a temper tantrum that needs to be ignored. Or worse yet, he is a cancer that needs to be cleaved away before it causes more damage.

I don't deny that Favre did some amazing things in Green Bay. He set in motion the dynasty that is today. But there's a huge difference in acknowledging an athlete's accomplishements on the field and forgiving or forgetting his inexcusable behavior when he left the team.

Aaron Rodgers deserves better. He, no doubt, put up with a lot of BS that he--aside from a few inferences here and there from his brother--will never talk about. That is class. That is leaving dirty laundry out of the public eye. That is a leader.

Sure, at the end of the day I'm willing to welcome Brett Favre back into the fold. But I think the time is right only after the sun has set on the Rodgers era and #12 is enshrined in Canton. Turn about is fair play. It's high time Favre gets to sit in Rodgers' shadow for a while.

foundinidaho's picture

As usual, Kelly says what I wanted to, better than I ever could. It's going to be a long time before I welcome #4 back to the fold.

Brian's picture

Frankly, I don't care if we/they ever welcome him back. I am old enough to remember the 1st Super Bowls, the dark years, and the recent glory. I cannot remember any other Packer acting close to this narcissist. So, why would I welcome him back without an apology?

Realizing that it will occur someday, perhaps after Rodgers retires.

MadMan's picture

No freakin way! He is still dead to me. I don't know when I would let him back into the fold, but it has to be a lot longer than three years.

PointBeer4Lunch's picture

Another vote - "No"

Stanislaw's picture

Are you writing this because you have nothing else to write? Who gives a rat about Favre - seriously, if you're going to talk about old GB QB's why don't you write about Lynn Dickey?

And how about 250 less paragraphs - dude, less is always more.

tundravision's picture

You know, nothing makes me happier than having folks take ten seconds to provide me with their suggestions of generic topics I can spend several hours writing, instead of the ones I really want to write.

foundinidaho's picture

CD writes very well. You may have a problem with what he says, but I don't have a problem with how he said it.

Aaron Nagler's picture

Stan - no one is making you read it.

Also - why be such a dick?

Cuphound's picture

Who? Wait, wasn't he that guy who played QB for the Pack between Don Majkowski and the start of the Aaron Rodgers era? He played for the Jets for a while, right?

foundinidaho's picture


Nerdmann's picture

Poor, dumb, scuzzy, uneducated white trash people will never let go of Favre. He's one of their own.

MarkinMadison's picture

That is just so wrong. Now you are insulting your fellow Packers fans. Best argument I've seen yet here for ending the war.

thehatefulnerd's picture

They're proud of being poor dumb scuzzy uneducated white trash people. Favre is their affirmation of that. To them, he's like proof that being poor dumb scuzzy uneducated white trash is the way to be.
Go into any country tavern in WI, or watch some of these car commercials they air during games.

phil's picture

Why would we think about that now and bring circus to town possibly messing up team chemistry with favre

brian's picture

It's not a war. I'm indifferent to Favre. The Packers as an organization can handle him however they want. It makes no difference to me.

tundravision's picture

"It's not a war"? Are you reading the rest of the comments?

markinmontana's picture

I don't think now is the right time- maybe a couple years from now, when his retirement has been "solidified". Besides, the Packers are already showing Favre more respect than the Vikings (who have already given his number to their punter).

Dice's picture

If Brent called me on the phone, I wouldn't even answer.

Bearmeat's picture


Screw the dongslinger.

Like I said earlier. We need to wait until ARod is enshrined first in the Packers HOF. THEN we start reconciling with Favruh.

In the meantime, assign his number to every backup punter on the roster during training camp for the next 10 years.

O&#039;Neill's picture


Karma is a bitch. Let Favre sit and watch the predecessor that he couldn't treat with respect pass him up in the history books.

Let a guy who has committed himself to this franchise and who won over the fan base instead of trying to stick it to them with childish talk and attempts to play for rivals get first dibs in Packer lore.

gbfninminnolnd's picture

Hillarious! Couldn't agree more. I live in minnesota Android love seeing these idiots still wearing purple 4 jerseys. Trying to hang on to that little glimmer of hope they had once with brent at the helm. Everytime I see a purple 4 on some morons back I still laugh and say " hey kluwee".

