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Packers: 49 Broncos: 23

By Category

Packers: 49 Broncos: 23

Aaron Rodgers, Jordy Nelson, Charles Woodson

The Bad

The Bad

The Defense

The Bad

The Bad

The Defense

BrokenTV

BrokenTV

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Fan friendly comments only: off Comments (68) This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.

PackersThad's picture

I don't know if I could agree with calling a defense that provided for 28 points off of turnovers "Ugly". The defense definitely needs tons of work though!

Bearmeat's picture

This just in: Jordy Nelson - 3 year extension: 13 mil..

GO TT!

Bearmeat's picture

Relax man.. didn't see you'd already posted it... just wanted to share the good news...

packeraaron's picture

Lol - I know, I know...

Jenna's picture

The defense only allowed one touchdown in the second half, and that was when the game was already over...

packeraaron's picture

Easy to do when your offense is putting up 42 points, making the opponents offense completely one dimensional.

They have a lot of work to do.

Bogmon's picture

Aside from the Sunday night game, I feel like most NFL Defenses are lackluster this season.
The lack of pass rush...hmmm...let me rephrase...the NON-existent pass rush of the Pack is very frightening.
They are going to get torched this season if the trend continues. We cannot count on 3 picks a game from our secondary.

Bearmeat's picture

Yep - exactamungo Bogmon.

4-0 is hiding deficiencies in pass rush and pass d....

If they don't clean it up they're gonna get the party crashed hard at some point soon...

tony's picture

The Packers D is par for the rest of the league... everyone sucks so far.

Luckily, the Packers have the track record of proven players and coaching to get it turned around.

And this week will be a great chance to get the pass rush situation figured out... Atlanta's been pretty brutal offensively.

PackersRS's picture

Sanchez and Flacco explain a lot about the Sunday night game.

We cannot count on 3 picks, but we CAN count on turnovers. 4 years straight being top 5 in forced turnovers is not a coincidence.

And, it's like tony said, we're 8th in sacks... Everybody is having problems against the pass.

al's picture

They have a lot of work to do on tackling, that and blown coverage, but everything else seems fine. It's just the dumb mental mistakes, oh an Shields sucks at tackling.. big time.

gratif's picture

That's just how our D works this year. Raji and Rodgers can be counted on make the other offense one dimensional every week.

We're daring you to get into a shootout with us.

Evan's picture

Ugly - new security measures at Lambeau.

It was a complete disaster. Only 3 or 4 guards at the main south entrance. I showed up at 2 and barely made kick-off. Around 3 they just gave up and started waving people in.

packeraaron's picture

It's not just at Lambeau - it's league wide. It's an NFL measure, not just the Packers.

mark's picture

i wonder if it had anything to do with johnny crazypants bringing the taser into dallas.

Bogmon's picture

Security is the new terror.

Majik Man's picture

+1

lebowski's picture

nice, that's gotta be a bumper sticker

Jack's picture

Welcome to the Nanny State, NFL-style.

John R.'s picture

Oneida street was an absolute mess. We entered through the atrium entrance relatively quickly, but still much longer than normal. We probably budged-- couldn't tell where the line started.

We were inside the stadium at 2:15 and the line at the Onida entrance was to the street. If you haven't been to Lambeau this is a pretty long walk-way between entrance and street. I have never seen anything like this in all the sporting events I've been to. They need to find a solution fast.

Evan's picture

Yeah, that's the entrance I came in through (I think).

As I said, around 3 the line started to really move and the 3 or 4 cops at the base of the stairs were just haphazardly patting down random people as we all flew by. At the point, yeah, the line (horde) was all the way out to the street.

I know it's going on at all stadiums, but I have to assume it's being handled more efficiently elsewhere.

The fact that it was 80+ degrees and I was in long underwear didn't help matters.

asshalo's picture

I literally got in the line right after I got up the stairs at the Lombardi statue. I agree on the lines. It shouldn't even be half that slow. Those lines were enormous at about 2:00-- it's not like people didn't take the packers seriously when they told everyone to enter the game earlier than normal. This is entirely on the packers and the police department.

If you read the article on jsonline.com, it's sounds like it will definitely improve. They basically said they learned a lot of what not to do.

RockinRodgers's picture

The secondary just seems to be off. I really don't know what they are doing. It was bad when Collins was in too.

It's a little concerning.

They are getting turnovers, which helps.

MarkinMadison's picture

New drug charges for Jonny Jolly. Whatever ails the Packers, everyone can now quit asking about Jolly. RIP big fella, you killed your NFL career.

dougie smooth's picture

It's really pretty sad. The guy is obviously an addict. No one is that stupid to get busted four times without an addiction involved. So where is the NFL on this one? They'll make a huge PR push about the long-term effects concussions, but they won't touch the long-term effects of getting addicted to painkillers. Unless it's the Dongslinger and he's shedding a tear over it.

