McCarthy Can’t Win…With Packer Fans
By Aaron Nagler on Jan 11, 2011 with 92 Comments
Over the course of the last month, Mike McCarthy has done some of the best coaching of his career – but you would never know it judging from the reaction of Packer fans on the Internet and on sports radio.
After a soul-crushing loss to the Detroit Lions that would have sent lesser (and poorly-coached) teams into a tailspin they could never have recovered from, McCarthy has turned around and delivered a near defeat of the best team in football (while starting his back-up quarterback no less) and gone on to engineer three straight victories, each of them must-win games. A loss at any point would have effectively (and literally in the case of the last two games) ended the Packers’ season.
Yet everywhere I turned on Monday morning when trying to take the pulse of Packer Nation I was confronted by the angry denizens of Packerdom, most in full throat about how McCarthy had “gotten too conservative” at the end of the Eagles game.
I mean, the guy just can not win with Packer fans.
When he calls a deep post or fly route on 3rd and 1, Packer fans are up in arms about how McCarthy is too aggressive. When his offense takes over with 4 minutes left and he drains the clock to near perfection by running the ball and taking away the other teams timeouts, giving them the ball back with 2 minutes remaining – he’s too conservative.
He just…can’t…win.
Lets say McCarthy calls pass plays and his offense doesn’t convert the first down. Now, not only have they failed to run time off the clock, they’ve left the Eagles with at least two of their time outs. Fans would be screaming “What horrible playcalling! Why is he so aggressive? Just run the ball!”
Packer fans would do well to recognize Sunday for what it was when it comes to McCarthy’s playcalling, which apart from some head-scratching decisions at the end of the first half, was just about the best game he’s called all year.
Filed Under: Featured • Mike McCarthy • Packer Offense
Coach and Team seem to be clicking at the right time this season.
Aside from some receiving snafu’s and an untimely fumble, they played outstanding yesterday.
Still room for improvement, but I like the changes against Atlanta.
Go Pack Go!
(btw…try to be happy Packers fans…enjoy the victories when you get ‘em)
Throw the ball once in a while you frickin’ idiot! Who hired this guy? Geeze…!!!
I used to get annoyed with all of the hate from supposed fans, but now its no big deal. You see these “hater fans” everywhere, in every medium/genre. It comes with the job, honestly for his salary you could rail against me all you want on twitter, radio, and tv. (And yes I know he does more than just that for his pay.)
I don’t have a problem with McCarthy trying to run out the clock at the endo of the 4th qtr. That’s what you’re supposed to do in that situation.
His decision to let the clock run out at the end of the first half, was beyond moronic. Yes, I am aware that we won the game. It was still dumb.
I agree, that was gutless what he did at the end of the half.
Then they came out in the second half and it got ugly too. They get the ball, which was good, but then Arodge has to call a TIMEOUT. Which sucks, why have to waste your timeouts like that, right? Well then we come back from the timeout and what happens? FUMBLE!
The requisite MM 14 point swing. James Jones drops a sure TD before the half, followed by a free TD for the other side after the half. Seems like EVERY game there is an ugly 14 point swing like that.
I don’t buy into the clock management criticism of M3 @ end of 1st half…J.Jones just dropped a SURE TD throw by AR & I think it deflated the offense…no need to take another play shot and really F it up with a turnover…don’t need that risk.
I thought the same thing at the time. The drop was a punch in the gut to the team.
I agree. With the amount of time left on the clock, going into the wind, with Aaron Rodgers looking uncharacteristically agitated after the Jones drop, I thought the chances of something bad happening was greater than the chances of us scoring any more points.
MM chose to take the 2 score lead and call it a half. I don’t blame him under the circumstances.
You don’t get the highest rated wild card game ever with a blowout which it could have become. It’s entertainment, people- keep it close, keep the viewers, keep the big TV contracts and we hope this year Pack wins in the end. Set up for Packer v. Bear Championship (through the roof)
WWF=NFL=Italian D1 Soccer=NASCAR=$
Agreed. Especially with getting the ball to start the second half.
One pass for field goal range. I think we can trust Rodgers to be safe with that.
I think it just irks people because he sometimes goes into “Martyball” mode. I thought it was very revealing the other day when McCarthy said in his presser that he models himself after Schottenheimer the most out of all the coaches under whom he worked.