Bugeater's picture

Favre was a great player who will rightfully be honored by Green Bay. But not now. He has not displayed any semblance of class or professionalism to this organization since his departure and there are zero reasons to take on him and his ego while the current team solidifies it's identity. He blew chance after chance to end his tenure with dignity - now he has only himself to blame for the rift.

Kendra's picture

I think that's the emotionally healthy thing to do but I don't think being a sports fan always taps into the emotionally healthy spot in our brains.

I don't hate Favre but he's annoying. The coy leaks about him being willing to listen should the Bears call is annoying. His attempt to compliment Rodgers/GB but not being quite ready to land it is annoying. Little things like that show he's not ready to come back into the GB fold.

The media doesn't just bait Packers fans. He's a story because people, even non-GB people, will read the story. It's kind of like car crash and you can't look away. This will probably be your most read/most commented on story.

However, all the media mentions about him possibly coming back are just a reminder that Favre has been out of football less than a year. I think healing may be at a 1 to 1 ratio to how long he toyed with Packers fans emotions. One year for the first public retirement saga. Another year for his retirement saga after the Jets where he retired his way to the team he always wanted to go to. Another year for his first year with the Vikings where he beat us. And finally the last year where he was rumored to have advised Matt GB Millen and told Chicago to "beat GB." As far as I know, 49ers fans didn't quite have to contend with that from Montana.

So basically, you're not wrong but I do think it's too soon. GB's relationship with him was not short. It was long and extremely emotional, even during the 'good times.' The divorce wasn't quick either. Favre seemed to be fighting a personal vendetta against GB for his final three years.

I wanted the reconciliation to come sooner rather than later but the latest Favre/Bears stunt made me realize that it will be coming later. Save this post. Rewrite it in five years.

Charlie's picture

We can retire "4" after we retire "12".

MarkinMadison's picture

Objectively speaking, I'm not sure about retiring #4 at all. I get that he brought home the trophy. Is the number of every QB who ever won a Super Bowl retired? You look at the guys whose numbers were retired, they are few. Being on the ring is one thing. Not letting anyone ever wear the number again. I don't know. I'd like to read THAT article, because everyone just seems to assume that #4 should be retired.

tundravision's picture

It's not that I disagree with you, but then why did we retire #92? Reggie didn't even play 50% of his career in Green Bay.

MarkinMadison's picture

Definitely, it gets tougher in the modern free agency era - and Reggie was a huge part of that being created. To be clear, I'm not saying retiring the number is in or out. Farve is clearly a Pro Bowl Hall of Famer. But there are a number of Packers in Canton who have not had their number retired. Where is that line at?

Glorious80s's picture

Can they stop with the retiring numbers, already. It kind of ignores others who may have worn them earlier and you eventually run out of numbers. Isn't that what the Packer's Hall of Fame is for? Now there's this ring of honor thing. How many levels of awards do you need?
Better that future players can wear the numbers and appreciate the history that went before.
Re Favre. Agree that the team will have to address recognizing his achievements at some point in the future. Now is not a good time. Favre isn't ready, fans aren't and this is a special time for this team. Let them have the spotlight.
My sence is that rather then revenge, Favre still has a passion to play, to be a part of the action in a division he knows, to matter. I would guess he has mixed feelings about his years in GB, may want to get back in good repute, may not know how. I don't think he meant to slight AR, but it came out ambiguously. People jumped on it. So, the timing is not right yet, but it will come.
Fans should back off on this and just enjoy what is before us. It's very special. We may miss it by dwelling on the past hurts.

eqfan592's picture

I know you may be catching some heat for this, and that many think your sentiments may be a little to soon, I still think it needed to be said. I still feel a lot of bitterness towards Favre, but at the same time we do have to move on from all of this once and for all.

Tho that would be a LOT easier to do if Favre would finally STOP trying to play for our most hated division rivals!!!! :P

tundravision's picture

Thanks for getting the point of what I wrote. I totally get that most people aren't ready to do it, but at some point, that gauntlet needs to be thrown.

