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Packers Daily Links: Digging into the Hamstring Issue

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Packers Daily Links: Digging into the Hamstring Issue

An article at the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel by reporter Lori Nickel attempts to take a look at the hamstring injuries that have impacted the Green Bay Packers early this season. "One could argue that the Packers' most formidable foe this year has not been the 49ers, the Redskins or the Bengals," writes Nickel. "It's been injuries, specifically nagging hamstring pulls. Eight Packers have been sidelined already this year, costing them collectively 41 practices (or preseason games) and seven regular-season games." Trainer Bradley Arnett, who works with NFL athletes, gives his understanding of the hamstring muscle in a general sense, but as expected, the article isn't able to pinpoint any one particular reason or issue hamstring injuries have seemingly become an epidemic in Green Bay.

More on the hamstring injuries comes from JSOnline.

Running back Eddie Lacy answered in the affirmative when asked if he'd be back after the bye. "Yeah,” Lacy is quoted is saying by Wes Hodkiewicz of the Green Bay Press-Gazette. “Since I wasn’t cleared, I had no intention of playing, but I have a bye week to still get right. When I get back, we’ll see where I go from there.” Lacy missed this past Sunday's Week 3 game at Cincinnati with a concussion.

More on the running back health situation in Green Bay comes from JSOnline, ESPNMilwaukee.com and ESPN.com.

Tight end Ryan Taylor reacted to a shot to the groin he took from Bengals linebacker Vontaze Burfict this past Sunday. "Obviously I think what happened has no place in football, but it happened," Taylor is quoted as saying by Paul Imig of FoxSportsWisconsin.com. "I don't blame the ref at all for throwing the flag. I think what was done to me was a little bit harder to see and the retaliation was obviously something that can't happen. Taylor was flagged for a 15-yard penalty when he retaliated, but referees did not see the original low blow from Burfict.

More from Ryan Taylor comes from PackersNews.com.

The day after the game, head coach Mike McCarthy stuck to his guns and defended his failed fourth-and-1 call from the Bengals game. "It was a solid call,” McCarthy is quoted as saying by Jason Wilde of ESPNWisconsin.com. “There’s a number of things that went into that decision based on the mark. In pregame for the field goal, and the wind, and so forth. I had plenty of time to think about it.” The outcome of the play in question saw rookie running back Johnathan Franklin fumble, and the Bengals return the football for the go-ahead touchdown.

More on Mike McCarthy's call comes from JSOnline.

The plans for replacing Jeremy Ross on returns are unclear, as pointed out by ESPNMilwaukee.com, the Green Bay Press-Gazette, Journal Sentinel, FoxSportsWisconsin.com, Packer Report and ESPN.com.

Post-game analysis comes from Bob McGinn at the Journal Sentinel, Cliff Christl and Eric Baranczyk at the Press-Gazette, Rob Demovsky at ESPN.com, Bill Huber at Packer Report and Joe Kay of the Associated Press.

Make sure to get your Green Bay Packers tickets when the Packers return from the bye with a home game against the Lions.

Comments from the Packers coordinators are passed on at FoxSportsWisconsin.com.

A round-up of the Packers injuries appears at Packer Report.

A macro look at the team heading into the bye appears at both ESPNWisconsin.com and Packer Report.

Aaron Rodgers' troubles with fourth-quarter comebacks are detailed at ESPN.com.

Former Packer Donald Driver made a public appearance at a children's literacy event Monday in Milwaukee.

Video: The one-year anniversary of the "Fail Mary" took place on Monday. ESPN takes a look back...

Brian Carriveau is the author of the book "It's Just a Game: Big League Drama in Small Town America," and editor of Cheesehead TV's "Pro Football Draft Preview." To contact Brian, email carriveau@uwalumni.com.

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Fan friendly comments only: off Comments (32) This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.

Derek in CO's picture

The team really needs to go outside the organization on the hamstring issue, because it is real. they are doing something wrong. Something should have been done a few years ago.

Oh, and Burfict is a punk who deserves an unpaid game off for that low blow.

some guy's picture

yes they are doing something wrong. I suspect the problem has 3 root causes based on all of my vast knowledge of the subject and my recent stays at the holiday Inn:

1) bad luck of course
2) the game of football lends itself to more hamstring injuries in general than other sports
3) the team doesn't do a very good job in warmup drills and stretching. It doesn't sound like they are being treated very well post injury.

go look at soccer, basketball and hockey players. They don't suffer hamstring injuries nearly as much as football players despite using them so much more frequently over the course of an average game or practice. Why? because players in those sports are moving much more frequently than football players and don't spend nearly as much time standing around.

I'd love to see how this team warms up every day and how they stay warm on the sidelines. and then i'd love to see how they are rehabbed. the answers are there

Cold muscles pull or tear, warm muscles stretch. Keep them more active at all times. Even basic jogging or jumping jacks. it will help.