My favorite are the comments about how bad the dropped passes are “You cannot win playoff football with those drops” right after the Packers won playoff football with those drops.
Not that I don’t wish the receivers would catch the ball, but jeepers, the Pack won!!!
Maybe people were so upset they spent all their time on the web complaining and missed the rest of the game.
there were a bunch of dropped passes on both sides of the ball on sunday. atlanta is not a spectacular team but they are pretty solid in all 3 phases so we can’t afford to make as many mistakes as we did against the eagles. i like our chances the way our D and special teams are playing now!
A.Nagler: Your first sentence says it all. Kudos on a good article.
I try not to be too harsh on MM. I believe a lot of the calls he make he does because he is confident our guys can execute. I know I know, of course he calls plays he thinks we are going to make. My point is, to a fault sometimes MM has so much confidence in his guys he makes that call. When it fails he looks like a bonehead. When he calls a 25 yard deep route throw to Jennings on 3rd and 2 he does it because he knows A-Rod and Jennings are going to make that play. I like that our coach has confidence in our guys even though sometimes it makes me bang my head on the coffee table. All in all I think MM is doing a great job.
You’ve expressed your displeasure about the Packers’ fans criticism of McCarthy over and over again. Don’t let it get to your head (as you now have shown it has). All those annoying comments are leading you to make several annoying comments yourself. Just read their opinion and move on to more important issues.
Exactly: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DNFTT#Usage
Brian has offered great advice. You CHTV guys are too wrapped around the axle regarding the criticism of MM by some of us fans. I think MM is good, but he’s not great. IMO, he’s the coaching equivalent of A.J. Hawk. I don’t mind if you disagree with me.
Many fans use a ‘standard of perfection’ as the baseline for their mostly negative comments …… MM could call a great game for 95% of the game & be so-so the other 5%, if that fan has a personal bias against MM, then that fan will focus on the 5% ….. Thus, the negativity.
Fans also have a tendency to forget that there is an opposite & sometimes superior force working against your team ….. A play-call or strategy doesn’t work as intended because the opposition has a better play-call or strategy …. That’s the nature of any team sport …..
Fans could do themselves a favor by realizing that the only goal in a playoff game is to score 1 more point than the opposition …… How GB accomplishes that is irrelevant, especially after the fact.
Ummm… didn’t you tweet this during the pre-halftime debacle?
http://twitter.com/#!/Aaron_Na.....4536260609
Apparently not only can McCarthy not satisfy unruly fans, but even the great ones (said in full reverence for fear of an internet smiting) are not immune to an occasional criticism.
Seriously, I suspect that sampling bias plays a large role in your conclusion that “the fans must be crazy”. You get a vocal minority who espouse one opinion that you dislike and a different vocal minority who espouse a different one, and on and on. Eventually you conclude that “the fans” must be crazy because “they” believe a whole bunch of things you think are nuts. It wouldn’t surprise me if hardly any individual held *ALL* of those beliefs. Yet when you aggregate a bunch of minority opinions into a large group and call them “the fans”, you end up making crazy conclusions about “them”. That’s sampling bias. And with twitter its really easy to get fooled by it.
So for example, with that tweet of yours, it looked like you were agreeing with those criticizing MM’s lack of aggression before the half. Yet, I think a more complete reading of your opinion is that you like MM as a coach. If people only looked at your tweet they might conclude otherwise. And I suspect you’re doing that with other tweeters.
So maybe consider pulling up a bit. Drawing conclusions of the opinions of the fans based on twitter, if done, must be done carefully.
Wow. That’s what I wanted to say, but much better.
If the Packers lose[unlikely], then I expect a pile of excuses from this site first. Tell us how there were injuries, bad luck, or great plays by the other team. Some people criticize, that’s what they do. Some fans are all happy all the time just being able to watch a team play, others have a sense of dread that comes out in ways that are perceived as negative. There are valid criticisms regardless of a game’s outcome. Here’s one this week-James Starks was phenomenal, did he just develop the ability to run this week?
Not only that but some people criticize in the heat of the moment out of frustration. It may not represent their deeper opinion.
If I tweet, “Dammit McCarthy! Again with the 40yd bomb on 3rd & 1″ It’s an expression of something that I dislike. It doesn’t mean that I want McCarthy fired. Yet when someone else, right behind me tweets, “Fire McCarthy” I’m lumped in with that guy. And then @Aaron_Nagler concludes that “the fans must be crazy”.
