Confessions of a Polluted Mindset: A Packers Brain Drain

Random thoughts swimming around in the Packers' section of my brain.

State of the Packers: The defense and offense are headed in different directions on this team. I feel good about the improvement the defense is making under the direction of Mike Pettine. I'm supremely pissed that an offense with Aaron Rodgers looks so rudderless. While Rodgers has not been his usual excellent self, nothing is being done to make things a little easier. That falls directly on the offensive coordinator, play-caller and head coach.

Adjustments: In Rodgers' post-game comments, he mentions that the Patriots adjusted "really well". We got some things going, and then they adjusted, and ..."  He hesitated with a pensive look as if filtering through the thoughts in his head and stopped short of finishing the sentence with what he was likely thinking: "...and we didn't make any adjustments to counteract theirs."

Trick Plays: When asked about some of the creative things the Patriots did, the trick plays, fast temp stuff, Rodgers' shrugs and says, "Yeah it seemed to work pretty good for THEM," followed by a wry smile. You have to hear the tone of his voice and facial expression to get the underlying message of, "not that we would try anything like that."

Sheriff Gutekunst: Let it never be said that Sherrif Gutey is hesitant to run a varmint out of town at the drop of a dime: Not much job security working in the Packers' secondary.

Nick Perry: When it comes to disinterest in getting too involved, is Nick Perry the Ha Ha of the linebacker corps?

3rd & 4 and 4th & 4 plays: On what would end up being the Packers final possession, the Packers faced a 3rd and four from the Patriots 48 yard line. As you can see below, every wide receiver route is at least 17yards deep and there is not one potential receiver in the middle of the field.. To make matters worse, with Rodgers looking downfield, he misses Aaron Jones who breaks open in the flat for what would have been an easy first down throw.  Instead, Rodgers ends up throwing a pass of over 25 yards in the air to the sideline, which falls short of Lance Kendricks

On 4th and four, the Packers this time do send Randall Cobb (who looked like he was running in quicksand all night) on a short crossing route, it was open briefly but Rodgers holds onto the ball. His only other receiver options are running deep routes or out routes and Rodgers has to unload it as the Patriots bring six and heavy pressure from all angles. So here we had three wide receivers split left, and each ran isolation routes (beat your man or we lose). No attempt to scheme one of those guys open with a rub route or other scheme.

So we have a combination here of really bad play choices (where is the slant or a rub route or a bunch - anything designed to be able to complete a quick short pass for the first down) and Rodgers falling back into that "hold the ball looking for a big play" mode that has always been his Achilles heel. Equal blame on those two plays for McCarthy and Rodgers.

__________________________

"Jersey Al" Bracco is the Editor-In-Chief, part owner and wearer of many hats for CheeseheadTV.com and PackersTalk.com. He is also a recovering Mason Crosby truther.  Follow Al on twitter at @JerseyalGBP

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Comments (80)

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Lphill's picture

November 07, 2018 at 05:38 am

McCarthy can’t get this team ready to play or make the right adjustments during the game , the writing is on the wall for him to end his career in Green Bay it almost seems like he knows it as well . Long overdue for some fresh thinking in Green Bay.

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The TKstinator's picture

November 07, 2018 at 05:48 am

While I have asked “is it time or a defensive minded HC for GB?”, I would have no problem with an offensive minded guy coming on board and retaining Pettine as DC (who has said he really didn’t enjoy being a HC anyway).
Look at what the offense offers: Rodgers, Bakhtiari, Adams, Aaron Jones. Some pretty good pieces at the key positions of QB, LT, WR, and RB.
Would GB be a prime job for the next hotshot offensive mind? YES.

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Lare's picture

November 07, 2018 at 07:08 am

Bruce Arians

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NickPerry's picture

November 07, 2018 at 07:33 am

As much as I would love to see Arians coach the Packers didn't he get out due to health concerns?

IF he's interested in the least I'd hope the people making the decisions for the remaining years of Rodgers career make that hire.

If not Arians then I'm on the John Deflippo bandwagon. Forget he's a Viking OC at the moment. What he brings is a young MODERN mind to the offensive side of the football. He WILL be a successful HC IMO. With a QB like Rodgers and some of the skill players in place it wouldn't take long at all.

Last thing... While watching some of the early games this week I saw some great offense. One thing I saw consistently was the Jet Sweep, something I think MVS would run to perfection. This is something I'm not even sure is on McCarthy's play card.

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Pauly's picture

November 07, 2018 at 09:34 am

Pack's last 2 jet sweeps I saw were in 2016 with Jeff Janis (4.3 40) both gained 20+ yds and 1 TD
Never saw that again, must have worked too well.
Cobb has tried some and usually lost yards.

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:08 am

Isn't Arians like 66 years old?

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GBPDAN1's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:52 am

Randell and Rollins were with that secondary last year, too. BG cleaned major TT house on the back end of our D. Now he has to finish the job at other positions to finally get the TT stinking smell off this team.