Chazman's picture

Timing is everything. In the middle of a historic winning streak for the franchise and a Super Bowl run . . . not so much.
Maybe after Aaron retires.

Bob's picture

What if information starts to come out that his conduct in New York was SOP in Green Bay.

tony's picture

No way. Everything he did could be forgiven until he forced his way back into the NFC North to "get back" at the Packers and the fans who supported him for so long. That was unforgivable...

Mojo's picture

THIS too.

Bob's picture


keeley2's picture

You lost me at Brett Favre. Stop it - let's enjoy the season and take this up on another day. Talk about atrocious timing for this tome.

tundravision's picture

As for this not being the right time, when do we start the conversation? Wait until Rodgers is injured for a season and the Packers go 5-11. Or wait until Rodgers, McCarthy, and Thompson have all retired? If you wait that long, you miss the entire point of what I wrote.

keeley2's picture

Okay, I understand you're not used to listening. I inferred that "AFTER THE SEASON" might be more appropriate (and more accepting from the masses). Just trying to help.

tundravision's picture

Honestly, I don't think the offseason is going to meet with a proposal like this any better than during the season. Just putting it out there and breaking the seal. Thanks for your help.

keeley2's picture

Okay, I get it that your gig relies on hits and during the off-season, your audience might be a tad bit smaller. But this reeks of "stirring the pot". Can't we enjoy the season without bringing up festering wounds? Not sure where your allegiances lie quite honestly.

tundravision's picture

Gig? What gig are you talking about? I don't get paid for this. I write because I enjoy writing. 100,000 hits vs. 100 hits times zero is still zero dollars.

The "pot stirring" is in direct response to articles written by Rick Reilly and Skip bayless, both of whom I dissed completely, and then offered the idea that Packer Nation should quit rewarding these clowns.

Which part do you disagree with? If you simply hate Favre and refuse to entertain any notion of moving on, then say so. I can accept a difference of opinion, but to question my allegiances? Seriously?

Glorious80s's picture

The right time, probably when this team has had its run, when AR leaves or retires or when BF and AR reconcile.

Bob's picture

Favre created this mess and the ball is in his court. It's up to him to see the wrongs and do the right thing until then, he's just another guy with a lot of stats and poor character. Do not bring him back, retire his number, or place his name on the ring!

bleedsgreen's picture

Brett Favre could have been hugging Aaron on the field after the Super Bowl. Had he been a mentor to Aaron and skillfully handed over the reins, Brett could have claimed some credit for the glory that Aaron brought. Everyone would be happy, the family would be whole.

That didn't happen. The opposite of that didn't even happen. Worse than the opposite of that happened.

It's not our exile Brett laments. It is of his own making. Only he can undo it. And that ain't ever going to happen. Why? Because Favre is a grade A asshole. I don't welcome assholes anywhere, least of all, back home.

Enjoy the lawnmowin' Brent. It's all you'll have now.

O&#039;Neill's picture

Yup. It's clear Brent wants nothing to do with our organization or us as fans. In fact, his whole goal since 2008 has been to stick it to us.

Why make him a part of something he hates?

Wagszilla's picture

I stopped reading about the third sentence.

I'm "over" Favre. Those specters dissipated when Aaron and the Pack won a Super Bowl.

I'm appreciative what he did for the organization (with Mike, Reggie, and a great TEAM) but the fact is: Packer fans don't owe Brett *anything*. He was paid well for his job, he was a great Packer, and is a future Hall of Famer but I'm not going to feed his ego or ignore his unrepentant attitude.

I fully forgive Favre and respect his professional choice to play football where he likes but all of our actions have consequences. He made his bed, now he has to lie in it. He's chosen alienation and exile for his performance both on and off the field.

Character is more important than football, stats, and Super Bowls and that standard I have for myself applies to my friends, family, peers - and yes, football players.

No more hero worship.

UpperWisRiverYachtClub's picture

This comment nails it. Well played Wagzilla. Well played.

Let's move on.


Philip's picture


Chazman's picture

Well played. And I mean that in a most non-hero worshipping kind of way.

