Cory's Corner: Welcome To Trade Season
This isn't the offseason, it's trade season.
This is where we are. We are no longer in the offseason.
This has now become trade season.
“Make no mistake: Both sides are fully aware that a trade is a very real scenario this offseason for Aaron Rodgers,” said ESPN’s Adam Schefter on Saturday.
When I first saw this, I was skeptical as well. First of all, Rodgers had one of his worst seasons as a pro with 12 picks — the most since his first year as a starter in 2008. Granted, I think the 39-year-old can still play, but if the Packers were to trade Rodgers, the window to do that was after he won back-to-back MVP awards in 2021.
Secondly, there is the sticky issue about Jordan Love. If the Packers were toying with trading Rodgers, then they should’ve played Love. You just do. And yes, I have heard the argument that says the Packers see him all the time in practice. Yes, I understand that, but there’s a Grand Canyon-sized difference between practice and actually playing in a real regular season game. I have been impressed with Love. He threw for 113 yards and a touchdown at Philadelphia in a Week 12 loss.
But despite all that, I honestly don’t know if Love can be a franchise quarterback. And for all the people that think that Love is terrible, they have absolutely no idea as well. Love’s future projection has been under such a lock and key that it will either be Green Bay’s biggest prize or it will be its most dubious failure.
Look, I completely understand why the Packers would do this. Rodgers knew that he was going to be throwing to younger wideouts and he didn’t spend the extra time with them to show them the ropes. He knew they were going to struggle, but he used that as ammo to finger blame instead of swallowing it for himself and moving on.
This is what the Packers need to do. They need to look in the mirror and be honest with themselves. Are the Packers a legit Super Bowl contender? Because if they want to get out of the NFC, this year’s team needs some tweaking. The running game needs to be trusted. The defense cannot allow gains of over six yards a play and the offense cannot be predictable in short yardage situations.
Does that mean that Rodgers has to go? I don’t think so. But like I said, the Packers really have to figure out who they are and what they want to become.
Are the Packers willing to walk the tightrope of uncertainty with Rodgers that obviously Davante Adamas was unwilling to do? If Rodgers comes back to Green Bay in 2023, it will be the same song and dance the following offseason.
Many are opining that the Jets would be the perfect landing spot because they are desperate enough to give up a couple of first rounders. Other teams that could be interesting trade partners are the Saints, Panthers, Titans and Patriots.
I don’t think the Packers are a long way from competing again, which of course is the beauty of the NFL. It seems like in the blink of an eye, the Lions went from league doormat to competing for a playoff spot.
So does Packers president Mark Murphy see the Packers competing again with the “complicated fella?”
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Cory Jennerjohn is a graduate from UW-Oshkosh and has been in sports media for over 15 years. He was a co-host on "Clubhouse Live" and has also done various radio and TV work as well. He has written for newspapers, magazines and websites. He currently is a columnist for CHTV and also does various podcasts. He recently earned his Masters degree from the University of Iowa. He can be found on Twitter: @Coryjennerjohn
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Comments (116)
NickPerry
January 24, 2023 at 06:39 am
"So does Packers president Mark Murphy see the Packers competing again with the “complicated fella?”
And here lies the whole fucking problem of the Green Bay Packers. It SHOULD have Brian Gutekunst's name in there, NOT Mark Murphy's.
UGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!
PS... I apologize for my language. I just see RED every time I hear Murphy's name tied in with what SHOULD be GM decisions.
NickPerry
January 24, 2023 at 06:40 am
PSS...TRADE his ass! Please, lets just move on, see what we have, and stop leaving the fan base and the organization hostage. Brett Favre's will he or won't he retire every year. And here he's doing it himself.
RCPackerFan
January 24, 2023 at 07:28 am
Be careful what you wish for. Its all that I am going to say.
You may want to trade his ass, but doing that may not have the same results that we had 15 years ago when we traded Favre away. Odds are highly against that happening.
We could very well become one of those teams that just hopes to get back to the playoffs.
So again. Be mindful of what you are asking and be prepared for what you are asking for to not work when it happens.
pantz_bURp
January 24, 2023 at 07:31 am
"We could very well become one of those teams that just hopes to get back to the playoffs".
Like this last season, RCPack?
RCPackerFan
January 24, 2023 at 11:05 am
exactly. But repeatedly over and over for years to come. How have the Colts been after Peyton Manning left?
How long did it take for the 49ers to become relevant again after Steve Young left?
There are cases upon cases of great QB's leaving and the team basically doing nothing after they left.
Latest example. Patriots. Belichek is regarded as the best coach in the league. And he hasn't made the playoffs since Brady left.
jurp
January 24, 2023 at 12:14 pm
How long did it take the 49ers to become relevant after Montana left?
Oh wait, that doesn't fit the narrative.
RCPackerFan
January 24, 2023 at 12:16 pm
because they went from Montana to Young who they know was good. Just like the Packers went from Favre to Rodgers who they had a good feeling was going to be good. If they know Love is going to be good. Go for it. But unless they know he is going to be good, why would they do the move. that would be career suicide.
jurp
January 24, 2023 at 03:25 pm
If Love is truly going to bust and MM, BG and MLF all know it, then they're idiots for not addressing the situation during the last draft; they're now in a lose-lose scenario because keeping AR as our QB will not win them a SB and may well find BG and MLF unemployed a year from now after MM throws them under the bus.
It's time to cut bait.
croatpackfan
January 24, 2023 at 08:17 am
Why are so many people here is afraid of future. Maybe because of SC hell that will follow if ACR will play...
RCPackerFan
January 24, 2023 at 11:10 am
Because the writing is on the wall. I don't give a crap if anyone likes Rodgers or not. That doesn't bother me. Clearly a lot of people just hate Rodgers for whatever their reasons are.
Regardless of peoples feelings Rodgers gives us our best chance at a Super Bowl for this coming year. That is all that I'm concerned about now is year 2023 (with an eye to 2024 and beyond). Maybe Love could be good. None of us know. Packers don't really know either. If they knew this wouldn't be a conversation because they would trade Rodgers or would be drafting another QB.
Everyone wants to place all the blame for this year on Rodgers without looking at the problems around him on the team.
barutanseijin
January 24, 2023 at 01:53 pm
The team wasn’t that great and neither was Rodgers. At Rodgers’ age, he’s unlikely to improve and his contract will make him increasingly expensive. It’s doubtful he gives the team more than Love would and he’s a lot more expensive. Time to unload Rodgers.