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The TKstinator's picture

November 07, 2018 at 05:41 am

Some pretty damning comments and evidence. Cannot remember this much disarray since the Ray Rhodes era, and we know what happened to him.

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Bearmeat's picture

November 07, 2018 at 03:50 pm

Where's your usual punchline and/or joke?

Oh wait, I geddit!!! The TEAM is the punchline and the joke!!! GOOD ONE!! ;)

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The TKstinator's picture

November 07, 2018 at 09:38 pm

Bazinga!

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EddieLeeIvory's picture

November 07, 2018 at 06:34 am

Such bad coaching.

Cobb is the slowest slot guy in the league.
Give me Wes Welker.

I wrote Teddy 3 years ago to tell him to draft Jakeem Grant. He wrote me back actually.

Jakeem has a LOT of Tyreek Hill in him.

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Jonathan Spader's picture

November 07, 2018 at 08:47 am

I like ESB in the slot he's shown flashes of potential. I had hoped prior to the Packers trading him that we'd see TY back in the slot to try and get him back on the field.

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CJ Bauckham's picture

November 07, 2018 at 09:12 am

I would love to hear more about what Ted wrote back

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Pauly's picture

November 07, 2018 at 09:37 am

I thought Montgomery would replace Cobb as a slot receiver last off season. But instead we kept a RB committee.

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nostradanus's picture

November 07, 2018 at 06:40 am

Eight games left and McCarthy will be coaching to salvage his job.
It will be interesting to see how Rodgers and the other veteran players respond.
If the players rally around their beleaguered coach and finish with 9 wins and victories
over the Bears, Lions and Vikings then Gute will probably keep McCarthy on as coach for another year.
If this team implodes like a house of cards in the second half of the season, he's gone.
Let's see if McCarthy can get another late season run going.
It should be interesting.

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pacman's picture

November 07, 2018 at 08:19 am

If MM does change and Packers go on a winning streak, I would fire him for not doing this 3 years earlier!

This was also the danger in bringing back Philbin instead of someone with new ideas.

Let's face it. It is unlikely to happen as this has been going on for years and he hasn't changed. Or AR hasn't. Or both. But we aren't trading AR so MM goes. I really wonder what the communication is like between Murphy, Gute and MM. My guess is that there isn't much and they each stay in their own silo. So who is going to push MM out of his comfort zone other than every football writer on the planet at this point? And he has ignored them pretty well until now.

Oh how far we have strayed from the greatness of Vince Lombardi. I wonder if MM ever walks by those statues out front or just goes in the back entrance.

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the real russ letlow's picture

November 07, 2018 at 11:51 am

I'm wondering if McCarthy isn't ready for a change as well. He may ride out his last year and then evaluate any offers he might get. Cleveland has been mentioned and they could use a coach who can get a young QB up to NFL speed.

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EddieLeeIvory's picture

November 07, 2018 at 06:37 am

Kliff Kingsbury from Texas Tech might spark our offense up a bit.

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Turophile's picture

November 07, 2018 at 11:22 am

If (not a given by any means) MM is gone at season's end, my new Head Coach list has 7 names. Four are NFL OCs, three are college football HCs :

John DeFilippo (Vikings OC)
Bill Lazor (Cincinatti OC)
Todd Monken (Tampa OC)
Matt LeFleur (Titans OC)
Lincoln Riley (Oklahoma HC)
Mike Leach (Washington State HC)
David Shaw (Stanford HC)

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stockholder's picture

November 07, 2018 at 07:03 am

What a change. One CB from last year. Perry just being Ha HA. Ryan out for the season. Nelson gone. I just see the wrong type of Force to remove MM. Character assassination by displeasure. The offense puts points on the board in pre-season. But yet when A-Rod plays we question MMs play calling. The more the packers shoot them selves in the foot. We blame his discipline. Have mercy on MM. He'll restore the packers to greatness. Standing against MM is wrecking this team. The fight is obvious yet. The coaches have experience. The right way is backing the team and trust in MM and his staff. This team will discover how to win again. Look at the players being dumped. The rift is because players are not doing their job. So instead of looking at MM and his staff. Look at the changes the packers must make to this team first.

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Demon's picture

November 07, 2018 at 07:59 am

I did trust MM and his staff, right up to the 2014 nfc championship game. Thats when i think he lost it.

Give me a reason why we should? This is the man who thought Hundley was an NFL QB. This is the man that thought Capers, Slocum and others were good coaches

At the very least MM has hung on 4 years too long. If what is going on now in GB is any indication of Gutes philosophy, MM will get canned at the end of the year. Finally accountability in Green Bay!

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PeteK's picture

November 07, 2018 at 09:43 am

He didn't draft Hundley and he wasn't on the field when the players ,especially Ha Ha's( appropriately named), made terrible plays.