Vince M's picture

I stopped reading your comment after the part where you said you stopped reading. No, wait, I actually read the whole thing because I don't make uninformed comments based on a blurb of an authors point.

CD Angeli made a concerted effort (if you would have read past the third sentence) to point out that this isn't about owing Favre anything or any kind of hero worship. His whole point was that we, as fans, have to let this go because, frankly, the argument and hatred is useless.

Feel free to agree or disagree with the message; that's your right. However, at least try to actually understand the message before you comment on it.

thehatefulnerd's picture

Bottom line is Favre will never stand up and be a man. He will never apologize, because he doesn't feel sorry. Not about what he tried to do to the franchise, not about the way he treated Arodge, not about the way he treats massage therapists, and not about anything else.
He's too busy listening to his wife and his agent whisper in his ear about how great he is. Big Irv was all that kept him grounded to any degree, but that ended years ago.
Now he's surrounded by a bunch of sycophants who have nothing to do but inflate his ego, and that's all he cares about.

O&#039;Neill's picture

I'd bet you dollars to doughnuts that Big Irv was rolling in his grave over all this.

packsmack25's picture

Why do we HAVE to forgive him? Why does he HAVE to come back? I'm sorry, but I have not heard one good reason as to why he HAS to be allowed back into the Packer family. He's a former Packer who will be in the Hall Of Fame. That's all he needs to be. There is no reason at all that he needs to be a part of the franchise any further than that.

Wagszilla's picture

I agree.

Ego Boost and Money would be the only two things that drive him back.
Bart for example has always been around the franchise and despite some rough periods, always shown an interest in "the Packers" as an organization and an entity.

Favre, contrarily, saw it as a job, a means to an ends, and a boss he wanted to stick it to.

But I think it's appropriate and necessary for them to put Favre in the "Ring of Honor". Anything else would be revisionist history. That being said, he needs to change his ways and garner some goodwill from the fans.

Don't want it anytime soon though. *Long* after Aaron is retired - then we'll talk.

mike's picture


Matt's picture

I'm not sure Favre and the Packers will make up until Ted Thompson retires.

Hard to imagine Favre coming to terms with the Packers with Thompson at the helm.

O&#039;Neill's picture

I say we retire a jersey in Ted's name instead and just forget about what's his name.

dawg's picture

Your shitting on Rogers / Packers parade,
did Brent put you up to this?

Tommyboy's picture

Great read, but I disagree. More specifically, I disagree with this: "We don't have to forgive the actions of 2008, or forget them, either."

We either have to forgive or not. I'm not entirely sure how we don't forgive and then just move on. The guy could end this all with one phone call to the Packers, a page in the Gazette, or even a "leaked" statement to Chris Mortensen.

I can't stand Favre, but I can forgive. I've forgiven worse. The problem is that he's like a disembodied zombie. He's largely immobile, but is still barely alive and trying to take a bite. I want ONE gesture from Favre, even if that's just an extended silence.

Robb's picture

In my 30 year career I've found that the more you have to write about a subject to explain it, or convince someone to take your side, the less substance is involved. Oddly, this subject came up during yesterdays game. My feeling is, Rodgers should be the barometer for this decision. I trust his judgement (he's more than proven himself). He has said he wants to be the best 'man' in the NFL. I think he'll make the sound decision with regard to this. Not Thompson, not McCarthy, but Aaron Rodgers. He was slighted throughout his career by Favre. Let Aaron Rodgers decide when enough is enough. When Rodgers is ready to present Favre to the Packer Nation, I'll be ready to accept it.

packeraaron's picture

<em> Let Aaron Rodgers decide when enough is enough</em>

That is a terrible idea - and it is exactly the kind of thinking that created the later-day Favre monster.

Robb's picture

Two completely different personalities at work. The Favre monster was created when his father passed and Farve's moral compass ceased to exist. The head coach/General manager 'bowed to his greatness.' Perfect storm. Rodgers family has different roots, different values and value system. And McCarthy and Thompson have already shown they are not Mike Sherman. They've proven they can handle the 'Favre Monster.' A leader leads. Rodgers can lead by being the bigger man (again) and letting the wounds heal.

