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How Hot Is Dom Capers' Seat?

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How Hot Is Dom Capers' Seat?

Green Bay Packers defensive coordinator Dom Capers is entering his ninth season with the team in that capacity.  To some, that is good news and to others, it's cause for anguish and nightmares of another disappointing season-ending playoff performance.  

Capers is certainly one of the more polarizing figures among Packers fans.  Some wonder if the game is passing him by and causing his defensive philosophy to inch closer to going the way of the dinosaur.  Others opine that he's still one of the best at his craft in the league.  They point to the simple fact that the team's defensive struggles can be easily attributed to a perennial stable that includes some of the youngest and inexperienced players in the NFL.

After the 2015 season in which the defense turned in one of its better seasons under Capers, I immediately said that it was likely time to move on from him.  The idea made no sense after his unit often saved the team in games where the offense failed to score enough to win.  Even less sense when looking at how well the defense played most of the day (all but a few gut-wrenching minutes) against the Seattle Seahawks in the 2014 NFC championship game.  But my argument was simple: this team needed a new voice and fresh ideas for these young minds.  

The scheme that the Packers run isn't the easiest, in terms of assignments and asks of the players.  Young players are already trying to adjust to the speed of the game and the daily grind of NFL life.  To throw in a defensive play book that reads to some like a Calculus text book is a lofty expectation.  I was tired of seeing the defense fold at the worst possible moment.  

In 2015, the defense featured a still-young Ha Ha Clinton-Dix at safety, rookies Damarious Randall and Quinten Rollins at cornerback and rookie Jake Ryan at linebacker.  That they achieved the success they did seemed to poke a hole in the idea that youth was holding the team back.  Then came the divisional playoff game in which Randall failed on his assignment of receiver Larry Fitzgerald.  Two players later, the Packers season was over.  But alas, Capers was back in 2016. 

Even when Capers' defenses do well during the regular season and help get the team to the postseason, their inefficiencies seem to be quickly exposed when facing the best offenses and quarterbacks in the league.  

So is the heat mounting on Capers to break through and produce a top-tier defense?  Is it possible that his job could finally be on the line after what seems like an extremely long leash that has been given by head coach Mike McCarthy?

Entering 2009, Capers generated a lot of excitement between his resume and converting the Packers defense to a 3-4 base concept.  Green Bay traded back into the first round of that year's draft to grab linebacker Clay Matthews, a move that paid huge dividends over Matthews' first five or six seasons with the team.  Matthews proved to be a key piece to the 2010 team that won a Super Bowl.  

But a quick look at how the Packers defense has ranked in a few key areas shows how the Capers-led defenses have failed to show real progress during his tenure.  Most NFL defenses are primarily ranked in terms of yards surrendered.  I've never understood why this was a primary metric, especially in today's pass-happy league.  Teams are airing it out more and the rules make it much tougher for defenses to adequately defend the pass.  We're seeing more teams get out to big leads and opposing teams needing to throw their ways back into games.  

So I look at two areas from 2011 to 2016: points allowed and third down efficiency (according to NFL.com).  There are many other areas that help tell the story of a defense, but let's be honest, keeping opposing teams out of the end zone is what helps win games.  So does getting off the field and avoiding long drives.  Those long drives lead to a tired defense that ends up giving up more points.  Some may be asking about causing turnovers, but while the Packers have been near the top every season under Capers (save for 2013), that hasn't proven to help them improve and advance overall.  

Let's start with scoring defense:

Year    Points    Rank

2011    359        14th most

2012    336        22nd most

2013    428        8th most

2014    348        21st most

2015    323        21st most

2016    388        11th most

In looking at those results, there is no clear pattern.  This is especially true when considering that if some of these totals are moved from one year to the next, the ranking would be quite different.

The Packers defenses appeared to be establishing consistency between 2014 and 2015 but last season's rough patch dropped Green Bay to 11th worst in points allowed.  While the team was still able to regroup and reach the NFC championship game, the points-allowed factor struck the Packers in a bad way.  They found themselves down to the Atlanta Falcons 31-0 in the third quarter.  Regardless of how or why that came to be, the defense failed to keep Atlanta out of the end zone.