And yes, I realize we're talking about purple drank here and that sippin sizzurp is a pop culture punchline, but codeine is codeine.

Bogmon's picture

He obviously has a chronic addiction to codeine; he needs some serious intervention/rehab.
I feel bad for him at this point. Not only has Jolly ruined a stellar career, but he's likely going down a very dark path from which he may not fully recover.

CSS's picture

Partial defense of the secondary here: Seeing a trend in opposing WR routes that involve a lot of double moves. Until the Packers can manufacture a pass rush you're asking a lot of your secondary, regardless of talent, when they have to defend so many double-moves.

I'm guessing the trend will continue with Atlanta if they can't hit Matt Ryan.

packeraaron's picture

Just said basically the same thing on Twitter. Its easy to get separation when a guy has all day to run his route.

bomdad's picture

There are alot of trends, mostly the league enforcing rules that promote passing offense and high scoring. I'd also point out the leniency on offensive holding, there's alot of horsecollar blocks on the edge.

I'm not so worried about Matty Ice. Turner makes that offense tick.

Idiot Fan's picture

What's puzzling to me is the fact that this is the same coaching staff and almost entirely the same roster as last year. There's no way that the loss of Jenkins (who didn't even play all 16 games last year) is the cause of all this decline. And the D struggled before Collins got hurt (though that is a big blow). Here's to hoping that Dom & Co. can right the ship. Even a moderately competent D pair with this O could be a force to be reckoned with.

NJ's picture

Maybe I'm remembering it wrong, but when Cullen was out for a few games last year the pass rush rush seemed to fizzle then too.

The bottom line: Without somebody who can create a mismatch one-on-one (aside from Matthews when healthy) this unit isn't going to generate enough of a rush to disrupt the passing game, and with all of the shoddy tackling in the second level I don't think they can afford to put more guys in the box on overlaod blitzes.

They need a healthy Neal in the worst way, Zombo to be productive when he comes back and somebody is going to have to step up if Shields is going to keep playing like this.

Just like the all-offense-no-defense Pats last year, this team aint getting through the playoffs if it can't clean this stuff up.

Bearmeat's picture

NJ - you are right. When CM3 and Raji get double teamed consistently GB didn't have an answer. Quite simply, without a healthy Neal (and the two guys that I just mentioned getting doubled a lot), they don't have the personnel to rush the passer. Walden, Wynn, Wilson, Zombo, Jones, etc... J.A.G.s...

Scary huh?

CSS's picture

The difference between that New England team and this Green Bay team: Rodgers is great with pressure in his face, he excels. Brady wets himself with pressure up the middle.

bomdad's picture

Cullen Jenkins had 0.5 sacks after week 14 last season. He didnt play the last 4 weeks, Packers went 3-1. So the personnel are the same, lending to be the scheme.

In week 14 Cullen had two sacks in a 7-3 loss to Detroit.

And Neal was on IR the whole time.

The "JAGS" were the defense in the home stretch.

Its scheme and gameplanning. Woodson has not been used to blitz much this season

packeraaron's picture

"Woodson has not been used to blitz much this season"

This is true - mostly due to the fact that teams are coming out in base and heavy looks and max protecting. The Packers ran more base 3-4 yesterday than they have all year. When they do that, it keeps Woodson out of the slot and out of most of his pressure opportunities. You saw him manning up on tight ends a bunch as well.

PackersRS's picture

Sacks have little to do with us missing Jenkins.

The guy was dominant when he played, almost always bringing pressures.

Still contend it was the right decision to let him go, 30 years old and injury prone, and we needed the cash for other players.

But his presence is being missed right now.

Evan's picture

I thought it was the right move to let him go, too. Then I read this:

"NFL Network's Michael Lombardi says Jenkins could be cut after making $4 million over a year, so his market was bone dry."

Hindsight, I know. And I'm not one to question TT, but, that sure seems like a deal the Packers could have made.

PackersRS's picture

I have no idea what the Packers' cap is. I do know they've re-done Sitton's and Jordy's contract, and I do know they're yet to re-sign Wells and Finley.

One can make a case that Jenkins would've been a better addition than Jones, but when you factor his age and the possibility of Driver retiring, plus how this offense is build, it's not as strong a case...

cow42's picture

i'm keeping my mouth shut.

Bearmeat's picture

Cow, you are an even bigger pessimist than me - and that's saying something.

But dang you're funny!

FITZCORE1252's EVO's picture

Yeah, fucking hilarious.

dougie smooth's picture

The weak links are OLB (opposite CM3) and speed at ILB (Hawk), and the ripple effect is breaking down the D. Can't cover all day and can't stop 3rd down.