Packerpasty
January 24, 2023 at 05:55 pm
put a few more weapons around him and keep him healthy I bet anything he'll be much improved again...and the author says theres a big difference from practice and real games as in what the coaches see in Love...its also possible that Love will be worse in real games than he is in practice...we may soon find out..
TXCHEESE
January 24, 2023 at 03:03 pm
I think most fans on this site, know they are extremely luck to have Rodgers as their QB. Problem is, time marches on. Anyone who watched the Packers this year, knows, he just doesn't have the magic any longer, and that's OK. We all lose our physical abilities. It's a young man's game. In a perfect world Rodgers could probably sit back in the pocket and sling it all over the field again. Problem is, it's never going to be perfect. He's going to get chased and smacked around....just the facts, and that has a much greater affect on the body as you age.
baldski
January 24, 2023 at 08:21 pm
Rogers has proven in the past 11 years that he chokes in big games. You cannot depend on him to win the big one.
Coldworld
January 24, 2023 at 08:29 am
This living in the past is fantasy. The question you need to ask is what if we had stuck with Favre? There’s no win in just trying to pretend that Rodgers is for ever. Add in the cap and the generational turnover and this is not a team where he’s going to thrive in what time he has left. We aren’t getting better except through developing talent and he doesn’t have that time and we don’t have the cap to do anything about that
Change is not always good, but it’s essential to survive. Stasis is a recipe for extinction.
RCPackerFan
January 24, 2023 at 11:20 am
The difference with the Favre-Rodgers thing was they had a pretty good idea what kind of QB Rodgers was going to be. They saw it in practice. McCarthy talked about if he had any balls he would have put Rodgers in at halftime of the Giants playoff game. They knew Rodgers was pretty damn good.
Right now does anyone in GB know if Love is any good? He played a good half against the Eagles. I'm sure they have a better idea in practice how he is. But we don't know that at this point.
That is why its hard for us to say one way or another.
Most people want the change made because they don't like Rodgers for whatever reason.
Leatherhead
January 24, 2023 at 09:36 pm
""Right now does anyone in GB know if Love is any good?""
The GM, who has grown up through the ranks from scout to head of scouting to GM, says "he's ready".
Coldworld
January 24, 2023 at 08:29 am
This living in the past is fantasy. The question you need to ask is what if we had stuck with Favre? There’s no win in just trying to pretend that Rodgers is for ever. Add in the cap and the generational turnover and this is not a team where he’s going to thrive in what time he has left. We aren’t getting better except through developing talent and he doesn’t have that time and we don’t have the cap to do anything about that
Change is not always good, but it’s essential to survive. Stasis is a recipe for extinction.
MooPack
January 24, 2023 at 08:31 am
So correct, it needed to be said twice.
pete-nado
January 24, 2023 at 09:42 pm
Agree. Trade him. You have your own first rounder and then at least one more...and if Murphy or Gute or whomever calls the shot is uncertain about Love...use one of the firsts on a qb and then you at least have a qb backup plan if Love doesn't pan out.
mnbadger
January 24, 2023 at 12:23 pm
Sorry Nick, but BG didn't make the AR contract decision in a silo, no matter what is said.
MM had absolute vision to and final sign-off of that contract.
If he didn't, I would fire MM for utter complacency.
Even though I thought it was an atrocious contract, I wouldn't fire him for his decision.
His job is to make the tough decisions. We can disagree, but he has to own the outcome.
GPG!
NickPerry
January 24, 2023 at 05:18 pm
Yes, I know this. My point was this SHOULD have been Gutes decision to extend Rodgers, just like it would have been Ron Wolfs or Ted Thompson's decision, and NOT Murphy's.
This is EXACTLY why things are so F'd up. The cap was NEVER an issue with Ted. Granted, he didn't really go after any FA's but neither does Gute, not really outside that first year. He dabbles here and there but that's it. Mostly because he's so fricking cash strapped from Murphy's boneheaded moves.
pantz_bURp
January 24, 2023 at 06:56 am
"We are no longer in the offseason"...exactly CJJ.
Most of this organization has been off, in season.
We will be fine and all this angst hopefully will spur some changes. I will never lose hope UNLESS those sweet cheerleaders trade in their Hardware Hank gloves for sequins...then turn out the lights, the parties over.
Everytime, and I mean everytime I believe #12 won't be the starter and _______ is. I (with much gusto) reinact the When Harry Met Sally scene at the cafe.
Yep, next chapter for this great-storied franchise...I ain't afraid.
Peace ✌️
Johnblood27
January 24, 2023 at 07:07 am
I'll have what you're having...
pantz_bURp
January 24, 2023 at 07:13 am
:D yes, yess, yesss,Yesss, YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!
croatpackfan
January 24, 2023 at 07:10 am
My position is known. I'm advocating ACR trade from before 2021 season. I understand why they did not. Jordan Love was unprepared to go and play as starting QB. I was OK with. After 2021 I was all in for trading Aaron Rodgers and after last season I do not see how they will not do that. There is 2 reason. His abilities start to diminish and his attitude. I remember when he was throwing the ball all over the field. I remember that in 2011 or 2012 there was game in which he tergeted 12 different players through the game. That was beauty of QBacking. From there he used very small number of different players. From 2017 it looks like he had always decision presnap to who he will target (one or most 2 players). He rarely used rrunning game. That focus on one player explode in 2020 and 2021, continuing in 2022 season (this time was Watson!), waiting until is to late to distribute the ball to open player, so it throws were finishig in only 3 scenarios - incomplete, interception or sack.
IT IS TIME! Either to trade him or ask him to retire. I understand that retiring is his decision, and I'm OK with that. But Packers need to put dead line for the decision. I also understand that it is not easy to make that decision for any person, so I have no problems with time he is taking for himself to make that decision.
Regarding Jordan Love, long term I belive he can excel as QB and the leader of the team. Short term I will not ask to much. Also, cleaning the future SC space must be the utmost importance for Packers. I know we will need to have patience and maybe it will need for one or two seasons for Jordan to blossom.
I'm also aware that my expectation can be wrong. But Packers need huge short term change in many aspects of football operations. And that starts with allowing people who was trained to run the show to do so.
Thank you.
RCPackerFan
January 24, 2023 at 07:10 am
Trade season -
Ahh yes. That time of year when there are a group of Packer fans that think the only path our team should take is to trade away our best players. We just saw the article last week right here on CHTV about them trading away Aaron Jones and that blew up on twitter.