Some are quick to point to the fact that the team unexpectedly lost cornerback Sam Shields all season and saw zero progress from Randall and Rollins.  Much of that was due to injuries that struck both and thrust undrafted LaDarius Gunter into a starting role on the outside.  That alone is enough to hamstring a defense.  

But did Capers do enough to help the young corners succeed?  I'm not a film junkie but the season's end result tells me that it's at least a valid question.  

Part of the answer to that question can be found in the next round of numbers: third down efficiency.  The argument about scheme vs. execution comes alive here and there are valid points on both sides.  A defense needs impact players to make good on the stunts and calls made to confuse and thwart an offense.  And those calls need to be a step ahead of the opposing offense.

A look at how the Packers fared on third down defense:

Year       Percentage    Rank

2011       43%                 tied for 4th worst (among 7 teams)

2012       38%                 tied for 6th worst (among 18 total teams)

2013       38%                 tied for 8th worst (among 18 teams)

2014       40%                 tied for 8th worst (among 17 teams)

2015       36%                 tied for 10th worst (among 25 teams)

2016       41%                 tied for 6th worst (among 10 teams)

A quick glance at that sample tells me that the Packers were bad in 2011, leveled off and were consistently middling for the next three seasons, took a nice step forward in 2015 and took a giant step back in 2016.  Once again, perhaps the lack of ability at cornerback was largely to blame.  Regardless, teams who achieve greatness are able to do the most important things, one of which is getting off the field with little damage done.

Capers comes into 2017 with more questions than answers.  It's possible that the Packers will be able to address some areas of need on defense in this week's draft, but based on history, it's not likely that a player taken this year is going to be a huge difference maker.  That means the Packers 2017 defensive performance is going to once again come down to Capers and his staff's ability to coach and scheme their way to better results.  

The Packers defense returns some key pieces who can be counted on to produce well: linebackers Clay Matthews and Nick Perry, defensive lineman Mike Daniels, safeties Morgan Burnett and Ha Ha Clinton-Dix.  Defensive lineman Kenny Clark and Dean Lowry as well as Inside linebackers Ryan and Blake Martinez should improve and offer more.  Throw in a healthy (hopefully) Randall & Rollins along with a stable of rookies and Capers isn't lacking in talent to work with.

So is 2017 the year where it's finally "put up or shut up" time for Capers?

-------------------

Jason is a freelance writer on staff since 2012 and also co-hosts Pulse of the Pack podcast.  You can follow him on Twitter here

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Fan friendly comments only: off Comments (54) This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.

The TKstinator's picture

If you ask the fans, many would say "pretty hot", but my feeling is management does not share that opinion.

jeremyjjbrown's picture

It seams like he'd have to commit some crime to be fired. Anyway, as much as I'd like to see a change in approach on defense, his squads perform at right about the level of talent he's provided.

dobber's picture

I think it's pretty clear that we've hit the stage where the person who will decide when Dom Capers leaves GB is Dom Capers.

Nick Perry's picture

Everyone of those players mentioned was signed to the Packers in 2010 or before. I think 6 years is more than enough to add some quality players to the defense.

"Then the Packers have to pick up the pieces and try to adapt to a scheme that doesn't include them. Happened again last year w/ Shields and Raji."

I'll give you Shields, Raji has been gone since 2011, it just took a few more years to actually leave the building.

Nick Perry's picture

My point is you live 6, 7 or 8 seasons ago! We're in the 2017/18 season yet you continue to use FA who were signed 10 years ago as examples or what a defense did 6 or 7 years ago. Who gives F*** what they did then in 2010 when we're getting ready for 2017?

.... If you actually think Raji was going to be a difference maker last year then arguing any further with you is pointless. Hey maybe Butler or Sean Jones can come back and help the Packers too. LMAO...

The NFL is a "What have you done for me lately" league. Clearly this point is lost on you.

Bearmeat's picture

TK is right. Capers seat isn't hot. It should be, but it's not.

Between TT's team building philosophy, his complete inability to find difference making players on defense, and Capers exotic defenses, I've pretty much resigned myself to hoping the offense can outscore other teams.

That will get you to the playoffs, but defenses that don't stand up at the opportune time also get you a 1 way ticket home in the playoffs against good QBs rather quickly.

