Cory's Corner: Pressure Is On Brian Gutekunst

Gutekunst has done a good job as Packers general manager, but his legacy comes down to one player. 

There are plenty of people that love to nitpick. 

Packers general manager Brian Gutekunst has been in charge of five Packers drafts and for every J’Mon Moore there’s a Zach Tom. Gutekusnt has also done a remarkable job of bolstering the roster through free agency by adding key additions like Za’Darius Smith and Preston Smith. 

But Gutekunst’s legacy will ultimately come down to one guy. It’s the guy that the Packers traded the 30th and 136th overall picks to get the 26th pick in the 2020 NFL Draft. 

Yes, it’s none other than Jordan Love. Gutekunst rolled the dice on a guy that was widely unproven at a smaller college — with a future first ballot Hall of Famer still on the roster. 

And that’s why Gutekunst’s legacy is on the line. He had to know that Aaron Rodgers wasn’t going to like the Packers picking a quarterback first. And it wasn’t just the fact that the Packers took Love in the first round, it’s that they traded up for him. 

That’s the part that I questioned on that night of April 23, 2020. It’s fine that the Packers had an interest in Love. I liked his athleticism and he looked like an interesting project. But do you draft a player in the first round to be a project? 

“The way the board fell, this was the best decision for the Packers,” Gutekunst said in 2020. “I think obviously Aaron's been around for a long time, and he knows what we're playing for right now, and that's what's most important right now.”

The board actually fell pretty good for the Packers. Linebacker Patrick Queen and receiver Tee Higgins were both still there. Green Bay could’ve had Higgins without moving up for him — and he’s a No. 1 wideout on at least 20 teams in the NFL. 

The problem is that we don’t know anything about Love. He has been in the NFL three seasons and we barely know if he can play. Obviously, Gutekunst wasn’t sold on Love or else he wouldn’t have given Rodgers a three-year $150 million contract extension on March 14, 2022. Over $100 million of that deal is guaranteed.

Now if the Packers had designs on making sure Love got ample playing time, giving Rodgers all that dough wouldn’t have been a sound business decision. 

And even if it’s more of a legacy contract, which is a payment for superb play that includes a 147-75-1 regular season record, a 12-10 postseason record, a Super Bowl title and four MVPs, it will ultimately hurt the Packers when No. 12 is no longer under center. 

So Jordan Love is Gutekunst’s fork in the road. Even if Love doesn’t play a snap in Green Bay, Gutekunst will be judged on lost assets, because I don’t see the Packers getting a No. 26 pick back in a trade. 

But then again, this is what Gutekunst said when he was introduced. Remember what everyone screamed for? We wanted bold. We wanted different. That’s exactly what the Love pick was.

It wasn’t safe. 

Unfortunately, if Love doesn’t work out, Gutekunst’s job won’t be safe either. 
 

 

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Cory Jennerjohn is a graduate from UW-Oshkosh and has been in sports media for over 15 years. He was a co-host on "Clubhouse Live" and has also done various radio and TV work as well. He has written for newspapers, magazines and websites. He currently is a columnist for CHTV and also does various podcasts. He recently earned his Masters degree from the University of Iowa. He can be found on Twitter: @Coryjennerjohn

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2 points
 

Comments (195)

Fan-Friendly This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.
HarryHodag's picture

January 28, 2023 at 06:29 am

A few points to consider:
1) You never know what a draft pick will do. Higgins and Queen are doing well but might have bombed with Green Bay. Brock Purdy is a great example of the draft being a crap shoot.

2)Rodgers getting a new contract had far more to do with public relations and legacy than what they thought of Love. A major flaw, which in another context is a major plus, is loyalty to the heroes. If the Packers didn't give Rodgers a new contract the fans would want Gute's head. The problem is the team is stuck with the contract.

3) Love has been a good soldier. There were more than a few reports that his play improved greatly this past season. It is one reason I suspect there's a bunch of chatter to trade AR.

4)Please don't fall into the trap that just because one person is gone it's bad for Green Bay. Quite honestly, I'd rather see the Packers lose more with Love than put up with more of the nonsense from Rodgers.

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Since'61's picture

January 28, 2023 at 07:42 am

If Gute/Murphy have made decisions because the fans would want their heads then both should have been fired. They are in their job to do what is best for the team, especially Gute. If they are worried about the fans they will create an absolute mess. Oh wait!!! Check our salary cap!!!

It is this type of thinking that has created cap hell and this never ending saga with Rodgers. They should have traded him and moved on and most fans would have moved on by now. Thanks, Since '61

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Johnblood27's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:33 am

All of the GBP fans would have moved on and be completely supportive of the new direction.

The Aaron Rodgers fans would still be howling.

There is really a difference and the conjoining subset is smaller than you think.

I will be happier when the GBP fans split from the AR sycophants and can then move forward carrying the G instead of carrying the R.

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Since'61's picture

January 28, 2023 at 11:00 am

johnblood27 I have been and will remain as big of a Rodgers supporter as any fan could be as long as he remains a Packers. However, from a management point of view there comes a time when, in the best interests of the team, hard decisions need to be made even with the team's hero(s).

The Packers have never had bigger heroes than the members of the Lombardi team. Yet many were traded off for picks or younger players towards the end of their careers. Herb Adderley, Dave Robinson, and Forrest Gregg to name a few. Before that Paul Hornung was released in the Saints expansion draft and Jim Taylor chose not to return to the Packers after the 1966 season and signed with his hometown Saints for the '67 season.

Change is hard but dealing with change is management's role in any organization. How change is dealt with is the question. Doing nothing or playing fiddle to one of the organization's heroes usually does not end well in my experience. Thanks, Since '61

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CheesedDeadHead's picture

January 28, 2023 at 11:19 am

"Change is hard but dealing with change is management's role in any organization."

I think the big difference was those 60's/70's teams didn't have the financial bankroll that the current administration can rely on if they make some bad decisions. So every decision from those earlier teams/leaders was an important decisions, while today it's no big deal to waste $100M. It's very much like a family business where the first generation made clever decisions and built a business while 3 generations down the line you have successors who have always had a pile of money to sit on and don't realize the importance of every decision. Lazy, entitled and stupid can go a long way when they have a pile of money to cover-up the incompetence.

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Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 11:50 am

The difference now is it’s no longer financial viability that drives, thanks to revenue sharing and TV being the primary income source, it’s the cap and relative competitive position. The driver is the same for those wishing to see football success, but the officers and employees are cushioned and have thus no hard benchmark pressing against their backs.

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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

January 29, 2023 at 01:21 pm

Johnny,
If you had a jersey # I'd buy it!

Love the post!!!

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KenEllis's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:31 am

Pressure on Gutey you say?

Pressure from whom exactly?

Certainly no pressure on Gutey from his boss Murph who is retiring in two years.

And there will never be any pressure put on Gutey from the lamest, most compliant group of loyal press followers in the NFL. Rather, they will sell the fans hope all offseason and tell us what a great roster Gutey has put together once again.

The reality is that Gutey just signed an extension last offseason and will be here for years and years.

Pressure is what GMs face in places like Philly and SF and that is why they trade for players like AJ Brown, Darius Slay, Christian McCaffrey, and Trent Williams while Gutey uses 1st and 4th round picks on a player who sits for 3 full seasons.

In Green Bay, not getting to Super Bowls has become more than acceptable and Gutey, who has been in the Packer organization for 25 seasons, knows full well there is NO PRESSURE on him to get back to another one any time soon.

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BirdDogUni's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:08 am

Spot on Ken...

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:20 am

Agreed.

If AR retires or is traded, there will be no pressure on Gute to even make the playoffs in 2023, and he probably gets a pass even on making the playoffs in 2024 as well.

I'd say if there is a new CEO/President in 2025, only then will Gute receive some scrutiny. And that new person might want to settle in for a year. Is there anyone on the board of directors who is competent to hire a new GM?

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Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 11:06 am

What you should also fear is that, typically, that search is conducted and led by the outgoing President. Typically that should occur even if he or she favors internal candidates, but often primarily lip service if the whole process is left to the President to shape and determine.

In well functioning organizations, independent board members, stakeholders (such as major shareholders or their nominees on the board) are really the deciders. Do you see that happening here? Another reason why there are real problems resulting from what Murphy has done with the structure and Board/Executive committee.

It’s going to be a Ball if he’s allowed to get away with it.

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stockholder's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:06 pm

All for the good of the organization?
Doubt that. You still have a team that hasn't
won since 2010.

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zeke's picture

January 29, 2023 at 03:27 am

I thought that the conventional wisdom was that Ed Policy is likeliest to succeed Murphy, for what that's worth.

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Since'61's picture

January 28, 2023 at 11:08 am

The only pressure for Gute is hanging on until Murphy's retires and je probably moves up into Murphy's job.

Having said that Gute at least needs to show some competency is building the team in '23 and '24. But whenever Rodgers moves on either via trade or retirement gives Gute another honeymoon period with which to get him through to his promotion. If Gute plays along with Murphy he probably already knows that he will be Murphy's hand picked successor. Remember Murphy will likely take a spot on the Packers Executive Board and the easiest path for him will be to promote a yes man from within to get the Board's approval.

Keeps football as a hobby in Green Bay. Meanwhile while the Packers burn Murphy plays his fiddle and the beat goes on. Thanks, Since '61

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stockholder's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:08 pm

If he can't win when he's a gm.
Why the hell do you want him to replace Murphy.
Get serious 61. Gutey needs to be fired!

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Since'61's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:49 pm

I agree that Gute needs to be fired and have posted such numerous times in the past.

I don't want Gute to replace Murphy but who exactly are you expecting to do the firing? If you think Murphy is going to do it you're the one who needs to get serious.
If you think that Executive Board is going to move on Murphy and/or Gute it's too late for you to get serious because you have reached the hopelessly lost stage.
You really need to start paying attention. Thanks, Since '61

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Coldworld's picture

January 29, 2023 at 12:24 am

I’m much more willing to give Gute the benefit of some doubt. Like all GMs there are misses, but there have also been notable hits and, in general, his non draft pick ups have been great and this roster got us 2 years of competitiveness. Given the Swiss cheese that Ball had made of Thompson’s roster in ‘16-‘18, the ones we went in to ‘20 and ‘21 with were a dramatic recovery. Its not his fault we didn’t capitalize on those rosters in my view. They were good enough and our coaching questionable enough that I think most here saw it that way at the time and probably still do. Then there was this year’s draft, which, while early, looks very promising one season on.

Moreover, that roster made a lot of sense to me as a basis for a post Rodgers year this year as the cap hangover started to work itself out and we blooded a new QB. There seemed to be a plan. Then it seemed like Denver was a gift horse of a generation. Yet we turned around and went in the opposite direction with no cap to change anything material. That was the point where logic left the building.

Having said the above, and a confident as I am that that was not a plan of Gute’s making, there comes a point where acquiescence erodes trust. If, a year later, Gute meekly acquiesces, then one has to wonder if he, like LaFleur, had the conviction required to truly succeed. At some point, Is anyone in that building more than a careerist sycophant? If not, none of them are leading and certainly none are showing the character that would qualify them to be heirs to Murphy as President or true GM.

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

January 29, 2023 at 02:34 am

Could be. I don't know who made the decision to retain AR last year.