When it comes to Rodgers, its the yearly song and dance right now. Essentially he is using the leverage he has to retain the players he wants to remain in GB. I don't blame him for trying to make sure some of the players he wants to remain does remain. But as an organization, they need to be willing to work with him, but they also need to take a stand against that kind of thinking as well. If they wanted to move on from Lewis or Cobb or Lazard or someone else they need to be upfront with Rodgers and tell him they are going in another direction from that player.
"I don’t think the Packers are a long way from competing again"
If the Packers thought they were farther away I think they would have made a bunch of coaching changes. This year was a fluke when you compare it to the last 3 years. Rodgers didn't have his best year, but lets take a closer look at the reason why. The reason why he had a down year is because they got rid of the best WR in the league. And they also let their deep threat leave. They didn't have a suitable replacement. Essentially they tried replacing Adams and MVS with Watson and Doubs. Now those guys I think will have bright futures, but you can't put that much on rookies. They brought in Sammy Watkins and that was a fail. Besides the WR issues, they had OL issues. I explained that yesterday. Tonyan was coming off a torn ACL and wasn't back to his pre acl injury form. Also he played with a broken thumb, which clearly affected some of his throws.
After the Dallas game the offense started gaining traction. Basically at that point Watson started to emerge and they finally started to settle in with the new OL they started to deploy.
Next year Watson, Doubs and Toure should take steps. They have figured out the OL, but even there Tom should take a step. Myers should improve with a full season of play. And Runyan should become more comfortable at RG. The offense should improve next year with the players it has alone. But then add in the players through the draft. One defense they will be getting Gary and Stokes back. That should help. Walker, Wyatt and Enagbare all got a ton of playing time and should take steps next year.
I firmly believe this team is competing next year for a championship if Rodgers comes back. If he doesn't return, then I don't know how good we will be because we have absolutely no idea what they have in Love.
dobber
January 24, 2023 at 07:30 am
"That time of year when there are a group of Packer fans that think the only path our team should take is to trade away our best players."
It's fantasy football season. That time when mock drafts take over and everyone thinks that every player can be traded for premium picks, every trade partner (with desired compensation) is already figured out, and it's management's fault for not making these fantasies come true--and some people literally hold it against management.
Bottom line, WRT trade season, is that until Adams last year the Packers haven't been big swingers--or really participants--in the off-season trade biz. Even then, the Packers hold fast to the party line that they really didn't want to trade Adams and wanted him back at a rate that, to quote Spaceballs, would've gone plaid. If they do start to play this year, meaning that they peddle the Bakhtiaris and AJones types on their roster, that means a lot as to where this roster is going.
RCPackerFan
January 24, 2023 at 08:13 am
Completely agree Dobber.
I don't see them trading Bakhtiari or Jones, but this time last year I never would have thought that they would have traded Adams either.
And if they do make trades like that, I see us sitting in the same spot as we were this year.
dobber
January 24, 2023 at 08:20 am
Honestly, if it were me as GM, I'd be putting out feelers on Bakhtiari to see what I could get. The cap relief isn't that much, but with that knee I'd rather sell a year early than a year late and there are younger and cheaper pieces on the roster that can fill that role.
Coldworld
January 24, 2023 at 08:36 am
If an asset isn’t going to get you to the objective, then the rational move is to convert it and to seek to employ that remuneration in a way that will increase the chances of reaching one’s destination. With Bakh, that comes down to getting what one can now because he isn’t taking this team to a Super Bowl.
The same is true of Rodgers and, sadly, Jones. The reality is that their cap implications mean we won’t have a chance in 3 to 5 years either if they stay. That would be fine if they gave us one now, but if you believe that then you missed the last couple of years in any meaningful sense. Bluntly, it’s over, don’t screw up the future for failing to face that anymore than we already have.
T7Steve
January 24, 2023 at 09:37 am
"The same is true of Rodgers and, sadly. Jones." "but if you believe that then you missed the last couple of years in any meaningful sense."
I know you know it's not about any of these players or their future. It's about how they're being used by the coaches/system. It's a fail/fail.
Coldworld
January 24, 2023 at 09:47 am
It’s partly coaching, certainly, but it’s also cost and relative career phases. To win, the majority must be good at the same time. Half now half later doesn’t work.
PeteK
January 24, 2023 at 09:33 am
If we can get a 3rd rounder, then yes. However, anything less is not worth it because he played well in his 9 starts at a very crucial position. It also gives us time to see what we have in Tom. The dead cap hit next year is 11 mill, this year 23.
jurp
January 24, 2023 at 07:46 am
Nice revisionist writing, pal. The Packers didn't "let" Adams and MVS leave - Rodgers' exorbitant salary meant that they couldn't AFFORD to keep them. If your hypothesis is true and that Rodgers' play declined because those two guys were gone, then he, himself, was the author of his own demise.
"I firmly believe this team is competing next year for a championship if Rodgers comes back." - Mark Murphy, is are you RCPackerFan? In no universe is this true.
dobber
January 24, 2023 at 08:11 am
Looking at MVS' production in KC, it certainly doesn't look like he's a bargain at $10M AAV. Would not be surprised to see KC cut him loose...it saves them nearly $7M against their cap, and they have other speedsters who could fill that role.
Coldworld
January 24, 2023 at 02:56 pm
Interesting. I see Lazard projected at about 11 million AAV. Very different players, obviously. Lazard got a ton more snaps, 6 TDs to 2 and about a hundred more yards. However, yards per target and snap heavily favor MVS. Seems to me, on that yardstick, MVS was about par and Lazard over used. That seems to be about the going rate for 3/4 types with strengths but limitations.
RCPackerFan
January 24, 2023 at 08:20 am
"The Packers didn't "let" Adams and MVS leave - Rodgers' exorbitant salary meant that they couldn't AFFORD to keep them."
False info right here. The Packers didn't want to pay Adams what he was wanting the previous year. He was asking for more money then what Hopkins got. Packers refused which then pissed Adams off and he was done with GB. When he told them he wanted to be traded and he wouldn't play for GB again, they then offered him more $ then what Raiders paid him. Packers could have afforded him, but they messed up the deal first. This is all been reported.
MVS they didn't even try to pay. Which I don't blame them overall. But he would have helped them this year.
I wish I was Mark Murphy. I'd love to have his salary, and I would love the ability to run the Packers organization. Though, the stress to run that job would be pretty intense.