My best advice to Aaron is this: ignore the crazy crap and move on. And by “ignore” I mean fully. Not only should you not respond, but be very careful on what conclusions you draw in your head about “the fans”.
” ….. reaction of Packer fans on the Internet and on sports radio. ”
Although your conclusions have validity, Nagler never remotely mentioned “in-game tweets” ….. Nagler is responding to next day analysis by fans who have had the time to become more rational than a simple in-game emotional response …… There’s a big difference.
Ok, but that is not the main point that I’m trying to make, which is that when you hear the opinions of one person or small group, you can’t aggregate that to the larger group. I think you’re going to end up drawing some wild conclusions if you start assigning all opinions heard on twitter or on the radio or whereever to all fans. For any sufficiently large group, you will find just about every opinion contained within it. That doesn’t mean that the whole is crazy. It means there’s a diversity of opinion.
I think Aaron might be drawing some bad conclusions here about the schizophrenia of the Packer fan base. If he could find the same individuals who claim both frustration at aggressive & conservative play calling, and then further demonstrate that the majority of the fan base hold those beliefs, then I’d concede that he’s right. In the mean time, I’m skeptical, but willing to be convinced otherwise.
Wow – a defense from Woody. We’re through the looking glass.
Donald’s Designated Driver said it best:
To be fair, Aaron has confessed to being sort of like a werewolf. After every Packer loss, he assumes the shape of a lunatic and lets loose all his most primal thoughts. Then he reassumes his rational human form the following morning. It’s weird.
Ok. Good to know.
Mental note: ignore all posts from the monday morning lunatic.
Repeat…
Repeat…
Ok. Got it.
More like – ignore all irrational Tweets on Gameday.
I would defend you on more instances if I could ….. But that would only serve to expose my own internal hypocrisy.
Yeah, I agree with dullgeek.
Even with fans that have had time to cool down, number one, you can’t pin them all together, number two, complains about playcalling do not translate to people asking for his release.
Also, complaining about MM’s playcalling in the last game do not show a pattern unless, like dullgeek said, they are from the same people that complained before, and for opposite reasons.
And even in those cases, they do not represent the majority of the people complaining at the moment, much less an entire fanbase.
Now, I get the feeling. I do understand and agree to some degree with what Aaron has written in here.
But, again, as dullgeek said, one cannot jump to that conclusion (that Packers fans get upset with MM no matter what) with these samples only.
I am drinking the TT and MM cool-aid. I am not postive the Packers will win next weekend but I am sure they will play hard. The team is well coached and loaded with talent and that all I ask of the Packers.
Yes, I am too. I was very skeptical of TT right after Favre left, but he’s proven me wrong.
HELL YEAH MM CAN’T WI…
/reads rest of title
Oh… I see what you did there…
More to the point, he coached to victory in 3 must-win games against damn good football teams. The Giants, Bears and Eagles are really good.
What does a team have to do to win it all? They have to go on a winning streak against good teams. I think McCarthy has gotten better throughout this year, and I think we can win the Super Bowl with this guy. I mean come on…Brian Billick and Tom Coughlin did it.
I can’t argue with anything he did against Philly. We forget that the wind was blowing 20 miles an hour. Some passes were just dying or diving into the ground. I don’t blame him a bit for the end of the first half.
We are one win away from playing either the Bears of the Seabags for the Halas trophy and a trip to the Super Bowl. It’s hard for me to bitch about anything in this situation.
I commented in another article regarding McCarthy’s playcalling/use of personnnel and formation. This was the best he has called a game all year…..HOWEVER…… I still come back to the 3rd and 1 call with 9 minutes to go. Could someone please explain to me why he put in John Kuhn and took out James Starks in that situation? From my perspective it was entirely predicatable given the personnnel with the formation. Why did he take out the “hot hand?” What did Kuhn give them in short yardage that Starks couldn’t? I just don’t see it.
The second set of downs on the last Packer possession was fine with the exception of that 3rd down call. Why, when you anticipate pressure, do you put Rodgers in a static pocket? Why do you put him shotgun and risk a bad snap? If the argument is that he was trying to kill clock, which it appeared he was doing based on the 1st and 2nd down calls, why not run it again or do some type of playaction or get Rodgers out of the pocket and give him a run/pass option? The run had been working all night and the threat of boot pass was there.