Nick Perry's picture

"That will get you to the playoffs, but defenses that don't stand up at the opportune time also get you a 1 way ticket home in the playoffs against good QBs rather quickly."

I posted a Stat a few weeks ago about the average yards and points surrendered by the Packers defense the last 5 playoff losses. It was something like 34 points and 440 yards per game. You won't win many games in the NFL if that's the "Average" of what your offense has to overcome each game. Not against a team with a good defense AND a good QB. Either or, either a good QB or a good defense but both is a bit much, at least the last 6 years it has.

Razer's picture

...Between TT's team building philosophy, his complete inability to find difference making players on defense, and Capers exotic defenses, I've pretty much resigned myself to hoping the offense can outscore other teams...

Exactly my sentiment.

This defense should be better but it isn't. Nobody wants to say it aloud and no one wants to ask Capers or TT the tough questions. For me, Datone Jones epitomizes the problem. Poor pick, doesn't fit, ineffective - next.

Ultimately, Capers system needs to go. Just look at NE, at defense without any stars that gets the job done year in, year out.

WKUPackFan's picture

Hi Bear, I apologize for my "hot takey" response to your comment yesterday. I allowed my distaste for the subject columnist to overcome my manners. Sorry about that.

Bearmeat's picture

WKU,

Appreciated. But not necessary. You don't have a history of being a jerk to people. I chalked it up to a bad day. :)

The bottom line is that we all love our GBP here and we're all frustrated about the fact that we should have a Patriots style dynasty going in the past 20 years, but we don't. Mostly because of defense.

Nick Perry's picture

When Capers is discussed I hear a number of excuses..opps...reasons why the Packers defense isn't at or near the top of the NFL rankings. In 2009 & 2010 the Packers defense ranked at or near the top of every defensive ranking, EXACTLY like Capers led defenses have in every other city he's coached in.

The reasons I hear most are..1) Injuries....2) The scheme is too difficult for a young player to grasp....3) He isn't given the talent he needs to be successful...4) His defensive philosophy is obsolete and doesn't work anymore, he's a dinosaur.

Reason #1 is valid, especially last year. Reason #2 is on Capers and if it's really true then after 8 seasons you'd think they could come up with a solid dumbed down approach. At least one where they are say ranked in the top 12 instead of the bottom 10. Reason #3 is just Horsesh** IMO. The 2017 draft should mark the 6th consecutive year the Packers use a 1st round pick on defense. To further make a point the Packers have used 23 picks on defense since 2012, 23 PICKS!!!! I'm sorry but if Capers can't make it work with that many picks, then maybe he is a dinosaur. It's either that or maybe (GASP) TT can't draft a Championship Defense.

I don't really know what it is. I suppose it's a combination of all the reasons. But PLEASE don't tell us it's because we draft near the end of every round. Other teams seem to find talent in rounds 2 through 7 all the time so there IS talent. Ted just isn't finding it often enough. OR the players aren't bright enough to understand it. No matter what the reason the seat should be HOT.

Excuses please...

Tarynfor12's picture

"Reason #2 is on Capers and if it's really true then after 8 seasons you'd think they could come up with a solid dumbed down approach."

With the very changing of offense and the rules enhanced to secure such, more for the video enthusiasts, this be comes more difficult when many still feel a player, more so defensive, needs 3 years to learn a scheme.
I'm not sure the issue is all scheme but more if an assistant coach issue of not knowing the scheme they need to teach on the more one on one than does Capers. However, teaching the assistant coach the scheme is on Capers and perhaps it isn't the player but the instructior not knowing the instructions......I think? : )

jeremyjjbrown's picture

Give the choice of the Packers defensive roster or a 31 sided die to roll for a different group I'd roll the dice. Yeah there's a lot of high picks, but it barely shows on the field.

fthisJack's picture

not a fan.i would like to see, since 2011, how many times the defense has given up the the go ahead TD or FG on the last drive of the game.
i never did like his play not to lose strategy at the end of games.....especially the Seattle game in 2014. his 3 man rush and bend but don't break strategy has never worked. but, after all the crappy endings, he's still there and will be until hell freezes over.

carusotrap's picture

Yes, Dom is a problem, but Dom is not THE problem. Ted is THE problem. Now, we'll see if Ted's unusual display of FA participation gets us anything this year. (Still don't have a real CB...)

