Enough is enough: Let's get crazy and draft a WR in the first round

The Packers last drafted a wide receiver in the first round in 2002. Will that change this year? 

A little bit of my tongue was in my cheek while writing this article. 

I’m not a needy person. I pride myself on being a laid-back individual that goes with the flow on most, if not all, occasions. What is good with the majority of the group is good with me. But enough is enough. I want – no, I need – the Green Bay Packers to take a wide receiver. Do the Packers have more pressing needs? You betcha. Do I care? Not anymore. 

In case you have been living under a rock – no biggie if you have been; it is most likely a warm inhabitance – the Packers have not drafted a wide receiver in the first round since the 2002 NFL Draft, when they drafted Javon Walker with the 20th overall selection. 2002! 20 years! Has it mattered in terms of the Packers’ overall success? I don’t think so. From 2002 until this past season, the team has accumulated a 200-120-2 record, with only five losing seasons. One Lombardi Trophy. 12 NFC North Crowns. 15 playoff appearances. Blah blah blah. Would the Packers have been better if they drafted a wide receiver in the first round after 2002? Who the hell knows and who the hell cares. 

“But Rex, is it really necessary to draft a wide receiver in the first round when the front office has had a track record of finding wide receivers beyond the opening round that range from quality to great?” Fair point. 

  • 2006: Greg Jennings, 2nd round. 425 receptions, 6,537 yards, 53 touchdowns in seven seasons with GB. 
  • 2007: James Jones, 3rd round. 360 receptions, 5,195 yards, 45 touchdowns in eight seasons with GB. 
  • 2008: Jordy Nelson, 2nd round. 550 receptions, 7,848 yards, 69 touchdowns in nine seasons with GB. 
  • 2011: Randall Cobb, 2nd round. 532 receptions, 6,316 yards, 47 touchdowns in 10 seasons with GB. 
  • 2014: Davante Adams, 2nd round. 669 receptions, 8,121 yards, 73 touchdowns in eight seasons with GB. 
  • 2018: Marquez Valdes-Scantling, 5th round. 123 receptions, 2,153 yards, 13 touchdowns in four seasons with GB. 
  • 2021: Amari Rodgers, 3rd round. Just kidding. 
  • 2022: Christian Watson, 2nd round. Too early to tell, but the star potential is there. 
  • 2022: Romeo Doubs, 4th round. Again, too early to tell, but he has the makings to be a solid wide receiver, if not better than that. 

Beyond the Packers’ draft history, plenty of high-profile wide receivers were drafted after the first round, with draft capital worth far less than a first-round selection. Recent examples include DK Metcalf (2nd round), AJ Brown (2nd round), Terry McLaurin (3rd round), Chris Godwin (3rd round), Cooper Kupp (3rd round), Tyler Lockett (3rd round), Amon-Ra St. Brown (4th round), Tyreek Hill (5th round), and Stefon Diggs (5th round), among others.

The Steelers have not drafted a wide receiver in the first round since 2006. The Patriots have only drafted one wide receiver in the first round this century (N’Keal Harry in 2019). And, of course, the Packers have drafted only one wide receiver in the first round this century. The point is, these three teams have been three of the most successful franchises since the turn of the century, so they clearly know what they are doing when it comes to the draft. 

I do not care about any of that, though, because, from a fan perspective, there is nothing quite like the adrenaline and excitement that comes from drafting a wide receiver in the first round. Sure, the selection could have the career of, say, Kevin White, the former Bears’ first-round selection in 2015, but the selection could also have the career of, I don’t know, Justin Jefferson, one of the best wide receivers in the game. Nobody knows exactly how picks will fare because the draft is such a crapshoot, but 2015 research (h/t SB Nation) found that “first-round receivers have the longest and most productive careers.” 

There seem to be five consensus first-round receivers in the 2023 NFL Draft – Jaxon Smith-Njigba, Jordan Addison, Jalin Hyatt, Quentin Johnston, and Zay Flowers. (Check out the Cheesehead TV draft guide to learn more about the prospects.) My preference is Smith-Njigba. First of all, he put up huge numbers in 2021 – 95 receptions, 1606 yards, and 9 touchdowns, including 15 receptions for 347 yards and three touchdowns in the Rose Bowl – alongside two first-round wide receivers, Garrett Wilson and Chris Olave. Second, when was the last time that a wide receiver out of Ohio State was a bust? Don’t bother looking it up because it’s probably been a very long time. 

In the spirit of the Masters, drafting a wide receiver is sort of like hitting massive drives. The long ball gets the people going and puts hair on your peaches. It is an electric factory. But chipping and putting is much more important because as the adage goes, drive for show and putt for dough. If a golfer can’t chip or putt consistently well, they face an uphill climb to win a major tournament, or any tournament for that matter. 

Yet again, I do not care. This whole article is premised on emotion, not sound logic. So, please, Packers, hit a big ole drive down the middle of the fairway by drafting a wide receiver in the first round. 

 

PLEASE SUBSCRIBE TO OUR CHEESEHEAD NATION WEEKLY NEWSLETTER HERE.

__________________________

Rex is a lifelong Packers fan but was sick of the cold, so he moved to the heart of Cowboys country. Follow him on Twitter (@Sheild92) and Instagram (@rex.sheild). 

__________________________

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Comments (139)

Fan-Friendly This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.
MooPack's picture

April 07, 2023 at 01:04 pm

I’d draft a WR for nothing more than to shut up the fan base, talking heads, and draft experts for another 20 years.

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Matt's picture

April 07, 2023 at 01:23 pm

This way you'd open even more mouths saying: 15 years of MVP play on QB position wasted by not drafting WR in 1st. Now, when Aaron's gone they draft 1st round WR.

It's funny how GB was called for lack of offensive weapons while when it's all said and done Rodgers looks for Cobb, Lazard, Lewis to follow him elsewhere. We could not be top 5 offensive roster all the years but in my opinion it was far from average and marked by Nelson and Adams leading the receivers' room for most of Rodgers' tenure.

I'd not go with WR in first, especially when people say it's not a good class for WRs. Wait for someone who fell deep.

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Bitternotsour's picture

April 07, 2023 at 03:17 pm

and those same folks would also say, yes, draft a wideout, just not that one....

and two years from now they'll excitedly say they would have traded up/down and selected Player X who they had in the 47th mock they participated in just before the draft. Also, Gutekunst is obviously an idiot because he didn't use his time machine to see what they know in their bones...

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Matt's picture

April 07, 2023 at 03:52 pm

Judgements made 2 years after are my favorite. Imagine all teams passed on Tom Brady... multiple times each. Amateurs ;)

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TKWorldWide's picture

April 08, 2023 at 02:16 pm

Agreed!
It’s also fun to look back a few years at the first round, and ask how much would the order change if they could have a do-over. In most cases, A LOT.

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Coldworld's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:33 pm

Ha ha, Yes! But much as I would like to see a pass catcher at 15, I’m not sure this year that there’s one I’d take even for that. This is a round 2/3 receivers draft I fear.

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:48 pm

Jaxon Smith-Njiba, who had the best times of all positions at the 2023 NFL in the 3 cone drill was 6.57 vs, 6.82 for Adams in 2014 and 20 yard shuttle 3.93 vs. 4.3 for Adams in 2014 and also at Ohio State's pro day ran a faster 4.48 40 than Davante Adams' combine 4.56 40.

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BirdDogUni's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:41 pm

"Smith-Njigba is a possession slot receiver who lacks the shake to separate underneath and the speed to run past defenses. He’s tough in the middle of the defense and has proven he can make catches in congestion. Smith-Njigba will need to fine-tune his route running to give himself his best chance to succeed at the next level. It is impossible to ignore his monster finish to the 2021 season, and he has starting slot potential, but the speed concerns coupled with an injury-plagued 2022 season threaten to negatively impact his draft stock." Per NFL.com

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BirdDogUni's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:44 pm

I don't think you draft a slot receiver in the 1st round at #15 overall. If he could play outside, maybe, but he can't play outside, which tells me he isn't worth a 1st round pick. Period.

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jannes bjornson's picture

April 08, 2023 at 09:24 am

If they go on a losing streak, they may be positioned for Marvin Harrison,jr in the '24 draft.

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MooPack's picture

April 07, 2023 at 06:31 pm

At least one person gets my post. I can't see a WR in the 1st for the Packers either, this year is not good, but I'd sure like to get rid of the incessant year after year knuckleheads that scream for Packers to get one in the 1st or it's a failed draft. Christian Watson was 2 picks away (2 picks!) from being a 1st rounder, and yet the call for a WR is still overwhelming.

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LLCHESTY's picture

April 08, 2023 at 11:01 pm

Listening to the fan base is a surefire ticket to 1st class ticket on the 1st plane out of town.

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splitpea1's picture

April 07, 2023 at 01:09 pm

Most of this article seems to make the case for NOT drafting a receiver in the first round. Best to leave emotion out of it anyway....We're looking for the intersection of BPA and opportunity to fill our many needs in the first round, and no one should be disappointed by a player at another position or a trade down that nets us additional picks in the second (an excellent way to round out the team with quality prospects).

By the way, I don't know how Flowers crept onto the list. I actually love watching players like this, but he's not in the same tier as the others listed, and besides, it would shocking if the Packers drafted a WR of such small physical stature.

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GregC's picture

April 07, 2023 at 01:14 pm

Yeah, a first round WR is the ultimate sexy pick--not counting a QB who actually needs to step in and play right away, which was not the situation with the Packers' last two first round QBs. I would share the author's excitement about a first round WR, although at the same time I would wonder if an OLB or even a TE would've been a smarter pick.

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DoubleJ's picture

April 07, 2023 at 02:29 pm

Since 2000, there have been 24 TEs drafted in R1. They have accounted for 24 combined Pro Bowl selections (Jeremy Shockey had the most of the R1 TEs with 4) and 2 combined All-Pro selections (Dallas Clarke & Jeremy Shockey each with 1).

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MainePackFan's picture

April 07, 2023 at 01:26 pm

It would be interesting to see the reaction if the Packers not only took a WR in the first round this year, but traded up to do it. If we want JSN, that's what it would take. Let's do it : )

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BirdDogUni's picture

April 07, 2023 at 02:46 pm

"Smith-Njigba is a possession slot receiver who lacks the shake to separate underneath and the speed to run past defenses. He’s tough in the middle of the defense and has proven he can make catches in congestion. Smith-Njigba will need to fine-tune his route running to give himself his best chance to succeed at the next level. It is impossible to ignore his monster finish to the 2021 season, and he has starting slot potential, but the speed concerns coupled with an injury-plagued 2022 season threaten to negatively impact his draft stock." Per NFL.com

Chad Reuter has us taking JSN at 15 in his latest Mock Draft. I would be disappointed if this came to fruition.

He has JSN the 1st WR taken. (By us.)

Jordan Addison going 21st to the Chargers.

Jalin Hyatt going 25 to the Chiefs.

Dalton Kincaid going 26th to the Cowboys.

Zay Flowers at 27 to the Seahawks.

Michael Mayer going 28th to the Bengals.

Quentin Johnston going 33 to the Texans.

Darnell Washington going to us at #42.

https://www.nfl.com/news/four-round-2023-nfl-mock-draft-2-0-round-1

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:00 pm

Bird Dog who would you rather see the Packers draft with pick 15?

Jaxon Smith-Njiba, who had the best times of all positions at the 2023 NFL in the 3 cone drill - which was 6.57 vs, 6.82 for Adams in 2014 - and 20 yard shuttle - which was 3.93 vs. 4.3 for Adams in 2014 - also at Ohio State's pro day ran a faster 4.48 40 than Davante Adams' combine 4.56 40.