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croatpackfan's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:27 pm

Since, let see what Brian Gutekinst did and what was left in his responsibility.

I will not discuss why Mark Murphy is acting GM of the team, as he is the one who makes the most important decisions (hire GM, than he hired HC and remove from appointed "GM" possibility to influence on salary cap and payroles of players and coaches by making Russ Ball "assistant GM for finance" who reports to him - true GM). That is explained and discussed heavily in last few months.

The last BG draft (thank God he remain that responsibility) Packers got 6 players that played significant role as starters or 1st back ups (Watson, Walker, Doubs, Engabare, Tom & Wyatt), and signed few FAs that showed to be intriguing if not position changing players (Nixon, Ford, Leavitt). So, for me it was great job he did in draft and in making team better with narrow space on SC.

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Coldworld's picture

January 29, 2023 at 12:41 am

Ball’s title is actually much grander: he’s the executive vice president/director of football operations.

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Pizzadoc's picture

January 30, 2023 at 02:06 pm

When '61 and TGR are depressed, it might be time for me to freak out.

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Barnacle's picture

January 28, 2023 at 07:21 am

Imagine that you have a volatile drug using prima Donna that you would be willing to mortgage the future to keep. Would you trade up in the draft for a questionable qb to help the negotiations?

Maybe try adding a receiver or an offensive lineman.

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Rebecca's picture

January 29, 2023 at 08:56 am

Tried scraping but the hammer did the job.

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jvole's picture

January 28, 2023 at 07:33 am

Hindsight says it was a catastrophic mistake. But Rodgers was not playing great leading into that year. Trading up, yeah that was dumb but not horrible.

The catastrophic mistake was the absurd contract they gave 'Max Deal But I Don't Do it For the Money' Rodgers last spring. Unless they can figure a way out of that pit, there are going to be a few years of purgatory coming. Gute is going to need a few more late draft homeruns to save himself from that decision.

6 points
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jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:10 am

"Catatrophic mistake"? Hyperbole much?

As should be obvious by now because it's been beaten to death, but Gutekunst was not the driving force with Rodgers' cap-killing contract - that would be Murphy, assisted by his imp Baal. (misspelling intentional).

6 points
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Johnblood27's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:36 am

you could spend 2/3 of your posts here just trying to inject some truth and reality into others' posts.

A cookie for trying, but the windmills always win around here...

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jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 09:19 am

"Damn you sirrah, must you keep moving so?"

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HawkPacker's picture

January 28, 2023 at 09:54 am

Good post JB. My thoughts exactly!

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dobber's picture

January 28, 2023 at 09:33 am

"that would be Murphy, assisted by his imp Baal. (misspelling intentional)."

Well played, sir. Well played!

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NickPerry's picture

January 28, 2023 at 02:09 pm

"Gutekunst was not the driving force with Rodgers' cap-killing contract - that would be Murphy, assisted by his imp Baal. (misspelling intentional)."

I find it strange people here STILL believe Gute was the one who wanted to sign Rodgers. I mean AFTER Murphy introduced MLF at the press conference with Gute barely smiling while remaining mostly mute, it was a SURE sign who was in charge.

With Gute trying to go along with a HC shoved down his throat AND the DC from the year before, he goes about his business trying to build for life AFTER Rodgers. He drafts Love, Dillon, a slew of O-Linemen to name a few to start the retool. People seem to forget how poorly Rodgers played (By Rodgers Standards) in 2017 and 2018.

Most people feel a pretty damn good draft is getting at least 2 or 3 quality starters from each one. Gutes first draft yielded Alexander and MVS. His second draft Gary and Jenkins with an off and on Savage. Year 3 wasn't great but IF Loves does pan out it's a HOME RUN to go with Dillon and Runyan. Year four, the 2012 draft he drafts Stokes, Meyers. Not great but if Meyers improves and Stokes comes back healthy I can live with it.

In 2022 Gute fucking hit it out of the park, at least so it seems. Walker just got better and better except for 2 VERY boneheaded plays towards the end of the season. Wyatt SHOULD have been on the field more, especially later in the season when he really started to settle in. 2023 that kid is going to be a BEAST and it will be that fast! Now add in Watson, Doubs, Tom, and Enagbare, and the Packers have the possibilities of a draft similar to the one New Orleans had in 2017.

The FIRST step in getting this team better is trading Rodgers. I would say firing Mark Murphy but that won't happen. Another draft like last years and FINALLY playing an offense like the scheme was MEANT to be played.

One last thing, if it's not Love at QB trading Rodgers gives you more ammunition, more swings, at getting THAT guy. Personally I think with the picks we have and the additional picks with who is already on this roster, Love can lead this team AND win.

But Rodgers MUST be dealt this season. Otherwise Murphy will retire leaving this colossal fuck-up behind. Gute will be fired even though Murphy held him by his tatas for his entire tenure as GM, and Rodgers will walk away with ONE SB blaming everybody but himself for never giving him a team around him.

2011 was pretty good and so was 2014 as was 2020 and 2021. Rodgers however wasn't good enough and it wasn't just those years either.

6 points
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jvole's picture

January 29, 2023 at 06:54 am

I always wondered what happened to my 8th grade English teacher.

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4thand10's picture

January 30, 2023 at 09:43 pm

she works at wendy’s now

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Since'61's picture

January 28, 2023 at 07:50 am

"When you reach the fork in the road take it." Yogi Berra

The problem is that the Packers have tried to take both directions in the fork. They took the Rodgers fork and the Love fork and here we are. Nothing resolved about our QBs and total cap hell.

In Medieval literature, which is primarily Christian literature in the Western world, when travelers, such as those in Chaucer's Canterbury Tales, came to a fork in the road, they always went to the right, because the road to the right always leads to salvation. History has proven that isn't always accuratet. In any case the Packers have chosen the road to cap hell and have arrived. Thanks, Since '61

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jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:15 am

In Latin, "left" is "sinister" and "right" is "dexter" (from which we get "dexterous", a good thing). The left being "unclean" goes back into pre-history, IIRC. This is possibly one reason that some doctors and teachers in the US (up to at least the late 1950s) tried making left-handers into right-handers. They tried it with my brother until my parents went ballistic with the teacher responsible for it..

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Since'61's picture

January 28, 2023 at 11:14 am

Excellent point jurp. I learned some Latin during my 4 years in a Catholic elementary school in NYC. Grades 4-8.
I stared in the NYC public school system K-4 before my parents transferred me to the Catholic school in our neighborhood.

Yes, the Latin root for left is sinistrum. And yes in the public school they tried to make lefties into righties but that was because of the idiotic belief that left meant you might be more susceptible to leftist, read communist thinking and in the Catholic schools it had to do with that you might be more susceptible to temptation from the devil (Sin in sinister).

Totally ridiculous, but it was true in the 50s and into the early 60s IIRC. Thanks, Since '61

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Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:27 am

The left is the sinister way, indeed that term means left in Latin.. There is a term for it: sinistrophobia. The origin of the prejudice against left handers was actually from the connotations of the Roman term for left and thus pervaded subsequent church fokelore, the reason that the sinners moved widdershins when invoking evil, the reason one threw salt over one’s left shoulder where your devil hovered to ward off evil or bad luck. However, following one way consistently has some advantages in terms of consistency that the Packers could have benefited from.

Nevertheless, the traditional right turn default was an option only when no other reasons existed for a more informed decision. That qualifier is pivotally critical. The pilgrims did not end up back where they started but made it to Canterbury.

We, on the other hand made it back to 2018 but now with a 39 year old QB and a cap spent years forward. Perhaps a lesson that the true evil lies in not making rational decisions and just taking the path most easy.

I suspect Chaucer, who after all was writing pretty biting satire on notions and practices of his targets, would have some choice words for the Murphy era.

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Johnblood27's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:39 am

Chaucer was certainly no Viking fan...

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Since'61's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:55 pm

That's for sure Johnblood. But most of his Tales were great fun to read. Thanks, Since '61

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Since'61's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:58 pm

Coldworld it would be great to have Chaucer to provide us with his jibes on Murphy and so much more of the current mythologies (especially some of the idiotic conspiracy theories) in our current world.

Great post again. Thanks, Since '61

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Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 06:46 pm

Perchance he already has found a vignette encompassing Murphy in his monk. A man who has departed from the duties proscribed by his vocation and done so proudly and consciously. He is enamored more of his own gratification and the display of superficial devotion to the casual observer, while he happily neglects the true purpose of his station.

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Since'61's picture

January 28, 2023 at 11:10 pm

Yes I think that perchance we could apply the Monk's tale to Murphy. Works for me. Thanks, Since '61

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BirdDogUni's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:13 am

"In any case the Packers have chosen the road to cap hell and have arrived."

Which was obviously to the left...

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Since'61's picture

January 28, 2023 at 11:15 am

Not necessarily. Their mistake was in attempting to go both paths or trying to retain Rodgers and Love. Now we could use both and end up with nothing. Thanks, Since '61

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Leatherhead's picture

January 28, 2023 at 11:39 am

I don't think that was a mistake. Since Gutekunst/LaFleur started running things after the 2018 season, they squeezed 65 starts out of Rodgers, including two MVP seasons. So that part of it worked pretty well.

The other path has us drafting his replacement and developing him until he's ready, which the GM has stated he is.

Now we're going to trade Rodgers and get compensation, which we wouldn't have received if we'd just let him leave in FA. Some of that compensation may well involve some financial considerations that benefit the team in some way.

Love is going nowhere. He's the guy we've been preparing and he's going to be our starter next year. He's going to be pretty good, IMO. Objectively, Rodgers was a pretty average QB in 2022, and I don't think Love will be a lot worse than average. He'll probably be average or better, even his first year.

So, to recap: We've got 4 seasons out of Rodgers, we've kept him healthy, he won the MVP twice, we're going to trade him for compensation, and we've got the best possible replacement we could hope for...a consensus first round pick who's been learning for 3 years behind a HOFer. Just like Rodgers did.

Doesn't look like a mistake to me.

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Since'61's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:05 pm

Numerous assumptions or what if's there. And a big part of it is hope as far as Love is concerned. Hope is not a plan and we certainly don't know if Love is a viable starting QB. We're hoping for that to be the case but we have zero evidence to base that hope upon or to support that assumption.

Not to mention what if the Packers do not trade Rodgers. While I expect it Is likely to happen I'm not holding my breath either, not with this management/coaching team. Thanks, Since '61

2 points
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Leatherhead's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:30 pm

There are no assumptions or what ifs. They extended Rodgers and drafted Love. The GM says he's ready. We don't know if Love is a viable starter, but the people who drafted him, and developed him, and are on the practice field with him, think he is. Rodgers himself said "He's a master of the offense",

You may have zero evidence. I have the evidence of the people who actually see him on the field on a daily basis over the last several years. If Love is truly horrible, then I guess we're being lied to. If he's mediocre, it's best we find out so we can get a new guy. But Rodgers is done in Green Bay, so he's not the answer to the question of "Who's your QB next year?"

Rodgers is going to get traded. We're going to be compensated for that. That's a good thing. Why aren't you happy? And he's going to be replaced by a guy who's going to play really well. Why aren't you happy about that?

You see incompetence in management and coaching. I see a plan to transition from Rodgers to the future that has been in the works for over 3 years and is about to bear fruit. Tasty fruit.+

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Since'61's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:28 pm

I'm very happy. There you go making baseless assumptions again. No one has seen Love on the field every day for the last several years unless you want to include his college days which are meaningless at the professional level.