(My take is that the "real Ted" will return with a vengeance in the draft, and under the guise of "best player available," he goes WR, TE, QB in rounds 1-3.)

stockholder's picture

Fire HIM! New leadership is needed.

Since '61's picture

This article has basically repeated my post from last evening except with more details and stats about how poor the Packers defense has been on 3rd downs and their inconsistent play overall. If we look at the defense since the 2010 SB win we find that Capers has had all types of players since then. 2011 we still had Woodson, CM3, Raji, Shields, Williams, and Collins until he was injured. Since then experienced and inexperienced players have come and gone but the results have been the same. Inconsistent defense during the regular season and bad defense during the playoffs. However Capers has been here for the entire time and his schemes have not succeeded regardless of who has been on the field. Since Capers has been the only consistent variable during the last 6 seasons it's pretty obvious, at least to me, that we're overdue for a change at DC. At this point Capers seat should be an ejector seat and he should be gone. His seat should be boiling but I'm sure it's not and may never be unless we fail to make the playoffs. Thanks, Since '61

Razer's picture

...At this point Capers seat should be an ejector seat...

Good stuff.

croatpackfan's picture

Well, when you are looking at the stats only, especially at average stats, that tells one story.
For example, 2011 defense was even worser than last season by many D categories, but Packers went 15-1 in regular season...
2013 season was another injury rattled season, especially on D side. In January at Lambeau, DomCapers did not have enough D healthy players to play D. Remember how Andy Mulumba was jumping around on one - ONE - leg trying to play OLB at the end of the game... I'm "sure" that shows clearly how obsolete Dom Capers is and were. Another DC will do miracle and suddenly all D players would be healthy and ready to play... But, next, 2014 season Packers was ruined by ST, not by D which kept Seahawks scoreless in NFCCG up to 2:10 to play in 4th Q (till than only ST gave 7 points!). It must be, because of Dom Capers...
Again, I do not have nothing against change, whom ever you think have to be changed. But who you'll suggest as replacement? Who is better and available now? And what if that one is not better. How many wasted years will be than...

Savage57's picture

The Dom Capers story should begin with, "Once upon a time"...

There was a time, when Capers constructed a notorious defense which capitalized on the unique skills and strengths of the players available. Players such as Woodson, Greene, Kirkland, Lloyd, Lake, et al coalesced to create a defense which was dominant, and is often the case in the NFL, led to Capers' ascendance to head coach. After several unsuccessful runs as HC, he was called to GB to replace Bob Sanders.

In 2010, he repeated that feat as a DC, as players such as Woodson, Matthews, Collins, Jenkins, Hawk, Williams et al coalesced to create a defense which was dominant and resulted in a Super Bowl win.

Case in point is this: Capers success has always relied on the assemblage of talent and nothing else. He is not, as a coach, a difference maker, and his record shows him to be quite average.

But in fairness, maybe his story should start, "Twice upon a time."

Ryan Graham's picture

You hit it on the head. Which is where I think a lot of people miss.

I am not a Dom Capers advocate. Just as I've said I'm not a Ted Thompson advocate. They both are football knowledgeable in completely different ways. Dom Capers can make good players even better with scheme. Ted can find one or two decent young players that will most likely under achieve, and then find five or six project players that will be talked about as quality picks.

One thing that should be clear, is that those two knuckleheads are too old and cenile to be working together butting heads like rams working against one another...

Im gonna take this one step further -- Let's be serious folks. Capers isn't going anywhere until he's ready to go. Same with Ted, unless he is ready which he may just be. But humor me, say hes not. To what point does Mark Murphy's name get put in on the blame-game? 'But he's just the President, not the owner. The people own the team.' So essentially its just the natural construct that prevents from big decisions to be made, Every major decision has to go through a delegation of a committee represented by the fans aka the big wigs that fuel the Packers economic structure.

I'm probably gonna get hit with recoil for this, which is fine. All I'm saying is teams that have owners have much more freedom to make decisions off a whim. Some are good at it, some are bad. Mark Murphy on the other hand is just a face.