The second-fastest wide receiver in both drills – Princeton wide receiver Andrei Iosivas – was .19 seconds slower in the shuttle and .28 seconds slower in the 3-cone drill. The second-fastest players in both drills was Kansas State cornerback Julius Brents, who ran a 4.05-second 20-yard shuttle and a 6.63-second 3-cone drill.

Smith-Njigba’s 20-yard shuttle time was the fourth-fastest by any wide receiver at the combine since 2007, while his 3-cone drill time was the 12th-fastest in that same span.

Both of those drills test a player’s ability to change directions quickly, so it should come as no surprise that Smith-Njigba posted elite numbers in both. It was that same agility that made Smith-Njigba so hard to cover during his record-setting 2021 season at Ohio State, when he caught 95 passes for 1,606 yards to break school records in both categories.

Coupling his agility drill times with an excellent receiving workout in which he caught every pass thrown his way, Smith-Njigba proved he was fully recovered from the hamstring injury that sidelined him in 2022 and made his case for being the best wide receiver in the 2023 NFL draft even though he didn’t run the 40-yard dash.

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BirdDogUni's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:24 pm

Broderick Jones. Bijan Robinson, Devon WItherspoon, Nolan Smith, Darnell Wright, or Deonte Banks.

I wouldn't draft JSN unless we got the Jets 13, we traded back (to gain another 2nd round pick) and he was available at 21 or 28... Then I would still draft Quentin Johnston or Darnell Washington, but that's just me. (Not a JSN fan.)

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Coldworld's picture

April 07, 2023 at 11:56 pm

He also had 5 catches for 43 yards over 60 snaps this year due to a hamstring that would not heal. That’s the type of issue that can return throughout a career. If we draft him, expect that to be thrown back at the team if he does have future unavailability.

JSN isn’t a burner. He’s not a perimeter guy. He’s actually probably most comparable with Adams. I think he will have a good career. I have him going early in the second round, but that’s because I don’t like the look of hammy issues that do not go away for that long. I think he’s an early round 2 player in a more typical WR class.

If we have one pick in the 20-32 range and there’s no must have D pick, then I’d take Washington before JSN. Washington can help block now. JSN looks too close of a comparable with Doubs to me too. Not an ideal duplication.

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 08, 2023 at 01:10 am

"He also had 5 catches for 43 yards over 60 snaps this year due to a hamstring that would not heal"

Coldworld, I understand your point on the hamstring. See what I wrote to Stockholder down below.

"If we have one pick in the 20-32 range and there’s no must have D pick, then I’d take Washington before JSN. Washington can help block now. JSN looks too close of a comparable with Doubs to me too. Not an ideal duplication."

JSN's work in the combine on the 20 yard shuttle and the 3 Cone is in another class relative to Doubs and surpasses Davante too.

I see what you say you would do if you had a pick in the 20 to 32 range, what would you do if your only 1st round pick is #15?

Everyone should save these predictions to look at a year from now, 2 years from now - hopefully we are all still alive by then.

What I wrote to Stockholder:

Stockholder, I have not seen what you have said you would do with choice #15. What would you do?

I don't see many bust wide receivers when it comes to the top 15 players of the first round - I see a lot of stars though:.

This website - which Cheesehead TV is now not taking goes back through the 1960s and earlier:

it is at drafthistory.com positions - wr

JSN's hamstring is a bit concerning as we just saw this with Christian Watson and Sammy Watkins this year and saw it with others in the past as well. It appears that JSN hurt his hamstring in the first game in the first quarter against Notre Dame going out of bounds and then tried to play through it the next week. Then took a month off and tried to come back for game 7 at Iowa and was not recovered. He then sat out the remainder of the season.

There are always going to be first round busts at every position.

If JSN is not the pick I would go with Darnell Washington - I would be happy with either.

From what I have read and watched on video and at the NFL combine , I am not excited about Addison or Johnston as wide receivers in the first round.

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Coldworld's picture

April 08, 2023 at 09:59 am

In answer to your question in what I would do with the 15th pick, I tend not to have a single choice any year, because it’s so hard to know what others will actually do. This year in particular is very short in BAP fits with need for us and also, I believe, short of Truly elite picks generally. It’s a year to be in the top maybe 8 picks or be in the mid late 20s.

I would go in with the default of trading back. I would like an edge or DT ideally or a WR/TE. However, with the exception of edge, I’m not confident an elite one will fall to us, and edge is deep. Perhaps the best players who might are

Bijan Robinson. Robinson is strength at one point where we are already strong. I don’t see him helping much this year and I don’t think we have that luxury.

Darnell Washington. I love the potential, but I fear that he’s a straight like guy. I don’t know how versatile he can be as a receiving TE. Blocking first TEs in the first is a huge reach. How a big a gamble is valued is a tough one. I see him as a mid 20s value at best.

Darnell Wright. Sorry, I’m in the we do not need a T this year camp firmly. A nice luxury that has some sense but one we can’t afford. I do like what we have much more than some.

Michael Meyer. I think Meyer will be a good all around NFL TE. I just don’t think his athleticism will allow him to be great. Normally I’d say second round at the highest. His ability to help now might get me to take him in the last 5 of the first round, but I’d go Washington first.

Halon Hyatt. No. He’s a slot. There are a lot of slots available later and in this draft particularly, but also generally, I don’t take a pure slot in the first. It also is s bad fit. We have 3 slot capable players already, but no big blocking type or perimeter threat. It’s the perimeter threat that would get me to jump at 15, but there isn’t one I see this year as good enough and there’s some goid ho prospect role players with real speed later.,

Dalton Kincaid. Interesting. A big slowish WR pretending to be a TE. If I felt like he was willing to fulfill more grunt work like Lazard and relished contact, I’d love him, but not at 15. Can I see a role for him? Maybe, but not without physicality and more as a role player in a varied O. I wouldn’t hate picking him later but not in the first.

My pre Combine favorite was Deon Branch, but those athleticism scores across the board just don’t hold up. Later maybe, but I see him having issues at this level. I’ve

So that does not leave a lot I think have a chance to fall. If I’m forced to take one of the above at 15 and can’t trade back, I’d reluctantly opt for Washington and hope that LaFleur can use his blocking and straight speed and make him a threat just from that.

As the draft starts, I will be hoping a guy like Bijan or a OT falls whom another team really craves or that a guy like Van Ness or Gonzales drops. Those I’d take in a heartbeat. Need and BPA, fit, but I just don’t think they will. If they aren’t there, I trade back if I can and, if Washington is gone then I’d consider trying to go back further.

There is a lot of similar talent after the top 10 or so right through into the late 2nd even 3rd. If not possible, then maybe Branch, maybe Kincaid and Johnston, if any are still there. I’d fear each would be a small reach, but one that fills a need. Right now, I’d take Johnston.

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 08, 2023 at 01:14 am

"He also had 5 catches for 43 yards over 60 snaps this year due to a hamstring that would not heal"

Coldworld, I understand your point on the hamstring. See what I wrote to Stockholder down below.

"If we have one pick in the 20-32 range and there’s no must have D pick, then I’d take Washington before JSN. Washington can help block now. JSN looks too close of a comparable with Doubs to me too. Not an ideal duplication."

JSN's work in the combine on the 20 yard shuttle and the 3 Cone is in another class relative to Doubs and surpasses Davante too.

I see what you say you would do if you had a pick in the 20 to 32 range, what would you do if your only 1st round pick is #15?

Everyone should save these predictions to look at a year from now, 2 years from now - hopefully we are all still alive by then.

What I wrote to Stockholder:

Stockholder, I have not seen what you have said you would do with choice #15. What would you do?

I don't see many bust wide receivers when it comes to the top 15 players of the first round - I see a lot of stars though:.

The Draft history . com website goes back through the 1960s and earlier.

JSN's hamstring is a bit concerning as we just saw this with Christian Watson and Sammy Watkins this year and saw it with others in the past as well. It appears that JSN hurt his hamstring in the first game in the first quarter against Notre Dame going out of bounds and then tried to play through it the next week. Then took a month off and tried to come back for game 7 at Iowa and was not recovered. He then sat out the remainder of the season.

There are always going to be first round busts at every position.

If JSN is not the pick I would go with Darnell Washington - I would be happy with either.

From what I have read and watched on video and at the NFL combine , I am not excited about Addison or Johnston as wide receivers in the first round.

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MainePackFan's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:20 pm

Draft Buzz-
Super productive slot receiver who Led Ohio state in receptions and yardage in 2021 despite playing officially as the third receiver behind Olave and Garret Wilson
Smooth hips with outstanding agility who is equally adept at moving laterally as vertically
Has outstanding soft hands demonstrated by his impressive 141.8 QB rating when targeted in 2021
Often used on deep routes, getting separation down the sideline or over the middle on crossing routes by extending his arms rather than pure speed.
Does a nice job locating and tracking deep passes and is a legitimate vertical threat. Willing to go up and attack the ball.
Has the strong hands any NFL wide receiver coach and quarterback would covet. Tracks the deep ball over either shoulder and brings in passes fluidly without breaking stride downfield.
Has a knack for getting open and is a quarterback's best friend - passers just need to toss the ball in his area and he'll come down with it.
Has enough straight-line speed and takes advantage of open seams when his quarterback is on target.
Good effort and technique as a blocker for his size. Can beat the press with elusiveness or physical contact. Runs elite crisp routes with sharp cuts.
Has good body strength to squirm out of tackles with the coordination to maneuver his frame between defenders.

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Tundraboy's picture

April 07, 2023 at 06:05 pm

Sounds like a winner to me!

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BDU's picture

April 09, 2023 at 09:59 am

He's a slow slot receiver who can't play outside. You don't draft slow slot receivers until the 3rd round. (See Amari Rodgers)

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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:31 pm

If the right WR was available at #15 I'd definitely pull the trigger depending on who else was sitting there. No hesitation!

I'm just not sure JSN would be my WR (certainly would not be upset) if Johnston was sitting there. For me it is all about which WR do I think would be the best fit for the Packers on the field at the same time with Watson & Doubs. I think people are going to be blown away with Doubs this year & why I think Johnston may be a better fit than JSN.

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:11 pm

Packers need a possession receiver in the middle of the field - something that Davante did for years.

Johnston disappeared for TCU against Georgia in their 65 to 7 beating. I do like TCU's Derius Davis as a late round pick and potential relief to Keisan Nixon on punt returns as it seems Nixon is being looked to start or play a lot more corner on defense. Davis ran a 4.36 forty at the Combine - same as Watson though slower than Melton. 4.38 in the 20 yard shuttle.

Jaxon Smith-Njiba, who had the best times of all positions at the 2023 NFL in the 3 cone drill - which was 6.57 vs, 6.82 for Adams in 2014 - and 20 yard shuttle - which was 3.93 vs. 4.3 for Adams in 2014 - also at Ohio State's pro day ran a faster 4.48 40 than Davante Adams' combine 4.56 40.

The second-fastest wide receiver in both drills – Princeton wide receiver Andrei Iosivas – was .19 seconds slower in the shuttle and .28 seconds slower in the 3-cone drill. The second-fastest players in both drills was Kansas State cornerback Julius Brents, who ran a 4.05-second 20-yard shuttle and a 6.63-second 3-cone drill.

Smith-Njigba’s 20-yard shuttle time was the fourth-fastest by any wide receiver at the combine since 2007, while his 3-cone drill time was the 12th-fastest in that same span.

Both of those drills test a player’s ability to change directions quickly, so it should come as no surprise that Smith-Njigba posted elite numbers in both. It was that same agility that made Smith-Njigba so hard to cover during his record-setting 2021 season at Ohio State, when he caught 95 passes for 1,606 yards to break school records in both categories.