Teams figured out halfway through last season they needed to get 52 blocked and didn't need to worry much about the other edge. I never bought that Matthews is bad against the run, but teams definitely started to run at him as a way to slow him down. To my eye he's been stout against the run this year and that might be part of the story with the reduced QB pressures -- I often notice him setting up the edge against the run rather than rushing the QB. Anyway, to think Zombo or So'oto are going to come in and do anything to free up Matthews is wishful thinking. We've seen Zombo and he won't add pressure. Maybe they get lucky with So'oto, but everyone and TT's mother knew they would be weak at OLB again this year.

As for team speed at ILB, Hawk has always been painfully slow (barrel roll missed tackles are my favorite). Bishop is no burner but has better quickness and anticipation and doesn't get caught out as often as Hawk.

PackersRS's picture

Aaron Rodgers deserved a new category in this game.

packsmack25's picture

I'm going to the Falcons game this week. It will be interesting to see what happens. The Falcons have no doubt circled this game on their calendar, and now they have Jones to stretch the secondary a little.

They are going to need to get to Ryan, as he wilts under pressure. The problem is, if they blitz and don't get home, Tony Gonzalez and Michael Turner are pretty good options for a dump-off.

They beat the Pack in the regular season last year by running the ball, being methodical, slowing the game down, and taking possessions away from Rodgers. I'd imagine that will be their blueprint again, with a few play action passes mixed in against our suddenly gullible safeties.

This is the only week until San Diego that I could see them having trouble, and it certainly could get away from them down in the Georgia Dome. Rodgers will have to be flawless again.

PackersRS's picture

If they don't do exactly like the Broncos, work the running game and playaction game, they're gonna get destroyed again.

If they think they're a passing team and go shotgun early, it's gonna be ugly for them.

CSS's picture

It's highly possible they do just that, PackersRS. Julio Jones draft day acquisition was spurred entirely by the whipping they took via the Packers. Will the Falcons ego trump the reality that they're a much better team when using play action passing established by a running game or suffer under the continued delusion that they can spread the field like the Packers, Saints or Patriots?

I'm going with ego....

tony's picture

That's a good point... they're primed to be a passing team now, and they don't want to "misuse" their weapons by running the ball and being effectively boring.

It's proven that ATL's defense is a wreck, and Rodgers could get the Falcons down early, meaning lots of passing, keeping up with the "ego" part of it.

Will be very interesting, either way.

PackersRS's picture

I really hope they do man. Matthews wants his stats.

And, of course, if they don't, there's the possibility that working with the run will be too methodical to match up with Aaron Rodgers.

That's the scary thing about the Packers. You need to pick your poison. You can beat this defense with the right gameplan, but you also need to keep up with the best offense in football...

packsmack25's picture

You might be right. And the defense giving up tons of passing yards has to be pretty enticing. Then again, McGahee ran at will this week, so they might look at that and last year's regular season game in which Turner ran wild and say, "Ok, let's gameplan away from a shootout."

Kevin's picture

Is it just me or is a lack of creativity also the problem? It seems like CM3 is constantly pass-rushing, he is basically playing like a defensive end in a 4-3. The whole point of a 3-4 in my opinion is unpredictability. (and I know, they dont play a lot of the base defense, especially the Packers, but it is definetly a difference in mindset. You dont see most base 4-3 defenses mixing in a lot of CB and LB blitzes like base 3-4s do)

It's not like he is a liability in coverage. I want to see him dropping back more so that teams that focus on him and assign two blockers to him have to refocus. If you have him crowd the line and then backoff while Walden and Woodson come off of the other edge it will create some situations that the opposing O-line WONT want to deal with.

Its stuff like that that I saw Capers do so well calling last year and Ive been unimpressed with this year. (Then again maybe they are setting up tendencies for other teams to read into just to break later) Meanwhile, other great 3-4s are calling stuff like that. Watching the Jets/Ravens game last night showcased a lot of different pass rushers from different locations.

packeraaron's picture

This is the heart of the problem when it comes to the pass rush, at least to my eyes.

And I think your idea that he's setting up tendencies has merit.

Idiot Fan's picture

I also wonder if getting burned on those screen passes and dump offs in the first couple weeks is a factor. We've been better against those lately, but maybe it's been to the detriment of our pass rush.

mark's picture

I agree with some of this too. If I remember correctly, Bishop had a few big plays yesterday where his blitz seemed pretty well disguised, and I remember thinking, "ureka, THERE'S the Dom Capers I've been waiting for!"