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 07, 2018 at 09:48 am

"This is the man who thought Hundley was an NFL QB."

OR this is the man who was given Hundley and told here, do what you can you aren't getting anything else...

"This is the man that thought Capers, Slocum and others were good coaches"

Wasn't Capers a good coach when he had good players? Is there a coincidence there?

Perhaps McCarthy will go. Perhaps he will stay. No clue.

My whole point is, Gutekunst has recognized that the talent level has not been where it needs to be over recent years. Maybe he is of the mindset that surround the team with better players will help the coaches more then anything.

Another question. If Rodgers is struggling playing in an offense that he knows more then anyone but McCarthy. How long is it going to take for him to learn a new system and play up to his level? Is it going to take 1-2 years, wasting another year or 2?

I'm not saying firing McCarthy isn't the solution they need, I'm just saying that maybe its not the answer either.

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Demon's picture

November 07, 2018 at 09:56 am

Make another excuse for McDoghnuts. He needs more of them!

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:04 am

What excuse did I make?

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stockholder's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:31 am

MM Trust=. TT screwed this team back in 2014 to 2018. That should be good enough.

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 07, 2018 at 07:03 am

"State of the Packers: The defense and offense are headed in different directions on this team. I feel good about the improvement the defense is making under the direction of Mike Pettine. I'm supremely pissed that an offense with Aaron Rodgers looks so rudderless. While Rodgers has not been his usual excellent self, nothing is being done to make things a little easier. That falls directly on the offensive coordinator, play-caller and head coach."

I do think the defense is trending in the right direction. The defense actually was playing really well until the Jones fumble and New England capitalized on momentum swing. What hurt the defense also was losing King, Whitehead getting ejected and then Brice getting hurt. The DB's got thin by the end of the game.

The offense I think is capable of doing great things, they just shoot themselves in the foot.

Rodgers has not been great. There are stretches in games that you can say "thats Aaron freaking Rodgers" and then there are points in the game you can say "what the hell is wrong with Rodgers".

For the offense to get going fully, Rodgers HAS to be better. Plain and Simple. He needs to make the right decisions on when to hand the ball off and when to throw it. He has to start taking what defenses are giving him. Two 5 yards plays equals a first down! Also when the running game is having success, don't be afraid to keep running it.

Can the coaches help him. Absolutely. But the truth is Rodgers has to help himself first. There was the 3rd down play, I believe it was 3rd and 2. Instead of handing it off to Williams he keeps it, doesn't get the first down, fumbles the ball and luckily it goes out of bounds. If I remember right that was right before half time?

There was another set of plays which started at the 1 yard line. They hand off to Jones and he gets 3 yards. 2nd and 7 he throws it to Cobb for no gain. 3rd down he throws it deep to Cobb and over throws him by 10 yards. The problem on that play is underneath of Cobb he has MVS running right at the first down line and if he hits him probably has the first down. Even if it doesn't, they give the punter more yards to work with.
That has been a problem with Rodgers a lot this year. He is not hitting the underneath stuff which would result in first downs.

On the opening drive that resulted in a FG, they had chances for getting a TD. They got to the 9 yard line. First down they have an incomplete pass.
Second down they have a delay of game which should not happen.
Second down Rodgers threw incomplete again.
Third down and goal from the 14, we thought was a give up play call when it happened. But looking back at it, Rodgers made another bad throw. If he hits Cobb where he is supposed to, Cobb may actually infact score.

https://twitter.com/zachkruse2/status/1059483668849266688

Play calling can help. Coaches can help.
But until Rodgers plays better, (not perfect just better), our offense will still struggle.

This all being said, I truly believe this will be the week it comes together. Lets not lose sight that they were leading against the only unbeaten team left in the league, and in a game in which they were 9 point underdogs. Who knows what happens if Montgomery doesn't pull his crap. And going into the 4th Quarter this week, Packers were driving until Jones fumbles at the 26. If Jones doesn't fumble who knows what happens. Essentially they are 2 fumbles away from possibly winning both games.

The night is darkest just before dawn...

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stockholder's picture

November 07, 2018 at 07:32 am

When Cobb was out. Adams was in his position. (Rams) Cobb comes back and this offense has trouble. This team is to loyal to A-Rods opinion. We saw Nelson slow down. We saw what happened when Nelson was out. They had to bring back James Jones and refused to sign him. Because of separation. This has nothing to do with play calling. I'm calling out Cobb and Allison for being to slow. We Need to change the slow to go. Then change the OL.

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 07, 2018 at 08:47 am

While Allison was timed slow, he was 18th in the league for yards per catch at 15.2. This is 18th with all receivers who had 20 or more receptions.

Sidenote- MVS is 2nd in the league with anyone that has more then 3 receptions, at 21.1 ypc .

Cobb definitely doesn't look like he is running up to speed yet. I'm assuming he is not pushing it yet.