You don't believe the Packers will be competing next year? Then you and I are watching 2 completely different things.
Guam
January 24, 2023 at 08:49 am
RCPF: I appreciate your commitment and fandom for the Packers, but I don't see the Packers competing for anything meaningful next year with or without Rodgers. This organization has serious problems starting with Mark Murphy and extending through the coaching staff. I don't believe this coaching staff can win a championship.
I have been on the trade Rodgers bandwagon simply to fix the cap and get the financial side of the Packers right so when the broom comes to clean out Murphy, LaFleur and Barry, the Packers will have the cap space to be able to compete for championships.
RCPackerFan
January 24, 2023 at 11:28 am
I will never stop rooting and cheering for GB. I'm definitely an optimistic fan.
If Rodgers is there, I see them competing (pending on moves that are made this offseason).
The reasons why I'm optimistic, are the players they have. And the youth that they brought in though last years draft. Those are the core players that will push us forward next year. The WR and OL positions are going to improve assuming they don't get rid of Bakhtiari.
The offense will be better, especially if they can add an athletic TE.
I believe the defense will be better even though Barry likely is still there. Gary and Stokes will be coming back. Walker, Wyatt and Enagbare are entering year 2. I believe the defense will take a jump. I believe they will use the way they played against Minnesota and come up with a defensive scheme that looks more like that.
I don't care about the cap. As we have seen they can manipulate the cap to make whatever they want to do work. Minus signing a big name free agent, which I'm ok with. Finding the Campbell, Douglas, Reed, types of players have been just as beneficial to our teams.
I believe we are a TE, WR, Pass rusher and whatever we do at S, away from a super bowl run.
Coldworld
January 24, 2023 at 09:45 am
Adams wanted to be paid as the best, as the league’s highest paid receiver in a market blown out by a ludicrous contract for Hopkins. The two sides weren’t close. Neither denied it, though belatedly the Packers are rumored to have thrown the bank at him in a last minute offer. The rest is you fitting the narrative to your purpose.
Interestingly, had we paid that, I suspect that we’d be adding the wisdom of that to these exchanges. We’d certainly not be retaining people like Bakh and would have to admit that Jefferson took the mantle anyway. One wonders where Adams will be next year. Lots of irony in this. No need to add your imagination.
dobber
January 24, 2023 at 10:22 am
The WR market went crazy last off-season in general. Adams, Hill, Brown...stupid money being thrown around. Hill has big cap numbers every year, but Adams--most of his money is cash in 2025 and beyond that he'll never see.
RCPackerFan
January 24, 2023 at 11:00 am
I'm not fitting any narratives into it. I'm repeating what Jason Wilde has said on Wilde and Tausch.
Had we paid Adams we wouldn't have gotten 2 draft picks and signed Campbell and Douglas.
dobber
January 24, 2023 at 12:39 pm
The whole package was, as you point out, pretty helpful.
But keep in mind that dealing proven players for draft picks and winning happens less often than we'd like to think.
RCPackerFan
January 24, 2023 at 01:05 pm
When you trade proven players for draft picks, it isn't always a winning situation. But I'm happy with the players they got from the trade. Essentially they got Walker and Watson for Adams in the draft. And then they were able to sign Campblell and Douglas. Essentially they traded Adams for 4 players.
pete-nado
January 24, 2023 at 10:00 pm
Sort of thankful they didn't end up paying Adams. You can't pay the entire team top of the league salaries and have anything left. And no depth if one of the highly paid get hurt in a game full of injuries.
Rodgers was paid to make things happen with knowledge that the payment means fewer weapons. And then the man with the massive contract can't be bothered to come in early and help train up the young guys. If you don't man up and work with the young guys to help the team's prospects, then you are no longer the leadership material you once may have been.
Untylu1968
January 24, 2023 at 08:08 am
So another year of snapping the ball as the play clock strikes zeros, hero ball on third and ones, along with going shotgun, first and goal from the two!? All while keeping his over the hill pals around! Rodgers will not change his approach and may even dive deeper into his rabbit hole, after another season of God knows what. Not saying we'll be better off without him, but don't think the organization can handle another year.
RCPackerFan
January 24, 2023 at 08:22 am
What is hero ball? I see this brought up all the time. So how do you define hero ball?
croatpackfan
January 24, 2023 at 08:35 am
Similar to hail Mary throw, just not at the end of game. Is that good enough for you?
croatpackfan
January 24, 2023 at 08:35 am
Double, sorry
Packerpasty
January 24, 2023 at 10:53 am
and everyone loves "hero ball" when it works, right?? Then its not hero ball its a TD or long gain and everyone goes crazy..
Untylu1968
January 24, 2023 at 09:04 am
#HeroBall. Third and one, so let's go shotgun, throw a bomb to the sidelines, to avoid the possibility of a pick. If you've never seen it, you my man, are blind! It's almost become predictable.
RCPackerFan
January 24, 2023 at 11:02 am
Ok, great. In that situation do you know what the play call is? If the play was changed? Was there options on the play that if the defense did this, the Packers were doing that?
My problem with hero ball term is that we don't know what the play calls are and what they are trying to do offensively.
I don't like taking 30-40 yard shot plays on 3rd and 1. But it doesn't mean its just Rodgers making that decision on his own. We don't know that part of it.
MainePackFan
January 24, 2023 at 01:02 pm
Hang in there RC. The natives are restless today : )
RCPackerFan
January 24, 2023 at 01:34 pm
lol. I feel great.
Anything pro Rodgers or anti trade everyone definitely doesn't sit well with a group of people here. But I have been coming here for a long time. Whether people like what I have to say or not, that's up to them. These are my opinions on it and I won't change my mind on how I feel about it.
But for me I'm great. lol.
MainePackFan
January 24, 2023 at 03:28 pm
Lol. I know the feeling. It's all good though, at the end of the day it's just Packers fans passionately discussing the path forward.
stockholder
January 24, 2023 at 07:41 am
I'm not ready to swap Lambeau for soldier field.
Rodgers wants to retire a Packer.
IMO that hasn't changed. And he could pull a Luck!
But who spoiled all that with the selection of Love?
Seems the problem in Green Bay is Gutey.
He's No TT, and we have the Cap Numbers to prove it.
But the thing that scares me the most.
Is Gutey's judgement of QBs and TEs.
WE Know he says he 'll get the coaches what they want!
But thats just not the case with the selection of Love.
We're back to the force of a gm trying to tell a coach.