That is what frustrates me to no end. It isn’t about that he runs or passes so much as it is how he chooses to sequence his plays and use his personnels and formation given a specific, critical situation. If you’re playing to eat clock then don’t line up in shotgun on 3rd and 8 and vary from your approach at that point and expose your quarterback to a rush that had already forced a fumble in the game. If you’re trying to get a first down, then by all means, throw in a pass on 1st or 2nd down. By my calculations, McCarthy was not intent on getting the first down. He was trying to eat clock. Like I said, I don’t disagree with that, but when you put the 3rd down call in to that context, it makes the decision to call that play and formation very concerning.
“Could someone please explain to me why he put in John Kuhn and took out James Starks in that situation?” Its obvious, isn’t it? He doesn’t trust Starks’ ball security in that spot. Not saying I agree, but I bet that’s McCarthy’s thinking – and yes, that is rather humorous considering Kuhn’s fumble.
As for the 3rd down call, I disagree there. He’s running clock…until its time to win the game. He’s got a quarterback who has traditionally killed it on 3rd down and indeed was doing well on 3rd down in that game. I have zero problem with his trying to pick up the first with that call.
The end of the first half, however, frustrated me to no end for the reasons you state.
I actually didn’t have a problem with how the first half ended. He took a shot and Jones didn’t deliver. That’s a player error not a coaching error. From where they were positioned, I didn’t have a problem with him taking the team in to the half up two scores. They had the momentum.
As far as the 3rd down call decision to pass. Again, I’m not opposed to the pass, I just think the choice of the type of pass, personnel, and formation had potential disaster written all over it. He ran it on 1st and 2nd down which was fine. Why not line up in 21 Pro I or 20 Flex and do a PA pass and get Rodgers on the edge? That would have fit in much better with what he was trying to accomplish on 1st and 2nd down from a scheme standpoint. With all of the pressure the Eagles were bringing, a moving Aaron Rodgers rather than a static Aaron Rodgers seemed to be a much better choice. It always appears that he in close games McCarthy gets “tight” and is a little unsure of himself. But all in all, I loved the game plan and use of the backs in the pass game, getting them in to the routes from the snap. Classic WCO. Can’t go wrong with it.
The end of the first half was the only time I uttered the phrase (it happens at least once per game)”Mike, what the hell are you doing?”
Other than that, pretty happy. He looks to be working on some of the things that have driven me at least crazy all year.
Go to the falcoholic (http://www.thefalcoholic.com/) and take a look at the Packers Eagles open thread.
Even Falcons fans were calling the play (3rd and short run the middle with Kuhn) before it happened.
Of course, we all know that every tendency MM has estabilished this year was just for this moment, so that he will reverse them and win the game…
I’ve said before…when we can run the ball we don’t know how to use it to much of an advantage.
Final drive second and ten glad they tried to run again.(fail) that was a unique play for us. And Agree on 3&10- go ahead and pass but run it behind center with play-action for once this season they’d have to respect our running game on 3&10! That’s somethin.
I commented on twitter that I didn’t like MM’s conservativeness. I felt that way more about the entire 4th quarter than the
I’m tired of all the “FIRE McFATTY” and “he’ll never get us to a SB” comments.
Yes we can argue about how he handled the end of the half vs the Eagles. But the hyperbole is over the top. Overall he’s a very good HC. He has a .600 winning percentage (48-32) and taken us to the playoffs 3 out of the last 4 years. He manages the roster, coaches, training schedule, and locker room well. He’s a good game planner, sets a good attitude “We’ll play anyone, anywhere, anytime” or “We’re underdog to nobody”. Game management, where he is most criticized is just one aspect of being the HC. Let’s not also forget he never had been a HC before, so we’re seeing a HC and the youngest team in the league going through a maturation process. Overall he’s doing it quite well.
>Let’s not also forget he never had been a HC before, so we’re seeing a HC and the youngest team in the league going through a maturation process. Overall he’s doing it quite well.<
Exactly right!
I commented on twitter that I didn’t like MM’s conservativeness. I felt that way more about the entire 4th quarter in general than the last couple of possessions. At the same time, I don’t blame MM for poor execution when he calls a play that exploits a matchup, such as the 4th and 1 in Detroit.
Had it been any other team the Packers were playing, I would have been less nervous. But, the Eagles clearly have the most explosive offense in the NFL, and they almost proved it again on Sunday. Luckily, Tramon stepped in and sealed the win.