The Packers have only seen Love on the field twice when it actually meant anything, actually once if we're going to be honest with ourselves. That was last season against the Chiefs and it wasn't impressive. The next time was against the Eagles during this season when it was garbage time for a defense that hadn't prepared to play against Love. He only threw 9 passes during his time in the game. That is a very small sample size. He threw for 113 yards, not bad but if we take out the 63 yard TD which was mostly due to Watson's speed we have 5 passes for 50 yards.

All I'm saying is that we haven't seen enough of Love to adequately judge how good of a QB he will be. Personally I think that he will evolve into a good QB but it will probably take 2-3 seasons for that to happen.

I don't take Gute's appraisal very seriously because what else is he going to say. "This guy is terrible, he's never going to make it." All that would do is prove that he wasted the pick back in 2020. He has every motive in the world to talk up Love.
Again as I posted a few times if the Packers have all this confidence in Love why wasn't he playing while Rodgers was injured?
If they see how good Love looks in practice why aren't they playing him when Rodgers wasn't even able to practice for most weeks and it was obvious that his injuries were affecting his throws during the games? Why did these brilliant football people and their offensive genius HC waste so many games that could have been won if Love is a viable starter? I'll make an assumption like you do. I'll assume it means they con't care about winning. And I can make a stronge case to prove that point.
And if he is mediocre why didn't they try to find out during the 2022 season when they had the perfect opportunity to play Love while Rodgers was injured? Why did they waste the opportunity to gather more information on where Love is at against weaker opponents like the Jets, Commanders and Lions 1st game.

As I posted on a thread earlier this week in response to one of your posts you and I come at these issues Fromm different perspectives. You use stats, events,or comments or what the GM or the coach says to support or justify your assumptions on what will happen. I come at these issues from a management perspective. I use much of the same information to ask questions like Why?, What?, When?, Where?, Who?, etc. rather than arrive at a conclusion. Neither is right or wrong or better than the other, it's just different approaches. I'm looking for answers, results, opportunities and possibilities. Yes I see incompetence in management/coaching's poor decisions.
I see it in their inaction in not just the Rodgers/Love situation but also in the Amari Rodgers/Nixon situation.
I see it in continually to give a majority of snaps to Lowry while watching him get pushed all over the field for the last 3 seasons.
I see it in having Jenkins play RT when he should have been at LG from the beginning of the season.
I see it in playing Hanson for several games rather than allowing TOM to start at RT.
I see it in not benching Savage earlier in the season when he looked lost on the field game after game combined with his miserable tackling.
I see it in allowing the 2021 season go down the tubes by doing nothing about STs when multiple kicks were being blocked game after game and not thinking/caring enough to prepare to prevent it from happening in a playoff game.
I could on and on. The point is that when the same mistakes happen game after game after game after season after season and worse yet it's allowed to go then yes I see management incompetence which is systemic and leads to failure after failure every season.
This is not what successful organizations allow to happen. You see a plan, I see excuses for their failures.
I can't, won't say that Love won't work out but I don't have the trust or confidence to believe what Gute, Murphy or Matt LaChooch are peddling as success or as Love being ready.
We don't even know yet whether or not Rodgers will be traded yet. You are assuming that it will happen but again offer zero evidence that. it will happen. If they were going to trade him why wasn't it done last off season when it should have been? Rodgers coming off 2 consecutive MVP seasons was the perfect time to make the move and get the highest value back in return. Why are we expecting the same team to make the move now when Rodgers value is reduced by his age, injuries and less than stellar performance in 2022. Yes that is a brilliant way to work their plan and get significantly reduced value in return. Having said that I fully realize that there are owners in the league who will trade for a future HOFer just to show off their shiny toy for a few seasons but it's far from guaranteed.
You mention that the Packers will be compensated but you don't say what that compensation will be. Yet you're so sure that it will happen. OK where's the evidence and where's the compensation? And if they are so committed to developing Love wouldn't a season of actual NFL experience been the best preparation for him? Wouldn't we actually now know whether or not he will be ready to start in 2023 with a full 2022 season behind him?
Yes, when I see how the Packers have been managed since 2018 I question everything. Why shouldn't I and why should you assume that I'm unhappy? I ask questions because that's what good management does. That's what management does when they want to improve. That's what management does when they are serious about succeeding. And BTW successful management can't and shouldn't wait for 3 years for their plans to bear fruit. Especially when it can all undone by stupid money management which the Packers have accomplished with the salary cap mess they have created. Love could be great but if the Packers can't afford to keep or acquire a solid supporting cast around him then poof it's all gone and so is Love.
Was salary cap hell part of this brilliant plan? If yes, then why are any of these Chooches still here?

You see you're looking at the Love/Rodgers situation in a silo. So it's easy trade Rodgers insert Love problem solved, we're the Packers, we're so brilliant and we're on our way to the playoffs again. Yay! No, wrong, It doesn't work that way. Because all those other annoying questions that I brought up above are all related to this alleged brilliant plan for Love. Whoever the QB is doesn't mean anything if the issues I've raised are not correctly addressed along with many, many others.

The quality of the coaching staff is a much bigger issue than any QB will ever be and this team is claiming that they want all of their coaches back. Really!!! WTF??? If that doesn't make us question everything coming out off 1265 then either we're just not paying attention we just don't care or both. In fact it is looking more and more like management and coaching either isn't paying attention or caring or both.

But hey it's OK because we have a plan for Love and we're going to trade Rodgers and we have Titletown and the money is rolling in and we have this nice hobby over here called a football team and everything is great in Green Bay and the beat goes on and on and on and on.

BTW I'm very happy now because I love and have always loved doing what I do. I loved getting my clients to actually think and take an honest evaluation of their company. I love working with them to clarify what they want to accomplish and why and to be an honest about it because when it works everybody wins, the company, the employees and the customers. And I especially loved it when my clients made assumptions about what was going to happen without any facts, events, results or evidence that it actually would happen or more importantly should happen. As I posed above just because the Packers trade Love and insert Rodgers doesn't mean that their "plan" will work. It doesn't guarantee any result for the Packers in the future. In the end it's just a hunch that you've convinced yourself will work either because you thought of it or more likely because you haven't done what is necessary to think of something else. Is their plan for Love so well thought out that the Packers know exactly what they will do if Love's career ends on his first snap as the Packers starter. I doubt it. But what about the 52 guys on the team? Are they just along for the ride? You see it's not just about what you do, it's about doing right and doing it right all the time. If you follow that approach the results and the success will come. But it starts with asking the right questions and addressing them honestly. I just don't see that the Packers are honest with themselves. The problem is that I don't think it matters to them either. But we'll see. Stay well. Thanks, Since '61

3 points
3
0
Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 11:57 am

I disagree ‘61, as far as that the mistake was in not accepting or seeing that one arm of the hedge had ceased to be viable and had in fact become a massive source of exposure. Hedging is a means to contain risk, but increases it if the parameters change such that the hedging position in fact pulls one down. At that point you unwind the unviable position fast and early. We chose instead to double down on it.

1 points
2
1
Since'61's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:00 pm

Agree Coldworld. As you know good planning always requires planning for the worst case scenario and having an exit strategy. That to me is where the Packers continue to fail badly in this situation and may in fact compound it again if Rodgers returns for 2023 and they bring the band back again for another run. Thanks, Since '61

2 points
2
0
jannes bjornson's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:41 pm

Ergo, schism into schizophrenia...

2 points
2
0
stockholder's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:15 pm

Thats right. And the next GM must fix
all Guteys mistakes.
Nobody told Gute to draft LOVE.

-1 points
4
5
BirdDogUni's picture

January 29, 2023 at 08:37 am

"Nobody told Gute to draft LOVE."

How would you know?

Someone told him to draft Love... If in fact a scout convinced him to draft Love or whether Gutey made the decision on his own, Love himself must have convinced him to draft him, because Gutey or the scouts saw something. He didn't just pull his name out of a hat.

0 points
0
0
Since'61's picture

January 29, 2023 at 09:55 pm

The Pacers are in the 21st century. They don't pick names out a hat any longer they've been using a dart board since Ron Wolf stepped down as Packers GM. Thanks, Since '61

0 points
0
0
Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 07:57 am

No. Pick your expletive for this pile of offal.

Gute’s legacy may actually very well be defined by the decision that it’s very unlikely that he made, to extend Rodgers last year and the total incongruity of that with either our cap (outside of his remit) or the roster assembled for Love or whomever and moving on. Somewhat ironic after what still has the potential to be a generational draft class.

Somewhat moronic since it misses the point with respect to virtually every facet of why we are languishing in futility and cap penury. Our rosters haven’t been the problem till this year: this year the problem wasn’t Love.

His fork in the road may in fact be multiply pronged, acquiescence to working under Murphy as the true final arbiter and Murphy’s hiring of LaFleur and then extension of Rodgers and consequent completion of a process of removing any cap freedom for the coming years.

10 points
13
3
dobber's picture

January 28, 2023 at 09:38 am

"Gute’s legacy may actually very well be defined by the decision that it’s very unlikely that he made"

Agreed. In general, the constant wrestling with 12 and radical shifting in organizational direction (and the playoff misses) will dominate this era of Packers history and firmly attach itself to all the key "players". Even if 10 fails (or never ascends to the starting role), he's the sideshow to the spectacle. Unless 10 becomes a quality NFL QB, he'll be quickly forgotten.

6 points
6
0
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:14 am

"Unless 10 becomes a quality NFL QB, he'll be quickly forgotten."

He could be the Rich Campbell of the 2020s...

-4 points
2
6
barutanseijin's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:41 pm

He isn’t. His arm is too strong for that. We know that much already.

1 points
1
0
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 01:52 pm

I meant in terms of being forgotten, not in talent. I'm betting that Love will be a star in this league for years if he's able to leave the Packers.

0 points
2
2
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

January 29, 2023 at 01:24 pm

#10 has already accomplished more in his career for the Packers than Campbell ever did.

0 points
0
0
MainePackFan's picture

January 28, 2023 at 02:30 pm

CW, I know it's your assertion that Murphy is behind the AR contract extension. That may be true, I have no way of confirming it one way or the other. Let's assume you are correct.

If that is the case, do you also contend that Murphy was behind the selection of Love in the draft? If Gute is merely a puppet whose strings are being pulled by Murphy, it would stand to reason that control didn't start in 2022.

Who knows, maybe Gute didn't want to draft Love, but Murphy's puppet strings took over :)

0 points
1
1
Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 02:59 pm

I would certainly assume that Murphy was aware of the possibility and Love’s standing on our board. I very much doubt that Gute’s move was not contemplated and the scenario discussed, or LaFleur dances that Jig he did when we picked him were it a shock to any member of the Packers leadership. Murphy was in the room at the time as well I believe.

Murphy himself said in the January before Love was drafted (2019): “[T]he reality is eventually we’ve got to make decisions that are in the long-term, best interests of the organization. And we’ll see. I think Aaron was drafted when Brett was about the age that Aaron is now. So, that’s certainly an option. We’ll see. We’re still in the process of preparing for the draft and who knows what might be available when we’re scheduled to pick.”