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flackcatcher's picture

November 07, 2018 at 09:35 am

Cobb should not have been on the field against New England last week. He could not plant and cut. Sometimes, safety blankets need to be left at home.

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Pauly's picture

November 07, 2018 at 09:50 am

Adrenalin junky. Time to face the facts in your face. Rodgers is a Adrenalin Junky.
Facts, holds ball, ignores short and midrange open receivers, always looking for the long, thrilling, highlight pass play.
What did he say after Patriots game? He needs to force ball to Devante more even though Devante is tightly covered.
4 yrs ago against Patriots AR went to 3rd receiver (Adams) to win the game when first 2 receivers were heavily covered. Not this time!!!!

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stockholder's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:25 am

You guys - all good points. Adams needs to be in the slot more. He's the fastest WR off the line now. Putting him on the sideline won't give him Room to cut. The Pats used the sidelines against him. Allison didn't do squat in the game he came back. The Wrs have been A problem. Cobb lost his speed. Yes, it may be because he's not back. But they had him covered Sunday. I loved Cobb but he's got to give way to the better alignment. The Rookies must go outside. Go for the speed. I want Moore on the field. A-Rod should see the speed faster! MM doesn't have time to wait. This team needs a remarkable outlook now. Strike Fast , Fear me, kick butt. The Rookies can bring It.

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 07, 2018 at 07:17 am

"Sheriff Gutekunst: Let it never be said that Sherrif Gutey is hesitant to run a varmint out of town at the drop of a dime: Not much job security working in the Packers' secondary."

Gutekunst is changing the culture in GB.

It started when he went out and signed Free Agents in the offseason. He made the bold draft day trades that ended up netting them Jaire and a 1st round pick next year. He traded away 1 outspoken player, who really had his mind on playing elsewhere next year. He traded a player that cost us a chance at winning a game, and he now cut a player who had a dumb penalty in a game. (I haven't heard if that is why he cut them, but it seems like its why.)

I'm not saying McCarthy is going to be fired at the end of the year, but he has to be feeling the pressure.

If you're McCarthy, what do you do right now to turn it around?

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carusotrap's picture

November 07, 2018 at 08:16 am

The problem is that he IS McCarthy and doesn't have the humility to realize what he is doing isn't working. He believes he's always right in spite of evidence (film) to the contrary. Exhibit 1 was the handoff to Jones from the 1 this week after the same call resulted in a safety last week. If MM was trolling Packer nation, then he doesn't deserve to be a HC...his priorities are simply wrong if his first thought is to prove he's a Highly Successful Football Coach™. If it was a genuine play call - which I think it probably was - then, as usual, he's being too clever by half. I truly think that Rodgers is looking for the home run on every play because he simply doesn't believe that McCarthy has the first notion of what play will work, and he just goes to his hard-wired default which is the 40 yard back shoulder off-balance pass to the sideline.

Bottom line is that McCarthy has always called his plays in a vacuum. He's never been good at countering the other team's play. The difference is that Rodgers isn't playing well enough to bail him out.

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 07, 2018 at 09:21 am

The problem with last weeks safety, play was Rodgers had the option to throw it to MVS. He had him wide open and elected to hand it off. That was a poor decision by Rodgers.
The biggest thing I didn't like about that play was that they brought everyone in tight on that formation against one of the toughest interiors in the league. I believe this week they had a few WR's outside.

" I truly think that Rodgers is looking for the home run on every play"

That part I agree with. He wants to hit the home runs. He continuously holds the ball when he has a timing option available underneath waiting for a big play.

The part that honestly is annoying though. When a play works out its all Rodgers.
When a play doesn't work its McCarthy's fault.

Both deserve equally the same amount of blame IMO.

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flackcatcher's picture

November 07, 2018 at 09:29 am

It not the offense scheme RC. If it were, this team would be getting their behinds kicked week after week. At this level there are no secrets among what systems each club runs. It is that Aaron Rodgers can not, or will not execute the called plays in that system. Why? like most here on CHTV I believe rust, injuries and a ego has merged into a toxic blend that is crippling this offense. More than anyone else, Aaron Rodgers need a win. Mostly to chase away the demons that have gather around him this season. McCarthy, short of of getting a faith healer, or soul transplant for Rodgers, can not do much for his starting QB at this point. Frankly, McCarthy has shown that he can coach at a high level with a rebuilding football team. There is not much more you can ask from him.

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:22 am

I agree its not the scheme. There are play calls that aren't good, but that is with every team.

"More than anyone else, Aaron Rodgers need a win."

COMPLETELY agree!!! I think he just needs to slow himself down. Take what the defense is giving him. Play smart. Make the throws that are there and trust the guys to make a play. MVS especially. Look at the plays he is making. Give him the ball 3-4 more times a game.

Rodgers needs to get some confidence and swagger back, and just keep it going. We have seen glimpses of it, but not for a full 4 quarters.