Kendra's picture

Not to harken back to a Favre quote but it's not Aaron's job to facilitate a reunion. It has nothing to do with what he's being asked to do and I would bet money he doesn't want to deal with that kind of distraction.

It's not even McCarthy or Ted's job to do so. It's up to Mark Murphy.

Will's picture


People are so dang petty, show some class.

For 16 seasons he made the Packers relavent. It's not hero worship it's called having the wherewithall to rise above all the crap and do the right thing.

mark's picture

This article might be the lamest and most pointless I've ever read on CHTV.

First off, we're in the midst of what is probably the best run of dominance in Green Bay Packer history! WHO (other than CD Angeli) CARES ABOUT OUR DISGRUNTLED EX-QB?? I spend exactly zero minutes of my week thinking about Favre. Only when media brings him up does he enter my radar.

"So, why continue to fight this battle that Rodgers doesn't need fought for him anymore?" -- Again, who's fighting?? 99% of Packers fans couldn't give a shit. Do Packer fans read every nugget of Favre media that comes out? Does Skip Bayless make us groan? Of course! We're obsessive Packers fans, that's what we do. We obsess. But are we still "fighting the battle"? Hardly. We're over it. So, so over it.

Furthermore, to suggest that it's somehow on US, the fans, to forgive Brett!?? Geez, if anything, this is between Mike, Ted and Brett. But from any fan's perspective, and independent of any hard feelings that may exist between Brett, Mike and Ted, it's on BRETT to get behind this organization and us, the fans, not to mention his former TEAMMATES, and to quit being such a little bitch. His comments about Rodgers not winning sooner, that was a back-handed compliment if there ever was one, not to mention an indirect F-U to ex-teammates like Driver, Clifton, etc.

So, I think I speak for most fans when I say, "Fuck you, Brett. How about you let US know when you're ready to grow up, and join us in supporting the team and organization and fans that gave you the best years of your life."

Aaron Rodgers will be winning in Green Bay for another decade or more. As long as that's happening, and if Brett can't be a fan like the rest of us, then fine.

In the meantime, us fans will be over here singing, cheering, drinking and celebrating the greatest TEAM in professional sports. Why? Because we're the most devoted and loyal fans in the game. We love Aaron just like we loved you, Brett. If and when you're ready to join us in loving Aaron, the rest of your old teammates, and the Green Bay Packers, we'll welcome you back with open arms.

Until then, well, whatever.

Joe&#039;sOnTheSquare's picture

Why waste 12000 words to try and convince us GBP fans?

Until Brent makes his interest clear and unambiguous, this topic is a non-starter - serving only to generate hits and hysteria (in that order) on the part of the author (don't even try with that "I don't care about hits" bullpucks - every site manager knows its all about "eyeballs baby, eyeballs!!"). Spare us - and let's stick to the 2012 Packers.

VApackerfan's picture

I agree with most. I think this is bad timing. Rumors of re-signing with the Bears last week, whether true or not, and next week we are talking about a Packers/Favre reunion? Why can't we forget about an outside issue for right now and enjoy what we have built since he left? Not to mention, he has been a distraction for so long and now we want to bring him back in the conversation while in pursuit of greatness? Why can't this be Rodgers time? Favre caused this mess with the greatest fans ever. He also created the mess (scandal) in his own personal life. Now is not the time to think about Favre or mention his name. The notion of letting Favre back into the family is like accepting a cheating girlfriend back, even though she has no intention of coming back or has any remorse for her actions. You, the boyfriend, feel it is the most PC/best remedy to fix a difficult situation. However, what you need is to not think about her, grieve, move on, and enjoy your new girlfriend. Besides the new girlfriend is so much sexier than the old one, and the new relationship is working out so much better. You start to see the grass is greener on the other side. There will be a time in the future where you will see the old girlfriend and settle your differences. However, enjoy what you have now. Go pack go, and Rodgers keep doing your thing. This is your time, this is your team.

fish/crane's picture

to error is human to forgive is divine

God's picture

First off its to "err" is human and secondly I'm too busy fixing Bronco games.