Rant over. Sorry for those that have wasted their time reading

Finwiz's picture

I'd love for it to be VERY hot, but in all reality, I'd say it's not hot at all.
If this relic hasn't been fired already, he should be able to coast into retirement as long as fat McCarthy is around.

Bert's picture

I don't think Dom is a bad coach at all. But I do think his complex scheme and Ted's draft-and-develop philosophy just don't mesh. If Dom had more vets on defense he would probably be fine. If the Packers had a coordinator who employed a much more simple scheme they would be fine. Just not a good fit for either party.

dobber's picture

I would be curious to hear about the relationship between MM and DC. Early on, I suspect that Capers was a good resource for MM as a former HC that had to build rosters on two expansion teams. Now, I have this feeling that he's being kept on due as much to loyalty as anything else.

lou's picture

The real key is the corner back positions on paper because if healthy the D-Line and LB positions along with the 2 safeties are competent and competitive and edge rush talent via the draft is available. Everyone is banking on Randall and Rollins being legit CB's if healthy but according to Tom Silverstein of the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel in his view covering the team full time there are more than health concerns with the pair;

"Randall has been inconsistent, wasn’t healthy last year, hasn’t grown intellectually on the football field the way Clinton-Dix or Adams did and wouldn’t be considered near the best-conditioned player on the roster. As a first-round pick, he should be hitting all those targets in his third season.

And it will start with how well he prepares during the offseason.

Rollins is in the same boat. He’s a second-round pick. Though he was picked there based on one season of football at Miami (Ohio), he’s had two years to learn the NFL game. His lack of speed (4.57 seconds in the 40) always will be an issue just as it was with Hyde (4.56)."

Except for a slightly higher vertical jump (36½ to 33 inches), Rollins tested about the same as Hyde coming out of college and it’s safe to say Hyde was a far more instinctive player when he was at this point in Rollins’ career. In other words, Rollins may not offer anything more than what Hyde did when it’s all said and done.

Andrew Lloyd Peth's picture

I don't know how much blame Capers deserves, but I do know my biggest problem with him: Failure in adapting to his roster.

Put simply, Ted has drafted many 4-3 players, but Dom stubbornly demands 3-4 and 2-5 packages. Datone Jones, among others, wasn't just a square peg--he was virtually worthless in his usage.

I don't see this changing with Capers, so hopefully Ted will draft better to the system.

Point Packer's picture

Oh really? If you asked the extreme homers on this site, they would tell you that despite his lack of any meaningful stat, Kung Fu Jones was super "disruptive". Kung Fu was a bust from day one, never fit the bill in the 3-4 and will likely be out of the league in two years.

Andrew Lloyd Peth's picture

Out of the league in 2 years? Come on. He's moving to a pure 4-3 in Minny that's perfect for his skillset, so I expect a solid year from him.

lou's picture

I suggest you revisit Mike Neal's history, he was Datone before Datone. Where is he now ?????

StvHld's picture

Dom is not completely to blame. Ted NEVER gets him the players he need to run his defense. He continues to draft players who "he thinks" can play OLB or DE in the 3-4. Instead of drafting players who actually played in a 3-4 defense. That being said Dom's job is to design that works with the players he has. Which IMO he has not done very well. Dom's seat should have been hot for the last few years. But MM just loves the guy. So as someone else stated Dom will leave when Dom wants to leave.

dobber's picture

The 3-4 is really only just, in the last few years, taking off on the college level. It's a defense predicated on limiting big plays (ironic, no?), so it's attractive. But this is the price teams have had to pay when they adopt it. If you look at last year's draft, the only defensive draftee who didn't play in a 3-4 in college was Lowry, and he's a classic 5-tech. Times are changin'...

Kevin Lamb's picture

Dom is not to blame here. Back when our defense was good in 2010 and 2011 the Packers had Pro bowl players on defense and at least one future hall of famer. Now we have no one at that level. Now it is Dom's job to help get these guys to that level but I feel our drafting on D has not been the best. I always ask the question if not Dom then who?? I just feel sometimes fans puts it on the coaches and not the players. The one thing for sure about Dom, he is one of the hardest working guys on the staff. I hope we have a good year and both our offense and defense has great success. GOPACKGO

vj_ostrowski's picture

Dom's seat doesn't seem hot at all, though it should be.