In all seriousness, they should have a professional soccer trainer from Europe come check out what they are doing. how could it hurt? at least take a look at it from a different angle.

Stroh's picture

Says "some guy" who knows dick about training and conditioning. Which basically render your entire comment moot!

Derek in CO's picture

and about ARod's 4th quarter crap. We were up 30-21 at end of the 3rd vs Cinci. Our turnovers and defense gave up the final 13 pts to Cinci. Sure, he threw an INT, but it was near thier goal line. Then Franklin fumbled. ARod's 4th quarter win/loss stats are skewed, IMO. Most losses had nothing to do with him.

some guy's picture

Kacsmar's work, which is what Demovsky is pulling the ESPN article from, is garbage. His story is "Rodgers is 5-24 in games in which the Packers trailed in the fourth quarter by 1-8 points." A few of the games that fit that description:

-Steelers '09 - Packers score TD and 2 point conversion on final offensive possession, PIT marches down the field and scores winning TD with a couple seconds on the clock.

-Falcons '10 (regular season) - Packers go on a 16-play drive to tie the game with 50 seconds left in the fourth quarter. Special teams give up a 40-yard kick return. Ryan passes for 20 yards, Falcons kick winning FG. Kacsmar assigns the loss to Rodgers.

-Fail Mary: Enough said. Kacsmar assigns the loss to Rodgers.

He does some interesting stuff as far as digging into historical data that other people haven't mined yet, but his definitions of what constitutes a successful tying/winning drive are so screwed up that, going by his method, a drive in which you take the lead on your final offensive possession is a failure if your defense then goes on to give up the lead.

some guy's picture

C says everything is normal. move along

C's picture

I read Nickel's article in full this morning, did you? Because at no point does the training staff, medical staff or approach to treatment or prevention come into question. Players interviewed never implied or stated anything was amiss. As far as the time missed from injury, that's the sign of an extremely conservative medical/training staff, not a reckless one. And in that article, and all your ill-informed comments I've asked a simple question that Nickle doesn't address and you can't seem to grasp: how does this compare to the rest of the league during the same time periods? Look at the weekly reports, it's not that far out of the norm. Look at the other injuries across the league, especially knees, shoulders, necks and ankles. The Packers have FEWER of those injuries than what the other 31 teams are reporting on average. By your logic, are the Packers Medical staff/Training team highly functional at prevention and treatment everywhere else and only incompetent with hamstrings? That's highly suspect.

Look, there's nothing wrong with asking 'why'. Right with you. But when you and others leap straight to, 'everybody dealing with hamsting injuries is incompetent' you're completely jumping the shark.

I get it, you're angry that a talented team is 1-2. There's need for a scapegoat and you've found a convenient one you can rationalize from the outside looking in. They're 1-2 for all manner of reason, and I highly doubt it's attributable to the medical staff. You and others espousing the theory come off like petulant children.

denniseckersly's picture

You might want to read-up on the meaning of "jumping the shark".

C's picture

Jumping the shark: "the moment you realize decay has set in." When it comes to this topic and commentors like 'some guy' their collective intellectual curiosity shows plenty of decay and the logic is 'irreversably bad.'

I would say it applies just fine.

some guy's picture

Interestingly enough, there are two of us using that name in this thread. Weird. Only other comment from me in this thread is the one saying Scott Kacsmar's work is crap. We have an imposter.

some guy's picture

get it through your head. The hamstring injuries are ridiculously high on this team. i have seen the injury reports, they run the gamut but there is NOTHING in the league like the hamstring injuries (read it again with me) on this team. so much so that an article was written about it because so many people are asking and because a hall of fame quarterback made mention that he'd never seen anything like it. what about that don't you understand?

Stop conflating the issue with other normal injuries that happen that can't be prevented (concussions, broken bones, torn ligaments). the prevalence of hamstring injuries on this team is staggering and they are the type of injury that can be prevented with proper stretching and preparation. Sorry that you don't think so, but its true.

And just stop with the conservative staff and that's why it takes forever to get them on the field. Jennings and Nelson dealt with issues all of last year, as has Matthews every year. Burnett and Hayward were re-injured just a month ago because they either came back to quickly or because the staff botched their rehab. who knows what happened with Harris but wasn't it the same knee?

And of course players don't blame the staff. of course they say they do everything they can to stay healthy and that staff does a good job. what asshole player says otherwise? But i ask again - why are so many packers players seeking second opinions now when they get hurt? Jennings, Tramon, Bulaga, Perry, Harris all in the last calendar year. Perhaps its because they don't completely trust the diagnoses of the staff maybe? or is that just normal these days too?

who said anything about being angry that they are 1-2 and i need to blame something/someone? not me. nice strawman. And at no point did i say the staff was incompetent - just that something is amiss in how they treat or try to prevent these types of injuries. you're starting to become hyperbolic. its telling.