Coupling his agility drill times with an excellent receiving workout in which he caught every pass thrown his way, Smith-Njigba proved he was fully recovered from the hamstring injury that sidelined him in 2022 and made his case for being the best wide receiver in the 2023 NFL draft even though he didn’t run the 40-yard dash.

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MainePackFan's picture

April 07, 2023 at 07:31 pm

Knock, I have watched Johnston's film. I just don't see a difference maker. Mingo, AT Perry and others will give you the same thing later in the draft. Give me Watson Doubs and JSN and Jordan Love becomes a very good NFL QB ; )

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Coldworld's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:34 pm

No one I’d trade up for at WR though

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Fubared's picture

April 07, 2023 at 01:34 pm

How about a moblile Tight end who can run with speed and has good hands. If anything the Vikings have shown us they can put three tight ends on the field at the same time and all of them can catch and run. We use out old guys to block?

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Leatherhead's picture

April 07, 2023 at 01:40 pm

Yes, we should be more like the Vikings.

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Bitternotsour's picture

April 07, 2023 at 03:20 pm

Agreed. The Vikings are the bar by which all NFL teams must be judged. Aspirational excellence.

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LeotisHarris's picture

April 07, 2023 at 02:04 pm

Indeed. Hockenson hauled in that three-yard pass on fourth and eight like it was no big deal. If only we could harness that power!

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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:32 pm

More importantly the Vikings only gave up a 3rd round pick in 2023 for him.....along with getting to use him most of the 2022 season. Still scratching my head on that one! Why didn't the Packers throw their hat in the ring?

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:14 pm

Because Brian and Mark, know the cost of everything and the value of nothing.

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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:15 pm

Now that this will be the first year with Gutey having complete control of who the Packers select (without Rodgers dictating) let's hope for the best!

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Tundraboy's picture

April 07, 2023 at 10:35 pm

Gute has to feel liberated , probably giddy with excitement and energy. Making the best picks , the right ones is difficult enough, having to make them while walking on eggshells to ensure Rodgers approval had to be impossible and exhausting.

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 08, 2023 at 12:00 am

Yeah Brian was really catering to Rodgers.

No 1st round draft choices on:

a) receivers
b) running backs
c) tight ends

since 2002 - no other NFL team has ever matched this 20 years in not doing so since the 1967 modern era.

Yeah, Gute had to get Aaron's approval.

Tundraboy, how old are you?

Where do you come up with this obvious nonsense?

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DoubleJ's picture

April 08, 2023 at 02:12 pm

"No 1st round draft choices on:

a) receivers
b) running backs
c) tight ends

since 2002 - no other NFL team has ever matched this 20 years in not doing so since the 1967 modern era."

That streak should continue as well as those positions lack positional value for R1 selections.

Andy Herman brought up that since 2000 there have been 24 R1 TEs drafted. They have combined for 24 Pro Bowl selections and 2 All Pro Selections. Basically very high bust rate.

Running back has been getting devalued a lot over the years. First there is a high level of attrition. Second even the best ones rarely are good past 30 years old. Third it is a position that you can find high level starters later in the draft ( see Aaron Jones who was an R5 draft pick).

Wide receiver has more value usually on R2 that R1. Since 2010, more receivers drafted in R2 have made the Pro Bowl than R1. In fact as of the end of the 2021 season R1 only had 1 more Pro Bowl receiver than R3.

Basically all 3 of those positions you are better off grabbing in R2 or later. The positions with the most value for R1 are QB, OT, EDGE, CB, and 2/3 the time IDL. Those positions usually have severe drop off in talent after R1. This draft is different in that EDGE is very deep. There are 1 or 2 top players and then a bunch that are late R1 players. That means you can probably get a good one in R2. This is not the norm for EDGE.

1 points
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Tundraboy's picture

April 09, 2023 at 11:02 pm

Lol

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Leatherhead's picture

April 07, 2023 at 01:39 pm

The Packers organization gets really good WRs on Day Two. That let's us use our #1 for other stuff, and it gives us a competitive advantage over teams that can't/don't.

Using Thehuddlereport as a source, I went through the top picks and removed any defensive players, all the QBs, all the offensive linemen, and all the WRs under 6' tall. This is what we're left with in our search for weapons:

Jaxon Smith Njigba, the top receiver in this draft. Projected to go in the first half of the first round, meaning he could still be around at #15, but probably not.

Dalton Kincaid, who is kind of a TE and bulked up WR in one. He's bigger than Lazard, and if we use him as a big slot, or move TE, he might be a good fit. Projected to go in the first round, but there's a good chance he'll be there at #15.

Quentin Johnston, WR. We've talked about him at length here. He's the best of the big receivers.

Jahmyr Gibbs, RB. Other than his lack of heighth (5'9"), he's probably the most dynamic offensive player in the draft. With Dillon being on the last year of his deal, and Jones basically being a year-to-year proposition,, it might not be a bad idea to get this guy.

Michael Mayer. He's never been ranked on any board I've seen any lower than #2 among TEs. He's looking like a 20-40 pick.

And...Darnell Washington is in that same area. His size and mobility make him kind of a rare specimen. He's big, and fast, but when he moves, he kind of looks.....not smooth. I know that's kind of nit-picking. If you want a receiving TE, there are better choices. If you want a blocking TE, you can get them later.

Jalen Hyatt. Barely breaks the minimum size at 6 feet and 179 pounds. He's talented, but that's pretty small.

Luke Musgrave, a clear Day Two TE but he can block and receive

Zach Charbonnet. Not a lot of dialogue on this RB, but he checks all the boxes for a guy that the Packers would like. Probably a late second round, or early 3rd round, selection.

Cedric Tillman, WR. I've been touting him for a month, and I'm not stopping now. It used to be a given that I could take him in simulations at #66, but he's moving up now and I'm even seeing him as a late first round guy now.

So, if we want a premium weapon with one of our premium picks, he's on that list. Although we haven't taken a weapon in the first round since 2002, I'd have a hard time passing on Quentin Johnston at #15, because I think he and Watson and Doubs would give us a pretty good WR group.

I think Charbonnet would be a good pickup in the second.. If all the RBs are healthy, we could deal Jones or Dillon at the trading deadline. If they aren't all healthy, it would be nice to have a guy who could step in and do the job without screwing up a bunch.

Add those two, get a starting caliber OT in the draft, and this offense will be better than last year's.

1 points
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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:39 pm

LH,
I am with you!

Couple additions.....would not go with Jahmyr Gibbs as his weight is quite a bit smaller than the average weight of RB's. He would be a that bonus (luxury) player for special gadget plays but never an every down RB. Jalen Hyatt isn't a good fit for the Packers as very slim and doesn't meet the Packers height/weight requirements. Jalin is more of a straight line speed guy but isn't a physical blocking & contested catch WR.

1,000% in agreement about Quentin Johnston. Size, speed, physicality, blocking, stretch the field, can high point catches, but most of all he is the type/style of WR the Packers need on the field with Doubs & Watson IMO. Throw in Kincaid as well if back is okay and receives medical clearance.

0 points
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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:19 pm

Hooker made Hyatt and Tillman look good, like Rodgers did with many Packers.

Did you watch many Georgia games or see Darnell Washington at the NFL combine? He is a game changer like Gronk.

As for JSN:

Packers need a possession receiver in the middle of the field - something that Davante did for years.

Johnston disappeared for TCU against Georgia in their 65 to 7 beating. I do like TCU's Derius Davis as a late round pick and potential relief to Keisan Nixon on punt returns as it seems Nixon is being looked to start or play a lot more corner on defense. Davis ran a 4.36 forty at the Combine - same as Watson though slower than Melton. 4.38 in the 20 yard shuttle.

Jaxon Smith-Njiba, who had the best times of all positions at the 2023 NFL in the 3 cone drill - which was 6.57 vs, 6.82 for Adams in 2014 - and 20 yard shuttle - which was 3.93 vs. 4.3 for Adams in 2014 - also at Ohio State's pro day ran a faster 4.48 40 than Davante Adams' combine 4.56 40.

The second-fastest wide receiver in both drills – Princeton wide receiver Andrei Iosivas – was .19 seconds slower in the shuttle and .28 seconds slower in the 3-cone drill. The second-fastest players in both drills was Kansas State cornerback Julius Brents, who ran a 4.05-second 20-yard shuttle and a 6.63-second 3-cone drill.

Smith-Njigba’s 20-yard shuttle time was the fourth-fastest by any wide receiver at the combine since 2007, while his 3-cone drill time was the 12th-fastest in that same span.

Both of those drills test a player’s ability to change directions quickly, so it should come as no surprise that Smith-Njigba posted elite numbers in both. It was that same agility that made Smith-Njigba so hard to cover during his record-setting 2021 season at Ohio State, when he caught 95 passes for 1,606 yards to break school records in both categories.

Coupling his agility drill times with an excellent receiving workout in which he caught every pass thrown his way, Smith-Njigba proved he was fully recovered from the hamstring injury that sidelined him in 2022 and made his case for being the best wide receiver in the 2023 NFL draft even though he didn’t run the 40-yard dash.

-3 points
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Coldworld's picture

April 08, 2023 at 12:03 am

This is a pretty good, balanced encapsulation of JSN:

“On one hand, JSN is a very safe pick. His ball skills (nine catches on 10 contested catches in 2021), size, after-the-catch ability (19 broken tackles in 2021) and nuanced route running are safe traits when projecting to the slot. On the other hand, he lacks explosiveness, long speed and leaping ability to win consistently downfield in the NFL. While quality slot receivers are valuable, being pigeonholed into such a role limits what he can bring to an NFL offense.

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2023-nfl-draft-top-10-wide-receiver-rankings.

1 points
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greengold's picture

April 07, 2023 at 06:56 pm

I shared earlier, this is a unique year. Time to hit these now, or never. Sometimes the window opens, and that’s what this is at TE and WR.

We will get all of these picks from NYJ. Take YOUR players, while they are in front of you.

Belichick is hoping we pass on the next Gronk at 13… think about it.

13 TE Darnell Washington
15 WR Jaxon Smith Njigba
42 OG Asim Richards
43 EDGE Felix Anudike-Uzomah
45 CB Kelee Ringo
78 S JL Skinner
116 WR Elijah Higgins
149 DT Moro Ojomo
170 S Quindell Johnson
232 EDGE Eku Leota
235 OT Warren McClendon
242 OT Malaesala Aumavae-Laulu
256 WR Antoine Green

-1 points
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SicSemperTyrannis's picture

April 11, 2023 at 12:32 am

Looks nice. #13 is a no go. Ruins your whole plan.

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SicSemperTyrannis's picture

April 11, 2023 at 12:28 am

We need an edge rusher. Of course if a premier TE is available at #15 and all the best picks at Edge are already gone, take the TE. Some analysts are projecting GB takes a QB high, I don't see the sense in that.

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MainePackFan's picture

April 07, 2023 at 02:11 pm

LH. I'm confused, why did you remove O-Line and defense? I agree, I don't think JSN falls to 15. I don't like anyone else on this list at #15. I don't share the love for Quenton Johnston that many do.

I think Mayer will be the 1st TE off the board. If I had to take one off your list (excluding JSN) it would probably be Mayer. I think he is going to be a great all around TE, and would be the player that would benefit Love the most from the list you provided IMO.

-3 points
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DoubleJ's picture

April 07, 2023 at 02:33 pm

I agree why remove defense. While I know that mock drafts are just for fun, Tom Fornelli's at cbssports has the Packers getting Christian Gonzalez at 15. If Gonzalez drops to 15 the Packers would sprint their card to the podium in a nanosecond. Overall this mock has been one of the more believable mocks I've seen.