I see the days of MM returning.
And Barry couldn't stop squat when it counted.
Yet who keeps paying the price for all this.
The guy who wants to retire a Packer.
Shut him down. Take away the check book.
And you'll see the truth about Gutey.
Get the coaches what they want.
You have a Hall of fame QB. And he knows Talent.
He stayed with Adams when everyone wanted better.
There is a reason why every draft is so vital.
The packers crystal ball has cracks.
And wishing, isn't going to change that.
Nobody is going to help the packers.
Their going to keep raiding the roster
until we're in the cellar.
dobber
January 24, 2023 at 07:47 am
"it's management's fault for not making these fantasies come true--and some people literally hold it against management."
Right on cue.
jurp
January 24, 2023 at 07:54 am
It's like he's a refugee from some weird upside-down parallel universe, where Murphy hasn't emasculated the GM, where Russ Ball isn't in the front office, where Gutekunst is in charge of contracts, where Rodgers is 2022's MVP, and where the Packers are playing in the NFCCG this Sunday.
dobber
January 24, 2023 at 08:01 am
If ARod of 2022 or 2023 were the ARod of 2010-2016, things are completely different. But--as you indicate--this ARod appears to be rapidly regressing to the mean...which means that better could be had, and likely at a far lower price. Good health for this franchise doesn't lie with 12 on the roster, and--with 12--any chance to win a title in 2023 lies with heroic efforts from developing younger players, immaculate team health, and unforseen contributions from either draft picks or scrap heap FA acquisitions.
Coldworld
January 24, 2023 at 08:57 am
In 2018 we still had a window. We had cap too. We went from an aging roster with holes galore and terrible depth quality to a contender by 2020 at least. We got there because Murphy slept on TTs decline and let Ball, an accountant, become de facto GM. He let good players go and oversaw terrible drafts.
Murphy then, instead of resigning or being removed, had himself made football supremo. He chose a head coach personally, messed up bringing in a veteran ST coach and subsequently sold the farm to a QB.
Through adding key pieces in FA in part, the roster improved much faster than many of us here thought possible. We became a contender. Our roster was held together through 2021. We failed to capitalize on it through a mix of baffling personnel moves in key games, dubious game planning, failing to clean up issues from in season or to learn from mistakes against opponents we had faced previously, being out coached and out motivated. We blew both chances. That’s it, the window closed.
The roster looked set to move on, Murphy wouldn’t. His choice of LaFleur has been a disaster, his handling of Rodgers a disgrace and his grasp of reality is extremely dubious and our cap position is a disaster both now and in coming years. History tells us that the new TV deal will explode salaries fast and early. Our competitive disadvantage will be material. Murphy as a GM in effect has completely wasted the last years of Rodgers and undermined our future competitive position.
It’s time to face it, stop blindly trusting what every scintilla of evidence plainly indicates, and cut the cord in the past that we might have a future worth cheering for while we are still breathing. No this team wasn’t close to contending this year. The victories over some very weak or sub par teams at the end were not something to justify that kind of conclusion. Another flawed team absolutely handed it to us. Yes we have some green shoots, but they aren’t blooming while most of our biggest stars still shine. It’s a classic case of conflicting paths.
One way or another Rodgers is done being successful in Green Bay. Facing up to that might start the climb to recovery. It might mean we don’t have to say the same about Watson in a decade. Not doing so will just make things uglier and longer lasting. It is as true off the field as on, and perhaps even more critically.
Another year of this and we are stuck with Rodgers full cap hit (99 million), long after he’s gone and a new head coach with maybe no Love and thus some retread or shiny new draftee. Murphy is on a path to a new wall of shame here, along with the board members who facilitated this. LaFleur may never coach again. This is a last chance saloon for so many, but blindly they seem determined to charge the guns head on.
Yes, this is negative, but sometimes that’s what it takes to avoid worse and regain the ascendancy.
T7Steve
January 24, 2023 at 09:54 am
"It might mean we don’t have to say the same about Watson in a decade." That saddens to remind me of James Lofton and Stirling Sharp.
If you don't learn from the past, you're apt to repeat it.
pantz_bURp
January 24, 2023 at 07:47 am
Stock, I like your unwavering passion... seriously.
Regarding Luck and Love, couldn't we all use a little bit more of each in our lives?
jurp
January 24, 2023 at 07:50 am
Yawn. Same old-same old, just with better punctuation. Not as entertainingly bonkers today - only a 2 out of 10.
dobber
January 24, 2023 at 08:04 am
"... just with better punctuation."
Think of it as Vogon spoken-word poetry.
LeotisHarris
January 24, 2023 at 08:41 am
Arthur Dent is on his way with a dozen cookies for you, dobber. Prepare your towel for the feast.
jurp
January 24, 2023 at 12:19 pm
So, kind of like a Vogon Beowulf, then?
Needs a couple of swamp-monsters and a dragon to really hold one's attention, though, doesn't it?
Coldworld
January 24, 2023 at 03:00 pm
Since the Vogons were the ultimate evolution of bureaucratic intransigence, that would indeed be excruciating.
jurp
January 24, 2023 at 03:31 pm
"that would indeed be excruciating"
Unless you were a Vogon, I suppose. They did seem a rather cheerless lot, though - maybe too much spoken-word poetry?
croatpackfan
January 24, 2023 at 08:40 am
"And you'll see the truth about Gutey."
I can't wait to see that truth. It would be awesome for Packers if Brian Gutekunst would run the show, not as old and mentally under capacitate Mark Murphy as GM of football operations.
croatpackfan
January 24, 2023 at 08:40 am
Double
jannesbjornson
January 24, 2023 at 03:58 pm
PFN
#15 to Wash for #16+ #2 (2024).
#16 to JAX for #24 + #1& #2 (2024).
#24 Mayer ND TE
JAX #1 & #2 to KC for #30.
#30 Uzomah K-State Edge
#45 Tillman Tenn WR
#2 & #4 (2024) to Bears for #64.
#64 Schmitz Gophers C/OG
#78 Benton Badgers DT
#114 Eric Gray OKL RB
#147 C. Jones Purdue WR
#202 Incoom C. Mich Edge
#211 Averett Bethune TE
#221 Henderson M State S
stockholder
January 24, 2023 at 04:12 pm
Tonyan wants to stay in GB.
I doubt Mayor gets drafted if Tonyan signs.
jannesbjornson
January 25, 2023 at 11:25 am
Tonyan has to move on. Draft three TEs if necessary, get better.