Bob's picture

Religous talk created by rich people sticking it to poor people and wanting to keep them docile. Our goverment does this for them today. Only now it is called social programs.

Patrick's picture

Hey, I've got a terrific idea: How about allowing Aaron &amp; Co. to enjoy their moment before we even begin to think about Favre's situation. This is far, far too premature. Would much rather than you expend your time and energy into getting Jerry Kramer a bust at Canton. Now there is a real role model to talk about. Let this issue alone for another decade or two....

foundinidaho's picture

I have to agree with this. I think our focus would be better spent on getting Jerry and Dave Robinson into the Hall of Fame. Where they belong.

hobot's picture

Not only should we not retire his number anytime soon, but the petty, vindictive side of me wishes they would give his number to some "camp arm" as a giant proverbial middle finger.

Bob's picture

How about green urinal and toilets in the stadium with a yellow number 4 properly placed. So fans can do to number 4 what he has done to them.

ppabich's picture

No one gets hits on like #4.

Jim Hurly's picture

Give me about 40 years, when I'm near death in my 80s, then I think I can let it go with this guy.

Nerdmann's picture

I also think Favre was throwing all those playoff interceptions on purpose. I think he was blackmailed to fix games.
We know he sat down for Micheal Strahan, and don't think people weren't gambling on that record.
Go back and look at some of those interceptions. Especially in the NFC Championship games.
How can you go all year playing the best football of your life, then throw THAT interception? With the Superbowl on the line. Those weren't coincidences.

Bob's picture

He was cold and he wanted to go home.

Jack's picture

And what about the interception he threw to blow the Vikings' shot at the Super Bowl? I am certain Favre wanted nothing more than to take that team to the SB and win in order to rub the Packers' faces in his feces. Sorry, I know that's crude, but I think that's how vindictive he is.

Bob's picture

That interception was why McCarthy and Thompson wanted him gone. He just never learned to be a smart Quarterback. Longwell would have made that field goal in a dome from that distance. Instead Favre throws a pass across his body and to the other side of the field. When he should have thrown it away or head for the sideline and a few extra yards.
Someday Favre will be inducted in the Hall of Fame. Under his bust should be written, "The Greatest Dumb Quarterback to ever play the Game". He just wasn't a team player, it really was all about the stats.

Point Packer's picture

No. He can retire a Viking.

Jack's picture


SteveHj's picture

CD, it would appear to me while reading the responses to your article, we are far far away from being able to reconcile with Farve. As the saying goes, time heals all wounds, but the wounds are still pretty raw and need much more time to heal. Personally unless the press brings him up, I doubt few fans are spending much time thinking about Farve. The team and how it is doing will always be of much more interest than any one player, and a retired one at that.

When people can laugh about what went on, then it will be time to talk about recognizing Brett's contribution to the Pack.

Beyond that, if Brett would somehow find a way to sincerely take the first step to acknowledge he f'up, that certainly would go a long ways.

Lynn Dickey 12's picture

I said this on May 13, and it's still true...(

Remember, gang….if Lambeau and Lombardi could both move on to the Redskins and have giant bronze statues made of them, BF can have his number retired.

All can be forgiven in due time...let'
s pick the first season after there's no SB win and get it done then...that way it won't step on any celebrations.

I say this as someone who had been in Rodgers corner since the NFCC in 2007.

Tommy's picture

I have no problem with burying the hatchet with Favre, as long as he does so first. Right now I don't know whether he's resting to get healthy for next season or what. If he wants to be re-accepted by the Packers, why not come to some games and start cheering on the team?

Jack's picture

I don't want to see Favre at Lambeau Field again under any circumstances, unless and until he makes a public apology for his despicable treatment of Ted Thompson, Aaron Rodgers, and the Packer fans who supported him through thick and thin, only to have him spit in their face. Favre is a washed-up hick with a deeply flawed character and inferior intellect. Let him fester in his own toxic, narcissistic emotional stew for eternity.

Starry Barts's picture

yeah... nope.