-1 points
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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 06:09 pm

Agree - good genetics and a 41 and 5 inch vertical jump - 11 foot 1 inch board jump and a 4.38 forty at the NFL combine. Unless he - NFL.com has Raiders taking him at 7 - or a top 5 player drop, I would draft JSN or Darnell Washington or Bijan Robinson - in that order - at 15.

-1 points
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Duneslick's picture

April 07, 2023 at 03:36 pm

Please not Mayer

3 points
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MainePackFan's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:05 pm

Not sure why people are down on Mayer. He is a turn key NFL TE. KIncaid is a overgrown WR. Washington is a Tackle that can catch the ball. I would take Laporta over either of them.

1 points
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MainePackFan's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:07 pm

If you could combine Washington and Kincaid you would have your #15 : )

1 points
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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:21 pm

Washington is the next Gronk.

1 points
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dblbogey's picture

April 07, 2023 at 07:34 pm

I do love me some Laporta. Was an exceptional weapon on a bad Iowa offense with a bad QB. I was hoping he'd maybe be available 3rd round, but people are catching on that he's very good, I'd certainly take him in the 2nd.

0 points
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BDU's picture

April 09, 2023 at 10:06 am

Washington is a complete TE who is much faster than Mayer, can block better than Mayer, and will probably be drafted ahead of Mayer.

Don't believe the BS media hype.

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Leatherhead's picture

April 07, 2023 at 06:09 pm

I was looking at only offensive skill positions in the first two rounds. This is what’s on the shelf..

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DoubleJ's picture

April 07, 2023 at 02:22 pm

"when was the last time that a wide receiver out of Ohio State was a bust?"

How about Parris Campbell (2019 R2) or Curtis Samuel (2017 R2). Campbell has been unable to stay on the field due to injuries. Samuel has been no better than an MVS but MVS was a compensatory R5 pick.

1 points
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crayzpackfan's picture

April 07, 2023 at 02:41 pm

I never once even considered this until maybe 2-3 days ago. But a quality running game, especially who can be an outlet in the passing game is a massive comfort for a new QB. AJ's cap numbers and age next year are looking like he's gone. Dillion will be getting close to his second contract thereafter who had a ton of mileage in college and is more of a banger than an explosive back. What am I trying to say? Bijan Robinson? Jesus Christ! In the last 10-12 years would have NEVER suggested a top 15 pick on an RB. Is Bijan Robinson a transcendent player that we could have cheap for 3-5 years? Talk me down Pack Fans....Talk me down....

4 points
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HawkPacker's picture

April 07, 2023 at 02:54 pm

I would go with Jesus Christ. He can walk on water!

7 points
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crayzpackfan's picture

April 07, 2023 at 03:03 pm

But can Jesus walk on water while chewing gum at the same time?

0 points
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Bitternotsour's picture

April 07, 2023 at 03:25 pm

and what were his times in the three cone drill.

1 points
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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:44 pm

Think WATER BUG!!!

:)

1 points
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dblbogey's picture

April 07, 2023 at 07:36 pm

But what is Jesus' RAS?

2 points
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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:44 pm

No need to talk you down Crazy!

I have been singing Bijan's name for nearly 2 months now. ML likes to talk about how creative it is and the complexity of illusion....blah...blah...blah! I am not a top notch x and 0 guy but jiminy crickets I could figure out a whole hell of a lot of ways to utilize Bijan & still keep AJ on the field at the same time. Bijan is one hell of a receiving RB. Let's think out of the box and take the best player available and that.....will be none other than Bijan Robinson.

4 points
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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:34 pm

If JSN or Darnell Washington are gone, then Robinson would be a better choice than anyone other than one of the consensus top 5 players that some how drops to 15.

NFLcom has Robinson going to the Chargers at 21 has JSN going to the Bears at 9 and Darnell Washington going to the Lions at 18.

Quentin Johnson's not even on their 1st round list.

0 points
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Starrbrite's picture

April 07, 2023 at 02:52 pm

WR is the very tempting, but good WRs are a dime a dozen.
We’re going to obtain a blue chipper at 15 and perhaps at 13 depending on the ARod saga.
IMO, a blue chip selection should be spent on defense—an edge I hope.
If we’re going to dream and forget logic, let’s take the RB Robinson.
If we do take a WR, I hope it’s Jaxon Smith-Njigba.
Go Packers!!!

0 points
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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:48 pm

Starrbrite,
Just me....
There are going to be 'a lot' of excellent Edge players in round 2, and even some in round 3. Have no idea if Bachtiari ends up going to the Jet's but if he doesn't round 1 should be for offense at skilled positions. I hope Gutey & LF collaborate and think out of the box about how they could use an all world superstar player like Bijan Robinson. If you just used him as a RB you would be wasting the guys talent.

1 points
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Starrbrite's picture

April 07, 2023 at 09:20 pm

Knock—-I’m absolutely good with that.

0 points
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Turophile's picture

April 07, 2023 at 03:13 pm

A year when the draft lacks top end WRs (ie this year), but has good depth, is not the year to get one in round one.

Once the Packers have addressed Edge (agreeing with @Starrbrite here) and TE, likely in the first two picks (they probably get a Jets 2nd round pick, 42 or 43) they have their own pick at 45, the third rounder at 78 and fourth at 116.

So after Edge and TE
(lets say Van Ness or Fosskey for edge and Kincaid, Mayer or Washington at TE, for the sake of argument)
they can get, in some order, a Safety, WR and maybe a DL, though I wouldn't object if they double-dipped at TE, as the position needs more than one player to fill it.

So is it round 2, 3, or 4 where they get a WR ? I don't know, but I'm betting its not where they go in round one.

Just as a postscript here, I think in the 2022 draft the Packers WERE going to get a receiver (Watson) with their second, first round pick (at #28), but when they saw DL Wyatt still there, they threw out the plan to get Watson, nabbed Wyatt, and then swapped both their second round picks to trade to the top of round two to get Watson anyway.

PS I rather like the Alabama Safety Jordan Battle, in round three......but also a good target there is Wake WR A.T.Perry......... but I also like Ole Miss WR Mingo - surely he won't last to round 4, will he ? Maybe WR Tillman in round two, is the way to go.
Edge Van Ness, TE Kincaid, WR Tillman, S Battle, in the first three rounds, would be a nice haul.

6 points
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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:51 pm

Turo,
WR Williams who went to Detroit and Wyatt were my two favorite picks. I too think the Packers were going Watson with #28 but could not believe Wyatt was available. I am hoping for big things from both Wyatt & Watson this year.

5 points
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dobber's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:14 pm

"There seem to be five consensus first-round receivers in the 2023 NFL Draft – ....Quentin Johnston"

Here's a list of TCU draft picks over the years. The corollary to Rex's OSU WRs don't fail statement: find me the last TCU WR who wasn't a bust.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_TCU_Horned_Frogs_in_the_NFL_Draft

0 points
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Tundraboy's picture

April 07, 2023 at 10:47 pm

Phillip Epps!

0 points
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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:35 pm

Dear Rex,

Thanks, fresh red meat.

Lets go with the facts and probability, not emotion.

The reactionaries will not be able to handle the facts and truth and Packer Management's paid propagandists are there to avoid the truth, but TRUE Packer die hard fanatics will find confirmation of what they know below.

"In case you have been living under a rock – no biggie if you have been; it is most likely a warm inhabitance – the Packers have not drafted a wide receiver in the first round since the 2002 NFL Draft"

Not only that:

CBS Sports: "The Packers have the longest drought in the common draft era (since 1967) without selecting a running back, wide receiver or tight end in the first round. The last time the Packers selected an offensive playmaker in the first round was 20 drafts ago when they took wide receiver Javon Walker 20th overall in 2002."

but the Packers have gone the longest time of any of the 32 NFL teams in selecting any offensive playmaker - no wide receiver, no running back, and no tight end and 13 of the last 15 years drafted defense in the 1st round - offensive tackles Derek Sherrod and Brian Bulaga being the only exceptions.

Also given the fact that during Aaron Rodgers 15 year as a starter, Tom Brady's teams had NFL top ten ranked defenses 12 times and Aaron's Rodgers teams only 3 times and 14 out of those 15 years Brady's teams had higher ranked defenses than Aaron Rodgers teams these circumstances tell you that the primary reason Green Bay made the NFC playoffs more times than any other NFC team - 11 - is because Rodgers was performing miracles - including with offensive weapons like Jared Abbrederis, Jeff Janis, Richard Rodgers, Ty Montgomery - that the other 200+ NFC starters over those 15 years obviously could not.

"In case you have been living under a rock – no biggie if you have been; it is most likely a warm inhabitance – the Packers have not drafted a wide receiver in the first round since the 2002 NFL Draft, when they drafted Javon Walker with the 20th overall selection. 2002! 20 years! Has it mattered in terms of the Packers’ overall success? I don’t think so. From 2002 until this past season, the team has accumulated a 200-120-2 record, with only five losing seasons. One Lombardi Trophy. 12 NFC North Crowns. 15 playoff appearances. Blah blah blah. Would the Packers have been better if they drafted a wide receiver in the first round after 2002? Who the hell knows and who the hell cares.

Rex,

Yes of course the probability of the Packers being better would have increased if the Packers had drafted a wide receiver - or tight end or running back - in the first round. It most probably would have been the difference in playoff games or the Super Bowl. As an example, we remember the 1996 Packer team that already had solid Dorsey Levens and Edgar Bennett - and Travis Jervey at the running back position and all pro tight end Keith Jackson and Mark Chmura and Gary Thomasson at the tight end and solid wide receivers in Robert Brooks, Antonio Freeman, Desmond Howard, Don Beebe, Derrick Mayes, and Terry Mickens, but more than replaced Brooks for the Super Bowl run when they brought in then young 5 time all pro Andre "Bad Moon" Rison - who made all the difference in the world in the Super Bowl victory over the Patriots.

Yes the Packers would have been better if they drafted a receiver in the first round sometime over those 20 years.

Certainly in the last 7 years, where Brian and Mark drafted 7 1st round defensive players (and Kevin King with the first pick of the 2nd round) - all of which has led to only 1 top 10 NFL defense - 2016 21, 2017 26, 2018 22, 2019 9, 2020 13, 2021 13, and 2022 17.

Certainly in the last 3 years, where Brian and Mark instead drafted the man that led all quarterbacks in College Football - both FBS (Georgia, Alabama, Ohio State, TCU, Tennessee, LSU, etc.) and FCS (where are Christian Watson played, North Dakota State, South Dakota State, Montana, Montana State, Missouri State, Holy Cross, Villanova, etc.) - in interceptions thrown by a quarterback in the 2019-20 season - the same season that Aaron Rodgers was challenging, finishing 2nd, to the all time NFL record Aaron had just set in 2018-19 for the fewest interceptions by an NFL quarterback throwing more than 500 passes in a season - only 2 interceptions in 2018-19 and 4 interceptions in 2019-20.

Ball protection on offense - as you well know - is a critical variable in the performance of the QB and team and depends in good part on the emotional and native intelligence of the person and is not something that can be easily acquired. Consequently, with 1 poor start under his belt in 3 years, should Brian and Mark exercise the Packers 5th year option at the May 1, 2023 deadline on Jordan at a $20 million cap hit for 2024 when the Giants with Daniel Jones having had 36 more starts did not do so last May 1, 2022?

Or should Brian and Mark, drop this trade idea, pay Aaron's $58.3 2025 option, allowing to spread this $58.3 million over the remaining 4 years of his contract and allow Jordan to compete with Aaron for the starting job, with their obvious intent to start Jordan in the regular season.