C's picture

Read everything you wrote slowly, do it several times if you have to. It's painfully dense, often dishonest.

WKUPackFan's picture

C, thanks for the link below! I counted 24 total hamstrings on the week 3 injury report, including the Bengals 3 and excluding the Packers 4. There were a couple of other teams with 3. A little background in statistics tells me it's not a large enough sample size to draw meaningful conclusions from. I think both of you guys may be right to an extent.

C's picture

To be clear, I'm also wondering why. But its asinine to call the professional staff incompetent or pretend you have a better solution from the internet.

some guy's picture

Nice. Laydown

good boy

WKUPackFan's picture

One of you says that the Pack's hamstring issues are not that much outside the norm compared to league wide hamstring injury reports. The other says there's nothing like the number of Pack hamstring issues using the same reports. That's a contradiction. How about posting the numbers (yes, I don't want to count them myself) so we can all decide for ourselves?

C's picture

Here you go:

http://www.nfl.com/injuries

Week 3 pre-game listing of all 32 teams. Packers list 4 hamstring injuries. Their opponent lists 3. Feel free to read through all 32 teams.

Derek in CO's picture

You can't just look at week 3 injury report. go back to weeks 1 and 2, the preseason, last season, etc. It is a fact that this team has had a ton of hamstring injuries over the last few years. I don't have a solution but certainly a team with GB's pockets can find something.

Doug In Sandpoint's picture

I would like to suggest that no matter what, you never put another mention of the "Fail Mary" on this website. Of course I wasn't forced to watch it but I did. Need to go brush my teeth because I threw up a little in my mouth again.

Barry's picture

Foods and supplements that encourage collagen production in the human body will make muscles and tendons more elastic. I can not believe that we hear nothing about nutritonal considerations.

Jamie's picture

From the peanut gallery? You're right, they're slacking.

Oh wait, did you mean from the Packers...to which I scoff at the notion you would expect to hear their 'nutritional considerations'.

WKUPackFan's picture

Lori is an excellent writer, but unfortunately her article comes to no conclusions. That may be because this is simply one of those problems there is no answer to. Everyone seemingly has a theory; suspect doctors, bad trainers, incorrect stretching, poor nutrition, soft, not enough hitting, yoga, etc., etc. All areas should explored and it's a good bet the Packers have done so (the view that GB is too cheap to do so is ridiculous). Right now the situation has the feel of a statistical anomaly, something that defies explanation.

Chad Toporski's picture

Best comment on this issue ever.

Unless we know specifically what the Packers are doing and not doing, then how are we to judge where the deficiencies lie? And who are we to assume that we know more than professionals?

Jamie's picture

Agree and agree.

Evan's picture

They should probably stretch though.

gslumbers's picture

At what point is it OK to begin some healthy conversation regarding hamstring injuries, and the prevention of them on this team? Doing so is not "calling out" the training staff, it's what a normal coaching staff would do---address problems that are becoming a pattern. Another pattern worth addressing- ARod sacked, knocked down, and hurried more than 31 other qb's. While TT tells everyone to "get on w/ their lives" when asked if he is comfortable w/ his O line. I'm not doomsdaying- I'm observing conditions repeated on a weekly basis..That's how great teams STAY great-strive to improve

Evan's picture

I have no doubt whatsoever that they're looking at those and a thousand other issues to improve the team. People can talk and theorize all they want on the Internet, but it has less than zero impact on what the team is doing. And just because you don't hear about the team doing something it doesn't mean they're not doing it.

Chad Toporski's picture

There's a difference between asking the questions and giving the answers. A lot of people think they have the answers without really knowing anything about the specifics of the problem.

Evan's picture

EXACTLY.

Breadman's picture

Do the Packers have a stationary bicycle on their sidelines? I've seen many college and pro teams using them during the game, can't recall ever seeing a Packer player using them. I could be wrong.

Evan's picture

I'm just about positive they do.

A-rodg's Mustache's picture

Hey guys, Not to jack the post but I wanted to get this in so peopel will read it. And sorry if I post it on multiple threads.

Anyone want to watch the pack play the ravens sunday oct 13th? I have 2 great seats.. section 125 row 11. Selling for $250 each. Dead center, 11 rows behind the ravens bench. the seats will be with my wife and I. I had a buddy back out on me at the last minute and now I ams stuck wih these. damn ravens fans!

I have posted here before and am willing to speak with you on the phone. I will meet you there on game day to arrange swap. Check online and you will see these seats are going for about 300-450$ each.

you can email me at wjtillery@gmail.com
thanks

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