However, while I feel it is certainly my right as a fan to criticize MM and the Packers, I do agree that there is clearly a significant amount of hypocrisy among Packers fans.
I also feel that MM is and should be the head coach of this team. The Packers will certainly have a chance to win a SB with him.
I agree with running out the clock with running plays. You make the other team kill timeouts. However, if you get 3rd and short I do not have a problem with the coach calling a run play or a pass play. I would prefer the pass play to be something high % like a play action fake to a TE similar to the Donald Lee TD. But running the ball on 3rd and short doesn’t bother me. I would prefer they would not get stuffed most of the time but hey that’s just me.
calling the rodgers pass play in detroit after he got his bell rung. calling not one but two qb sneaks from the 2 in atlanta. not challanging the gonzo non-catch on 4th down. going for all the marbles in new england after running a dopey draw to jackson on 2nd and 2. wasting a timeout in philly before the half. there have been some errors this year, let’s be real.
but mccarthy’s also done a good job to rally this team through a whole bunch of injuries. and outside of the detroit game, this team seems ready to play most weeks. the players respect him and have said as much.
as is often the case on the internet, the truth is somewhere in the middle. dullgeek points this out very nicely.
Fire MM fans are simply our fifth column. All teams have them. That said- he still needs an assistant next to him for: clock management, replays, three plays ahead play calling, and now OT.
And Please- you must defer in OT – you can’t lose in one series, and get the advantage of 4 downs if opponent scores.
Ummm… That is incorrect. A touchdown on a first possession is a win. End of game. If I’m the Packers, I would want the ball.
Ahh..my bad, but still a field goal can’t beat you. The advantage is to kick I believe. Especially with our D
If I’m the Packers I kick an onside kick every time.
We struggle in coverage. We have one of, if not the best onside kicker in the league. Our D is one of the best in keeping opponents out of the endzone. And, if we don’t recover and they kick a FG, we get the ball back.
Now, if we get the ball, all we need is a FG to win the game.
IMHO the best approach for us in this new OT rule.
“Now, if we get the ball, all we need is a FG to win the game.”
I’m not positive, but I don’t think this is correct, because if the kicking team recovers the onside kick, the receiving team had never had a possession.
The nature of the new OT rule is that the team to have the first possession can not win outright by FG without the other team also having a possession to attempt to either match the FG to extend the game or conclude the game with a winning TD, or lose by failure to score in response.
I have to believe an onside kick recovery would not circumvent these things.
Agreed with about 50% of this, Aaron. I agree that even well before this game, the mantra of many Packers fans is “Get rid of McCarthy.” I, for one, have been a staunch supporter…maybe even an apologist for McCarthy at times. At work, I’m the lone wolf crying for him to be rewarded, not canned.
However, even I struggled with the last 4 minutes of playcalling. I thought he had a BRILLIANT game plan that he executed all day. With that last series, I felt it was predictable and rigid. Two fullbacks in the backfield screams run. It also doesn’t lend much of an opportunity to audible. In other words, I thought there was room for CREDIBLE criticism there.
There are no doubt fans who criticize indiscriminantly when the Packers fail. Some of the fans fell into that category on this one…I’m not sure all did.
Hindsight being 20/20, I wonder if McCarthy doesn’t think today “If I had to do it over again, I’d roll out playaction on first down on the second set of downs with 4:00 left.”
Just read this over and I shouldn’t have said “I’m not sure all did.” I didn’t mean to imply that Aaron is literally saying every Packer fan falls into this category.
I would hate to watch a game with a fan like that
Aaron,
i think you are correct that McCarthy – and the whole coaching staff minus perhaps Slocum – has done a tremendous job overall this year considering all of the injuries and a pretty tough schedule.
That being said, I have found McCarthy’s playcalling to be questionable numerous times this year- and so have you. You were not happy with him after the Washington game.
My Problem with McCarthy is that i think he tries to hard to establish a running game when it just isn’t there and his playcalling can be downright terrible, especially on 3rd and short or goal line situations. Everyone knows Kuhn is getting the ball and the Packers have been lucky that Kuhn has converted when he has, several times on sheer guts and luck.
But mostly, I think Packer fans are right to be upset with the playcalling at the end of the Philly game for the simple reason that with the season on the line, McCarthy took the ball out of a future Hall of Famer’s hands and put it behind a line that gets little push and a rookie running back. Green Bay is a passing team. Win with your best. you play to win, you don’t play not to lose. Show some faith in your stud QB.