You can probably tell that I'm a relatively big defender of MM & TT, but I think their decision to keep letting Dom choose his own destiny is the thing I'm most mad about. You can argue that TT has missed on defensive picks (he has). You can also argue that we've had bad injury luck (we have). But Dom's defense since after the 2009-2010 glory years has continually baffled me with its evolution. I hate the style of Nickel/Dime defense we play, I hate seeing undersized players trying to rush from interior DL positions

Frankly, I also wonder why Dom keeps wanting to come back at his age and with all he's accomplished, as well.

Tundraboy's picture

As always there are lot of valid theories, points and ideas on this endless discussion. I would just throw out that perhaps with the large amount of young players over the years, players have not fully grasped the system because we don't have a head coach on the sidelines guiding players up front and personal. Maybe I'm too old school but just maybe that would help. Sky box coaching just seems bizarre to me and always will.

lou's picture

Love the term "Sky Box Coaching", I too wonder what effect that has.

the REAL Packman's picture

I believe its the personnel and scheme. obviously there is a disconnect in the WAR Room pre- drafting. I agree on some of TT defensive picks were complete busts... Harrell, Datone Jones. But overall TT has been very effective selecting players. MY biggest problem with Capers is the adjustments. That was evident on the 2016 NFC Championship game. Remember the start of 2016 the Defense was on fire leading the league in the first 6 games stopping the run and scoring. Then the wheels fell off. I'm not worried about the Defense or Schemes but the adjustments. The Defense can only improve from last years fiasco.

croatpackfan's picture

Well, when you are mentioning last season NFCCG I can tell you that I saw a lot of adjustments - to 5th and 6th row players. Those players had to come into D because there was no health bodies left on the team D after 1 Q.
So, I do not know what kind of adjustment you are talking about and with whom.

Lphill's picture

I was on the band wagon to fire him but I realized he can only produce results with the players available to him, now if he had a bunch of pro bowlers to work with and could not get the job done then yes it's on him , but he is not stocked with pro bowlers so let's see what they give him to work with this year .

mjbrogno's picture

A change should have been made a couple of years ago, I don't expect much difference from this season from last year. If we struggle this season hopefully, there will be a change, no questions asked.

Razer's picture

unfortunate that you got 2 down votes for the most concise assessment of the situation.

JohnnyLogan's picture

I've been praying for his dismissal for years. You don't need stats, you just need to know the feeling when an important stop on 3rd and long is necessary, we all know the other team will convert. We know someone, an average QB (Kaperdick) or an average WR (could name a dozen) will set some sort of career or NFL record. I also blame TT, but Capers just has to field an average D with our offense since Rodgers and he hasn't done it. We'll all have our hopes up this year because we will win the North. But then against a good team with a good QB's Dom's dumb ass schemes will doom us and we'll have this same discussion next year. I'd dump both he and TT, but no one will let me. So we're stuck in the hope that Rodgers will be so spectacular as to overcome the D. Of course that could curse us with Dom for another five years.

al bundy's picture

I've always given some the benefit of don't considering who he has to play with. The worst pass defenders in football, blow avg jobs, pass rushers, what pass rushers.
I'm more shocked he didn't quit and tell Ted to gfu.

The TKstinator's picture

Dom has the absolute worst hair in the NFL. It's atrocious.

PatrickGB's picture

Its "Players not Plays". Our defense is slow and slower. Dom has tried to work around the lack of speed and talent. Perhaps another DC can do better but my guess is that MM doesn't think so and its only his opinion that matters in the case of his handpicked DC.

JJtheTraveler's picture

The best metric for a defense and a full team effort I've seen is from Football Outsiders. It's the difference between your QB's efficiency and the opposing QB's efficiency. The Pack sucks using that metric.

davids's picture

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PackerfanAuggie15's picture

One of the reasons why there are so many injuries on defense is because they're on the damn field so long! Imo Dom Capers = good, Red Thompson = good but D.C + T.T = Bad. Capers needs a high percentage of vets to run his schemes. Too many young guys on the field increases the risk that assignments will not be understood and hence blown.

gauravchauhan's picture

perfect

Donster's picture

Capers is like the mother-in-law that comes for a visit and never leaves. Only she will choose when to leave.