Yes, I think Murphy both knew and approved of the possibility, but I think no one knew that the draft would fall that way, just that if it did, they’d take the chance.

3 points
3
0
MainePackFan's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:15 pm

“[T]he reality is eventually we’ve got to make decisions that are in the long-term, best interests of the organization."

What do you think changed his mind? The dysfunctional mess created by these 2 decisions (draft Love/extend Rodgers), in my humble opinion, has not been in the "best interests of the organization" in the short-term or the long-term.

2 points
2
0
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:24 pm

Hubris.

2 points
2
0
dobber's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:34 pm

Fear.

3 points
3
0
dobber's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:20 pm

I would be shocked if in this power structure Murphy isn't kept in the loop on all day 1 picks (if not also day 2) before the slip is read at the podium.

4 points
4
0
MainePackFan's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:31 pm

dobber, I agree, and I also have to believe that it's that same power structure that made the decision to extend Rodgers. I don't believe Murphy looked for input regarding the draft but didn't seek input on the extension. I just don't believe this all comes down on Murphy.

0 points
2
2
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

January 29, 2023 at 01:27 pm

Murphy was very involved with offering Favre $20,000,000 to quit & retire. I feel strongly Murphy was involved with the legacy contract for Rodgers. I do not believe (have nothing to go by other than belief) that Murphy is not involved in selecting draft picks, or FA's. Certainly Gutey shares his draft board with Murphy leading up to the draft.

1 points
1
0
Since'61's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:47 pm

Offal!!! Excellent choice of words Coldworld. That sums this mess up perfectly. Thanks, Since '61

1 points
1
0
Handsback's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:04 am

I'm sorry Cory but I don't agree with your premise of a GMs performance boils down to one man.
In Gutseys case, there is one thing he must do...keep the talent pool refreshed. When he took over he had to compensate for TT's draft decisions and sign 4 major FA players to keep that talent pool full.
When his all world QB showed signs of back sliding...he did what he had to do.
All the roster players have a talent that fits the Packer needs. His job is replace and improve. If someone interjects or bypasses his opinion, do we still hold him responsible?
Love pick was a Gutsey move...
Just MHO

11 points
14
3
stockholder's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:09 am

Cory- Legacy isn't what were after in Green Bay.
What Did Gutey leave the packers?
It's time to write his obituary and not praise him.
He caused the divide in the fan base.
And put this organization and team at the crossroads.
The Cap hell that will take years to get out of.
Not to mention the power struggles between
players and dealing in good faith.
What is disturbing is the overlooking talented players
and drafting of another position with less impact.
Yes, I'm referring to the sitting of players before starting.
Haven't we had enough of the Love/Rodgers distractions?
And the railroading of players in this organization?
Thats exactly what Gutey wanted. Wolf didn't.
And TT gave us financial stability, and draft importance!
That you never pass on a talented guy dropping.
Gutey is everything we don't need in a proud organization.
So just stop. If they're a packer. Stamp it on the butt!

-11 points
8
19
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:57 am

Congratulations, a solid 8 on the Bonkers Scale. Well done!

Let's evaluate just how bonkers this is, shall we?

"He caused the divide in the fan base."

I assume you mean the Love draft pick. Yes, it was controversial to some of the fanbase, but it didn't really divide the base at the time. The division is really over Rodgers, not Love, and started, IMO with Rodgers' anti-team and anti-management tirade before the 21 draft. This also coincides with Rodgers' increase in passive-aggressive behavior towards the team and media. Rodgers is at least partially responsible for the division, which actually plays into his narrative that the team needs him to succeed. This is not on Gutekunst, who has been a "good soldier" throughout this entire mess.

"The Cap hell that will take years to get out of."

As you've been told too many times to count now, Murphy and Baal are responsible for our cap hell caused mostly by Rodgers' cap-killing contract. Gutekunst had nothing to do with this because this is not his area of responsibility,

"Not to mention the power struggles between players and dealing in good faith."

Hmm, are you referring to the team's dealings with Rodgers? As I remember it, Murphy rolled over like a subservient dog and gave Rodgers $150 million so that he (Rodgers) would rub his (Murphy's) tummy. Any power struggle was over in about 10 seconds. And once again, this is NOT Gutekunst's area of responsibility.

"What is disturbing is the overlooking talented players and drafting of another position with less impact. Yes, I'm referring to the sitting of players before starting."

Well, as anyone who knows the game can tell you, the NFL draft is often a crapshoot, and sometimes the results of a draft depend on how a team handles a drafted player. Here's an example for you: a certain QB thought to be a fuck-up and wasted pick by his head coac. As a rookie, he threw only 5 passes with no TDs, but was responsible for at least one pick-six. A "party boy" who would never amount to much. Luckiily for this much-maligned bust, he was traded and is now in the HOF thanks to Ron Wolf and Mike Holmgren.

This answers your second point - MLF does not report to Gutekunst and is solely (with Murphy's approval, I would assume) responsible for whether a player plays or not. Who was responsible for trotting Amari Rodgers out to perform sub-standardly as a returner? MLF. Whi brought in Keisean Nixon as his replacement and then had to wait until Bisaccia (I assume) finally got MLF to sit Am Rodgers? Gutekunst. Get your facts straight,

"Haven't we had enough of the Love/Rodgers distractions?"

Yes, yes we have. Rodgers could end this today by requesting a trade, but I don't think he should. He may be the axis around which all this distraction is revolving, and he may be enjoying this distraction, but he can and should act however he pleases. By saying nothing, he may in fact be helping the Packers set up a trade. Or not. No way to tell. So - maybe it would help if you yourself stopped bringing it up?

"And the railroading of players in this organization?"

Are you referring to the trade talk around your Dear Leader? Why? Teams trade and cut players all the time. This is business, not railroading. Railroading cannot happen in the league anymore - there's a union, remember?

"Thats exactly what Gutey wanted. Wolf didn't."

Railroading players? Distraction? What, exactly, are you talking about?

"And TT gave us financial stability, and draft importance!"

TT didn't have Murphy involved in everything and was responsible for contracts. Because of Murphy's restructuring after TT was retired, Gutekunst is not involved in the team's finances or contract talks. HOW MANY TIMES MUST YOU BE TOLD THIS? Murphy is responsible for the current cap situation (financially, the team is sound thanks to outside investments). And what the hell is "draft importance"?

"That you never pass on a talented guy dropping."

Gutekunst would agree with you, which is why he traded up to get Love. And Watson. Understand now?

"Gutey is everything we don't need in a proud organization."

Wrong on so many levels. It's MURPHY whom we don't need.

"So just stop."

Please do, with this kind of willfully misinformed idiotic post. Please, though, continue with your other types of posts; they help lighten the board, I think. And I actually think your draft posts may have some insight buried in them - please continue with those, too.

"Stamp it on the butt!"

This is humorously incongruous in the context of the rest of the post. Stamp WhAT on the butt? Are we sure it even has a butt, whatever it is?

11 points
13
2
HawkPacker's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:05 am

Lengthy editorial jurp.

Box of cookies for you as this is a good post.

Stockholder doesn't seem to want to pay attention to posts that do not agree with him.

3 points
6
3
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:15 am

Thanks, Hawk

Going with today's theme, stockholder is one of the larger windmills on the site.

-1 points
1
2
Bitternotsour's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:36 am

the troll beneath the bridge. suspect grasp of language, no idea of team structure, limited understanding of football. I assume he was brought in to lively up the comments. it's sort of working, though I do my best to ignore the inanity.

but we can stick with Quixote - that was a nice turn. bravo.

1 points
3
2
jannes bjornson's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:53 am

Preach it. Keep up the good work...

-1 points
2
3
Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:54 am

This perhaps should be known as the Stockholder Ballad:

“Ladies and Gentlemen, skinny and stout,
I’ll tell you a tale I know nothing about;
The Admission is free, so pay at the door,
Now pull up a chair and sit on the floor.

One fine day in the middle of the night,
Two dead boys got up to fight;
Back to back they faced each other,
Drew their swords and shot each other.

A blind man came to watch fair play,
A mute man came to shout “Horray!”
A deaf policeman heard the noise and
Came to stop those two dead boys.

He lived on the corner in the middle of the block,
In a two-story house on a vacant lot;
A man with no legs came walking by,
and kicked the lawman in his thigh.

He crashed through a wall without making a sound,
into a dry creek bed and suddenly drowned;
The long black hearse came to cart him away,
But he ran for his life and is still gone today.

I watched from the corner of the big round table,
The only eyewitness to facts of my fable;
But if you doubt my lies are true,
Just ask the blind man, he saw it too.”

-Anonymous

6 points
9
3
pantz_bURp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 11:08 am

In reading this gem Cold...I envisioned this to be Coach LaF's offense. The reader in this case, is our opponents' defense.

I gotta dust off the VHS of Dead Poet's Society. 😀

3 points
3
0
jannes bjornson's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:45 pm

What offense?

1 points
1
0
pantz_bURp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 01:09 pm

Exactly, that is why I used envisioned. My hopes was/is it would be the illusion of complexity. Which would equate to success on offense.

After some thought, this poem is somewhat parallel to #12 at the mic being asked about what he is doing to help the rookie WRs to aid in their development with him....this is his response? Not sure on this one, just wild speculation on my part.

2 points
2
0
Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 02:31 pm

It’s striking that I don’t recall the writers singling out LaFleur. Plenty of pieces focused on Rodgers, Murphy, Gute, Barry yet none about the man who laid out so many targets so often during the season and preseason.

3 points
4
1
stockholder's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:01 pm

Garbage - This is about serious football matters.
You are blind. I don't need your opinion.
Love was the weapon for a power hungry gm.

-6 points
2
8
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:24 pm

"Love was the weapon for a power hungry gm."

Given the timing of the post, and because it was preceded by "This is about serious football matters.
You are blind.", This post gets full marks - a perfect 10 - on the Bonkers Scale. This is quite a feat because the Bonkers Scale works like the Richter Scale in that it increases exponentially. Very hard to go from 8 (today's previous high) up to a 10. Bravo!

3 points
4
1
jannes bjornson's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:50 pm

The Love pick was an obvious Power Play. A Gutedkunst stamp in hot wax. A fulcrum point which kept contributors from the Packer roster. We can watch a few of these guys, not taken, perform tomorrow in the CH Games.

-2 points
0
2
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 01:54 pm

It must be difficult walking forward with your eyes glued firmly to the past.

1 points
3
2
jannes bjornson's picture

January 29, 2023 at 11:34 am

I use six gears, all moving Forward. Not a recidivist, not addicted to kool aid. He made his mark with His guy, who has not seen the field in three years. 2010 is the past dude.

0 points
0
0
Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 02:41 pm

You Stockholder are becoming the embodiment of Azathoth. H.P. Lovecraft predicted you.

“[O]utside the ordered universe [is] that amorphous blight of nethermost confusion which blasphemes and bubbles at the center of all infinity.”

“Here the vast Lord of All in darkness muttered
Things he had dreamed but could not understand,
While near him shapeless bat-things flopped and fluttered
In idiot vortices that ray-streams fanned.”

0 points
4
4
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:28 pm

At least he's not At the Mountains of Madness.

CW, if you've never seen 'Professor Peabody's Last Lecture" from Night Gallery, you need to find it (it used to be on fee Hulu; may be on YouTube now). It is the first known instance of Lovecraft being referenced in non-print media. Carl Reiner is great in it, although the Shogggoth leaves much to be desire.