Granted, McCarthy showed a lot of faith in his defense and justifiably so, but even very good defenses buckle against Vick and those receivers late, especially on the road and especially when he knows he has 4 downs to work with. Ask the Giants.
the Packers outplayed Philly and if not for a Jones drop, this game was over at half. but GB was also very fortunate that the game ended the way it did because i think if that last drive played out 100 times, it would end badly for the pack about 50 of them…
The worst case scenario in the last 4 minutes of the game would have been a TO by GB in their own territory ….. All MM did was play the odds …. You have a greater chance of TO when throwing the ball …. AR fumbles in his drop (sack fumble), pass is intercepted, pass completed but WR is stripped …..
Running the ball means only a clean hand-off & the RB securing the ball with both hands …. Turnover chances are minimized….
Why not trust your defense ? …. 2nd in the league in least points allowed …. Philly had to beat GB’s strength …. They failed.
can’t disagree more. you play conservative, you give an MVP candidate with great receiving weapons a chance to beat you on his home turf. Philly had started to move the ball well and at the end, they have an extra down to work with. Mike Vick with 4 downs is that much more dangerous than with 3 downs…
you go out and put the ball in the hands of a great, great quarterback who has the best rating in NFL history and you tell him you need two first downs and we win.
doesn’t seem like much of a choice to me.
Go watch the Butler/Silverstien review, it all makes more sense and it’s understandable why McCarthy did this.
Common sense /=/ football wherewithall.
“MVP candidate” & “best rating in NFL history” have nothing to do with late game strategy …..
There’s no doubt in my mind that AR was instructed to throw the ball on the 3rd down play only if the WR was uncovered ….. Also, AR basically took the sack to avoid a sack-fumble ….. This is all “Football 101″.
Sack kept the clock moving, an incomplete pass would not have. Eagles were forced to use all their timeouts.
#1 defense, bending but rarely breaking, back on the field. Mission accomplished.
You’re exactly right ….. Attention to detail on GB’s part is why Philly had no chance ….. Plus, throwing at Tramon.
again, so you would take the ball out of the hands of one of the best quarterbacks alive?
makes no sense
Just finished watching the LeRoy Butler segment with Tom Silverstien. They both, in as many words, said fans criticizing McCarthy only see a minutia of the game and preparation. In essence, fans don’t know what they don’t know but call into question his competence nonetheless.
Butler thinks we’re not as smart as we think we are, I know I’m not. Butler for the win.
true, fans don’t know the minutia nearly as well as coaches. but they know common sense and general strategy. sometimes great football coaches aren’t generally smart human beings and they do tremendously stupid things. See Caldwell, Jim from this past weekend.
“Common sense” certainly has it’s place in any venue, but you don’t see hundreds of hours of coaches tape, game plan based on opponent tendancies, have specific installs depending on time (4 minute/2 minute offense), down and distance with assistant coaches reporting defensive alignments from the both to the sidelines/head coach.
We get to see the line of scrimmage and the football snapped to the QB. That’s the ‘fans’ vantage point and totality of the viewers ‘common sense’.
Common sense arguement doesn’t fly. Using 1 play out of 70 + plays from Jim Caldwell and an AFC game doesn’t make a point at all.
you’re completely missing the forest for the trees.
your talking nuts and bolts football. I’m talking basic strategy. i don’t care about alignments and tendencies with the game on the line. the question isn’t which play to call and who to have in there, the question is do you play to win or do you play not to lose.
we chose to play not to lose when we have a stud QB. that makes 0 sense
I have a firm grasp on both and you’re oversimplifying the professional game to the point of elementary school, midget league football. Complete, false equivication.
I would strongly disagree with this, if it weren’t LeRoy speaking.
Fans saying they’d make better play callers is comparable to an average guy who makes a good plate of spaghetti and meatballs believing he could operate a great Italian restaurant in New Jersey. It’s the Madden-ization of fandom.
That said, it’s becoming obvious that when we go to the Pistol look in a long down and distance it’s a screen to Jackson
Aaron Nagler says:
January 11, 2011 at 11:25 am
More like – ignore all irrational Tweets on Gameday.