HarryHodag
January 24, 2023 at 07:53 am
More clickbait.
I have always reminded the anti-Love folks that it really is pointless to put thumbs down on him. He hasn't played because he's behind a Hall of Fame diva who wants everything his way. Whether Love is a franchise QB is also not an issue because we assume you have to be a HOF QB to win in the NFL. You don't. Ask the 49'ers who are in the championship game with Brock Purdy. What you need is a QB who can run they system. Russell Wilson also wanted it his way in Seattle, now he's playing in Denver, losing, and Seattle is winning. Geno Smith went from washout to hero because he simply ran the system as presented.
There is no affordable answer at QB other than Love. What's done is done and quite frankly I think Love will provide an element of mobility that Rodgers has lost.
One other lesson to remember is there are 21+ other players on a football team. I'm far more concerned about a defense that often is gashed than Love's role at QB.
Packerpasty
January 24, 2023 at 11:01 am
Get real...the Niners are a loaded team with a fantastic defense,,,there is no way they can keep all those dudes, they could end up like the Rams...they better win it all this year...Geno Smith has had his moment in the sun, he's a mediocre back up and it has been and will be shown that this is true...where are the Seahawks now?? Same place as the Packers...Love does have mobility and he will run because he still doesn't go through his progressions down the field...maybe he'll learn but who knows...
croatpackfan
January 24, 2023 at 11:33 am
"...because he still doesn't go through his progressions down the field."
Based on what you get that conclusion?
BirdDogUni
January 24, 2023 at 06:12 pm
His rookie year? IDK. Didn't make much sense to me either. He looked poised and when through his reads the 10 snaps he actually got to play this year, IMO.
T7Steve
January 24, 2023 at 07:54 am
I'm not going to comment on the "ifs" of trades. The only "ifs" that mater start on both sides of the line of scrimmage. "If" the Packers are going to contend just for the division, let alone a Super Bowl, they have to quit getting pushed around by even the bottom of the leagues' lines.
I don't like the Brett Favre waiting game any more than the next guy, but it doesn't matter "if" the coaches think we can finesse the rest of the NFL with cute play calls that have to be executed perfectly to have a chance and then are obsolete after they've been seen because they're easy to predict.
You have to get a yard when you need a yard. Play a cute play when it's 2nd and 1 not on 3rd or 4th. Did you notice that 2nd and1 is the only time they tried to force one up the gut?
dobber
January 24, 2023 at 08:14 am
I wonder if--assuming Jerry Gray leaves--Jim Leonhard would be a candidate the new secondary/Assistant DC? I realize that I'm just feeding into the Leonhard fixation around here, but anything that might breathe some fire into the defense and perhaps percolate up into Barry's scheme would be welcome.
That said, it's been remarkably quiet on the Leonhard front in general. There are rumors that he might be in the running to be the next DC in 'Bama (which would be an obvious springboard to a power-5 head coaching job), but they seem to have cooled some--and staffs are getting filled.
Coldworld
January 24, 2023 at 08:23 am
The packers are a long way from competing. As the young part of the team hopefully ascends, the older part will decline and is already taking cap away that could be used to supplement. That’s a recipe for futility. Has this season taught nothing?
Packers0808
January 24, 2023 at 08:24 am
As fans we think we know everything in reality we know squat, but is fun to speculate!
pantz_bURp
January 24, 2023 at 09:32 am
So true P0808,
I get to make decisions without checking the balance in my corporate checkbook. I don't need 3 references for confirmation. I have full access to the comings and goings in and near 1265 Lombardi Ave.
I have it set up, where...if I play it right, I can look like a genius! :D
Since'61
January 24, 2023 at 08:32 am
With the exception of Green Bay I don't think that there is any FO in the league that would be dumb enough to make a 21st century version of the John Hadl trade.
I think that the time for trading Rodgers for a bunch of 1s and 2s has passed. The Packers might still be able to get a few 2s and 3s but even that is probably a stretch at this point. You can be sure that Murphy and Gute are afraid to death of trading Rodgers for a few mid round picks and then playing Love and having him completely go bust. Then what??? They would be tarred and feathered and then hung in public in "Titletown."
If they have all this confidence in Love they should make a deal, even one that is not so great in terms of return for the Packers. If they have all this confidence in Love then why wasn't he playing against the Jets, Lions and Commanders while Rodgers was injured. It should not matter that Rodgers said that he would play as long as the Packers had a playoff chance. If that is why they didn't play Love then as I have frequently posted here lately The Packers have much bigger problems than Rodgers or whoever is playing QB. The urgent issue is coaching and the important issue is the FO, specifically Murphy and Gute.
Murphy prefers to take the team down with Rodgers and Gute is hanging on because if it works out, then when Murphy retires Gute moves into Murphy's role.
The problem is that whether it's Rodgers, Love, Mahomes, Josh Allen, Jalen Hurts, Joe Montana, Johnny Unitas, Dan Marino, Brett Favre or Bart Starr it's not happening with this coaching staff. This FO created this mess, especially the salary cap. The coaching staff has made it worse because they are mostly clueless. I don't believe that this group (FO and coaching staff) can get the Packers out of it. I'm not even sure that they want to.
This off season or trade season or whatever you want to call it will prove for certain if they want to move forward or if they want to maintain the status quo by bringing the band back again. For whatever reason they appear to be afraid of the future and that lack of confidence goes all the way down to how the team plays on the field. They are on the clock. Tick, tick, tick. Thanks, Since '61
Coldworld
January 24, 2023 at 09:58 am
Perhaps they are afraid of the wrong thing. Standing pat and losing while repeating the same coaching and tactical failings with aging players and mortgaging the future to do it may not play out as well as trying and failing to move on. And the hangover may be longer.
There aren’t too many who believe that we can win with this roster, cap and coaching. There aren’t too many who think that troika is even plausible. Then there is the evidence if this season as collateral support.
No one loves a loser, but a cowardly one usually gets more despised than one who attempted to save the day. One who leaves behind IOUs galore among the devastation is well in the way to ignominy.
SinceLombardi
January 24, 2023 at 08:39 am
I don’t see this team on the edge of being a contender. I think the free fall has just started.
They have a ton of decisions to make and I don’t trust the people making the decisions. For years Aaron Rodgers was a giant band aid for this team, and now he’s no longer that fix all.