After a few games, Brian and Mark - and Packer fans - will know what they have in Jordan and can then if Jordan exceeds Aaron's 2008 performance (adjusted for the improved overall QB numbers for the last 15 years, a consequence of the NFL owners choosing to protect QBs better and bring more offense to the game) Brian and Mark - in their soulless way - can trade Aaron between March 13, 2024 and the September 1 day before 2024 NFL regular season opener they must exercise their $47 million option for the 2026 season to be able to amortize this $47 million over 3 years, or if Jordan underperforms - or in fact implodes, something we have seen only in Seneca Wallace, Brett Hundley, TJ Rubley since Favre arrived in 1992 as Farve and Rodgers were so durable and outstanding Hall of Fame QBs - they can keep Aaron and ponder what to do with Jordan.

"Would the Packers have been better if they drafted a wide receiver in the first round after 2002? Who the hell knows and who the hell cares."

Rex:

"who the hell cares"?

Rex, "unless you have been living under a rock", you have seen that the probably 40 year old and younger Packer fans on here are spoiled and not satisfied with the fact that over the 15 years that Aaron Rodgers has been the Packers starter no NFC team or NFC quarterback has been in the playoffs more seasons - 11 - than the Packers and Rodgers and during those 15 seasons, no NFC team or NFC quarterback has been in more playoff games - 21 - than the Packers and Rodgers and during those 15 seasons, no NFC team with the same quarterback has been in more NFC Championship games - 5 - than the Packers and Rodgers and over those same 15 seasons no NFC team or NFC quarterback has won more Super Bowls than the Packers and Rodgers.

Those spoiled young so called Packer fans - who have never known consistent Packer losing - cry that the Packers have "only" won 1 Super Bowl.

“But Rex, is it really necessary to draft a wide receiver in the first round when the front office has had a track record of finding wide receivers beyond the opening round that range from quality to great?” Fair point. "

Rex, no not a fair point.

In modern football, you are not consistently in the playoffs as the Packers have been without pro bowl wide receivers or top ten defenses or a combination of pro bowl wide receivers, tight ends, and running backs, unless you are the Packers and have been blessed with Aaron Rodgers the last 15 years.

And don’t let anyone tell you’re the probability of finding an all pro receiver in rounds 2 through 7 is higher than the probability of finding an all pro receiver in round 1. You are nearly 10 times more likely to find an all pro receiver in the first round – 20% chance - than in rounds 2 through 7 – 3.38% chance.

See here from Sports Illustrated:

"Over the last 20 drafts, 80 receivers were selected in the first round. Green Bay’s NFC North rivals, the Detroit Lions and Minnesota Vikings, have taken a league-high five receivers during that span.

Of the 80 first-round receivers, 16 (20%) have been selected to multiple Pro Bowls, including 11 (13.75%) with at least four. In the final six rounds, 562 receivers were drafted. Of that huge group, 19 (3.38%) have been selected to multiple Pro Bowls, including eight (1.4%) with at least four.”

Rex, the Packers experience is very much in line with all other 31 NFL teams experience with wide receiver chosen in the first round and in rounds 2 through 7.

In addition to the 9 receivers that you mention - only 1 (Adams) of which has been selected to "at least 4 Pro Bowls" - the Packers have drafted 19 other wide receivers over the last 20 years:

1) Carl Ford
2) DeAndrews Rubin
3) Craig Bragg
4) Terrence Murphy
5) Cory Rodgers
6) David Clowney
7) Brett Swain
8) Charles Johnson
9) Kevin Dorsey
10) Jeff Janis
11) Jarred Abbbrederis
12) Ty Montgomery
13) Trever Davis
14) DeAngelo Yancy
15) Malachi Davis
16) J'Mon Moore
17) Equanimeous St. Brown

and 18) Samori Toure last year.

None of the 18 made any pro bowls - ZERO - never mind more than 4.

And of the 9 you listed, only Adams (6) and Jennings (2) - who the Packers screwed like 2002 1st round pick Javon Walker (who made the pro bowl and then tore his ACL after the Packer and Favre worked to screw him - for those that do not remember go back in history and read) - has made multiple pro bowls.

1 out of 27 making the Pro Bowl more than 4 times is 3.7% vs. 13.75% for first round picks.

2 out of 27 making the Pro Bowl multiple times is 7.4% vs. 20% for first round picks.

So clearly the Packers drafting experience is consistent with the overall NFL draft data for the last 20 years .

REX, YOU ARE MUCH MORE LIKELY TO DRAFT A MULTIPLE YEAR PRO BOWL RECIEVER IF YOU DRAFT HIM IN HE FIRST ROUND VS ANY OTHER OF THE 2ND THROUGH 7 ROUNDS.

AND AFTER ROUND 2, THE PACKERS CAME UP WITH A BIG ZERO IN TERMS OF ANY PRO BOWLS AT ALL.

And how much of Jennings (2nd round, 52nd overall pick in 2006) and Adams (2nd round, 53rd overall pick in 2014) performance numbers are due to having the most intelligent and composed QB in the NFL throwing to them?

Hard to tell, but Davante's catch percentage with Aaron in 2020 was 77.2% and 2021 was 72.8% and with David Carr in 2022 was 55.6.

So yes Rex, Brian and Mark have screwed Packer fans that wish to see the Packers go further than they have the last 20 years by not drafting wide receivers - or any running backs or tight ends (i.e. offensive weapons) - in the last 20 years.

"Yet again, I do not care. This whole article is premised on emotion, not sound logic."

Rex, better for you to use logic.

"My preference is Smith-Njigba."

Mine too, based on logic.

Hopefully the Packers are able to draft either or both:

1) Jaxon Smith-Njiba, who had the best times of all positions at the 2023 NFL in the 3 cone drill was 6.57 vs, 6.82 for Adams in 2014 and 20 yard shuttle 3.93 vs. 4.3 for Adams in 2014 and also at Ohio State's pro day ran a faster 4.48 40 than Davante Adams' combine 4.56 40.

and/or

2) Darnell Washington, who for those that have watched him at the NFL combine and in Georgia games and know him is a game changer.

Do that and drop the ignorant, emotion driven trade of Rodgers and bring back Cobb and Lewis and Crosby as well and I would be happy.

The rest of the draft, quality edge rusher and run stopper - maybe some run block driving guard or center to replace Myers and/or Runyan - and anything beyond that is a bonus.

-2 points
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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:55 pm

Starr,
Just maybe the longest comment in the history of CCTV. Well done!

0 points
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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:46 pm

I favor truth, facts, independent research, critical thinking and substance over bullshit and propaganda from Packer Management propagandists or the superficial Packer "fan" that - like a PARROT - repeats Packer Management propaganda.

-5 points
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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:47 pm

Also my writing is not for the illiterate or mono syllabic.

0 points
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Oppy's picture

April 07, 2023 at 06:00 pm

Which is a shame, because your writing often caters to those with an inability to think critically.

3 points
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Bitternotsour's picture

April 07, 2023 at 06:19 pm

it's a core value. write to your audience. embrace your customer.

his content speaks to the mouth breather, the least he could do is strip out some of the big words. as my company's communication director says, all writing is improved by editing.

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 06:51 pm

I dumbed it down further:

Brian and Mark drafted the man that led all quarterbacks in College Football - both FBS (Georgia, Alabama, Ohio State, TCU, Tennessee, LSU, etc.) and FCS (where are Christian Watson played, North Dakota State, South Dakota State, Montana, Montana State, Missouri State, Holy Cross, Villanova, etc.) - in interceptions thrown by a quarterback in the 2019-20 season

Brian and Mark made this draft pick of Love - without any discussion before hand with Rodgers - immediately following the very same season that Aaron Rodgers challenged the All time NFL record Aaron had just set in 2018-19 for the fewest interceptions by an NFL quarterback throwing more than 500 passes in a season - only 2 interceptions in 2018-19. Aaron finished with 4 interceptions in 2019-20, placing him 2nd to his own all time NFL record just set in 2018-19.

Ball protection on offense - as you well know - is a critical variable in the performance of the QB and team and depends in good part on the emotional and native intelligence of the person and is not something that can be easily acquired.

Consequently, with 1 poor start under his belt in 3 years, should Brian and Mark exercise the Packers 5th year option at the May 1, 2023 deadline on Jordan at a $20 million cap hit for 2024 when the Giants with Daniel Jones having had 36 more starts did not do so last May 1, 2022?

What do you think?

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 06:23 pm

I can't help the illiterate but I can help literate people like you Oppy that are simply having difficulty thinking critically - after being hypnotized by Packer Management propaganda - by providing truth and the facts as the antidote.

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Oppy's picture

April 07, 2023 at 06:28 pm

I can already see in your above diatribe that you actively avoid presenting facts that conflict with your chosen narrative. It is at that point I actively disregard your personal definition of "truth".

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 07:03 pm

Oppy, please let me know specifically which facts I actively avoided presenting that "conflict with my chosen narrative" and please let me know specifically what "my chosen narrative" was in my response to Rex on his "Enough is enough let's get crazy and draft a receiver in the 1st round" article.

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Oppy's picture

April 07, 2023 at 07:50 pm

You start off by supporting an argument that Rodgers hasn't been given tools to succeed by listing off role players and neglecting to mention the incredible pass catchers at WR that Rodgers has been surrounded by.

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 08:54 pm

"You start off by supporting an argument that Rodgers hasn't been given tools to succeed by listing off role players and neglecting to mention the incredible pass catchers at WR that Rodgers has been surrounded by."

Oppy, you are missing the point.

The Packers are the ONLY team in the last 20 years not to draft a wide receiver, running back or tight end in the first round.

Oppy, read this below and you should be able to understand why that FACT is relevant:

Those spoiled young so called Packer fans - who have never known consistent Packer losing - cry that the Packers have "only" won 1 Super Bowl.

From Rex: “But Rex, is it really necessary to draft a wide receiver in the first round when the front office has had a track record of finding wide receivers beyond the opening round that range from quality to great?” Fair point. "

My response:

Rex, no not a fair point.

In modern football, you are not consistently in the playoffs as the Packers have been without pro bowl wide receivers or top ten defenses or a combination of pro bowl wide receivers, tight ends, and running backs, unless you are the Packers and have been blessed with Aaron Rodgers the last 15 years.

And don’t let anyone tell you that the probability of finding an all pro receiver in rounds 2 through 7 is higher than the probability of finding an all pro receiver in round 1.

You are nearly 10 times more likely to find an all pro receiver in the first round – 20% chance - than in rounds 2 through 7 – 3.38% chance.

See here from Sports Illustrated:

"Over the last 20 drafts, 80 receivers were selected in the first round. Green Bay’s NFC North rivals, the Detroit Lions and Minnesota Vikings, have taken a league-high five receivers during that span.

Of the 80 first-round receivers, 16 (20%) have been selected to multiple Pro Bowls, including 11 (13.75%) with at least four. In the final six rounds, 562 receivers were drafted. Of that huge group, 19 (3.38%) have been selected to multiple Pro Bowls, including eight (1.4%) with at least four.”

Rex, the Packers experience is very much in line with all other 31 NFL teams experience with wide receiver chosen in the first round and in rounds 2 through 7.

In addition to the 9 receivers that you mention - only 1 (Adams) of which has been selected to "at least 4 Pro Bowls" - the Packers have drafted 18 other wide receivers over the last 20 years:

1) Carl Ford
2) DeAndrews Rubin
3) Craig Bragg
4) Terrence Murphy
5) Cory Rodgers
6) David Clowney
7) Brett Swain
8) Charles Johnson
9) Kevin Dorsey
10) Jeff Janis
11) Jarred Abbbrederis
12) Ty Montgomery
13) Trever Davis
14) DeAngelo Yancy
15) Malachi Davis
16) J'Mon Moore
17) Equanimeous St. Brown

and 18) Samori Toure last year.