If we did that, I might be out of a moderating job
No matter what team you root for, there are gonna be fans that love being aggressive and others that prefer conservative play. This is human nature, it does not just apply to Packer fans. Why is this addressed? Is it something that just simply bothers Aaron? Or is it aimed at someone in particular who displays hypocrisy in their opinions of McCarthy’s play calling?
Go Pack, go!
No disrespect, Aaron.
Lol – no worries man. To answer your question, yes it is simply something that bothers me. You’ll get that a lot on this site.
I agree – McCarthy called a great game. The only call that I thought was terrible was his failure to call timeout before Philly’s field goal attempt at the end of the second quarter. Packers would have gotten the ball back with about 1:45 to go and 1 TO instead of 1:10 and 2 TOs… just seems like a no brainer to call the timeout there instead of letting the clock run down.
My point exactly from a post on a different thread. Then when the JJ drop happens you still have time to try something else rather than pack it in for the half. Just think what a field goal at the end of the half would have done to the whole complexion of the second half.
McCarthey called a great game except for the end of the second half and the end of the game in my opinion.
First of all, at the end of the first half we still could have drove and kicked a long field goal after the Jones drop.
Considering Akers missed two field goals, if he had made even one of those, we could have likely lost the game.
I never understood the give up play at the end of halves. Troy and Joe Buck didn’t understand it either. When there is blood in the water you don’t back off just because someone drops a pass. It makes no logical sense to stop trying just because there is a certain amount of time on the clock. It’s like coaches are scared something bad might happen just because of the time on the clock.
Horrible decision by McCarthy.
Second, I don’t understand why, when Starks pretty much always gets at minimum 2 to 3 yards, you would take him out for Kuhn who has no burst and frequently gets stopped on 3rd and 1. I know he had a good stretch of games where he was converting them, but McCarthy won’t even give starks a chance when it’s obvious he is the better runner.
Third, at the end of the game. I don’t understand the concept of trying to kill clock if you are only up by four points. Sure, you only give vick two minutes but with their offense that is plenty of time to score. I’d rather you try and actually get the first down, leave four minutes on the clock if you get incompletions and that way if they score it at least gives A-Rod some time to go back down the field to score again.
Twice that same tactic backfired on us. The bears game, we let them take all the time off the clock and kick a game winning field goal. The falcons game we left time on the clock and they got a good return and beat us.
You always play to win in my opinion. PLaying to kill the clock is a coward move. Any time you play to not get beat you usually get beat. That’s why I hate prevent and trying to kill the clock.
OTher than that McCarthy did do very well. Its a good thing we have dom capers and our defense or we would have been an 8-8 team or worse, and a large part of that would have been on McCarthy.
I think that’s why fans are so mad. Because he consistently does stupid shit at critical times.
But there is a way for him to win. Run it on 1st down. Evaluate down and distance. You can run a high percentage pass if its 2nd and long (screen to RB/WR/TE), PA pass, or a QB rollout to the right. If its second and medium or short, then run again. Rinse and repeat on what should be 3rd and manageable. Anything to avoid 3rd and long.
Time management at the end of half is a whole other story.
Be aggressive and win the game instead of playing conservative and try not to lose MM! Just throw a high percntage screen or outlet pass to try and get the gamewinning first down instead of constant up the middle runs on first and second down. This constant mindset almost cost us the first Vikings and Lions games and the last Bears game.Do not let up against the Falcons if we have a lead!
I was screaming at the TV at the end of the first half and thought we should have been a bit more aggressive getting a second first down on the last drive. That all being said, we won and that thug who should be still rotting in jail, used his pea size brain and threw to Tramon’s man in the end zone. MM had confidence in his defense at that point and for good reason.
He’s a better than average coach who in my opinion, keeps getting better. I like how he handles AR. If Capers sticks around long-term due to his relationship with the head coach that’s another plus on the MM side. If we make it to the NFC Championship all dissidence will subside.
Judging from this week’s comments from Alex, Jaymee and you, it has obviously it has been a long season for all the bloggers out there and I understand the frustration and wear that comes from having to deal with the same negative complaints week in and week out for an entire season. I’d just like to make the point that probably 1% of your readers actually even post anything–and unfortunately a disproportionate number of those are the negative whiners. The rest of us come to your site for the insight, analysis, and yes, even to consider the validity of the comments of those whiners. Since it is not a constant barrage for us, the comments are just opinions, and considered as much. Usually, even though sometimes wildly blown out of proportion, there is an element of truth. I just want to encourage you to keep doing what you are doing and try not to get frustrated by the 1%. Deal with them as needed but remember the greater majority of your audience who aren’t so quick to react. We really appreciate what you do.