MarkinMadison's picture

Actually, I did see him do this when I watched the Denver game last night. (Dropping into coverage off the double team.) Maybe you want more of it, but it is there.

retiredgrampa's picture

If the defenses in the league improve later on, the Packers D MUST do likewise. I believe it will. Too much talent and drive not to.

ppabich's picture

I think there is a lot of truth to the point where the Packers have been playing 'vanilla' defense. The Packers got most of their pass rush (outside of CM3) from ILB blitzes and Wood. It is pretty clear that Wood has blitzed less. ProFootballFocus.com had Bishop as the best pass rushing ILB in the NFL last season. I think it is pretty clear that good consistent pass rush isn't coming from the OLB opposite Clay. Knowing that i think it is pretty clear that Capers needs to figure out a way to get Bishop and Wood more involved, but if you can win games and keep your defense relatively vanilla, I think you're doing alright.

lars's picture

There not really doing all right, though. Even the D vs. the run got mauled yesterday. So, if Capers insists on "going vanilla" that his choice but don't use it as an excuse for poor defensive play.

Use the three starter who are injured (Neal, Zombo and Collins) instead!:))

ppabich's picture

Wow, that was a pretty arrogantly written comment. I don't think the injuries are an excuse. The pass defense was pretty bad when Collins was in there for 2 games. Neal has really shown nothing outside of a game about a year ago, and is Zombo all of the sudden a good pass rusher? I'm not making an excuse for why the defense hasn't been good. And most of the passing yards the D has given up were against Drew Brees and Cam Newton, who has thrown on everyone outside of a monsoon. The Bears and Broncos found some holes in the defense, but neither team was that good throwing the ball.

The problem with the defense so far has been the pass rush. Almost every play yesterday the Broncos doubled CM3 or rolled out away from him. Maybe Neal when he is healthy can help, but he cannot be expected to stay healthy at this point. I really don't see how Zombo is going to be much better than Waldon.

I'm just trying to think of where the pass rush can come from based on who we have right now. Bishop and Woodson are the guys who did it last year, the fact that we haven't seen much of them pass rushing this year leads me to believe that Capers best blitzes haven't been used much.

And in regards to the run D, I had a nice little argument with Aaron in the preseason. If an emphasis is to made at stopping the run, I believe, at least some emphasis in protecting against the pass is going to be lost. After the first 2 games the Packers were the #1 run defense. I'm willing to give up a few good running plays, as long as the defense is putting an emphasis against the pass. And with the ability of the offense to put up points teams are going to throw the ball a lot.

I feel while the defense wasn't great yesterday, it has definitely played better the last two weeks.

Mojo's picture

Agree that maybe the Pack has been holding back some, but wouldn't it be nice if they could win some of the one-on-one battles more often. I know Raji and Pickett have gap responsibilities but I just don't see anyone breaking through from time to time like other teams do against us.

CSS's picture

Feels like Raji's pass rushing ability is being wasted on most downs. He's a team player, I'll give him that.

Just frustrating to me how Capers uses him on most passing downs.

Wagszilla's picture

Capers is covering up the deficiencies in the pass rush by dropping LBs.
D-Line is entirely to blame for lack of penetration. See: 2010 Dolphins, Redskins games.

And Real-Talk:
Clay isn't the same Clay.

Same speed and technique but the power is missing. Can't bullrush like he used to, used to get off blocks easier and quicker. Either he's getting too much girl-action or he's off the PDEs... It's easier to go with the latter but I've seen the former too, see: Allen, Roethlisberger, amongst others.

I hope Ted makes a move. It's not his style but this is a "win-now" team.
I'd rather have a high-probability Super Bowl than a really good draft pick.

Of course the season is young, I'm sure he's waiting until teams start tanking and a valid prospect is put on the market.

PackersRS's picture

Just so much wrong with this.

It looked like Matthews didn't have the burst in the first 3 games, but last game you'd have to be completely blind to not see it. The power was there, the burst was there. Matthews is fine. Watch the game again. Particularly the second half, when the Broncos were passing more out of the shotgun.

As for the trading draft picks and being a win-now team, Minnesota completely agrees with you.

Wagszilla's picture

Burst =/= Power.

PackersRS's picture

As such referenced in "The power was there, the burst was there."

Kendra's picture

Clay appeared hungry in the Broncos game. Hopefully we'll see more of his old self as the season goes on.

As to your other point, this team is 4-0. It is a "win now" team because they are actually winning now. Unless we suffer a monumental collapse, I'm going to guess we'll be drafting in the late 20s/early 30s again this year and are facing a minimal threat of "bettering" our draft position for a good pick.

TT can't just wave his magic wand and create an unsigned, Cullen Jenkins quality player to snap up at a low cost. Since he does work out players, I have no doubt if such a player existed, he'd be on our team right now.

fishandcrane's picture

"RIght the ship" ?? We just beat an NFL franchise by 30 points. It's a new league- and we own it for now- blemishes and all.

And I have to repeat myself cause I like it so much:
Best NFL quaterback is Rogers.....second best is Russell Wilson

WisconsInExile's picture

"Best NFL quaterback is Rogers... second best is Russell Wilson"
+50 style points

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