Its kind of like a 3 point shooter. Sometimes they just need that first one to go down to get back in the zone.

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Pauly's picture

November 07, 2018 at 09:54 am

What can MM do??? Apply to Browns for HC job!!

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packerbackerjim's picture

November 07, 2018 at 07:36 am

Here’s my take on what is happening: I will put responsibility for the dysfunction of the offense on Murphy. MM pointed fingers at TT for not getting him players and Murphy granted him one “prove it” Year. AR could have more forcefully thrown MM under the bus but didn’t. Now he regrets his timidity and has to put up with MM’s nonsense till the end of the year. His feelings are being worn on his jersey sleeve. This is a case of half-measures resulting in failure.

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Demon's picture

November 07, 2018 at 08:06 am

You may be right.

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NickPerry's picture

November 07, 2018 at 07:45 am

"Trick Plays: When asked about some of the creative things the Patriots did, the trick plays, fast temp stuff, Rodgers' shrugs and says, "Yeah it seemed to for pretty good for THEM," followed by a wry smile. You have to hear the tone of his voice and facial expression to get the underlying message of, "not that we would try anything like that."

Trick plays????

Not even in McCarthy's vocabulary. Mike continues to trot out 11 personnel about 85 to 90% of the time. I'm GRATEFUL of the job McCarthy did in GB. BUT his time is DONE here.

IF the Packers were to turn it around this year it would be because of Rodgers and NOT Mike McCarthy.

My God how much more of Aaron Rodgers saving the likes of McCarthy and Thompson do people need to see. Just look at what happened to this team last season without Rodgers. Just look what happen in 2013. Hell had Thompson not finally brought back Flynn the Packers wouldn't have even needed Rodgers heroics in week 17 in Chicago that season because they'd have been cooked.

The same people who defended Thompson the last several years of his career are the SAME people defending McCarthy now....Question..Are the Packers a better team NOW after keeping Thompson a few years to long? Ummm, NO!

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Demon's picture

November 07, 2018 at 08:29 am

You did a better job of saying the same thing i have been saying all along.

The same people defending TT are the same ones defending MM. Fans on here are afraid of change. Its been beat to death here the last few weeks.

Funny thing is no one can give a good reason why MM should be retained other than whomever takes his place could be worse.

Gute replaced TT just fine so far. Does anyone here want terrible Ted back? I only wished it would have happened 5 years earlier, before the sizzler became the fizzler.

Truth is TT and MM got too comfortable fat and lazy at their jobs. Good riddance to all of them!

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 07, 2018 at 09:37 am

"IF the Packers were to turn it around this year it would be because of Rodgers and NOT Mike McCarthy."

This is absolutely true. Because the truth is Rodgers has not been at his normal level. Due to injury, due to lack of practice time, due to new players around him. Regardless the reason he has not been up to his standards. He has missed a number of throws, didn't throw to open WR's, has fumbled a lot, and simply made bad decisions.

IF Rodgers plays to his standard I have 0 doubt we win against the Lions, Patriots and Rams, and our season looks completely different right now.

"My God how much more of Aaron Rodgers saving the likes of McCarthy and Thompson do people need to see. Just look at what happened to this team last season without Rodgers. Just look what happen in 2013."

The problem with this argument is that the entire team is built around Rodgers. Once Rodgers goes out the team is not going to look as good. The entire offense is built around Rodgers and his abilities. He is the best in the league.

The talent level has dropped in recent years. That was obvious after last year. That is getting fixed now.
Let me ask though. Is it McCarthy's fault there was a lack of talent? Now that we have a GM that is willing to add talent, won't McCarthy be better too? He showed what he can do with better talent. Having a GM willing to get him talent, should help right?

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Pauly's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:00 am

I still hold MM responsible for Rodger's Bears injury. Bulaga is just back and rusty, Mack's first game and rearing to go.
Any prudent coach would have Lewis on right side helping Bulaga until situation is figured out.
NO, not MM. Result, Rodgers gets hurt!!!

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stockholder's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:40 am

Bulaga is done! The speed rushers eat him up. Need a new RT and better back-ups.

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JDK52's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:43 am

Except the hit that hurt Rodgers' knee came from the DE falling on him. Nothing to do with Bulaga/Mack. Rodgers could have gotten the ball out of his hand faster on that play and negated the rush up the middle. He held the ball, got hit, hurt knee. In fact, Bulaga kept Mack just far enough from Rodgers that he could have stepped out of it if not for the DE crashing down after blowing up the TWO guys assigned to block him. So yeah, MM did scheme to protect Rodgers and the guys responsible failed at their jobs.

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PeteK's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:03 am

Flynn was great when he left here and what team can survive a star QB's injury( Niners) ?