Pack12's picture

Aaron Rodgers has made Favre irrelevant and the greatest punishment for Favre is seeing just how successful the current Packers are without him. Rodgers and the Packers are on their way to their second consecutive Super Bowl and perhaps an undefeated season. Rodgers will break Favre's single season Packer TD pass record this Sunday against KC. Before Rodgers hangs it up he has a chance to win multiple championships which only Bart Starr accomplished. Let Brett sit and stew in his own juices. Success is the best revenge.

packeraaron's picture

<em>Aaron Rodgers has made Favre irrelevant</em>

Spoken like someone who wasn't around for the 70's and 80's.

Favre will never be irrelevant. Ever.

Lynn Dickey 12's picture

I was around. I remember. (Shudder)

Pack12's picture

I've been around since before you. I've been a Packer fan since the Lombardi days. I remember the 70's and 80's very well and those were horrible times. What I am saying is that Rodgers is making people forget Favre. That is not to take anything away from Favre but Rodgers has already matched Favre's Super Bowl total and will win many more. I don't think that there are many Packer fans missing Favre too much right now.

packeraaron's picture

Packer fans don't have to miss him. They don't even have to respect or like him. But he'll never be irrelevant.

Otto's picture

He's drunk. Somebody take his keyboard away.

Vince M's picture

As someone who came into football existence (so to speak) during the very beginning of the Favre era, he will be forever linked in my mind with the Packers. This idea of shunning him forever makes no sense to me. Do I think he has ego problems and the emotional maturity of a 3 year old? Sure I do. Do I care? Not a bit. I don't care about Favre as a person. Who he is or what he does in his free time doesn't matter to me in the least.

His value to the Green Bay Packers is what he did on the field. Nobody, excepting the biggest anti-Favre homers, could deny his sustained greatness there. He will always be relevant and he will always draw strong emotions because of how absolutely great he was at playing the game of football. To exclude him from Packer legacy over some perceived (yes, perceived) slight would be an absolute tragedy.

I say perceived because we, as fans, have no idea what happened behind the scenes. We don't know how we would react, and frankly, it doesn't matter. This idea that any player owes us fans anything but 100% effort on the field is ridiculous. Favre gave at least 100% effort to the Packers for 16 amazing seasons. Not all were hall of fame caliber, but many were. For those accomplishments he needs to be taken back into the fold. Not this year, and probably not for a few years after this, but it needs to happen. Trying to "stick" it to him by making him wait until Aaron Rodgers gets his due is just as immature and ridiculous as many of you are accusing Brett Favre of being. No one is asking you to like him as a person, just respect what he gave this team as a player.

P.S. Those of you attacking CD Angeli for this very well written opinion piece need to take a long hard look in the mirror and question where they get off being absolute dicks. You don't like the piece, don't read it. You aren't paying for access to this site, it's completely free. Far as I know, CD Angeli gets absolutely no funds for what he does. Don't like the quality of writing? Start your own blog and show us all how it's done.

Chazman's picture

"This idea that any player owes us fans anything but 100% effort on the field is ridiculous."

True, but the idea that we fans owe players anything but the price of a ticket is equally absurd.

Bob's picture

Wow, this post put a stick into a hornets nest.

Zeke's picture

Induct him into the ring of honor before the first game next season, on condition that A-Rodg agrees to bring Jenn Sterger as his date.

Colin's picture

This is fantastic.

toolkien's picture

Until Favre shows any regret for his behaviors, I don't feel the need that it is up to us to make the first move. And the continued use of Favre's "greatness" as a requirement and necessity in welcoming him back is invalid. Favre's greatness most revolves around himself - his records, his streak, his legend. Favre's actual contribution to the TEAM success is harder to find.

So many people still rely on the post '96 narrative and believe that Favre somehow turned around the franchise singlehandedly, so any immaturity he showed the last few years with the team, and the three years after, should automatically be forgiven. Forgotten is Favre's 78 QB rating after 2.5 years as a starter, for which serious consideration was given to turning the starting job over to Mark Brunell (Peter King wrote an article on such back during the media blitz of Super Bowl XXXI, and Favre discusses the same in his own auto-biography). While Favre finished the '94 season reasonably well, the front end of the '95 season wasn't all that brilliant either. It was basically 11/12/95 that Favre finally switched over from being mediocre to poor to being elite in one big jump. That was 57 games worth of time before Favre began to play at a level one would call great. But after '97, suddenly all the "rocket ball" and uneven/inconsistent play was stricken from the narrative.