0 points
1
1
Rebecca's picture

January 30, 2023 at 10:39 am

🫦

0 points
0
0
NJ-RICK's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:21 am

Time for Gute to move on... I had no problem with the Packers signing AR12 to a 3 yr contract but at least give the guy some veteran talented WR and TE's to throw to. Losing D Adams was the Packers down fall on Offense. If the Packers can't bring in some talented free agent WR's or TE's then AR12 should move on, otherwise next season will be a repeat of last season. Gute has really divided up this team. The Eagles and 49ers are all about DEFENSE..... The Packers still lack so much in that area... Packer's personnel are poor judge of college talent.

-13 points
7
20
Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:38 am

The Packers can’t bring in any talented anyone thanks to what Murphy and Ball have done with the cap. Gute may get flushed out with the dirty water, but he’s neither the architect nor driver of this.

12 points
14
2
Johnblood27's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:42 am

you could spend 2/3 of your posts here just trying to inject some truth and reality into others' posts.

A cookie for trying, but the windmills always win around here...

8 points
9
1
MooPack's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:48 am

Don’t know about winning, but there sure seems to be a lot of gusty wind to keep them spinning.

1 points
2
1
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 09:03 am

Reference missed, methinks, although the windiness reference certainly works well.

2 points
3
1
MooPack's picture

January 28, 2023 at 09:17 am

Nah, I just like the play on words.

2 points
2
0
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 09:23 am

You did well, then :)

1 points
2
1
Johnblood27's picture

January 29, 2023 at 08:28 am

A Quixotic reply...

0 points
0
0
Rebecca's picture

January 30, 2023 at 10:40 am

💩💩💩

0 points
0
0
dobber's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:25 pm

"You're in charge of the roster and personnel...except when you're not."

--Mark Murphy

1 points
1
0
egbertsouse's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:38 am

Picking a guy in the first round and sitting his butt on the bench for 3-4 years is GM malfeasance in today’s salary cap world. It is not 1967 and you don’t have the luxury of drafting a 1st round QB and sitting him for 5 years. You need to make hay while he’s on his rookie contract so you can surround him with talent. Today’s motto is: Get them good or get them gone.

However, based on the Packers’ management structure, I realize that Gutey will never be held accountable. I predict that when Murphy leaves, Gutey will become the team president. It’s the Packer way.

-2 points
9
11
Johnblood27's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:44 am

Were you even born when the GBP selected Jordan Love?

Do you even have a clue to the context of the previous 2-3 years of on-field performance before his selection?

Do you recall a Super Bowl winning Head Football Coach named Mike McCarthy and how his exit from the hamlet of Green Bay transpired?

Sheesh, I just don't even know what to say when I read absolute feces like this.

Brian Gutekunst is quite clearly NOT the villain in any of the above scenarios.

6 points
10
4
stockholder's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:14 am

quite clearly NOT the villain?- Wrong- there were other choices!
SF took Purdy!

-6 points
4
10
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:20 am

Every GM, including SF's, passed on Purdy through six rounds. Are they all villains? Stupid? Bad GMs? Get a grip.

It must be exhausting being you...

Like NE when they took Brady (6th round, IIRC) and Seattle when they took Wilson after already having Flynn under contract, SF got lucky (so far) with Purdy.

Hindsight is always 20/20, foresight almost never is. The Watson pick may be a rate example of 20/20 foresight, due to the skill of the Packers' scouting department and GM. We won't know for sure for another couple of years.

1 points
3
2
stockholder's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:50 am

Purdy was a QB. Just saying.

It's better to Keep your options open.
He doesn't. The Love pick was to divide!
He's turn the draft into Love at first site.

-4 points
2
6
Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:59 am

And no one took him seriously until he got extended playing time. Good grief, do you listen even to yourself and hear it? If not, why must we suffer this vortex of tortured, fragmented pondering?

6 points
7
1
jannes bjornson's picture

January 28, 2023 at 11:09 am

What scenario makes sense to a football operation playing to "win it all' in our "last dance", Taking Love to sit for 3-4 years, or fielding Higgins at WR #2 with Devante? Maybe they choose Travon Diggs (Winfield, Taylor) with the two pick ( removing King from the lineup) and the pesky #4 pick could have gone to Sneed at safety in lieu of Savage getting hood-winked by Brady a few times on key 3rd downs? Three players, not chosen. At least one of them would have made a difference in 2020-2021 to propel a Playoff Win and a trip to the SB. What might have been etc. is the counter argument from a captured audience, but this is the Evidence File, the indictment of Gutedkunst. Those are His calls. The decline of Rodgers was a fabrication, 26 TDs and 4 picks in 2019 with one viable receiving option and how many Dropped balls?

1 points
4
3
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:31 pm

"Higgins, not Love!" = hindsight. Without Love on the roster, who would you have used for a backup in 21? A draftee? Whom? And what round? And which GB draftee in the 21 draft would you NOT have drafted so that we had this hypothetical not-Love backup? Or, which journeyman would you have picked up - and why?

Every decision has future consequences that can never be known. If only Hitler had died when he got gassed in WWI...

0 points
1
1
jannes bjornson's picture

January 28, 2023 at 01:12 pm

The point was this guy is not a strategist and can barely see a depth chart that makes sense. The players were well scouted by the pre-draft bloggers. The Howling against the Love pick at the time was palpable. Most serious SB contenders would go with a Veteran, journeyman QB, behind the stater. Love wasn't even activated most of the time in rookie year, so he wasn't in consideration to back up anybody. Boyle was their guy. Stokes would be replaced by Tyson Campbell who was the better cover guy on the Georgia's squad. I guess Rousseau, who was brow beaten by the draft business crowd of lemmings is doing pretty well for Miami with 12 sacks, but we don't need pass rushers, correct? The obvious preference for Creed Humphrey over Myers. A no-brainer. The Amari selection, what can one say? No SB 4 U. The second round was loaded with quality NFL players, just like 2022 and 2023. Case Keenum would have been my guy to replace Boyle. The QB issue would have been addressed in the 2019 draft and Stidhem was a guy I wanted with another pick in the third round. He was available, but Gutedkunst, naturally traded away the four pick. He liked Sternberger over McLaurin. My Tirade is well-documented on JS after that particular whiff. Keke over a guy they should have watched every weekend in Madison, Van Ginkle an edge guy.

2 points
3
1
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 01:58 pm

Because Gutekunst's plan was not your plan does not make his plan wrong nor your plan right. His rosters got three 13 win seasons in a row; he was not in charge of player usage or coaching. so those seasons ended as they did.

The only draft choice I agree with you on is Humphreys over Myer. I suspect they thought Myers could play at multiple OL positions. No GM gets a majority of the picks right.

-2 points
1
3
dobber's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:28 pm

The driving the Packers organization right now feels about like riding the bumper cars at the fair with your 6-year-old.

2 points
2
0
Johnblood27's picture

January 29, 2023 at 08:26 am

some other fanatical kraut would have empowered Himmler and things would have been basically the same. I dont think that just one guy drove the agenda that became the legacy of the name Hitler.

Great book on the subject of the Einsatzgruppen by Richard Rhodes called Masters of Death. The SS was one very sick group of people.

0 points
0
0
Oppy's picture

January 28, 2023 at 02:30 pm

Were you and stockholder out of the country or in a coma or something that you weren't available to see what happened in 2005?

-1 points
1
2
jannes bjornson's picture

January 29, 2023 at 11:45 am

Ted accepted the gift and drafted Rodgers. sherman was the coach. Ted Fired him after the final game, at dawn. What else was there to see? Attended my first Packer game in 1960. Have seen pretty much all of the story.

0 points
0
0
CheesedDeadHead's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:51 am

"SF took Purdy!"

After passing on him how many times? Every team passed on Purdy on average 7 times. SEVEN. He was the last player selected which in many cases is an attempt to reduce competition for a UDFA, not to acknowledge a great talent.

Anyone pointing to Purdy for any meaning is so clueless they don't have a chance of stopping the stupid stick from hitting them every second...

4 points
6
2
dobber's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:34 pm

"SF took Purdy!"

Congrats on the red herring.

1 points
1
0
Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:46 am

Gute should perhaps become true GM when Murphy leaves. Rumor is, though, that Murphy wants Ball as his replacement as President, not Gute. Ball was the one he allowed to stand in for Thompson in 2015-18, and had suggested him as a permanent successor at the time. Look where that got us. Even when forced by results and resistance from both the coach and QB to drop Ball as GM, Murphy very openly ensured that Ball had equal status with Gute and reported only to Murohy. Unheard of for a contract guy and a true GM. But Ball has always been Murphy’s man.

Regardless, the next Packer President needs to be none of the above and he or she needs to be not involved in day-to-day football operations. They must come from outside and have an independent perspective. The person that nominates, and thus controls the board in our unique structure, must not also be allowed to become the problem. We are seeing why that mingling is a disaster now.

3 points
6
3
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 09:15 am

Sigh, but I can easily see a corporate org chart like this after Murphy retires:

President: Baal
GM - some weak-spined lickspittle
Coach - another weak-spined lickspittle
CFO - A former corporate raider

Financial Result? Titletown completed and coining money. Additional property acquired for expansion. BoD besides themselves with joy.

Football Results? Perennial doormats. Now nicknamed the Green Bay Aaaackers (reference to Bloom County, for those too young). A .500 season is considered a successful season. Free agency has dried up because no one wants to play in Tiny Town for a shitty team.

Results on the fanbase? The season ticket list has been pruned 30-40%, but Lambeau is still full on gamedays. Many season-ticket holders, however, are selling their seats to fans of the opposing teams. After a couple of years of seeing more opposing colors than green-and-gold in the stands, the Board institutes a ban on ticket resale in response.

Doom and gloom? Yep, but with Baal as President and the same org chart as now in place, who would want to come here in the FO? No one with any self-respect, that's for sure.

2 points
2
0
dobber's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:04 am

" Now nicknamed the Green Bay Aaaackers (reference to Bloom County, for those too young)"

The Bloom Picayune is now the official outlet for all Packers press releases.

2 points
2
0
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:21 am

LOL! I bet that it'll be at least as hard-hitting as the Post-Crescent.

2 points
2
0
stockholder's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:07 pm

Since you Love to reply to my posts:

Let me help you with Murphys replacement.
Murphy should Fire Gutey. Retire.
And let the board hire JC Trotter.
Who is currently the president of the players union.
We don't need another Idiot who's only purpose
is to divide and over-pay himself.

0 points
2
2
Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:16 pm

It’s Tretter, not Trotter, but it is a sow’s ear of an idea.

1 points
2
1
dobber's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:40 pm

Agreed.

What's best for the Packers is for the next President to oversee the overall running of the organization, but to return football decisions to the GM. Tretter likely has no idea how to run an organization as complex as an NFL franchise. Bringing in a "football guy" invites a continuation of the current power structure and further meddling from above.

1 points
2
1
BirdDogUni's picture

January 29, 2023 at 08:57 am

I would expect AR12 in the Presidency before any other player. He's obviously the smartest man in the room...

AR12 has owned two NFL franchises in the last 18 years. Duh Chicago bares and the Green Bay Packers. Played them both like a fiddle. As much as we're paying him he might as well be CEO, GM, HC, and OC...