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Community Guy's picture

November 07, 2018 at 07:49 am

Kings of the North? it can still happen; however, now injuries (and cuts?) are beginning to eat at the depth of this team. how is this team going to gel?

i am surprised at how little play-making has happened from the OLB position in first 8 games.. injury, inexperience and cuts not to blame. Reggie Gilbert and Nick Perry have been invisible in Pettine's D so far.. Fackrell not much either.. Matthews first neutralized by officiating, then by ?? all i can think about is a lot of guys getting overpaid.

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Lare's picture

November 07, 2018 at 08:17 am

Frankly, I think a lot of people are clutching at straws in order to find a way to fix a team that is unfixable this season. Especially with an injured QB.

This team never had the talent this year to be truly competitive, they need upgrades at several starting positions right now. They're also getting used to new coaches & schemes. They're doing the best they can with what they have but they didn't have the means available to fill all the holes TT left on this team.

As I've said before, this is a rebuild year for this team. Other than some stopgap measures Gutekunst is making decisions for the future, not for the present. Next year he'll have decent draft position and a lot of salary cap money to work with, similar to what the Bears and the Saints had in previous years.

I think the best thing fans can do is have realistic hopes for this season and realize that the future is going to be a lot better than the present.

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Razer's picture

November 07, 2018 at 08:24 am

Lare - are you a Russian hacker? Was basically writing the same stuff and posting as you posted. Uncanny.

Totally agree.

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Razer's picture

November 07, 2018 at 08:22 am

Packer fans need to toughen up for the next couple of years. As much as people are slapping Gutekunst on the back for his decisive action, we need to accept that this team has some significant holes. On defense alone we need pass rush (cause we don't have any), safeties (cause we don't have any), Dline depth (cause we don't have any) and CB's (cause King is made of glass and the rest are rookies). Bottomline its rebuild time.

On defense we are two years until enough talent is accumulated. Thankfully, we changed the scheme and some of the coaching this year.

On offense we need to change the schemes and coaching to come into this decade. This will take at least a year if our old dog will learn new tricks. Sprinkle in a couple of Olinemen and voila it is 2020.

Buckle up and keep your heads up.

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

November 07, 2018 at 05:49 pm

Agreed. Seems like Gute had an eye on the future but also thought the Packers had enough to be good this year. I had visions of Wilkerson looking like Calais Campbell, and having a cascade effect on Daniels and Clark, making them more productive. In turn, a fine DL would make CM3 more productive since he'd get sacks due to chasing (which he can still do) rather than by having to beat OTs. I thought Perry would get 8 sacks by beating OTs, maybe more. On March 14, I wrote on APC that GB should rescind HHCD's 5th year option and sign FS Tre Boston and a SS, either Reid or Vacarro. They would cost less than HHCD and given roughly similar production to HHCD and better than Brice. I worried about the CBs, but Alexander has been a bright spot and Tramon has been okay. We got enough out of King and Jackson to allay my worst fears. I worried about the OL, didn't think Graham was what we needed, but I figured an AR-led Offense would be top 10. When Bulaga didn't have to start the season on PUP I was happy.

Well, the lynchpins on defense didn't work. Wilkerson never looked like Campbell and then got hurt, and Perry did nothing. McCray was less than okay, Bulaga was in and out and Bell was awful at OT. Spriggs was initially bad but seems to have improved, though it might be too late. And AR himself has been an average QB.

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Chris Vachio's picture

November 07, 2018 at 08:25 am

I don't have any issues with using the same formation repeatedly. News flash, you can run multiple plays from the same formation. And doing so makes it harder for defenses to know what you're doing. The problem is, you actually need to do things differently out of that formation.

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Pauly's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:06 am

Problem is that most of those plays are based on isolation and beating your man. Packers have one of slowest WR group playing.
TT had no respect for speed, Fortunately Gute definitely loves speed.
Next yr should be a far stronger team, question is,,, will AR be able to perform like normal?

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Since'61's picture

November 07, 2018 at 09:08 am

Al the 2 examples that you posted here are excellent samples of what has been wrong with the Packers offense so far this season. Whatever happened to running to the sticks and turning in. Why are our WRS 15+ yards down the field.

Also, the Packers had obviously decided to go on 4th down why not run the draw play that worked against the Rams for a TD. Even if Jones only picks up a yard or two you now have a 4th and 2 or 3 which means the Pats need to respect the possibility of another run play on 4th down.

Why are we not using Graham in these situations? Go down the middle 5 or 6 yards and throw it high and let him use his height to make the play or throw a quick slant to Adams or MVS. We should be able to execute those types of plays if we actually call them.

MM allegedly likes TEs but he rarely uses them. This offense is too dependent on Rodgers making plays and he is just not healthy enough to carry this team by himself.

Many here remember the 1967 season for the famous Ice Bowl and the Packers 3rd straight NFL championship. But how many remember that Bart Starr threw 9 TDs and 17 interceptions during the regular season? Imagine if that was the case with Aaron Rodgers.