Forgotten is that the '96 team was a great team, of which Favre was a part. Do people remember what happened after Brooks went out for the year, Freeman broke his arm, and Chmura was out with a groin injury? The Packers were playing at about a 4-12 pace over that span, and it took the defense kicking behind the second half of the Ram game to salvage it for the Pack to go 2-2 over the stretch the starting receivers were out. It was only when Freeman and Chmura returned, Freeman with a plate in his arm and big ol' cast on, and Chmura at about 85%, that the Packers didn't lose another game the rest of the season. It would appear that Favre hardly made even the championship season all by himself.

Favre coming to the team hardly brought about an instantaneous change, and even in the greatest year did he do it all by himself. But the narrative that we're supposed to use to necessarily forgive and forget is written differently. If we use the correct narrative of slow progression, being PART of a championship team, all the other talent on hand from the front office to the coaches on the sideline and all the other player talent, and include the Tony Romo-esque decade from '98-'07, it is a much different narrative, one in which automatic forgiveness doesn't reside.

The PACKERS were the best team in football overall from '92-'07, in the REGULAR SEASON. The best W/L and the best point differential, and it took more than Favre to make it so. Yet they managed to only secure three byes and some homefield, and the last one only after Thompson did things his way instead of Favre's, which is what led up to The Divorce in the first place. A bevy of '93-esque performances (Favre had a bad 72 QB rating in '93) outside The Great Years of '95-'97, in the playoffs, drove DOWN team success, while Favre rolled up great personal stats from the regular season. And yet the narrative hands Favre all the credit, and seeks to blame the rest of the team for ultimate failure, when all the time it was Favre using a typically fine team to run up HOF personal stats, and kill success at the ultimate level. Essentially the popular narrative is exactly BACKWARDS. And Favre used the cache of the incorrect narrative to use to his advantage to hand ultimatums to the team if he was going to continue, and to put pressure on the team when the 2008 game of chicken unfolded. And now the incorrect narrative is supposed to be used to eventually forgive and forget while Favre doesn't have to lift a finger.

Simply, Favre didn't contribute to the TEAM's success to an extent that allowed him to be put above the team and to insist on being the de facto GM (the complaints on Greta about his linemen, or who his coach was supposed to be, or which free agents to sign, and ultimately AFTER RETIREMENT how the draft was supposed to be constructed). Favre employed the incorrect narrative to gain support for his behaviors, which ultimately was to seek his release so he could go to the Vikings and stick it to his old team. And to just give one final epilogue to a Favre led team, he supplies the Cliff's Notes version of his Packer career up in Minnesota - gain the support of the fanbase, get into fights with the coaches over "simplifying", and ultimately kill the TEAM's chances with ill timed 1993-esque Favreball. And then STILL the narrative is whatever good happened was due to Favre and everything that went wrong was somebody else's fault.

Well, it is FAVRE who is ranked 118th out 166 QB's ALLTIME (with over 1,500 attempts) when it comes to INT %, adjusted for era. And he UPPED that rate in the post season when it was all on the line. Favre had a lot of upside, but he also had a lot of downside, THROUGHOUT his career, that caused harm to his teams. And the NET worth simply did not allow him to be such a jackass, and certainly doesn't mandate forgiveness. His greatness weaved about himself and not his teams. The NFL HOF will recognize him for his lifetime personal achievements. We aren't bound to honor him as a PACKER just because of personal numbers. Again, his NET contribution to the TEAM doesn't warrant knee-jerk forgiveness. Favre has a lot of bridges to mend. Favre burned his legacy, no one took it from him. The next move is his, not ours.

Jack's picture


John's picture

GUYS, the Favre years were great and you know it. The transition from Favre, not so great. Remember the good and the fact that Favre helped to bring the Pack from 29 years of groans. Yes, he belongs on the ring of honor sooner than later

John's picture

Tool, a long narrative that shows how petty you are. Cast that aside and honor the greatness

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