None of the 18 made any pro bowls - ZERO - never mind more than 4.

And of the 9 you listed, only Adams (6) and Jennings (2) - who the Packers screwed like 2002 1st round pick Javon Walker (who made the pro bowl and then tore his ACL after the Packer and Favre worked to screw him - for those that do not remember go back in history and read) - has made multiple pro bowls.

1 out of 27 Packers drafted in the 2nd through 7th rounds making the Pro Bowl more than 4 times is 3.7% vs. 13.75% for first round picks.

2 out of 27 Packers drafted in the 2nd through 7th rounds making the Pro Bowl multiple times is 7.4% vs. 20% for first round picks.

So clearly the Packers drafting experience is consistent with the overall NFL draft data for the last 20 years .

REX, YOU ARE MUCH MORE LIKELY TO DRAFT A MULTIPLE YEAR PRO BOWL RECIEVER IF YOU DRAFT HIM IN HE FIRST ROUND VS ANY OTHER OF THE 2ND THROUGH 7 ROUNDS.

AND AFTER ROUND 2, THE PACKERS CAME UP WITH A BIG ZERO IN TERMS OF ANY PRO BOWLS AT ALL.

And how much of Jennings (2nd round, 52nd overall pick in 2006) and Adams (2nd round, 53rd overall pick in 2014) performance numbers are due to having the most intelligent and composed QB in the NFL throwing to them?

Hard to tell, but Davante's catch percentage with Aaron in 2020 was 77.2% and 2021 was 72.8% and with David Carr in 2022 was 55.6.

So yes Rex, Brian and Mark have screwed Packer fans that wish to see the Packers go further than they have the last 20 years by not drafting wide receivers - or any running backs or tight ends (i.e. offensive weapons) - in the last 20 years.

"Yet again, I do not care. This whole article is premised on emotion, not sound logic."

Rex, better for you to use logic.

"My preference is Smith-Njigba."

Mine too, based on logic.

Hopefully the Packers are able to draft either or both:

1) Jaxon Smith-Njiba, who had the best times of all positions at the 2023 NFL in the 3 cone drill was 6.57 vs, 6.82 for Adams in 2014 and 20 yard shuttle 3.93 vs. 4.3 for Adams in 2014 and also at Ohio State's pro day ran a faster 4.48 40 than Davante Adams' combine 4.56 40.

and/or

2) Darnell Washington, who for those that have watched him at the NFL combine and in Georgia games and know him is a game changer.

Do that and drop the ignorant, emotion driven trade of Rodgers and bring back Cobb and Lewis and Crosby as well and I would be happy.

The rest of the draft, quality edge rusher and run stopper - maybe some run block driving guard or center to replace Myers and/or Runyan - and anything beyond that is a bonus.

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Oppy's picture

April 08, 2023 at 07:48 am

What picks are those 1st round pro bowl WRs coming in at?

And, since you mentioned it, how many division titles, NFC championship game appearances, or SB's have the rest of the NFC North experienced due to their selecting WRs in round one?

You are drumming up data and making either poor or knowingly fraudulent connections between 'not drafting a RB, TE, or WR in the 1st round' and a lack of success. Hit rate on RBs, TEs, and WRs are particularly low in the first round. Among the worst of all position groups. (TE is easily the worst). But I digress.

Perhaps being the only team that hasn't drafted RB/TE/WR in the first round in "x" number of years is nothing more than a statistic that has zero bearing on success. How much more successful are all the other teams in the NFL that have done so than the Packers?

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Oppy's picture

April 07, 2023 at 06:38 pm

I would also like to add that I'm not sure what parts of the internet you're accustomed to doing most of your Packer-fanning at, but the readership at CHTV is largely perceived to be less prone to "Packer(s) management propaganda" than most. In fact, this community is often misconstrued as anti-Packers management by most others.

I would also caution that while you might get away with talking down to the audience wherever it is you came from- the CHTV community seems to have an abnormally high concentration of high-level executives, business owners, consultants, engineers, authors, and academics amongst its readership. Heck, we even have a guy who posts here occasionally who boasts about his bottom-tier MENSA IQ (just poking fun, Dragon ;) ) We also have a bunch of very savvy retirees, internationals, and regular-joes-with-above-average-knows in the mix.

You aren't going to intellectually intimidate or bully anyone here.

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 07:10 pm

"I would also caution that while you might get away with talking down to the audience wherever it is you came from- the CHTV community seems to have an abnormally high concentration of high-level executives, business owners, consultants, engineers, authors, and academics amongst its readership. Heck, we even have a guy who posts here occasionally who boasts about his bottom-tier MENSA IQ (just poking fun, Dragon ;) ) We also have a bunch of very savvy retirees, internationals, and regular-joes-with-above-average-knows in the mix."

Oppy, I respond to what I receive and what is being received certainly isn't from any of the above.

What is being received is rather from the Packer Management parroting crowd and the unappreciative "only" won one Super Bowl crowd...

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Bitternotsour's picture

April 07, 2023 at 10:14 pm

if you draft an all-pro receiver in the second round, an all-star running back in the fifth round, an all-world left tackle in the 4th round, are they not regarded as "talent", are they not weapons? Do Donald Driver's, Jordy's, James Jones and Greg Jenning's stats get asterisks because of their not having been drafted in the first round? Your arguments are tedious, they're better shared with an audience of people who otherwise don't pay attention. word count is not indicative of deep thought.

talent is talent.

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 11:54 pm

The point is

Sports Illustrated: "Of the 80 first-round receivers, 16 (20%) have been selected to multiple Pro Bowls, including 11 (13.75%) with at least four. In the final six rounds, 562 receivers were drafted. Of that huge group, 19 (3.38%) have been selected to multiple Pro Bowls, including eight (1.4%) with at least four.”

you are much more likely to obtain A GAMIE CHANGING (I.e. 4X plus Pro Bowl or 2X plus Pro Bowl) wide receiver, tight end, or running back if they are drafted in the first round.

The percentages on the 80 1st round wide receivers drafted in the first round and the percentages on the other 562 receivers drafted in rounds 2 through 7 over the 2003 through 2022 period bare that out.

In the Packers case, Driver was drafted in the last millennium not in 2003 through 2022.

Of the 27 receivers drafted by the Packers all were drafted in the 2nd through 7th rounds and only Davante (6 pro bowls) and Jennings (2 pro bowls) made more than 1 Pro Bowl. And Davante was the 53rd pick in the 2nd round of 2014 and Jennings was the 52nd pick in the 2nd round of 2006.

Of the 27 receivers drafted by the Packers not a single one of those receivers drafted below the 2nd round made even 1 Pro Bowl. - Jordy was 2nd round and made 1 pro bowl, Jones never made a pro bowl, Cobb made 1 pro bowl and was 2nd round.

And when it comes to the playoffs you need GAME CHANGER MULTIIPLE PRO BOWL CHOSEN OFFENSIVE weapons to give you that edge because the level of competition is stepped up.

Especially when your defensive almost never cracks the top ten. Case in point of the 15 years that Aaron was our started, Brady had the higher ranked defense 14 of those years. Of the 15 years that Rodgers was our QB, Brady had top 10 defenses behind him 12 times, Aaron just 3.

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Oppy's picture

April 08, 2023 at 07:51 am

We get it.

You can save us all a lot of time and just post "It's not Rodgers' fault."

That's your core message, right? That it's everybody's fault but Rodgers that the Packers don't have multiple SB rings over his tenure?

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BirdDogUni's picture

April 07, 2023 at 06:26 pm

"2) Darnell Washington, who for those that have watched him at the NFL combine and in Georgia games and know him is a game changer."

"... and know him is a game changer." (Obviously, you're not an English Teacher either.)

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 07:18 pm

Nope and have limited time to deal with the typo of "i" for an "a", most people will figure out the substance.

Always good to have English teachers around though - especially if they are TRUE long time Packer fans who have seen it all and are still here cheering and will still be there cheering Love even if he fails miserably in 2023-24 and is still starting and failing miserably in 2024-25.

Won't be cheering however the 31 conspiring colluding Billionaire Parasite NFL owners behind this NFL Revenue maximizer Rodgers trade or Brian or Mark who drop to their knees and comply to keep their positions of power as the Packers team and fans get screwed.

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BirdDogUni's picture

April 07, 2023 at 09:46 pm

Limited time? The novels you write, (and nobody reads) suggests you have way too much time on your hands. Maybe get a job. Leave your Momma's basement and get some sun...

Do you really hate Love or simply believe he'll fail because MaLF is a lousy coach? If you can't see the FO moved on from AR12 a year too late and still think he's the answer to getting the Packers to the Super Bowl, you're sorely mistaken.

Better to get what we can for him before it's too late and move on. If Love does fail, you can bet Murphy, Gutey, MaLF, and Barry will all be leaving town about the same time.

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 08, 2023 at 02:27 am

"Limited time? The novels you write, (and nobody reads) suggests you have way too much time on your hands. Maybe get a job. Leave your Momma's basement and get some sun..."

BDU,

You live here - 2,372 posts relative to my 156 - so it seems you are speaking of yourself.

"Do you hate Love"

BDU, I will be cheering Jordan as much as anyone win or lose, but you have the same two eyes I have - see if you can get ahold of Jordan's game against LSU and Burrow or any number of other games in his last year of College football when he led all of college football in interceptions thrown. Also I assume you have watched all of Jordan's games as a Packer - 5 preseason games, 2 in 2021 and 3 in 2022 (4 interceptions) which was worse than 2021 - and the regular season games against Kansas City - a 7 point terrible performance where the Chiefs game planned and blitzed Jordan - sending 8 and 9 players to the line at times and yet with only 2 or 3 men in coverage Jordan could not connect - and Detroit, last week of 2021 with more blitzing and not much better and Philly in 2022 - 10 snaps with Eagles sitting back in a prevent D with no pass rush giving Jordan short passes that you could complete.

If you have not studied these games go subscribe to NFL Plus and watch them in "Alll 22/Coaches Film" view and tell me what you see.

BDU, I am happy when the Packers are in the playoff hunt until the last game or make the playoffs and have a chance for the Super Bowl.

I hope Jordan surpasses Rodgers production from 2008 - adjusted to 2023 for inflated numbers across the board for QBs 2008 to 2022 - and he takes the Packers to the playoffs in 2023. I hope at least that MLF and JB and RB can hide Jordan for at least a ittle while behind a good running game, short passing game, good defense and special teams.

As for Rodgers - if the ignorant emotion driven trade goes through - the Jets will be in the playoffs the next 4 years and Rodgers will then retire with no cap hit to the jets.

And Jets fans will be very happy and appreciative.

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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

April 07, 2023 at 10:33 pm

"Always good to have English teachers around though - especially if they are TRUE long time Packer fans who have seen it all and are still here cheering and will still be there cheering Love even if he fails miserably in 2023-24 and is still starting and failing miserably in 2024-25".

Buckle up.....Jordan Love is obviously going to surprise you!

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BirdDogUni's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:39 pm

SMH -

I don't think there is a WR worth the 15th overall pick in this year's draft. (Hindsight will prove me wrong, but it will probably be a 2nd or 3rd rounder we should've taken in the 1st round.)

I think it is much more likely Gutey drafts an OT in the 1st round than any WR or TE. The caveat would be if he trades down and goes after his guy who probably won't be there at #45. (Not sure who that is, but we'll have to wait and see come draft day.)