Capers will retire when TT retires. He won't be fired. If the Packers felt his work wasn't any good, they would have fired him a few years ago. But apparently they think he is doing a great job.

BPEARSON21's picture

I think the point here is much simpler than "how hot Capers seat is." There are 2 core arguments to Dom Capers: It's either his systems fault for being too complicated and asking too much of players, or he doesn't have enough talent to work with. Those are the arguments right? Either way what do those arguments share? They share the necessity for change. If Capers system isn't working then he needs to go. If he doesn't have the "talent" then we need to get rid of our stingy GM who is providing him his sub-par players. It's so frustrating how we can sit here and argue over whose fault it is instead of, oh I don't know...admit that the bottom line is there is a MAJOR defensive issue that is causing us to lose championships and someone needs to go. It's either Capers or Thompson's fault. So one of them needs to go. Why aren't we calling for changes? How frustrating is it being a fan of an organization that has stats to back up how bad we've been on defense.... but makes ZERO changes. Patriots wouldn't stand for a glaring weakness this long.

BPEARSON21's picture

I think the point here is much simpler than "how hot Capers seat is." There are 2 core arguments to Dom Capers: It's either his systems fault for being too complicated and asking too much of players, or he doesn't have enough talent to work with. Those are the arguments right? Either way what do those arguments share? They share the necessity for change. If Capers system isn't working then he needs to go. If he doesn't have the "talent" then we need to get rid of our stingy GM who is providing him his sub-par players. It's so frustrating how we can sit here and argue over whose fault it is instead of, oh I don't know...admit that the bottom line is there is a MAJOR defensive issue that is causing us to lose championships and someone needs to go. It's either Capers or Thompson's fault. So one of them needs to go. Why aren't we calling for changes? How frustrating is it being a fan of an organization that has stats to back up how bad we've been on defense.... but makes ZERO changes. Patriots wouldn't stand for a glaring weakness this long.

LAS VEGAS-TOM's picture

I'll start by saying, I am not a fan of Dom Capers. He & his defense should have been gone long ago. I also was never a fan of Shields, Williams, & Lord knows AJ HAWK.

Bishop was a Big Loss, so was Nick Barnett, Raji, yes & no. It all started with Cullen Jenkins, if you want to know it. These were the 3 or 4 losses that hurt GB, Not Shields, & certainly Not Williams. If you want to talk about a Great CB that GB lost, all you need to do is mention the name McKenzie. Shields or Williams, couldn't tie his shoes.

Jenkins, Bishop, Barnette, & Raji were replaced with inferior players. GB never recovered from their loss.

I don't pretend to be an expert on defenses, but I'd like to think I know a Good Player from a Bad one, or a Good Coach from a Bad Coach. I think MM is a Great Coach. That's where it ends for me.

One thing I do know, this guy has had 9 years. Without Charles Wilson all 9 would have been Bad.

From what I can remember, Ed Donetell took a bullet for 1 play. He apparently didn't belong to the "Good Old Boy's Club".
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LAS VEGAS-TOM's picture

Never said Donetell was better?? I said he was fired because of the 4th & 26, one play, & and actually it was Sherman who changed the coverage, not Donetell. The point being, Capers has done virtually nothing in 9 years, & is still around.

Tramon was never a Playmaker, neither was Shields. You felt the same way about AJ Hawk for 3 or 4 years as well. How did that turn out?

I mentioned McKenzie only because that's what a Good CB looks like. Shields & Williams were Corner Backs. Woodson & McKenzie were Great CB's

BisHop & Barnette were both Much Better linebackers than Hawk, & they should have both been retained.

Raji was an Excellent NT but was being played out of position. He may or may not have started to decline.

Cullen Jenkins has Never been Replaced.

That's why the GB Defense is what it is, & why it starts with either TT, Capers, or both.
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cruzjohn's picture

On the off chance that you asked the outrageous homers on this site, they would reveal to you that regardless of his absence of any significant detail, was super
was a failure from the very beginning, never fit the bill in the 3-4 and will probably be out of the association in two years.

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