Excellent point. And thanks very much for your kind words.
Right. Until he actually wins big, he can’t win. That’s a product of his personality.
> After a soul-crushing loss to the Detroit Lions
I kind of think that’s the problem. McCarthy does do some amazing things. But those things come with prices like, “but then you lose to the Lions.”
I think it’s very natural that fans feel a great deal of frustration with McCarthy. If he wins a championship with this bizarre package of liabilities, a lot of that critique will subside. Nonetheless, so many of his downsides are so glaring, I can’t see why, barring that sort of success, he’s going to develop personal loyalty on the part of fans.
Being a sports fan isn’t, for most people, an exercise in zen-like detachment. Indeed, the fact that one has to be detached in real life is all the more reason to be emotional in the recreational sphere. I know you prize that detachment, but I just don’t think you are ultimately be successful in getting your readership to adopt that value.
Your work is deeply valued and appreciated anyway. If you don’t reshape your readership around that value, it isn’t the end of the world.
McCrathy has done his best work since his team lost to the Lions. Belichick has done his best work since his team lost to the Browns. Hmmm….
Yes, but losing to the Lions in Detroit is no longer a debacle.
Let’s hope we get the Lions in the first game next year so we can go 15-1!
1000% agree Aaron!!! They beat Phili in Phili twice in the same year. Unbelievable. We never could beat them before. Now they are marching to greatness! McCarthy gets the credit for winning. That is the bottom line–winning, which he did.
Screw all the haters.
WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? we beat the eagles all the time.. just because we lost to them in a playoff game one time does not mean anything -__- your acting like we just beat this god team.. the eagles are not super.. they are a solid tema with an explosive offense.. that the defense held in check..
Most of the credit for this year’s results are on Dom’s side of the ledger. In no game this year did the Packers trail by more than 7 points.
I calculate that the offense performed well enough to carry the team to victory 5 maybe 6 games. This indicates a need to improve that part of the team. MM runs it and therefore he becomes the target.
He is also the head coach and gets the credit for the overall record. I don’t see criticism of his offensive management as a terrible offense to mankind. It’s just the emotional babbling of GB fans who want everything to be better. Nothing more, nothing less. Count me as one of them.
Not speaking specifically about the previous few games, but my biggest issue with MM play calling isn’t if he runs or passes, but often how he chooses to do so in certain situations.
The biggest example of this would be this particular situation I’ve seen far too often over the last few years:
3rd and Goal (short). MM decides to pass the ball. Fine, I’m okay with that, I’m not one of these “RUN THE BALL, RUN THE BALL” people. But does he have to do it with in five wide/empty backfield? It’s third and manageable, it’s goaline, and you just tell the Defense “Don’t worry, we’re not going to run it. You guys just go ahead and play Coverage/pressure. No Run here.”??
All I ask is at least show the threat of run in that situation.. Be smart, keep the D honest.
2 minutes is entirely too long to leave a high powered offense like the eagles…
if he does the same thing against the falcons… the falcons will score with those 2 minutes left. and run the clock down to the point where we wont have any time to answer..
i dont care what you say.. anyone who thinks what MM did with 4 MINUTES! left on the clock was a smart thing does not know football you have to try to score and make it a two possession game.. does that mean you go out and throw the ball every down? no… but u dont just run the ball till you have to punt it away.u call some high % short routes on 2nd or 3rd down cause you need to move the ball.. that is a lot more of an issue than throwing a bomb on 3rd nd 1 because that is somewhat rodgers decision not completely MM.. but really.. dont lie to yourself and say that going into a coma with 4 minutes left rather than trying to get points in a one possession game is smart.. if tramon doesnt pick off that pass we might be talking about next year right now
if starks didnt break away and get that first down.. you have no idea how this game would have ended.. 4 minutes is way to long.. if there were 3 minutes or 2 minutes.. you run nd kill the clock.. 4 minutes is different especially in a one possession game.. two possession game i agree with what MM did.. but all they needed was 1 drive.. and had all the time in the world.. you dont need to use your timeouts with 3 minutes on the clock.. a lot of teams can score with less than a minute on the clock.. its just a huge risk