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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:58 pm

If I was going after an OT it would be Darnell Wright from Tennessee. Tired of all the finesse OT's, so let's go get this monster of a man at 6'6" and 345 lb road grader. The Packers are going to run the ball, so let's get a road grader to help the running game. The beauty of Darnell is you draft Darnell Washington and you could have Darnell & Darnell side by side. :)

No the beauty is the Packers could either fall back from #15 to late in round 1 to draft Wright, or move up from #42 to pick him up.

5 points
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BirdDogUni's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:12 pm

Lol... (I thought of the Darnell/Darnell parallel too...) ; P

Imagine if we get Pick 13, trade back to 21 with the Chargers for 21 and 54. At 15 we take Broderick Jones and Wright or Dawand Jones at 21... LT and RT for years. Giving us the ability to trade Bakhtiari before the trade deadline. (Yes, we can trade 69 after 1 June...)

I doubt it happens, but it would be wicked to have an OL that was feared when they took the field.

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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

April 07, 2023 at 10:40 pm

BD,
I'm hoping for skilled game changer offensive players but it would be damn hard to complain if an OT was taken with one of the hopefully 2 first round picks. With the Jet's hole at OT and Bachtiari being such a good friend of Rodgers it is hard to not see him going to the Jet's. If this was the case there is no way I see Gutey not taking an OT in round 1 with one of the picks.

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Leatherhead's picture

April 07, 2023 at 11:38 pm

Knock….the list of game changers on offense is kind of short. Look at the players between 15 and 45, set aside the defensive players, QBs, and OL and it’s not a real long list. If we got #43 from the Jets, we could get an OT and two weapons, but it’s a limited pool..

We could get aTE who could be our 6th offensive lineman on Day 3.

Quentin Johnston, Cedric Tillman, Anton Harrison at OT, a RB in the third (hopefully, Charbonnet, Schoonmaker in the 4th.

1 points
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golfpacker1's picture

April 07, 2023 at 09:10 pm

I have two cousins named Darrel and Darrel. Does that count?

3 points
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Tundraboy's picture

April 07, 2023 at 11:10 pm

Larry? Lol

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 07:24 pm

"I think it is much more likely Gutey drafts an OT in the 1st round"

Bird Dog,

If Brian and Mark do that will be only the 3rd time the Packers Management has drafted an offensive player with their first pick of the draft in 16 years - the other 2 times being offensive tackles Derek Sherrod and Brian Bulaga.

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BirdDogUni's picture

April 07, 2023 at 09:54 pm

No kidding. Believe it or not, I was around for those drafts too. My memory isn't gone yet. Btw, how long has it been since they drafted a WR in the 1st round? 20 years? Too bad Sherrod got hurt. Bulaga wasn't too bad.

Guess we'll find out what Brian will do come the 27th. You keep writing those fiction novels. It'll keep you out of the bars anyway.

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 08, 2023 at 01:57 am

"No kidding. Believe it or not, I was around for those drafts too. My memory isn't gone yet. Btw, how long has it been since they drafted a WR in the 1st round? 20 years?"

So Brian now is going to change and draft an OT with this first pick - pretty low probability of that happening.

BDU, You make my point for me and only the Magician Rodgers - not over 200 other NFC QBs - was able to get the Packers to the most years in the playoffs - 11 - during the 15 years he has been Packer starter.

And he is to be replaced by all of College football's leader in interceptions thrown in 2019-20 who has started one game in which he was a complete failure.

BDU, I hope Jordan surpasses Rodgers production from 2008 - adjusted to 2023 for inflated numbers across the board for QBs 2008 to 2022 - and he takes the Packers to the playoffs in 2023. I hope at least that MLF and JB and RB can hide Jordan for at least a ittle while behind a good running game, short passing game, good defense and special teams.

As for Rodgers - if the ignorant emotion driven trade goes through - the Jets will be in the playoffs the next 4 years and Rodgers will then retire with no cap hit to the jets.

And Jets fans will be very happy and appreciative.

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golfpacker1's picture

April 09, 2023 at 10:49 am

Trading Rodgers is not about emotion, obviously it is with you Starr, it's a Packers business decision to move an aging player who still has enough value to help the team. And to get control of the team back from a player that thought he was the team. The players are all just employees.

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PhantomII's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:45 pm

Yes picking WR’s in the 2nd and later have made a big negative impact on an aging QB who did not have literally years to wait for the WR to get to DA level. That’s the knock on second and beyond are generally rawer and take longer to make a real impact with a few exceptions. JL needs more offensive weapons Stat. A top 3 WR and. Top 3 TE is in order as far as I’m concerned followed by an A.Jones replacement.
If we can do all 3 of those with quality players Love will be much better off this season.

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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:02 pm

Phantom,
You mentioned my name, so felt compelled to answer. :)

In agreement with your thoughts on the 3 quality offensive players.

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 07:39 pm

Yep, Jordan needs all the help he can get and the Packers haven't supplied for over 20 years to either Favre or Rodgers in a day where QB stats are much better because the NFL owners have put in protections for the QB and rule changes for more scoring.

Yep, Aging QB that just won 2 consecutive MVPs and 2 consecutive Passer Rating Titles - in front of Mahomes, Allen, Burrow, and all the other youngsters and Brady too - in 2020 and 2021 after breaking the all time NFL record for lowest interceptions thrown by a QB that threw 500 or more passes in 2018 and 2019.

If Mark and Brian's ego driven - they can't stand their QB being more intelligent, composed and communicative than they ever were both on the field and in an office - ignorant, emotion based trade goes through we will watch the Jets in the playoffs the next 4 years after which Aaron will retire with no cap hit to the Jets, while the Packers make the playoff maybe once in the next 4 years with Jordan, despite Jordan, or whomever follows Jordan.

And Brian and Mark will be gone - along with the younger Packer management bean counters who know the cost of everything and the value of nothing , along with their parrots and the unappreciative "only' won one Super Bowl crowd here,

And my fellow Packer die hards will still be here cheering the Packer players as loudly as ever.

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PhantomII's picture

April 09, 2023 at 09:01 am

We don’t have a #1 or 2 WR. We don’t have the luxury of drafting outside the top and can’t afford a FA. Watson will be a #1 but we have young guys at every spot. DA, Cobb, Jordy took 2+ years to be very good. That’s just reality. I wanted Jefferson at #20. He would have started next to DA. That decision took at least 1 trophy away from GB. So yea, drafting in the first round matters at WR.

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HarryHodag's picture

April 07, 2023 at 04:50 pm

One draftnik I read said it was a 50-50 proposition that the Packers would work with a team wanting the 15th pick and trade back. His reasoning is that the team has so many holes to fill that more picks(and cheaper contracts) in other rounds would be attractive. That either will make a receiver a higher chance or a lower chance and there's valid arguments for both.

But is receiver a critical priority in the first couple of rounds? Right now there's a gap the size of the Grand Canyon at tight end and especially safety. There are only a couple safeties worthy of 'starter' labels so if one is available at 15, the team likely will select him. If not, a trade back makes sense.

They also need at least one interior defensive lineman along with an edge rusher. With A.J. Dillon up for free agency next year and another tight cap year look for a running back sooner than later.

While fans go wild with the idea of an early wide receiver pick, probably not unless the Packers become as incompetent as some here and elsewhere allege.

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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

April 07, 2023 at 05:05 pm

Harry....Harry....Harry,
I believe we are going to see some phenomenal changes taking place with the draft & team now that diva is basically gone. Do not be surprised to see either a WR, or TE, or both drafted with the first two picks. Believe me.....Gutey cannot afford to see JL fail right out of the gate. For that matter, neither can ML!

2 points
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Leatherhead's picture

April 08, 2023 at 12:01 am

“”””…..so many holes….”””

I’m not so sure.

On offense, we return six legit starters on the line, the Dillon/Jones backfield, two starting caliber WRs and Deguara in a contract year. We could play and win with that if we get lucky with injuries. On defense, the only starters we don’t return are Lowry, Gary, who is injured, and Amos….who still hasn’t signed anywhere.

All along, there’s been an operating assumption that we should trade down and get more players, but IMO, we need a starter at WR , a complementary WR , and an OT. Get a Day 3 TE. A few good players at the top of the draft (15, 43,45) would help the offense stay on the field, which helps the defense stay on the sideline. We don’t need a bunch of guys.

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Leatherhead's picture

April 08, 2023 at 02:08 pm

2:07 Saturday. I cannot log on, and I'm getting a message that "Leatherhead" is not allowed. But somehow, I was able to get in here and post this message.

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golfpacker1's picture

April 09, 2023 at 10:53 am

The new reporting is the Bills want to move up in the draft for probably Bijan. That probably costs them a 1st, a 2nd, and a 4th this year. Maybe also a later round pick from 2024 because of their draft position. They can have #15 for that.

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ShawnO's picture

April 07, 2023 at 06:04 pm

NO!

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Oppy's picture

April 07, 2023 at 06:09 pm

Historically, first round picks on WRs are among the most likely to disappoint - that is, they are among the riskiest picks- they are more likely to fail to become a solid starter than to succeed. It's right around 33% success rate.

I'm not talking about being all-pro.. just a decent, long-term quality starter.
When you pick in the bottom 1/3 of the first round in particular, the odds are against you.

Impact offensive skill position players are often found in rounds 2-3.

I would only really be interested in spending a first round selection on offensive skill position player if the Packers were picking in the top 5-10. Even then, it's a risky proposition.

2 points
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PhantomII's picture

April 07, 2023 at 07:30 pm

We selected Savage 5 rounds too early...So I see your risky point. Every pick that does not work out and every LT paid to rehab for 2 years is an even bigger risk, cause now it’s money, like 20 Mill.not a draft pick. It is a risk oriented business. If Gutekunst does his due diligence and picks a top 2-3 WR and TE our offense will be much better than what we worked with last season. Our OL is not coming back from injury or open holes from players moving on. JL should have a pretty solid run game ,decent defense and better special teams. He needs a solid TE/ jumbo W/R and High rated WR, RB. Mingo or Tillman in the Second Round.

1 points
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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 07:47 pm

"Historically, first round picks on WRs are among the most likely to disappoint -"

Not true, statistically 1st round receivers are much more likely to succeed than those drafted in rounds 2 through7.

Here is Sports Illustrated's data for the last 20 NFL drafts:

Of the 80 first-round receivers, 16 (20%) have been selected to multiple Pro Bowls, including 11 (13.75%) with at least four. In the final six rounds, 562 receivers were drafted. Of that huge group, 19 (3.38%) have been selected to multiple Pro Bowls, including eight (1.4%) with at least four.”

Receivers in the 1st round are over 10 times more likely to succeed than those drafted in rounds 2 through 7.

And that has been the Packers experience to with the 27 wide receivers they have drafted in the 20 years, 2003 through 2022.

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Oppy's picture

April 08, 2023 at 08:24 am

You don't seem to grasp the difference between success rate and level of success.

Yes, the odds of being a superstar WR are higher for picks taken in the first round. However, the odds of being a complete bust are high in the first round, particularly for TEs and WRs.

The earliest draft slots are the closest thing to a "sure thing" you're going to get in the NFL- 75% go on to be at least solid long term starters. After those first 5 slots, hit rate drops to roughly 55%. From picks 21-32 success rate drops to as low as 29-39%. Success being judged as an average long term starter, not even a plus player or pro bowler. If you start looking at success at even a modestly higher caliber, the success rate plummets.

Here's a ten year evaluation. Read it. Perhaps now you will understand the difference between odds of a successful pick in the first round for a WR, and odds of finding the pro-bowler.

https://theriotreport.com/more-than-50-of-first-round-picks-are-busts-an...