In the previous 3 seasons Starr threw 16 interceptions combined. What happened in 1967? Starr played hurt for most of the season, even missed the last game of the season which was a Packers loss. Yet the team won their division and the NFL championship and the second SB. How? Starr was still playing with 8 other future HOFers, 6 of them on the defense.

Bottom line, football is still a team game and even in this era when the QB is king one player cannot do it all. We need better players at many positions and we just don't have them yet. It's going to take patience and perspective for the rest of this season at least. Thanks, Since '61

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Tarynfor12's picture

November 07, 2018 at 09:10 am

Reading the comments, it's hard not to laugh at the crying over what is now is what 's been seen for a few seasons and all the ' blind optimist ' denied all.

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packerbackerjim's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:19 am

Taryn, let it never be said you were anything less than gracious.

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stockholder's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:59 am

:)

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Johnblood27's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:48 am

Thanks for that piling on "I told you so" comment.

BTW, you were and are wrong. This team is not bereft of talent, it just has a couple holes and some declining veterans and a stale coaching staff.

Absolutely nothing else that every other team in the league has to deal with.

You are not a prognosticator, its just cyclic patterns in a copy cat unionized CBA delimited league.. Go place a bet or have a date with Vegas Tom.

Troll be gone...

once again...

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PeteK's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:09 am

I think all winning teams that don't go to the SB have fans that lament and play Monday morning QB's.

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Tarynfor12's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:34 am

Other fans lament is more justified than the Packers fans lament.

Not all winning teams have Rodgers and relied on him to do it all while ignoring what was actually happening to other positions.

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RCPackerFan's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:38 am

And who's fault is that?

One person to blame, who is at blame?

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PeteK's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:52 am

How frustrating do you think it must be to be a Vikings, Steelers , or Aints fan ?

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PeteK's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:09 am

I think all winning teams that don't go to the SB have fans that lament and play Monday morning QB's.

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PeteK's picture

November 07, 2018 at 10:42 am

The Pack was very close to beating two of the best teams in football on their own turf. Two players made crucial mistakes that have nothing to do with coaching. When you have a great QB he is part of the game plan and adjustments made during and prior to game time ,so they're all to blame . In my view the offense is hampered this season by the following circumstances : new receivers and injuries on the line especially Bulaga . When we have to keep a TE in to help the right tackle, it hampers diversity in play calling, especially when Graham is a mediocre blocker. We run a very complicated offense that new receivers need time to adjust to which might explain why it's taking so long to snap the ball and the simplified play calling when compared to last year. We still have a solid chance for ten wins and the playoffs, it will start with a pesky Miami team.

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Tarynfor12's picture

November 07, 2018 at 11:15 am

Everyone here agrees that having Rodgers makes the Packers an automatic SB contender and the odds from Vegas each year condone such belief.
Every season most here begin their endless over rating process of every player drafted, retained and Fa signing. The weekly excuses to stand by ___(fill in name) begin and are repeated weekly,bi-weekly.
If the other players are what many believed they are,regardless of rookie/veteran, this team shouldn't be so dysfunctional simply because of the assumed talent and the QB named Rodgers.
Yes, coaching has a hand in it but players that are truly good are rarely made to look this bad so often as in GB.
This team should not be back door entrants into the playoffs as has been mostly, if they are what so many here believe them to be.

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Since'61's picture

November 07, 2018 at 12:03 pm

Without Aaron Rodgers this team would have been a 4-12 team at least since 2014 and maybe even before that. He is that good when he is healthy regardless of the play calling. Since 2008, Rodgers first season as the starting QB this team is 5-14-1 when Rodgers does not play.

That record includes 0-2 in 2010 with a roster that won the SB,
2-5-1 in 2013 with a mostly different roster from 2010,
3-7 with yet a third roster.

To me this makes the case that Rodgers has carried this team for far too long and it's not MM or play calling it's just one player making a huge difference on a team with mediocre to average players except for the 2010 SB team. Now he is playing hurt and the league knows it and they know he doesn't have any serious game breaking weapons that the DC needs to plan for. With Rodgers hurt this team is not even one dimensional they are about 1/3 to 1/2 dimensional.
Thanks, Since '61

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Oppy's picture

November 07, 2018 at 01:28 pm

Respectfully disagree on this in 2018, Since’61.
Players as individuals whose play demands accounting for:

Davante Adams forced teams to account for him. Graham, while not great, still needs accounting for.
MVS needs to be accounted for.
I believe teams are aware of EQ, simply because of his height/speed combo- not gameplanned for, but I’m guessing they take note when he’s on the field.

Aaron Jones and to a lesser extent jamaal Williams need accounting for.

Rodgers decision making , being “off”, and the lack of feeding RBs the ball (whoever you want to pin that on) is hurting this team more than a lack of supporting cast around #12 in 2018.