I think we will be in a real transition at the close of next season( coaching/ front office).. this year it’s only shuffling some players.
mrtundra
January 24, 2023 at 08:44 am
The Packers finished 3rd in the NFC North. What changes if Rodgers stays? I see more of the same, if Rodgers stays. If we bring in Love, to lead the team and finish third, in the division, in his first year as starting QB, I feel I can live with that, knowing Love can improve. I do not see Rodgers improving from his recent past. I wanted to trade Rodgers for draft picks, prior to this past training camp. Love should be our QB and we should move forward with the young QB and let him run the offense. It was fun while it lasted, Rodgers, but it is time to move on. Rip off that a band-aid and move forward, Gute!
jurp
January 24, 2023 at 10:56 am
"What changes if Rodgers stays?"
Well, if we keep all the old men that AR wants we could go 4-13 and wind up last, behind the Bears next year.
Saw a mock-up of Rodgers in a Jets uniform (wearing Namath's 12), and he looked good. I'd love to see it in real-life this fall.
coolhand
January 24, 2023 at 01:13 pm
Also, if they bring back all of the same coaches what changes? The offense was anemic, the defense couldn't get a stop at critical times in games. The only improvement was on special teams and even that took 5 fumbles from Rodgers to make that happen.
LeotisHarris
January 24, 2023 at 09:00 am
I'd be okay with lovingly setting 12 free in exchange for picks/players. I'm also in the camp that believes LaFleur is in way over his head and doesn't have the support system to bolster his skill set. A season, with Love as our starter, and LaFleur legitimately at the helm would clear up a great deal of uncertainty.
I don't think we're headed back to the 70s and 80s. The Vikings defense is old and slow, and while they have made good choices at HC and GM, they still aren't better than the Packers. The Bears continue to have unlimited potential. That's nice. I'm happy for them. The Lions have found a winning record under the forceful guidance of Dollar Store Bill Cowher and the world must take notice. Behold the Lions! They also have 150 of the first 100 picks in the draft. Fit 'em all for gold jackets right now.
Next season might be painful, or it may be a surprise. Nothing changes of nothing changes.
dobber
January 24, 2023 at 10:17 am
"The Lions have found a winning record under the forceful guidance of Dollar Store Bill Cowher and the world must take notice"
I think you give Campbell too much credit: Campbell is all passion and he lets his coordinators coach. So far his players have responded to it. This is likely why his coordinators have been getting calls for HC jobs, too. When those coordinators move on, it will put a lot of pressure on Campbell to find the right guys to replace them.
LeotisHarris
January 24, 2023 at 10:35 am
Agreed, dobber, should have used the sarcasm font. The Lions may rise nearer the top, but it won't be with DC at the helm. He has a Jim Harbaugh-like shelf life.
dobber
January 24, 2023 at 10:39 am
Agreed--coaches of that type tend to wear their teams out.
Since'61
January 24, 2023 at 10:02 pm
Especially if they don't win an SB. I give Campbell 2 more seasons, 3 at the most. Thanks, Since '61
Since'61
January 24, 2023 at 10:11 pm
Great post Leotis!!! You are spot on. Let's give Love and LaFleur a shot and see if the Packers have anything there. I don't have much confidence in LaFleur so if Love is going to make a difference he will do it on his own.
If the Packers actually make moves on Rodgers, Bak, Jones, Lazard, Lewis and Crosby next season could be very painful especially on offense. It will difficult for Love but it would be worth it if it moves the Packers into the future and we are competitive in the playoffs by '25 or '26. By then Murphy will be retired and MLF and his staff likely done as well. Time will tell. Thanks, Since '61
Packer_Fan
January 24, 2023 at 09:24 am
This is pretty much the same scenario as 15 years ago. Farve's last pass was intercepted. So was Rodgers. Rodgers is an unknown and so is Love. Farve gave an out by retiring. Rodger's out is being traded. We drafted two QB's in the 2008 draft. If we trade Rodgers, we can do the same thing.
The front office needs to get the board of directors and major stockholders on board. Trade Rodgers and move ahead. It took two years with Farve. Perhaps the same again.
dobber
January 24, 2023 at 10:03 am
If Rodgers retires, then the situations mirror, but so long as 12 is active they're only somewhat similar. Favre opened the door to management with his retirement and it allowed them to push him through it.
Coldworld
January 24, 2023 at 02:47 pm
I increasingly wonder how valid that is in reality. Management tried hard to cajole Favre into retirement after several years of dithering—Murphy then supposedly added kerosene by trying to give him a media contract to buy him off. Rodgers conditions and internal soul searching might be of a more philosophical bent, but I don’t really see the distinction that I once did, beyond Murphy’s giving him the keys last year. In both cases two very questionable offers from Murphy.
CheesedDeadHead
January 24, 2023 at 09:31 am
I'm focusing on the Brady watch. It really depends on what Tommie Boy decides to determine how long Rodgers will play. Why? Because there's a snowballs chance in hell that Rodgers will retire the same year as Brady because there is no way Rodgers shares the HOF stage with Tommie Boy. If Brady comes back for another season then any team trading for Rodgers will get 2 years. If Brady calls it quits now, there's a good chance Rodgers will only play 1 more season. Until Tom decides, Rodgers will waffle...
jurp
January 24, 2023 at 11:02 am
I can see Brady trolling Rodgers by saying that he plans to continue playing and then, after Rodgers retires, retire himself. Rodgers will then un-retire. And so will Brady. Hopefully this affects a team not named "Packers".
J-Rome
January 24, 2023 at 09:33 am
I hope they trade Rodgers. He hasn't been the same since his last collar bone break. Since then he has random, wildly inaccurate throws that are becoming much more frequent. He won't use the middle of the field, and when he does and throws an interception he will only throw to the sideline. He only wants to play a certain way but some teams are able to take that away and he struggles. He certainly isn't the only problem, but LaFleur's offense is set up for a lesser quarterback than Rodgers to run, yet Rodgers refuses to fully accept it. Rodgers has said himself at times the " Hero ball" throws are more an attempt to get a pass interference than a completion. Planning on offsides, 12 men on the field, and pass interference is no basis for an offense. Rodgers still has some physical talent, but it looks like he's trying to outsmart everyone, rather than outplay everyone.
ricky
January 24, 2023 at 09:53 am
Some good points, some wrongheaded ideas. First, definitely, the Packers should have traded Rodgers after his second consecutive MVP. They didn't. Water under the bridge. The question now becomes, do they compound the mistake by bring Rodgers back again, and trading Love? To me, that would be the dumbest possible "solution" possible.