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fair_weather's picture

April 07, 2023 at 07:24 pm

This is the way. How exiting. Set Jordan up for the next several years. Love this idea.

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EnemyTerritory's picture

April 07, 2023 at 07:40 pm

Wrong year for WR in first round. That was last year and the year before. Give me a TE in order to upgrade the pass catchers. WR in rounds 3 or 4.

7 points
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golfpacker1's picture

April 09, 2023 at 11:04 am

Yes, that is the rational team building move to make. Especially after trading back from #15. Nobody sees the VALUE in picking a Top 5 TE @ #15, but they do from #20 all the way to #45 because that's a better value. I think the top 5 TEs will be gone by our 2nd round pick so we need to trade back, get more picks and draft one of the top 5 TEs with our first pick.

Plus then we use the 2nd rounder we got in the trade for the best Edge, WR or lineman available. The 4th rounder that we also got in the trade for another TE, Safety, or RB.
Seems like the right business move to make.

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BDU's picture

April 09, 2023 at 12:16 pm

Just did my 1,000,000,000th PFF simulation.

Traded AR to the Jets for 13 and 42.

Traded 13 to to the Chargers for 21 and 54.

Traded 15 to the Steelers for 17 and 49.

Traded 17 to Baltimore for 22 and 86.

Here's something for Gutey to aspire to:

21: Deonte Banks CB Maryland 6' 0" 197lbs 4.35 speed

22: Darnell Wright OT Tennessee 6' 5" 333lbs 5.01 speed (fast for a big man!)

42: Darnell Washington TE Georgia 6' 6" 264lbs 4.64 speed
(I don't think he'll last to 42 though.)

45: Julius Brents CB Kansas State 6' 3" 198lbs 4.53 (Safety Speed)

49: Keeanu Benton DT Wisconsin 6' 4" 309lbs 5.08

54: Jahmyr Gibbs RB Alabama 5' 9" 199lbs 4.36 speed (Homerun Speed)

78: Isaiah Mc Guire OLB Missouri 6' 4" 268lbs 4.76 speed

86: Luke Schoonmaker TE Michigan 6' 5" 251lbs 4.63 speed

116: Bryce Ford-Wheaton WR West Virginia 6' 4" 221lbs 4.38 speed

149: Zack Kuntz TE Old Dominion 6' 7" 255lbs 4.55 speed

170: Matt Landers WR Arkansas 6' 4" 200lbs 4.37 speed

232: Marte Mapu S Sacramento State 6' 3" 216lbs No 40 time available

235: Tavius Robinson OLB Mississippi 6' 6" 257lbs 4.66 speed

242: Warren McClendon OT Georgia 6' 4" 306lbs No 40 time available

Now, we all know Gutey won't make all those trades, or draft those players, but he could do a lot worse. I just hope he doesn't.

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ShivaJim's picture

April 07, 2023 at 08:21 pm

Tight end first (Washington), big or fast wide receivers later, defensive line, safety, and please, no tackles until late. Imagine Caleb and Washington next to each other.

3 points
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BirdDogUni's picture

April 07, 2023 at 11:44 pm

I'm on board with Darnell Washington. If Caleb Jones could actually play RT for us, that would be a boon for the ages.

I like Wheaton and Landers late. Hope Gutey finds a way to snag both of them.

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stockholder's picture

April 07, 2023 at 09:52 pm

Javon Walker was the last Wr taken in Rd. 1.
TT became the GM and never took one in rd 1.
He stated more "mistakes" are made with Wr @ #1.
And very few contribute right away.

Is there a Megatron this draft.??
Look how many mistakes were made
by the Lions, before him.?

So as much as you want a Wr. @#1.
The bust potential is enormous!
TT had success because of Rodgers.
I think the thought of taking a Wr in rd. 1
Should be dismissed.

3 points
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BirdDogUni's picture

April 07, 2023 at 09:57 pm

Have a thumbs up sh.

I don't want a 1st round WR either, especially a slot WR who can't play outside.

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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 08, 2023 at 12:54 am

Aaron Rodgers is a once in a lifetime talent and made every receiver look better than they were. Most ignorant and soulless move ever for Brian and Mark to trade him.

Stockholder, I have not seen what you have said you would do with choice #15. What would you do?

I don't see many bust wide receivers when it comes to the top 15 players of the first round - I see a lot of stars though:.

This website goes back through the 1960s and earlier:

https://www.drafthistory.com/positions/wr.html

JSN's hamstring is a bit concerning as we just saw this with Christian Watson and Sammy Watkins this year and saw it with others in the past as well. It appears that JSN hurt his hamstring in the first game in the first quarter against Notre Dame going out of bounds and then tried to play through it the next week. Then took a month off and tried to come back for game 7 at Iowa and was not recovered. He then sat out the remainder of the season.

There are always going to be first round busts at every position.

If JSN is not the pick I would go with Darnell Washington - I would be happy with either.

From what I have read and watched on video and at the NFL combine , I am not excited about Addison or Johnston as wide receivers in the first round.

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stockholder's picture

April 08, 2023 at 06:23 am

@15- You take the guy that falls.
This maybe Carter, or Bijou Robinson.
Next if both are gone.
You wait for a Trade down.
(And take any #1 plus another #1)Then TE!
Finally if No one wants to trade.
You take edge- Nolan Smith @15.

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Oppy's picture

April 08, 2023 at 08:26 am

Rodgers is one of the most talented QBs to ever play, but his attitude and ego get in his way in the biggest moments. His talent is limited by his own refusal to trust his team mates and coaches.

Brian Gutekunst is doing what's best for the long term health of the Packers.

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golfpacker1's picture

April 07, 2023 at 09:56 pm

There are no safeties worth drafting in the 1st round, Maybe not until the bottom of the 2nd, Jordan Battle.

The WR position is not weak in the first 3 rounds. I would be thrilled with any of A T Perry, Tillman, Rashee Rice, Xavier Hutchinson, Mingo, Ford-Wheaton, Iosivas, Trey Palmer, Landers or Wicks. All available in rounds 2 &3. Later choices that could help us Donte Demus, Elijah Higgins, Puka Nacua, Trey Schropshire, Rakim Jarret, Jadon Haselwood, Jason Brownlee. Any of these probably makes our roster. Especially the first group. But not in first round.

We don't need a WR as badly as we need some really good TEs since we don't have any that would even start for another NFL team. None. It's the biggest need because we have none and because it would immediately improve our offense. At this point no NFL team we play bother to gameplan for our TEs because basically we don't use them in our offense. Other teams do and their offenses are harder to stop.

I could go either way on Bijan Robinson because he would make us way better @ RB because he is a total RB. He also would be cheaper for Green Bay for 3-5 years. I don't include him routinely in my mocks because we NEED TE more. I would't bitch if we did draft him and traded Aaron Jones for a 2nd or 3rd.

Trading #15 to some team that really wants him would probably be better for the Packers because we would end up with that teams 1st, 2nd, and 4th for letting them have the "Best Running Back of the Last 10 Years." That 2nd and 4th gets us a Safety and a RB. 2 needs filled. And a replacement for Jones.

If we ended up with 6 picks in the first 3 rounds after trading back twice(from #15 and #43 from Jets) and ended up with a combo of either player listed below:

Washington or Mayer

Keion White or Will Mcdonald

Gervon Dexter or Keanu Benton

A T Perry or Ford-Wheaton

Kraft or Kunz

Battle or Antonio Johnson

Anything after 6 of these would be gravy. Trade back and get more early picks.

3 points
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StarrtoRodgers's picture

April 07, 2023 at 11:33 pm

"Trading #15 to some team that really wants him would probably be better for the Packers because we would end up with that teams 1st, 2nd, and 4th for letting them have the "Best Running Back of the Last 10 Years.""

I agree on Darnell Washington, but if you do this trade it is unlikely you will get him.

And you think someone in the16th through the 32nd pick will trade their 1st (16 to 32), 2nd (48 to 64) and 4th (112 to 128) for Bijan Robinson?

Not impressed with Mayer.

Steelers also have pick 32 - the equivalent of a first round pick:

16) Washington Commanders
17) Pittsburgh Steelers
18) Detroit Lions
19) Tampa Bay Buccaneers
20) Seattle Seahawks
21) Los Angeles Chargers
22) Baltimore Ravens
23) Minnesota Vikings
24) Jacksonville Jaguars
25) New York Giants
26) Dallas Cowboys
27) Buffalo Bills
28) Cincinnati Bengals
29) New Orleans Saints (from San Francisco through Miami and Denver)
30) Philadelphia Eagles
31) Kansas City Chiefs

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greengold's picture

April 08, 2023 at 05:17 am

If we get 13 take Washington and trade 15.
If we don’t, take Washington.

I could easily see Gutekunst taking one or two WR R4-R7, then adding more UDFA.

Need positions are real: TE, EDGE, S, DL, OL, CB, and CB might be more of a need than we know.

If we get 13 & 15, and Quentin drops to 15, I’d take him with Washington. Been mentioning JSN, but that’s because I don’t see Quentin getting to us.

*Can you imagine the positive impact adding both TE Darnell Washington AND WR Quentin Johnston to the Packers O?

Wow.

Should Gutekunst keep both 13 & 15, with Quentin gone? I think he adds Washington and OLB Nolan Smith.

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Catman22's picture

April 08, 2023 at 07:14 am

Iowa's Lukas Van Ness checks all the boxes we need for our defensive line and should be available at #15. He will be productive at any position on the D line.
WR can be addressed in the 2nd/3rd rd with University of Mississippi WR Jonathan Mingo.

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WD's picture

April 08, 2023 at 12:00 pm

Negotiate for a WR from the Jets In addition to draft picks for Rodgers. Then draft a receiver the third day preferably a TE. Try using Samori Toure for a change. If you must; draft the best slot receiver and playmaker in the draft. To be specific Jahmyr Gibbs. The problem for the Packers is they only have one number one pick and it is a long way from their first pick to the second. All players in between are what is called in economics opportunity costs. Or, what we could have had. With Gibbs paired with Watson, Doubs, Toure and even Aaron Jones you will not need a receiving tight end. Gibbs changes the entire offense. He is that good . People forget he was the leading receiver at Alabama. Some even say he is the best running back in the draft. I agree. So, if you get him you can then focus on getting the best defensive front seven possible. Starting with the d-line including edge. Names like Adebaware and Calijah Kancey come to mind as they can play in the middle or edge because they have the speed as well as size. And, maybe we could trade up to get one. Probably lower first or early second round picks. You can not expect to get more than two starters. We hopefully will have great years from our second year players. If that happens GB will be very competitive in the first year of Love.

-1 points
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golfpacker61's picture

April 08, 2023 at 02:05 pm

No to the 5'9 RB from Alabama. Too small & too expensive of a pick. You would get the same production from Achane or Spears and you could pick either in the 3rd not the 1st. They aren't Bijan but either of them, Eric Gray or Roschon or Evan Hull lets us move on from AJs $$$$$.

As for WRs, I would jump up and down if we ended up with Andre Iosivas and Matt Landers in the 3rd and 4th rounds. Low 4.4 and high 4.3 , both over 6'3 and 200 lbs. Sleeper Trea Schropshire-UAB over 22 YPC.

Washington, Mayer, and Kraft are interchangeable, can play every down and I would be happy with any of them.
Schoonmaker in mid rounds and finish with Whyle or Averett late rounds. Mission accomplished.

And yes I do think multiple RB hungry teams will trade up for Bijan and give up more to get him. Hendon Hooker too.

Edges are so plentiful really good ones will be avilable in 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th rounds. Not with first pick.

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