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Since'61's picture

November 07, 2018 at 06:02 pm

Oppy - I'm talking about players like James Lofton, Sterling Sharpe and even Greg Jennings or Jordy Nelson. MVS may evolve into a game breaker but right now we have no one who can change a game like a Sharpe or a Lofton. Thanks, Since '61

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Oppy's picture

November 08, 2018 at 11:26 am

We definitely have Greg Jennings /Jordy Nelson-level talent on this roster. (We do not have Sharpe or Lofton level receivers, at least, not at the present.)

What we don't have, however, is the same aggressive, confident, and decisive QB at the helm delivering pin-point accurate passes to the receivers.

As I commented elsewhere recently- go back and watch some condensed games from 2010-2014, focus on the play of Aaron Rodgers. How low he holds the ball, how he works the pocket, footwork/mechanics, and how "open" or "covered" his intended targets are when he releases the ball.. Then watch 2018 games and run the same observation.

I have done this, and I think the difference is startling. Do it for yourself if you can find time.

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Pack204's picture

November 07, 2018 at 12:52 pm

The offense specifically looks like its just going through motions out there a lot of the time. In the press conferences the responses illicit a team that has almost checked out on the coaches messages. Will be interesting to see the team plays here as we move along. Speaking of Nick Perry, you would never even know hes on the field!

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PatrickGB's picture

November 07, 2018 at 01:02 pm

But, but but ...Aaron doesn’t throw interceptions!
Of course, he doesn’t throw the ball on time to open receivers either.

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croatpackfan's picture

November 08, 2018 at 08:30 am

Well, Al, my opinion is that - you have players you have and you are making your playbook adjusted to the players you have plus some more plays for possible improvement of young player during the season. So when you main player are not in his best, you can throw away your playbook and all those work you had in OTAs and TC in installing the playbook. Your main player are doing so many mistakes that when you call play which should work main player do not execute it.
Is that guilt of execution or it is guilt of playcall?
I would like to know that answer!
You can not copy Patriots, Rams, Saints or whatever team you may pick, playbook, because you do not have players they have. You are making your playbook according your players.
I believe Packers would adjust to some decline of the main player, but he, still, from time to time make that plays Packers installed. Other time he just do not make that plays. What to do?

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JerseyAl's picture

November 08, 2018 at 08:38 am

A reasoned thought, but there is one problem with your theory. McCarthy's playbook has NEVER changed. Players have come and gone and the same plays are being run. This is a big part of my complaint about him - he doesn't adapt to the skills of his player. He has his offense and whoever is in the team is expected to run it.

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stockholder's picture

November 08, 2018 at 08:44 am

But why does he have to adapt to the skills of the players? When you draft players aren't they suppose to fit your scheme? When you have a game changer you put the ball in his hands. ( It's a Mis Match)

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JerseyAl's picture

November 08, 2018 at 08:49 am

putting the ball in your playmakers' hands IS adapting to your players. Has he put the ball in Jones hands enough this season in your opinion?

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stockholder's picture

November 08, 2018 at 09:00 am

No, He believed in Williams first. I'm sure it was because of the ball handling. Jones almost had two fumbles Sunday. If you remember the Miami Dolphins backfield of Csonka, Kick, and Mercury Morris. It took sometime before Morris was used.

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croatpackfan's picture

November 09, 2018 at 05:19 am

Well, sorry for late response from me.

I believe Joe Philbin clearly said that he was involved in rewriting offensive playbook. So, it is not all on Mike McCarthy. We only do not know how much of influence on the playbook had Joe Philbin and how much had Mike McCarthy. Also, from several different sources came information that Joe Philbin is not the guy who will accept everything what HC say or prepare. And still when you listening Joe Philbin, it looks like he thinks playbook is at least OK, if not very good. Furthermore, Aaron may say whatever he wants, but there is evidence on tape that he did not see available (free) player to throw him on more than few occasion per game. Which may indicate that playbook is not that bad or same as past years, just Aaron is not speedy as he was when he is reading the field in front of him...

Sorry, but I believe that we saw this season a lot of different looks on both sides of the ball, just execution was not on high level.

I accept that my view of football game is much less detailed as yours are, but still, if I can see some new things, how many do not? That is mystery for me...

Thanks

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Doug Niemczynski's picture

November 08, 2018 at 09:18 am

And Josh Jones is now on the chop block.
Will he survive or be cut like the rest? Stay tuned ...

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ILPackerBacker's picture

November 08, 2018 at 11:19 am

some difficult issue

is there a lack of talent at WR?
why did it take TWO not one but TWO injuries to get MVS on the field? that is not a lack of talent

Why has Jones STILL not gotten ball enough or in the correct situation? There is no rule requiring a 3/4 down call to be everyone run deep and look. Just Jones on the field changes the defense....that is not a lack of talent

why is cobb still being forced the ball? that is lack of talent

why is Tramon returning punts? lack of talent

why is the center unable to assist either guard? over rated talent

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