I say that only half jokingly.

0 points
0
0
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:34 pm

I do love to reply to your posts :)

"We don't need another Idiot who's only purpose
is to divide and over-pay himself."

and perhaps, shockingly to you, I agree with that sentiment. I'm not too excited about your choice of replacement, but it does have the advantage of being someone from outside the current team structure. I prefer someone with executive experience, but from the non-profit world. I have no one in mind, though. I think Gutekunst is a goner once Murphy leaves, but if Murphy retires early, he should let his replacement ax him. And LaFuckup, too.

0 points
0
0
dobber's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:43 pm

"I think Gutekunst is a goner once Murphy leaves"

Will have a lot to do with how the Packers are doing and who is hired, methinks.

0 points
0
0
stockholder's picture

January 28, 2023 at 04:22 pm

I would hire somebody before.
That way he can get use to the board.
And the board to him.
Mike Borgonzi is My choice to replace
Gutey. (KC)

0 points
1
1
lou's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:02 pm

Packer President ? Cmon Man. The only current Packer options besides lots of outside options are Russ Ball and Ed Policy.

-1 points
3
4
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:34 pm

I would be strongly in favor of an outside hire for Packers President; specifically, a very experienced CEO of a major non-profit. Baal would probably quit, which would make the hire a win-win.

3 points
3
0
jannes bjornson's picture

January 28, 2023 at 01:43 pm

Andrew Brandt would have kept the ship on the correct course. He couldn't deal with Ted's reluctance to acquire FAs and his over-paying His guys.

4 points
4
0
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 01:59 pm

Yeah, he would've been a very good hire, I think.

3 points
3
0
dobber's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:50 pm

We'll never know. He seemed to be happy to run in a different direction, and nobody has lured the genius back to the NFL.

1 points
1
0
lou's picture

January 28, 2023 at 05:31 pm

Ball was seriously considered when Murphy got the job, age may be a factor with him. Policy's father Carmen was the team President when the 49ers won all the super bowls with Montana & Young, and is the teams legal counsel also held in high regard, don't count him out.

-1 points
0
1
Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 06:55 pm

He’s 63, 5 years younger than Murphy. Policy is general counsel and now COO and in his early 50s. Personally, after what Murphy has done to the checks and balances within the organization, and they’ve been presumably comfortable with, and are king time insiders, I’d say on no account should either be seen as viable candidates. This organization needs fresh perspectives and a leader who is not steeped in the current culture and mindset. We need to open the windows and let in light and fresh air.

1 points
1
0
PackyCheese500's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:24 pm

What about Mahomes? Didn't he sit on the bench for a year?

1 points
1
0
PackyCheese500's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:24 pm

Duplicate

0 points
0
0
Johnblood27's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:49 am

Hey, I have an idea for you Corey.

Write a column pillorying Gutey based solely upon his 3rd round selections and add in all of the "potential" picks he "could have had" in all the spots where he traded draft picks to move around in the draft.

Now THAT would be a "fair" evaluation, at least it would equate to evaluating him solely on the pick of Jordan Love.

Your shit-stirring is at its peak. Nice work!

9 points
11
2
BirdDogUni's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:28 pm

Oh shit, you actually read the articles?

I just come to read what stockholder writes...

After I get done laughing, I read the rational, well-thought out knowledgeable CHTV commenters remarks, and I know exactly what is said in the articles.

If, by chance, I am one of the first to see an article, I do read it, and write a comment.

To me, the writers have a tough job. Picking a topic that will get the most reaction from those reading it and those trying to frame an argument that will get the readers thinking as they do, either way, I'm sure it's not easy.

I too was fairly pissed when Gutey drafted Love, because the timing was shit.

Then, Gutey didn't have the power last year to trade AR12 and install Love like he absolutely planned to do, because of Murphy.

Everything about Gutey's tenure with GB will be rightfully judged by how the Love decision turns out. Every GM is always judged by the QBs they draft and when they move up to draft them, the scrutiny is even worse.

The truest test of Gutey's metal will be what he is able to trade AR12 for this off-season, or if he's forced to keep AR12 another year by Murphy, we will know exactly what kind of GM he truly is, a weak one...

1 points
1
0
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:38 pm

"Oh shit, you actually read the articles?

I just come to read what stockholder writes..."

You, too? I think all some of the writers have to do is write an inticing headline and a one paragraph abstract. The comments would flow like melted butter if the abstract can stir the pot enough.

As for Gutekunst... why the hell hasn't he resigned yet? Does Murphy have incriminating photos? Has he left his spine for cleaning at the chiropracters and can't be bothered to pick it up? Is he a Vogon in disguise, building a case for the demolition of all Earths across all possible timelines? Baffling...

4 points
4
0
Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:10 pm

In general, I think Gute has done a decent job, maybe better if last year continues to pan out. Ultimately though, there’s only so much pandering that I can stomach even then. If they do the wrong thing now, I think, sadly, that he gets flushed out with the detritus as well when, a year later and I. A bigger mess we are just as futile. In the end, complicity is there through facilitation, regardless of agreement in principle or not.

0 points
0
0
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:39 pm

Yeah, I think you're 100% correct.

I quit my last professional job without a job lined up, primarily because the place was literally driving me crazy (it was owned by one guy who was... well, politely, all I'll say he was a piece of work). People would get fired for no apparent reason, strategy would shift every six months, decisions that were made at the executive level were, when shown to wrong, blamed on lower-level employees, people rarely lasted 2 years... i think you get the picture. After three years, I was done. Haven't worked professionally since, but my mental health is the best it's been in years.

So, how the hell can Gutekunst be happy? Be proud of his work? Sleep at night? I'm truly baffled why he's still here.

1 points
1
0
BirdDogUni's picture

January 28, 2023 at 06:41 pm

Gutey himself describes himself as a scout. As Personnel GM, he is a glorified scout and I think scouting is what he loves. Oh, I know he loves the Packers too, or else why would he put up with Murphy's BS?

If Gutey can't convince Murphy the thing to do this off-season is to trade AR12, then he's not the man I think he is. If we don't trade AR12, how do we get our Cap situation sorted out? If we don't trade AR12, what ends up happening to Love, his career, and our prospects for a decent starting QB when AR12 is gone?

I don't know what the truth is, but I believe Gutey's plan all along was to trade AR12 to Denver last year, install Love as QB, and Murphy put the kibosh on it. After a 8 - 9 season, if Gutey still can't convince Murphy we need to trade AR12, get our Cap straight, and move on as a franchise, I don't know what tell you. It looks pretty %'in bleak to me.

Trading AR is probably the only thing that will get this franchise straightened out, but is that even up to Gutey? What happens if Murphy were to say no again this year? I don' think that is even a possibility this year, because I think AR12 is right now trying to decide which team he most wants to go to, because he knows what a mess he's in the middle of right now.

We don't even have the money to re-sign his buddies, now. AR12 isn't stupid. He knows he's not getting anymore help than a new draft class, because we can't afford it. Just from the things he's said so far on PMS tells me he's come to terms with that fact. I would be shocked if he plays in GB next season.

3 points
3
0
croatpackfan's picture

January 28, 2023 at 01:10 pm

I beieve Joshua Deguara can be excellent player But he wasn't/isn't ACR darling. He might have some pride. And he was 3rd round selection!

-4 points
1
5
BirdDogUni's picture

January 28, 2023 at 06:42 pm

He should've been a 6th round pick...

1 points
3
2
Swisch's picture

January 28, 2023 at 09:14 am

After an amazing string of three straight seasons of 13 wins, with a couple of playoff victories along the way, both Gute and LaFleur had the bargaining power of being able to get hired by other NFL teams.
Both of them could have pushed back when it came to giving Rodgers his monstrous new contract, privately and even publicly.
Neither of them did.
Perhaps both of them wanted to bring back Rodgers, perhaps neither.
However, both sold out much of their dignity in appeasing the pomposity of Rodgers interfering in their jobs of personnel and coaching -- toward the ruin of the Packers in results and reputation.
***
It's been tragic all along, and the results on the field increasingly ugly when it comes to the unceremonious losing of big games at Lambeau Field to abruptly end the season three years in a row.
Indeed, it seems still the case that neither Gute nor LaFleur will stand up to the arrogant and domineering weirdo who continues to jerk around the Packers. I don't know how they can live with their servility.
At the least, we fans don't have to grovel before Rodgers, and can express disgust at management for being so spineless in doing so.
I hope we can bring Gute and LaFleur back to sanity, and dignity, for their sakes and ours. Don't sell out the good name of the Packers for anyone ever.

-2 points
7
9
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

January 29, 2023 at 01:33 pm

Swisch,
Well said!

0 points
0
0
Dragon5's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:22 am

Finger pointing be dammed, I see a psychological flaw in the way many NFL orgs / GMs execute their draft circus. The media will always advertise the prolific home run / sure thing pick in the first round, but ask yourself just how common is that? If so obvious, why do generational talents like Aaron Donald fall to the 13th pick? Like a forbidden fruit, the excessive promotion of day 1 not only gets the fan's attention, but keeps it. Herein lies the tragedy of the first round, with it's daunting psychological load on GMs and player alike to deliver instant gratification to a starving and/or drooling fan base. If management would instead lean more to acquire second round picks, often associated with trading down, not only do odds of fulfilling roster tenure for the foreseeable future increase, but more importantly, the psychological burden morphs into a boon as the pressure that comes with nailing a solo first round pick subsides, and more importantly, these highly talented players, many of whom were graded or thought of themselves as a first round pick, essentially become media-branded misfit toys, inciting MAJOR chips on their shoulders to outperform their draft slot selection. It is well known in human behavior that the fear of loss is greater than the hope of gain. Unfortunately, far too often NFL draft shot callers fail to heed evolution's primal instinct, only to have their heads prematurely roll.

1 points
3
2
Packfangirl's picture

January 28, 2023 at 04:38 pm

Hey Dragon5, When do you post your comments for players etc based on their astrology chart? I used to get a kick out of reading them...then I tried to go back because some seemed to play out like your comments...This might get laughed at, and that's OK :), but I was just wondering...Thank you!

0 points
0
0
pantz_bURp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:37 am

If Love is the fork, who is spooning each other? What about the sign, "Dip in the Road" followed by the sign "Blind Intersection"...then "Caution, One Way". What about the side mirror, "Objects in Mirror are Closer Than They Appear"? So many questions, do few answers.

I am not a big fan of looking back, after the fact and saying we could have drafted Higgins or Queen. What if they did choose one of them or another? We are assuming #12 still recommits himself and plays great during the regular season, like he did.

It is fun to discuss, evaluate and learn. Not sure what can be learned in the here and now. We have to address this mess. I shouldn't use we because my neck and legacy aren't on the line. But, that is what they are paid for.

"Two roads diverged within the woods...and I, took the one less traveled by..." and on and on we go.

3 points
6
3
Heyward's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:43 am

Gutekunst hasn't done a good job as GM. If he did a good job, the Packers would've played in a Super Bowl and not finished third in the North this season. He's mediocre and he won't sniff another GM job after he leaves Green Bay.

-7 points
5
12
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:44 pm

Yeah, if Gutekunst had only thrown accurately to Gutekunst in the end zone against TB for the TD, and then run hiimself into the end zone on the 2-pointer, we could've tied that Game. And then Gutekunst could've kicked the game-winning FG after intercepting Brady in OT to get us to the SB.