But, the idea that the Jets are a good trade partner because they'd (for some unknown reason) give up two firsts for Rodgers? Nonsense. The Packers got a conditional draft pick, which ended up being a third. And Favre didn't have that horrible contract the Packers gave Rodgers. So, if he was traded to the Jets, expect a small return, but within two years, the team would be clear of that odious contract. Which brings up the second misconception. That the Saints might be in the market for Rodgers. Even though they have a worse cap situation than the Packers? Nonsense. And the Titans or Carolina? I think Rodgers would retire before going to either destination. The Patriots? Belichick is going to overpay an aging QB, when he lost the relatively underpaid (but older) Brady?
Your comments about the Packers need to get better coaching on both offense and defense was absolutely correct. But LaFleur is already showing an unwillingness to change, bringing back Barry and retaining Stenavich as the OC. Were either of these guys being interviewed by other teams? Nope. Just an inquiry about Bessacia.
This team is in a rut, and they need someone to give them a kick to get them moving in the right direction again. Put someone other than Murphy in charge, and have him evaluate all the front office and coaches, as well as players, and start making some of the hard decisions that will bring glory back to Title town.
dobber
January 24, 2023 at 10:34 am
The lever-point is the contract, but the buyer in a trade doesn't have to carry the burden of signing bonus and other guarantees--so the cash value makes him pretty affordable on another team's caps compared to other starters. If they decide that 12 wants to play, but not in GB, there's going to be reworking on that deal, too--likely even if he stays in GB, that deal will need to be adjusted.
"But LaFleur is already showing an unwillingness to change, bringing back Barry and retaining Stenavich as the OC."
Way too often a vote of confidence is followed by changes, so I wouldn't put too much stock in these statements until we get another month or so down the line.
How can you tell if/when a coach or GM is feeding you misinformatIon? His lips are moving.
Guam
January 24, 2023 at 10:41 am
Agree with most of your points ricky, but another commenter noted that Rodgers' contract is really not that onerous for the acquiring team. It was something like $25 - 30 mil for 2023 and $35 mil for 2024. It is the unamortized signing bonus that is the killer for the Packers and that stays with the Packers ($40 mil) if Rodgers gets traded.
I have no idea what the Packers might get for Rodgers in a trade, but his contract may not be that much of a stumbling block. I think his age and decline will be bigger factors.
harleycops
January 24, 2023 at 10:47 am
PackerNation is so fatigued by this AR drama year after year. Now we are held "hostage" by his demands for certain senior citizen players. Does Guter give in or move on? If AR stays, will he 'sit out' every OTA until training camp and not get in sync w/ his WRs? If he's traded, let's cut bait and move to rebuild this team to championship level. Is Love the solution or the problem. We'll never know at this rate. So if AR doesn't want to be in GB, then hit the road so we can make our draft selections with Love and new teammates. I for one, am tired of this annual soapbox!
Packerpasty
January 24, 2023 at 10:51 am
In little ol Green Bay who wouldn't want a few good friends to hang with at home and on the golf course?? Cant blame him there...
jurp
January 24, 2023 at 11:10 am
I once worked remote (in Neenah, of all places. Yuck) for eight months. You get used to not having anyone around five days a week (in my case, wife and daughter were four hours away). One month I couldn't go home at all due to three major Friday snowstorms that would've made travelling state and country roads hazardous and/or a pain in the ass. And we didn't have Skype or Zoom in those days, so we could only talk by phone, Again, you cope and get used to it.
Gee, I think I could handle the situation now, with Zoom, for 6 months for a paltry $30 million/year.
My heart bleeds for these guys,
LeotisHarris
January 24, 2023 at 02:13 pm
"...snowstorms that would've made travelling state and country roads hazardous and/or a pain in the ass..."
Jurp, you should copyright all possible versions of "roads are in hazardous condition and/or a pain in the ass" before every weather warning service out there makes it their ticket to fame. It's much more accurate than snow-covered and slippery.
Lphill
January 24, 2023 at 10:55 am
Does it matter who the QB is if Joe Barry is still calling the defense?
splitpea1
January 24, 2023 at 11:17 am
This team is going to need a hell of a lot more than "tweaking" to get out of the NFC and in to the Super Bowl. I won't even bother to list the multiple areas of improvement from coaching to personnel needed for that to become a reality.
The quicker the Packers' BOD realize that it's time for a housecleaning, the quicker the team can start their journey to competing for a Super Bowl again. Right now we're looking like a marginal wild-card team at best with the current cast. Can you see us beating either of the two remaining NFC teams either home or away?
Leatherhead
January 24, 2023 at 12:17 pm
This season, already, both parties have talked about the possibility of a trade. That's different than last year, different than the year before. I think we're looking at a different offseason.
I don't think the trade will benefit us cap-wise very much, and I don't think we'll get a huge cache of draft picks, and I don't think that changing from Rodgers to Love guarantees a better offense on the field, but I still think that moving on and giving Love the keys to the car is the right move for all parties. If he fails, it'll be time for a housecleaning at 1265 because we've been working on this guy for 3 years and on The Plan since before that, so it'll be time for a New Plan with new people. If he succeeds, the Packers are going to be a good team and in the hunt for the Division title in 2023, and LaFleur and Gutekunst and Murphy will be vindicated.
T7Steve
January 24, 2023 at 01:09 pm
He might only have to be a game manager (which Rodgers was last year) to be successful. Look what could happen if the O-line works and practices together through camp? The all they would have to do is keep the D healthy. How would it be?
stormin
January 24, 2023 at 01:40 pm
If Love was the answer management would have traded Aaron last year, but obviously they know Love is NOT THE ANSWER !
T7Steve
January 24, 2023 at 02:08 pm
It was a lose/lose for management last year. If Rodgers succeeded, who ever traded away the two-time raining 4-time MVP? If he didn't succeed, they get what they got this year.
That makes this year a whole different story.
Leatherhead
January 24, 2023 at 03:51 pm
Because nothing changes in a year.
Packerpasty
January 24, 2023 at 05:51 pm
Rodgers has no confidence in MLF and the coaching staff, thats obvious through some of his remarks and actions the past couple of years....one "talking head" says MLF lost Rodgers when he took the ball out of his hands and kicked the field goal against Tampa Bay...of course the Packer never got the ball back...MLF is a soft ass coach with no fire in him...good cheerleader though....