Or., if only Gutekunst would've made that block against SF, maybe Gutekunst's punt wouldn't have been blocked. And even if Gutekunst fails on the punt, Gutekunst should've hit the wide-open Gutekunst on fourth down for the touchdown.

Yeah, if only Gutekunst would play like a professional, then the GB Gutekunsts would've been World Champions twice in the past three years.

2 points
5
3
PackyCheese500's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:25 pm

LOL!!! made me chuckle!

3 points
3
0
Thegreatreynoldo's picture

January 28, 2023 at 10:55 am

The pressure is indeed on Gute. It probably does not help that some of the biggest decisions are not his to make.

Gute can provide a nudge in the direction he desires to go. For example, he can wear out the phone trying to find a team that AR is willing to be traded to that will pay AR and also provide enough compensation to appease the fan base and upper Packer management.

Gute has to persuade at least eight players to restructure their contracts. He might have auto-conversion rights on some of them but perhaps not all of them, and if he needs to add void years, then he needs the consent of each player. They did a good job of that last year; however, I imagine the players thought their team had a chance to contend. Such a belief might no longer exist, particularly if the team has traded AR already.

If some players refuse to restructure, Gute might have to trade them or release them. Trading means more phone calls, and releasing also entails some more decisions.

The Packers also have a long list of free agents, including some RFAs and ERFAs. Many of then are useful players even if they don't have high price tags, at least not high in a normal year. But things are really tight this year if AR is traded. Lots of decisions.

The Packers still might lose Bisaccia and perhaps Gray. I would have thought those would be decisions for Matt LaFleur, but I really don't know who does what on the Packers. I gather LaFleur does a lot of the initial screening but others have input, perhaps even something close to a veto.

5 points
7
2
CheesedDeadHead's picture

January 28, 2023 at 11:10 am

"The pressure is indeed on Gute. It probably does not help that some of the biggest decisions are not his to make."

I had a boss for 7 years who held me accountable for our "success" while giving me little to none of the authority to make decisions. Good Times. Thankfully most of the other "leaders" knew I was in an untenable situation. Hopefully, other teams will see past the Murphy stain on most of the decisions and Gute will have a post-Packers opportunity. If not, ESPN would be more than happy to hire him as a commentator if he's willing to sling mud at the Packers.

4 points
5
1
LambeauPlain's picture

January 28, 2023 at 11:06 am

Kind of shallow article that evaluates an ASSISTANT GM based on one draft pick. And even then, the book on Jordan Love still hasn't been completed...except for a few paragraphs in the "forward".

I guess Cory forgot Rodgers rode the pine for his first 3 seasons too, sitting behind a highly paid future HOFer.

No one knows if Gutey was ready to pull the trigger with Denver last year but was overruled by Murphy, MLF and Ball.

Stating Gutey wasn't sold on Love so HE gave Rodgers the cap wrecking Ball contract is silly. Murphy made that call and both Ball and MLF are more culpable than Gutey getting it done.

Gutey is not a GM in any sense as defined by other NFL teams. Murphy installed himself as the "Acting GM" on a "temporary basis" back in 2017 due to McCarthy's whining about Ted not listening to his needs. Mike also said he would resign if Ball was TTs heir.

6 years later, Murphy obviously loves the role. He isn't very good at it.

Not real impressed with your police work on this one, Cory.

9 points
10
1
Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 11:22 am

I suppose in his defense, which is hard after this twaddle, it is, at its core, fair to say that there’s little meaningful that can be predicted or said about the Packers that doesn’t hang on what’s happening with Murphy or at QB. That’s tough when one has to write something.

That’s all been said and it’s not yet February. Rodgers shows all the signs of dithering till the end of the window. Yes, I know what he said, but he said that last year. I’ve often wondered how much Adams hearing him dither during their exchanges last January sealed the decision to move finally. Ultimately we let him then and seem to be willingly the passive partner now.

For that all involved should be held accountable, starting with Murphy, who is truly trying his best to contradict his own statements. As Forrest Gump said: “stupid is as stupid does.”

3 points
3
0
Thegreatreynoldo's picture

January 28, 2023 at 02:19 pm

The combine starts on February 28 and ends March 6. It is in Indianapolis. We can do some draft stuff in the interim but things heat up when the shorts come on.

0 points
0
0
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:42 pm

There's not nearly as much fun with draft articles, though :)

Well, once AR is officially back in the fold I'll be leaving again, anyway... If pigs fly and unicorns come dancing down my street bleating that Rodgers has been traded, I'll hang around.

0 points
0
0
BirdDogUni's picture

January 28, 2023 at 07:36 pm

AR12 will likely get traded during the Combine. Not officially of course, but the groundwork conversations will be had in person over a scotch or beer or bourbon...

We have to be under the salary cap by March 15th I believe? Free Agency starts 15 March as well correct? AR12 said we'd have his decision before then. I believe shortly after the combine, we'll have AR12s answer, and news will break he's been traded, or will be traded at the most advantageous time for us. (Not sure when that is?)

We've only to wait a month or so and we'll have many more answers than we do today, don't you think James?

You're also right about another thing, once we have the Combine numbers, boards will be realigned, and serious draft talk will commence.

0 points
1
1
Rossonero's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:49 pm

You can't have your cake and eat it too.

I initially hated the Love pick on draft night 2020. Told my friends "he'll never get to play!"

As I cooled off and the buzz of beer left me though, I realized Gutekunst was attempting to look out for the long-term interests of the Packers.

After all, Rodgers was OK in 2019, but he didn't wow anyone: 4,002 yds, 26 TDs, 4 INTs with a 62% completion rate. I remember thinking, "he's backsliding sooner than I thought he would." Then we all know he went nuts in 2021 throwing 48 TDs to only 5 picks and got the two MVPs. Well deserved.

Where Gutey wanting his cake and eating it too was when he gave Rodgers that extension and still keeping Love on the roster. Obviously there was a way to make it work for the 2022 season, but the financial fork in the road is coming to pass this off-season. I just don't see how they can exercise Love's 5th year option for a fully guaranteed $20M and also keep Rodgers.

I can only hope that the financials simply force Gutekunst's hand. We all know LaFleur wants Rodgers back, but LaFleur is merely thinking about next season. Gutekunst, if he's smart -- will trade Rodgers in the coming months and recoup some much needed draft picks and cap help.

If he fails to do that, then he deserves to be relieved of his duties.

1 points
3
2
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:54 pm

Gutekunst didn't extend Rodgers, Murphy did, with Baal's help. Dumb and Dumber. Gutekunst would almost certainly have traded Rodgers to Denver and would, I'm sure, love to trade him to anyone, but Murphy makes that decision, not him,

Blame Murphy for our off-season from hell part 2, not Gutekunst.

3 points
5
2
Rossonero's picture

January 28, 2023 at 02:10 pm

What is the point of having a GM if you think Murphy is some kind of puppet master? And do you have any proof to back up that claim that Gutekunst is merely a pawn obeying Murphy?

2 points
4
2
Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:34 pm

Multiple Mark Murphy statements about how decisions are made generally by the quatrain of himself and Ball, Gute, LaFkeur who get together once every two weeks. That’s outside of other things like the LaFleur hiring, where Murphy flat out said that he knew after 2 hours that he had the right guy and ordered the recruitment process stopped their and then, stating only that no one subsequently disagreed with his actions.

0 points
1
1
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:45 pm

What is the point of having a GM if you think Murphy is some kind of puppet master? And do you have any proof to back up that claim that Gutekunst is merely a pawn obeying Murphy?

See the Packers' corporate structure for the answer to your questions. EVERYTHING RUNS THROUGH MURPHY.

0 points
1
1
BirdDogUni's picture

January 28, 2023 at 09:43 pm

Look at the Packers Organizational structure and see how far down the %'in page Gutey is...

https://www.packers.com/team/front-office-roster/

Gutey's %'in name is listed right below:

Jason Vrable WR/Passing Game Coordinator -

Now, I'm not saying Packers.com has an ax to grind with their Player Personnel GM, but if I were the supposed GM, I might be pissed off if my name were listed after 14 Administration members, 19 Football Operations members, and 27 members of the current Coaching staff.

So 60 members of the Packers Organization are listed ABOVE our GM, so how much power do you think he actually wields...

Just the visual that gives everyone makes me sick. Tell me, why on earth, wouldn't they list the front office as such:

Mark Murphy - President and CEO
Russ Ball - EVP/DOFO
Brian GUtekunst - GM of Player Personnel
Matt Lafleur - HC

And then list everyone else underneath? Seems almost disrespectful to me. Gutey seems like a humble sort and counts himself as a scout, so it probably doesn't bother him, but if a man were a bit narcissistic, I'd imagine it would bother him quite a bit.

Since Murphy has all the say over everything, Gutey might as well be listed 60th on the Packers Organizational page, because he has no real power beside scouting...

2 points
2
0
dobber's picture

January 28, 2023 at 04:04 pm

" We all know LaFleur wants Rodgers back, but LaFleur is merely thinking about next season. ."

The Packers organization is strung by their misters on the ARod thing. They have no choice but to put on a smiley public face.

0 points
0
0
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 12:52 pm

I just had this waking nightmare... Gutekunst finally gets his balls back from the pawnshop and resigns, so Murphy promotes -

Wait for it...

LaFuckup to Coach and General Manager! And in 2025, when Murphy retires, Baal becomes President and LaFuckup, as GM, hires Barry as his replacement at Coach. Barry then hires Mo Drayton as DC.

*shiver*

It's five o'clock somewhere and there's a beer looking for me to get outside of it...

2 points
5
3
jannes bjornson's picture

January 28, 2023 at 01:51 pm

They all have to go. The nightmare scenario; however, has motivated me to take the beer run before the Badger game begins.

2 points
2
0
stockholder's picture

January 28, 2023 at 02:39 pm

I thought his message had a " Do not reply on it. "

-1 points
0
1
Alberta_Packer's picture

January 28, 2023 at 01:43 pm

The acute irony here is that the most competent football mind in the organization (Gutekunst) - has been positioned to be the fall guy through the actions, and non-actions, of an autocratic and obsolete President - a complicit Executive Committee and a head-in-sand Board of Directors.

I would have expected that for a community-owned sports organization - the good village people would have shown-up, by now, at Murphy's doorstep - with torches and pitchforks in hand. Figuratively speaking of course. Perhaps at the stockholders meeting - or not.

5 points
5
0
jannes bjornson's picture

January 28, 2023 at 01:53 pm

He is a willing participant in this screwball comedy of errors. If he didn't like the deal, he could be running the show in Houston.

0 points
1
1
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 02:17 pm

Sad but true. I have no idea why he's staying. If he truly thinks he'll be Murphy's successor then I strongly suspect he'll be one very disappointed (and unemployed after Baal fires him) General Manager.

3 points
3
0
Coldworld's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:26 pm

Gute is a talent guy. He, and no one like him, should be seen as a Presidential prospect because no President should be a GM and no GM has the requisite background in what is required. The next President should have years running large organizations with multiple stakeholders. Gute is a potential future GM, and could be a good one if he doesn’t let himself get tarred by association with the others around him.

4 points
4
0
Alberta_Packer's picture

January 28, 2023 at 02:19 pm

My take is that Gutekunst has been extremely loyal to the "G" and genuinely wants to live and work in Green Bay. So he's become the "good soldier" - taking orders at the expense of his own decision-making. While admirable on one hand - it appears that he has had to compromise himself on the other.

Meanwhile, under the current hierarchy and working conditions, I don't know if there is any other scenario for a GM.

4 points
4
0
Oppy's picture

January 28, 2023 at 02:44 pm

Maybe he's waiting out the eventual end of the idiocracy of Murphy reign so he can get to be an effective GM for the team he loves and calls family.

Maybe it's important for him to keep himself and his family where he's been for the last 25 years.

1 points
2
1
Alberta_Packer's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:20 pm

I do believe that GB is a love interest that Gutekunst finds very hard to leave. He very well may be willing to wait out Murphy and his cronies. In the meantime, more suffering seems inevitable.

2 points
3
1
jurp's picture

January 28, 2023 at 03:49 pm

Yeah you may be right, but I think he's a dead man walking at this point. If they do trade Rodgers and Love doesn't immediately pan out, he's toast. Maybe he should look at becoming AD of UW-GB or UW-O or, for the LOLs, St. Norbert or Lawrence "University".

0 points
1
1
Alberta_Packer's picture

January 28, 2023 at 05:28 pm

It wouldn't be the first time that an innocent person (relatively speaking) has been pre-judged and sentenced - while the true perpetrators walk free

2 points
2
0
Coldworld's picture

January 29, 2023 at 01:06 am

If this goes further down hill, none of them will be around. Murphy will of course retire, tarnished, but LaFleur won’t survive another season like last year—I’m not merely talking wins and losses. Oddly, Gute’s draft last year could yet give him a life line: it may be the only source of light left in the gloom. However, that would undoubtedly depend on the new broom as well.

0 points
0
0
ricky's picture

January 28, 2023 at 02:18 pm

Your arguments are (1) Drafting a project QB in the first round when you already have a franchise QB is a bad idea. (2) The franchise QB might get upset at the thought of having his replacement on the team. (3) If you have a project QB on the roster, and don't see them play extensively in actual games, you can't tell whether they are ready to play.
Why does this sound so familiar? Because it is an almost exact cut/paste of the Favre/Rodgers dynamic. Including the "first ballot HOFer who has multiple MVP's" argument. What is missing is that as both players have aged, they have became more and more high maintenance, even to the point of constantly musing about whether they'd retire or not. Now we have Love. And your "nail in the coffin" argument is that Gutekunst wouldn't have given Rodgers that huge contract if he thought Love was ready. But as I've said repeatedly, can we really trust the talent evaluators on this team? They started the season with at least two OL men who were incapable of playing at a high level. Fans kept point this out, but the team kept them as starters for several weeks. Then, the team tried to make a slot WR who couldn't break into the starting lineup, and decided to make him a returner. And when it was apparent to everyone, the guy was not able to handle the job, they kept him there anyway. And the coaches? Ugh. The new OC coincided with a severe drop i offensive production, while the DC has apparently lost the respect of all the players. But the HC (and Gutekunst has to be at least partially responsible here) had decided that bringing these guys back at their current positions is a good idea. And we should trust them to decide the fate of the backup QB for the team? I still remember when the Packers had Ray Rhodes as the HC, and it became apparent he was not capable. They brought in Ron Wolf to watch some practices and give some advice. He did, and Rhodes was gone after one sub-par year. His entire staff went with him.
The real question, Mr. Jennerjohn, is what do you suggest? Trade Love for whatever you can get for him and retain Rodgers. Or the reverse? Don't worry about compensation, or quibble about how many draft picks the Packers should get. Just choose. Rodgers or Love. Because I choose Love.

3 points
4
1
Johnblood27's picture

January 28, 2023 at 06:26 pm

Wolf replaced Braatz and then shit-canned Infante.

It was after Holmy left and Rhodes was hired that Wolf saw one year of his circus and set him free to be followed by Mike Sherman who was an OK coach, but a woeful GM once Wolf left and promoted him on his way out the door.

History, it is a wonderful thing!

1 points
1
0
Packerpasty's picture

January 30, 2023 at 12:00 pm

my bet is after one season you won't be choosing Love...just don't see it, didn't see it when he was in college and I don't see it in preseason...I see a career backup...

0 points
0
0
Packerpasty's picture

January 30, 2023 at 12:00 pm

my bet is after one season you won't be choosing Love...just don't see it, didn't see it when he was in college and I don't see it in preseason...I see a career backup...

0 points
0
0
Packerpasty's picture

January 30, 2023 at 12:00 pm

my bet is after one season you won't be choosing Love...just don't see it, didn't see it when he was in college and I don't see it in preseason...I see a career backup...

0 points
0
0
PhantomII's picture

January 28, 2023 at 02:49 pm

MM got fired because our team was mismanaged by TT for several years and MM did not scheme WR's open delaying the play and inherent bad habits in QB#1. The overall talent level of the Packers was bad when Gute took over. First mistake ,hiring a rookie OC to be HC was about saving money they were still paying MM contract. Moving up for JL instead of to #20 for Jefferson mistake #2. This one has in my opinion lost us a couple super bowl chances in itself. a mix of DA and Jefferson at our WR corp is HUGE. DA moving on and having a #1 WR already on the team is also HUGE. Gute used #1 picks on Savage, the Gary Project also. Gary has progressed, Savage played quite well against Detroit so there is some hope there. Paying AR ridiculous money for (IT TAKES AN ENTIRE TEAM) mvp b.s. awards. Championships are the only thing and we have not been in over a decade. Paying a QB's ego is not gonna get us over the hump...A legit HC and DC and a big bad ass OL and DL with some elite talent sprinkled in there and offensive weapons at WR and TE WILL regardless of which one is at QB.

0 points
2
2
Duneslick's picture

January 28, 2023 at 05:45 pm

OK Packers did not need to draft a quarterback in the first round period. Then he sits and does not play. You cant rationalise that

2 points
3
1
Oppy's picture

January 28, 2023 at 08:16 pm

Uh, it worked out pretty good with Favre and Rodgers.

So.. that's pretty easy to rationalize.

0 points
2
2
SinceLombardi's picture

January 29, 2023 at 06:24 am

With all the Love/ Rodgers stuff aside I still don’t think he’s done a good job. In 2019 the season ended because we were steamrolled by a more physical team. While sometimes the final score has been closer, every season has ended and most every game has been lost to more physical teams.
He has done nothing to bring in players that make this roster stand up to teams like that. Although we do have some guys that can shove a training staff member around.
Even the best GMs are going to have good and bad draft picks, that’s a given. But what bothers me is how long he let players like Kevin King and Amari Rodgers stay on the roster. Let’s add Dean Lowry to the list. In general I’d like to see a little more Ron Wolf decisiveness on some of these players.

4 points
4
0
Oppy's picture

January 29, 2023 at 11:29 am

Re: Amari Rodgers::

You think moving on from a 3rd round pick before his second season has ended is waiting too long? Wow, tough crowd.

You can argue he shouldn't have been fielding punts as long as he was (and I'd agree with you), but that's not the GM's call.

For what it's worth, I don't think there's a talent issue with Amari, I think there was an opportunity / system (ahem..#12 system) with Amari.

-1 points
0
1
Rebecca's picture

January 29, 2023 at 09:07 am

Season’s over. The team sucked and the product was not worth the price of admission. Over priced shifty entertainment. Gutekunst is going to be just fine. We’re evidently not sick of arguing about the same crap eternally. Here’s one: Rodgers gets traded to the Bears for their #1 pick and Rodgers gets a 15% ownership in the Chicago Bears. Rogers owns the Bears!

0 points
2
2
stockholder's picture

January 29, 2023 at 05:58 pm

How many impact players are left-
2018 1 1 18 18 Jaire Alexander DB Louisville
2 2 13 45 Joshua Jackson DB Iowa
3 3 24 88 Oren Burks LB Vanderbilt
4 4 33 133 J'Mon Moore WR Missouri
5 5 1 138 Cole Madison T Washington State
6 5 35 172 JK Scott P Alabama
7 5 37 174 Marquez Valdes-Scantling WR South Florida
8 6 33 207 Equanimeous St. Brown WR Notre Dame
9 7 14 232 James Looney DT California
10 7 21 239 Hunter Bradley C Mississippi State
11 7 30 248 Kendall Donnerson LB Southeast Missouri State

0 points
1
1
stockholder's picture

January 29, 2023 at 05:59 pm

2019
1 1 12 12 Rashan Gary DE Michigan
2 1 21 21 Darnell Savage DB Maryland
3 2 12 44 Elgton Jenkins G Mississippi State
4 3 11 75 Jace Sternberger TE Texas A&M
5 5 12 150 Kingsley Keke DT Texas A&M
6 6 12 185 Ka'dar Hollman DB Toledo
7 6 21 194 Dexter Williams RB Notre Dame
8 7 12 226 Ty Summers LB Texas Christian

0 points
0
0
stockholder's picture

January 29, 2023 at 06:01 pm

2020
1 1 26 26 Jordan Love QB Utah State
2 2 30 62 AJ Dillon RB Boston College
3 3 30 94 Josiah Deguara TE Cincinnati
4 5 29 175 Kamal Martin LB Minnesota
5 6 13 192 Jon Runyan G Michigan
6 6 29 208 Jake Hanson C Oregon
7 6 30 209 Simon Stepaniak T Indiana
8 7 22 236 Vernon Scott DB Texas Christian
9 7 28 242 Jonathan Garvin DE Miami (FL)

0 points
0
0
stockholder's picture

January 29, 2023 at 06:02 pm

2021
1 1 29 29 Eric Stokes DB Georgia
2 2 30 62 Josh Myers C Ohio State
3 3 21 85 Amari Rodgers WR Clemson
4 4 37 142 Royce Newman T Mississippi
5 5 29 173 Tedarrell Slaton DT Florida
6 5 34 178 Shemar Jean-Charles DB Appalachian State
7 6 30 214 Cole Van Lanen T Wisconsin
8 6 36 220 Isaiah McDuffie LB Boston College
9 7 29 256 Kylin Hill RB Mississippi State

0 points
0
0
Leatherhead's picture

January 29, 2023 at 06:46 pm

By my count, that list contains at least 13 guys who were a regular part of the 46 man roster last year:

Newman, Myers, Stokes, Slaton, Love, Dillon, DeGuara, Runyan, Hanson, Garvin, Gary, Savage, Jenkins.

You could include MVS and Equanimeous, since we "traded" them away for a compensatory pick and they're still playing. That would bump it to 15. Several of these people are very good players for the Packers, the core of what we're putting on the field in 2023.

You said "impact". I'm not sure what that means. Does a guy who gets his man blocked have an impact? A WR who runs a clear out route? A DL who sheds his blocker and makes a stop? A Safety who prevents a long completion? I have a simpler standard: Would you be willing to put this guy on the field with the game on the line?

0 points
0
0
stockholder's picture

January 29, 2023 at 07:44 pm

It means Starter; ( they can't do without! )
Sidenote. I wanted Higgins Not Love.
Look at him eat up everyone.
He would have been so good with Rodgers.
Yet all the Guru 's on this site said BS.
Just so sad to trust a guy who wants power.

1 points
2
1